10 replies to this topic

[Burnt Ash]

As Sonic has changed over time, so has his some of his abilities. Sonic 1 through 3 and Knuckles (excluding CD) introduced us to the Spin Dash, Insta-Shield, and the roll. These moves were very fun to use, and the enemy placement and level design both complemented the moves, allowing for the moves to be used to their full potential. These games did the two moves well.

Then we hit Sonic Adventure. Sonic Adventure retained some of the classic moves, while trading some classic moves for several new ones. For example, the spin dash made a return, while the Insta-Shield was taken out in favor of the Homing Attack. However, the fact whether or not the level design utilized the Spin Dash is arguable. Sonic Adventure also introduced us to the Light Speed Dash, although many criticize it for taking far too long to charge it up. Now we move on to Sonic Adventure 2. Sonic Adventure 2 retained the moveset of Sonic Adventure, while introducing new ones such as the Bounce Attack and the somersault. The Bounce Attack was somewhat fun to use, while the somersault constantly killed the games pace. The Light Speed Dash also made its return in Sonic Adventure 2, although the player could use the move instantaneously, rather than charging it up before use. Like Sonic Adventure however, the fact whether or not the level design complemented the moves is arguable. Concluding the Dreamcast Era, Sonic Heroes comes in and removes the spin dash, replacing it for a roll(?), while other moves are more or less the same from Sonic Adventure 2.

Fast forward two years later, and we come to Sonic the Hedgehog. Sonic the Hedgehog had the same moveset as Sonic Adventure 2, and it added two more moves (excluding gems) although more broken. For example, the light speed dash didn't work half of the time, charging the spin dash did absolutely nothing, and aerial movement while using the Bound Attack was extremely limited. The level design did not complement these moves at all. The new moves Sonic the Hedgehog introduces fared slightly better. The slide (Antigravity?) and the sliding kick thing was somewhat efficient in killing enemies, although the slippery controls makes it a bit difficult. After this game, we witness a massive change with the introduction of Sonic Unleashed.

Sonic Unleashed, in terms of its moveset, was radically different than any other title before it. For the first time in the console main series, the boost is featured. The boost in Unleashed (and Generations) was a way to get instant speed, along with a quick way of killing enemies. Sonic Unleashed also introduced the stomp, a way to instantly kill any aerial movement, and get to the ground. Both of these moves were used well, although some may say that these moves were used too much. In addition to the stomp, Unleashed also included the wall jump. Sonic Unleashed retained the light speed dash from the Adventure series, although moves such as the Spin Dash and the roll have been eliminated.

Sonic Colors had the same moves from Unleashed (minus the light speed dash), with the addition of a double jump, and the homing attack was mapped to a single button. The double jump was a semi-decent platforming aid, a nice move to save Sonic from falling in bottomless pits. Finally, we reach Sonic Generations. Sonic Generations (minus the extra unlockable moves) has the same moveset from Unleashed, although it restricts the usage of the light speed dash and the wall jump to certain marked rings and wall jump panels.

So yeah, a brief(?) history of Sonic's moveset. However, what moves from Sonic (or any other character) would you like to see improved upon, or what moves would you like to see return, or what move ideas do you have?

[Semi-colon e]

A problem I have with Generations is the whole context specific stuff for the wall jump and light dash. I mean the wall jump worked FINE in 3D in Unleashed, I had no issues with it at all. I don't really care much for the light dash anymore, I wouldn't mind them scrapping it honestly as it was used so little in Generations anyway.

As for other moves, I'll ignore boost vs spin dash as that's a whole different thing that this thread will inevitably degenerate into, but I find the stomp so much better than the bounce attack, I was playing SA2 again earlier and I kept trying to stomp to the ground (I used to love the bounce as it was cool but I think the stomp has much more utility). I also hated the mapping stuff to the same button thing those games had going on, Unleashed onwards just made that so much easier. And yeah, I hate the somersault as well. I prefer the slide to the somersault, but we might as well have rolling with physics, even if it's essentially useless compared to the boost.

Other than that, you forgot the drift and the quick step. I find the quick step kind of context specific, but I don't really mind it or find it offensive. The quick step also suffers from really pointless quick step sections, aside from my favourite one in Crisis City Act 2, simply because there's so much shit to avoid and if you use it at the right times you can reach higher areas, which doesn't really happen with the quick step that often.

I do like the drift though, I mean it sucked in Unleashed and Colours limited it to a handful of sections, but the tight Spin Dash drift is so much fun to use personally. I just kind of wish there were more areas it would benefit with than the typical "use drift here" parts, I mean there's one part in City Escape that is certainly possible to drift through to speed things up - I'd like to see more of that if we keep the current gameplay.

Double Jump... meh. I don't really mind it being in Colours but don't miss it that much in Generations. One thing I will say though is that the jump dash is so jerky nowadays, I mean it's great for aiming for specific platforms but it kills the flow, I do prefer the SA2 version of it, though I suppose we do have the air boost as well, so hmm...

[Burnt Ash]

Yeah. That's something I don't really like about the Jump Dash in Generations. I found it to be better in Unleashed and SA2 as well.

[Vertekins]

I loved the ability to customise the moveset to the extent seen in the Storybook games. The added bonus was the fact that the stages and missions were designed cleverly around the skill system.

SatSR's skills like Volcano Slider, Fire Gaze, Aegis Slider, Back Step, H Pearl Collector etc found real usage in the game. And it was a refreshing experience customising Sonic to your own personal tastes with such a wide scope of abilities provided Sonic is levelled highly and has skills that are only unlocked by certain Gold Medals. The Gold Medal ability that makes every ring count as a pearl rather than a ring is...interesting to say the least.

Not to mention the Crests are pretty cool though I haven't quite discovered exactly what the Crest of Dark does. Crest of Wind in SatSR is an incredible move that, whilst hard to use effectively given it's sheer speed and ring-draining, is a blast to use when used correctly. In the hands of a skilled player, Crest of Wind is a sight to be seen. Crest of Fire is fun to use and watch too. Practically every fire-type move is accompanied by a fiery blast of flames, especially the homing attack when the Crest of Fire is equipped.

But as I said before, what does the Crest of Dark in SatSR actually do?

[Azure Yakuzu]

My only problem with the customizable moves from the Storybook games is that Sonic is essentially a snail before you get the crest of wind, which made playing the first levels a pain in the ass, I mean why should I have to buy something Sonic should already be able to do?



In any case, moving on to other characters I kind of hope for future 3D games that more focus is a bit more on the character's individual abilities as opposed to the ones Sonic has, I mean they should have the general abilities Sonic has(Spin Jump, moderate speed,) but let Sonic(and arguably Shadow) keep the Boost, and Homing attack. Knuckles has a bit more close ranged combat moves, Tails has more gadget based abilities in addition to his tail attack etc. etc.

[Generations (Chaos Warp)]

I always thought they could mix the stomp and the bounce by making it so that if you just tap the button, you bounce, hold it, you stomp down. Just a little idea of mine.

Edited by Chaos Warp, 26 April 2012 - 03:40 AM.

[Chili Dawg]

I always thought they could mix the stomp and the bounce by making it so that if you just tap the button, you bounce, hold it, you stomp down. Just a little idea of mine.

Anything that lets us bounce is okay with me. Seriously, bouncing was so much fun, we need more of it.

[Lamor]

So my idea for Sonic moveset in future games is: first of all keep Homing Attack (Cross/A in the air) but let as carry momentum after preforming it. When preforming Homing Attack at balloon (in Unleashed, Colours, Generations) you carried your speed and that's what I want in future Sonic games to appear just this time at actual enemies. Instead of boost reintroduce Spin Dash. After pressing Square/X you would roll, if you held down X/square you'd perform Spin Dash. Boost would still be there. After using Light Speed Dash (triangle/Y) Sonic would get some kind of energy ball that'd allow him to perform PS2/Wii styled boost but only once per Light Speed Dash. Instead of slide Sonic could have Slide Attack. What's the difference you ask? During Slide Attack Sonic would work pretty much like brake. Depending on speed you had it would take different amount of time to stop. Other than this Slide Attack could work as offensive move. Last and probably best function of Slide Attack could be grinding. When holding down circle/B Sonic could grind on rails. Grinding would work just like in SA2 but you wouldn't be forced to perform it since grinding would be used only for alternate roads or picking up speed. Spin Jump, Drift and Quick Step would work just like they worked in Generations. There could be one more move: Homing Smash. After holding down Square/X in the air Sonic could charge up his Homing Attack and defeat group of enemies with Homing Smash. You just press it once and Sonic take out all enemies kinda like in Unleashed Opening. If used without enemies around it could work like Air Boost.

[Son1ctrainer]

Rolling/Spin Dash > Sliding

I think they should bring back the Spin Dash/Rolling and make sliding something Sonic does when you move the Control Stick in the opposite direction while running, for when you want to slow down.

The Drift is getting better but it still needs more work.

Sonic shouldn't need "special walls" to Wall Jump off of.

[Darth InVaders]

What I think Sonic's modern moveset should be (with a jump button, a duck button, a Boost button, a Drift button, and a Side-Step button)

Homing Attack - same as it always was by tapping jump button in air (of note, basic jump is a spin jump like it has been since Unleashed and it was from the Classics to Adventure, never return to Sonic06 where the basic jump did no damage)

Spin & Spin Dash - press the duck button while running to do a basic (and classic) roll which would completely replace the slide for getting under things (and also for the return of classic burrowing), press and hold the duck button while stopped to duck down, then tap the Boost button to charge up a spin dash; when spinning, controls are more sluggish while side-steps, drifts, and the Boost are disabled; rolling down hills can build great momentum faster than running

Boost - works more like the classic Peel Outs of old where the player is bumped up to full speed but must maintain that speed on their own (no holding the Boost button to maintain speed), as the player builds momentum by basic running, the momentum charges the Boost Meter (likewise slowing down & stopping depletes the Boost Meter), when the player nears Sonic's top speed (non-overclocked) the Boost Meter is fully charged - the player can press the Boost button with the fully charged meter to boost Sonic into his overclocked speed (as if Sonic just used a dash pad or some other accelerator) but it is on the player to maintain that speed; if the player wants to use the Boost without building momentum first, they can bring Sonic to a stop then press and hold the button to charge a Peel Out which builds the Boost Meter; furthermore the Boost is nerfed so that it cannot defeat or damage any enemies (the less controllable Spin & Spin Dash do that), although both Sonic and the enemy are knocked back (unless the enemy has spikes or an electric field or something else that would cause immediate damage to Sonic); Boost does not work while rolling and can be used in the air like in other modern games*

Side note: when reaching full overclocked speed without the use of the Boost (via dash pads or other accelerators or simply by running or rolling down long hills to build momentum), the same Sonic Boom warp animation still goes across the screen (think along the lines of the Advance games' version of the Boost)

Drift - like in Unleashed (either version)

Side Step - works like Unleashed for Wii (a button is pressed and then the controls for the analog stick switch over to side stepping until the button is released)

Bounce - pressing the duck button in mid-air makes Sonic do a bounce attack (which works like in SA2)

Grind - basically works like it does in other modern games (but I am a little tired of it so it should be used less)

Swing - same thing

Wall Jumps - works like it has in 2D, should try to bring it to 3D or bring back the Triangle Jump

Also want to point out that the series should be momentum based with no more dash pad accelerators and such before loops and all (though loops, corkscrews and such should not be dangling over bottomless pits) as getting into those to get the goodies in them should be earned; and no more QTEs (wall jumps, side-steps, evasive maneuvers and such should be the closest thing to them)


* For more information on what the hell I'm talking about with "overclocked speed" and such, visit http://www.sonic-jam...gories-of-speed

Edited by Darth InVaders, 26 April 2012 - 08:24 PM.

[New Year's Miru]

Tails Mechanics:

Tails's flying is like the classics, but he has a tail attack instead of spindash.