41 replies to this topic

[Hershel Layton]

It's only one character though, and to me that made the racism plot too subtle

Except it wasn't just Cera, LittleFoot's mother and Cera's father were also racist: "We only play with dinos from our species" The whole movie is about racism and working together as much as friendship. Even the narrator mentioned that there was never a group of dinos as diverse as Littlefoot's group. Also, too subtle? That's exactly what makes it fantastic. When people watch it as adults they look at the movie in a completely new way.

Also, American Tail is awesome, But Nimh is stll Bluth's best movie.

Edited by pppp, 13 April 2012 - 11:46 AM.

[BW199148]

I would say prejudice as a whole than just Racism.

[VisionaryBlur]

Except it wasn't just Cera, LittleFoot's mother and Cera's father were also racist: "We only play with dinos from our species" The whole movie is about racism and working together as much as friendship. Even the narrator mentioned that there was never a group of dinos as diverse as Littlefoot's group. Also, too subtle? That's exactly what makes it fantastic. When people watch it as adults they look at the movie in a completely new way.

Also, American Tail is awesome, But Nimh is stll Bluth's best movie.

Littlefoot and his mother are racist at first, but Littlefoot has no real conflict when dealing with his racism. He accepts Ducky easily into the group despite knowing that his kind shouldn't interact. He does it with Petrie, Spike, and Cera as well.

I honestly don't believe a theme of racism should be subtle to the degree it was in Land Before Time. It's a topic that should be well known at an early age.

[Arle985]

I loved the first movie, but both the sequels and TV series were really terrible. Back when I was a kid, I've watched some of the sequels until I stopped at the ninth one. Looking at them now, they weren't even compared to the original due to how childish, boring, and cheesy they were.

The first movie was indeed the only good one.

[Kevin]

One of my favorite Don Bluth movies! They really should have just stopped right afterwards though and not made so many sequels that was just basically milking the series. The fact that it took so long to do a regular cartoon series (despite it not lasting very long) surprised me since I'd thought it would be done a lot sooner.

Back to the original movie, I'm very curious as to see the good chunk deleted scenes that were taken out due to it's frightening nature. I wonder if we'll ever see them in the future...

Same here since it was originally going to be a lot darker than it was when it came out. It'd be nice if they released a DVD with those cuts either as extras or in the film itself.

[Rusty Spy]

Littlefoot and his mother are racist at first,

Littlefoot and his mother were never racist. His mother only explained that each group simply kept to themselves, being completely neutral, and Littlefoot never understood to begin with. Notice how she only explains why Cera's father got uppity about his daughter playing with Littlefoot.

The reason the racist ideology was never explicit throughout the movie was because no one, besides Cera, had any concept of racism, it was only a concept the adults followed. These were just kids who needed to survive. Cera and her prejudice served to show how they depended on each other to survive, and how they needed to be a team to reach the Great Valley. And even then the message was less about not being racist and more about teamwork and working together.

[Azure Yakuzu]

My first time watching this series was the one of the sequels, my five year old mind thought "COOL TALKING DINOSAURS", and I wasn't even aware there was an original, until I was 9......and then all of emotion came out, ALL OF IT.

[VisionaryBlur]

Littlefoot and his mother were never racist. His mother only explained that each group simply kept to themselves, being completely neutral, and Littlefoot never understood to begin with. Notice how she only explains why Cera's father got uppity about his daughter playing with Littlefoot.

The reason the racist ideology was never explicit throughout the movie was because no one, besides Cera, had any concept of racism, it was only a concept the adults followed. These were just kids who needed to survive. Cera and her prejudice served to show how they depended on each other to survive, and how they needed to be a team to reach the Great Valley. And even then the message was less about not being racist and more about teamwork and working together.

Thank you for just repeating what I was getting at. I felt the racism was non-existent, and any hints of it was better used for the teamwork angle. Seriously, why are you targeting me when I'm the one who fell in line with the message of teamwork and cooperation?

I'll admit, saying Littlefoot's mother was racist may have been going the wrong way, but I'll concede to that.

----


Nepenthe! You and your thumbs up when you believed in the racist angle more than I did.

I have to disagree with your take on the racism angle; I think it's relevant.

Same here since it was originally going to be a lot darker than it was when it came out. It'd be nice if they released a DVD with those cuts either as extras or in the film itself.

That ten minutes of footage has been long destroyed. You'll never see it on DVD. You can only interpret it.

Edited by VisionaryBlur, 18 April 2012 - 07:09 PM.

[Nepenthe]

Rusty's post was pretty much what I was getting at earlier but better stated. Why would I not thumb that post up? =P

[VisionaryBlur]

Rusty's post was pretty much what I was getting at earlier but better stated. Why would I not thumb that post up? =P

Because, from what you're saying above me: I didn't get your message.

Edited by VisionaryBlur, 18 April 2012 - 07:39 PM.

[Nepenthe]

Both me and Rusty basically claimed that racism is relevant in the film in that it allows Cera a character arc and for the filmmakers to approach teamwork in a respectable way, that every character didn't need to be overtly racist for it to having meaning.

[VisionaryBlur]

Both me and Rusty basically claimed that racism is relevant in the film in that it allows Cera a character arc and for the filmmakers to approach teamwork in a respectable way, that every character didn't need to be overtly racist for it to having meaning.

I does have meaning, but not one for kids to take from. I'm claiming that it isn't relevant enough for that intended demographic to get anything from it. Rusty doesn't even seem to be claiming the racism is that important:

Cera and her prejudice served to show how they depended on each other to survive, and how they needed to be a team to reach the Great Valley. And even then the message was less about not being racist and more about teamwork and working together.

The racism only serves as a silly subplot that could be easily replaced by Cera's pride for herself.

Edited by VisionaryBlur, 18 April 2012 - 07:59 PM.

[Rusty Spy]

I does have meaning, but not one for kids to take from. I'm claiming that it isn't relevant enough for that intended demographic to get anything from it. Rusty doesn't even seem to be claiming the racism is that important:

The racism only serves as a silly subplot that could be easily replaced by Cera's pride for herself.

That's the POINT. It was never intended for kids to understand because none of the kids in the movie understood it.

It isn't a subplot either, it's background information that establishes the culture and is what makes the team all the more admirable. If the movie hadn't made it a point that there was segregation in the dinosaur society, there'd be no significance in the assembly of a bunch of radically different species. They might as well have all been the same species.

[Nepenthe]

I does have meaning, but not one for kids to take from. I'm claiming that it isn't relevant enough for that intended demographic to get anything from it. Rusty doesn't even seem to be claiming the racism is that important:

The racism only serves as a silly subplot that could be easily replaced by Cera's pride for herself.

But it is important, though; it directly serves to motivate a main character's attitude and actions which is part of mine and Rusty's point.

And of course there were numerous ways to give Cera's pride validity. That's a facet of writing; there are near infinite ways to explain basic traits like "pride" in a character, but this fact alone doesn't diminish how a trait like pride is explained in specific stories.

This is like calling the loss of Batman's parents irrelevant simply because his parents could be replaced by a sibling, or a grandfather, or an uncle, or a close friend. Well, yeah, the writer could've done that, but it's irrelevant considering how the story is actually written. The fact of the matter is, Batman became Batman on account of his parents being murdered, same as Cera is prideful and mean towards Littlefoot because she believes triceratops are better than apatosaurus, e.g. because she's racist.

Also, I disagree with the idea that kids need to be able to understand every single theme about an animated film for them to take away something positive from it. There are a lot of things about animation that my ten year old brain couldn't comprehend that my twenty-two year old self now can, even with Don Bluth's other films. Why is this particularly problematic in LBT's case?

Edited by Nepenthe, 18 April 2012 - 08:16 PM.

[VisionaryBlur]

That's the POINT. It was never intended for kids to understand because none of the kids in the movie understood it.

It isn't a subplot either, it's background information that establishes the culture and is what makes the team all the more admirable. If the movie hadn't made it a point that there was segregation in the dinosaur society, there'd be no significance in the assembly of a bunch of radically different species. They might as well have all been the same species.

You know, I don't think the directors intended it to be like that, but I'll accept that since it adds more depth to the movie.

The part about it making the team more admirable? I'd say that character traits and animation did that well enough. Really, if I have to look to a message to "feel" that the characters are different species, when their traits alone do that well enough, then I'd look down on the movie even more. However, you've explained the best compromise for me, and you explained it better.

But it is important, though; it directly serves to motivate a main character's attitude and actions which is part of mine and Rusty's point.

And of course there were numerous ways to give Cera's pride validity. That's a facet of writing; there are near infinite ways to explain basic traits like "pride" in a character, but this fact alone doesn't diminish how a trait like pride is explained in specific stories.

Also, I disagree with the idea that kids need to be able to understand every single theme about an animated film for them to take away something positive from it. There are a lot of things about animation that my ten year old brain couldn't comprehend that my twenty-two year old self now can, even with Don Bluth's other films. Why is this particularly problematic in LBT's case?

.

It's a motive that has a connection to a very large theme and message which I've explained had no worth to me as a child, or to many other kids I know because it wasn't presented well enough for children.

Now you don't understand me. This is boiling down to how we view how a message should be shown. There are certain themes which I admire being well hidden, but then there are some that I feel shouldn't be well hidden from children because of how significant it is to them. Racism is one of those themes.

Edited by VisionaryBlur, 18 April 2012 - 08:28 PM.

[Mono]

I saw this movie for the first time last year. Didn't think it great, it was good. But with the bazzions if sequels are insane

[Hershel Layton]

You know, I don't think the directors intended it to be like that

Well, we all know how Bluth sucks at storytelling,so it might have been Spielberg's idea or any of the other writers.

[VisionaryBlur]

Well, we all know how Bluth sucks at storytelling,so it might have been Spielberg's idea or any of the other writers.

Spielburg saw this as a movie for kids only, so I don't think he thought of the idea either. It was his idea to get rid of those 10 minutes of animation.

[Hershel Layton]

Spielburg saw this as a movie for kids only, so I don't think he thought of the idea either. It was his idea to get rid of those 10 minutes of animation.

You're right,my bad. Well,one of the other writers then?

[VisionaryBlur]

You're right,my bad. Well,one of the other writers then?

Maybe. I really think that idea Rusty brought up is more viewer interpretation. It's good viewer interpretation though, that's for sure.