Megathread The Lara-Su Chronicles and Ken Penders topic - READ PAGE 164, POST 4096

[Maeson]

 

Penders Said:

You obviously can't grasp my genius at business!

I'm plotting my schemes, and for you dismay,
They're perfect in every way

My genius will bring, you down to your knees,
There's no stop until Lara is speaking chinese!

Business, I will change all your rules,
If you disagree, you must be fools,

All my plot-twists, are made for confusion,
I will be, my own Kirby!
I will succeed, and you will see
With my style, your effort's futile!

------

Thank you based Penders for giving more oportunities to become (even more) silly again. At this rate i'll finish the entire song.

But being serious now; Penders doesn't seem to have that big of a fanbase right now on his own language, why not trying to increase it (By, I don't know, releasing the first book, so people can discover what is the project, maybe?), and then try to search for public outside english? I mean, He comes from Archie, Lara-Su Chronicles, comes from Archie, and those were pretty much "american comics", even if sometimes they appeared in some stores on the UK.

But then again, if he does that I won't be reading Lara-Su in Spanish, so... Please, continue.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Thank you based Penders for giving more oportunities to become (even more) silly again. At this rate i'll finish the entire song.

But being serious now; Penders doesn't seem to have that big of a fanbase right now on his own language, why not trying to increase it (By, I don't know, releasing the first book, so people can discover what is the project, maybe?), and then try to search for public outside english? I mean, He comes from Archie, Lara-Su Chronicles, comes from Archie, and those were pretty much "american comics", even if sometimes they appeared in some stores on the UK.

But then again, if he does that I won't be reading Lara-Su in Spanish, so... Please, continue.

Allow me to put things in perspective about Penders' "global" audience. Archie Sonic has only been popular in the US. That's a fact. It's the only place you can get the damn comics in normal shops. Sega consider it a tiny blip. Penders' claim to fame is he claims that he was a whole big thing to Sonic in general, and that Sega needs him in order for Sonic to survive. He claims his stories like EndGame (One of the most plot hole ridden stories in comics to date, along with the fact it's old and pretty shit) should have been the basis for the Sonic movie, despite the fact no one would have a fucking clue who the Freedom Fighters or his characters are if you live outside the US, and haven't seen SatAM.

He also believes that his works were more or less more popular in the UK than Sonic the Comic (You know, the actual fucking comic released in the UK), this comment actually pissing me off enough to call him out on it and say that Sonic the Comic is far more popular, with an online continuation and a comic con solely focused on Sonic the Comic. He believes that in general, his work is beloved by everyone worldwide and that he is the "savior" of Sonic the Hedgehog, despite the fact that in the UK, it's hard enough to get ahold of Archie Sonic because you have to track down an actual comic shop who orders in US comics, and the French and German dubs of Archie Sonic only reprint issues post #225. So exactly how the hell does Penders believe that these "worldwide fans" have actually read his works when they would need to A. Learn English in order to read them, B. Deal with his overuse of technolbabble and other such crap, and C. Even get ahold of the comics in the first place?

TL;DR: Penders is full of shit, as per usual.

PS: Lara-Su Chronicles has nothing to do with Archie. This is solely Penders' work, and Archie has and likely wants absolutely no part in it.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Ryannumber1Scarer

[Vertekins]

I just find it funny how he seems to claim along the lines of being some sort of messianic figure for the franchise when in reality, if writing Archie Sonic is your highest claim to fame regarding influence in this franchise, it really isn't much to boast about given how small-time it is and how SEGA and Sonic Team itself palpably don't give two shits about it.

[horridus]

I just find it funny how he seems to claim along the lines of being some sort of messianic figure for the franchise when in reality, if writing Archie Sonic is your highest claim to fame regarding influence in this franchise, it really isn't much to boast about given how small-time it is and how SEGA and Sonic Team itself palpably don't give two shits about it.

He seems to be under the impression that because he got a few letters from overseas that it's an indicator that he has some kind of global recognition, rather than recognizing that maybe, he just got letters from the niche market in those countries. 

And you know, it's really funny that he keeps boosting himself up as the Sonic Champion given that not only did he ignore the games, he also ignored and eventually bastardized the SatAM show the comics were meant to tie into at the time, sabotaged Sally's chances of getting transferred into the games thanks to the shitty mini-series he made, and screwed over Ben Hurst's chances at making a Sonic movie and then failed at his own efforts. There was once a period when he conceivably COULD have actually been reasonably important, but that ship sailed, and he obliterated every last chance he ever got from that era.

Hell, technically speaking? Michael Gallagher is a more influential figure than him, because at least ONE of his characters got use outside the comic in another bit of media, via Athair being used in Sonic Underground. An absolute bit roll, but it's still more play than anything of Penders. 

[King Scoopa Koopa]

He claims his stories like EndGame (One of the most plot hole ridden stories in comics to date, along with the fact it's old and pretty shit) should have been the basis for the Sonic movie, despite the fact no one would have a fucking clue who the Freedom Fighters or his characters are if you live outside the US, and haven't seen SatAM.

In fairness, any good movie is probably going to introduce the characters to its audience whether people know them already or not, and there are bound to be new faces thrown in as well. It's actually kind of hard for me to think of anything that adapted a popular character into another medium that didn't introduce a new character, Sonic or otherwise.

In that regard, the Freedom Fighters wouldn't be different from anyone else anywhere else. They just have more familiarity in North America, and I guess anywhere Sonic Spinball or SatAM were released. They'd need to be introduced to the film's audience where that wasn't quite so necessary in the comic, but that's true of any character.

Keep in mind, I'm not advocating making Endgame the basis for the movie. I'm just saying that audience familiarity with the cast would be the least of the problems involved.

Heck, someone could probably swap in characters from the games for all the prominent stuff in the story, if someone really had an issue with using the FF. It would no doubt take some considerable rewriting to make certain characters work (and Penders might not even allow that), but that's nothing new for movies. Movie scripts are constantly rewritten, and things seldom stay 100% true to the source material in the process. That's why they're called "adaptations."

 

[Ryannumber1gamer]

In fairness, any good movie is probably going to introduce the characters to its audience whether people know them already or not, and there are bound to be new faces thrown in as well. It's actually kind of hard for me to think of anything that adapted a popular character into another medium that didn't introduce a new character, Sonic or otherwise.

In that regard, the Freedom Fighters wouldn't be different from anyone else anywhere else. They just have more familiarity in North America, and I guess anywhere Sonic Spinball or SatAM were released. They'd need to be introduced to the film's audience where that wasn't quite so necessary in the comic, but that's true of any character.

Keep in mind, I'm not advocating making Endgame the basis for the movie. I'm just saying that audience familiarity with the cast would be the least of the problems involved.

Heck, someone could probably swap in characters from the games for all the prominent stuff in the story, if someone really had an issue with using the FF. It would no doubt take some considerable rewriting to make certain characters work (and Penders might not even allow that), but that's nothing new for movies. Movie scripts are constantly rewritten, and things seldom stay 100% true to the source material in the process. That's why they're called "adaptations."

 

Yeah, but we have to think about the amount of characters that would need to be introduced, and then keeping up with all their subplots. There's Sonic and the Sega cast, Freedom Fighters, The Wolf Pack, Hershey, Drago, then there's Geoffrey, King Max who isn't even really King Max, Dulcy, Dr. Quack, Eggman, Snively, and even more on top of that. Then you'd need to introduce the plot elements, with the main plot behind Sonic being framed, set up Drago and Hershey's relationship. the entire plan behind it, Eggman's plan with his ultimate weapon, Antoine and Bunnie's little side plot, the plot about the fake King Max attacking the robians, Snively's planned betrayal, and even more. How is that any kind of plot for a beginning movie, and considering the original story is plot hole ridden, I'd imagine things getting worse from there.

[horridus]

All interesting questions, but perhaps best reserved for another thread regarding how you'd adapt works into a Sonic movie. I will chime in though by saying that even if SEGA lost their minds and did such a thing, he'd still bitch about how it was done because the simple reality is that a lot would have to be re-worked for any of it to be presentable, and Penders really, really does not strike me as the sort who would play or be particularly grateful that his stuff was used at all. 

Now, getting back to LSC, Penders argument seems to have continued on twitter, and he has elaborated as to his reasoning and goals a bit. 

I would note that he is only addressing part of what this person asked, but I'm not linking all that up. And his answer is still condescending and totally ignoring the various statements he's made in the past that he still has a rather massive fanbase and pre-built audience and 'new fans' who are all eager to see his 'continuation of what he started in Sonic'. Furthermore, you've got to love the way he states the obvious with regards to franchise building... evidently he must believe that Sonic was a super franchise from the start. Then again given his supreme and willful ignorance of the franchise beyond his own work. 

When pressed regarding how nonsensical his logic is, this was his answer. 

Stay classy, Penders. Stay classy. 

[King Scoopa Koopa]

That makes it sound like the whole thing would be unaltered. Nothing there a good pair of scissors and some glue can't take care of.

Even Jurassic Park saw tons of stuff cut and changed for the movie. And Marvel changes all kinds of crazy stuff.

Edited October 12, 2015 by KingScoopaKoopa

[Ryannumber1gamer]

But there's the problem. Penders wouldn't dare let anyone alter his work. That would imply that it's anything less than perfect, and we all know that can't be so! 

[King Scoopa Koopa]

So, is he printing apps overseas? These two answers don't gel, as if that's any kind of surprise.

[GamerGirl54321]

Didn't he also say that he was going to have a graphic novel version as well? I dunno.

Anyways, I... Honestly don't see the issue with having it translated. I mean, it's not him doing it, so it's not a waste of his time, so why is it an issue? I mean, yeah, there's him assuming that it's going to be a big hit everywhere, but still.

[horridus]

Didn't he also say that he was going to have a graphic novel version as well? I dunno.

Anyways, I... Honestly don't see the issue with having it translated. I mean, it's not him doing it, so it's not a waste of his time, so why is it an issue? I mean, yeah, there's him assuming that it's going to be a big hit everywhere, but still.

It's not the translation itself. It's more the fact that he's kind of counting his chickens before they hatch; he's speculating that he NEEDS this many translations long before he has given any kind of indication that his product is ready or even before he has seen any indication that there will be success at home, let alone the numerous, numerous countries he has listed that would require the sheer amount of translations. Add in the whole 'talking about making an effort versus actually making said effort' thing, and it becomes scornful. It's not the translation in of itself, it's the attittude on display... and his behaviour to being asked about if maybe he isn't getting ahead of himself. 

[Blacklightning]

Not to mention that his translations have been so crap on at least two separate occasions that actual native speakers of the language have called him out on it. I'd sooner wager that he's running his lines through Google Translate first.

[QuantumEdge]

Y'know, it may just be his online "persona", but those tweets are so nauseatingly condescending that it makes me imagine he's not a fun person to talk to about this even in person.  As much as I think it's good to sell your product in any country you can, this is more a lesser priority for him now.  He should be writing the damn comic, finish writing it and then translate it for foreign markets.  If you want to sell something internationally, actually make it in the first place.  It's like the guy's doing all the important priorities in reverse order.

[Maeson]

TL;DR: Penders is full of shit, as per usual.

PS: Lara-Su Chronicles has nothing to do with Archie. This is solely Penders' work, and Archie has and likely wants absolutely no part in it.

Lara-Su Chronicles tries (key word here) to continue the story that Sonic Archie had. That's what I meant, nothing more.

It's obvious that Archie itself has nothing (And doesn't want anything) to do with this ungodly creation, obviously. But that doesn't erase the fact that Lara-Su Chronicles have ties with Archie Sonic thanks to P.E.N.D.E.R.S intention to continue from it.

Those ties may not be real or canon for us; but they are for him. Either because he really want to write about those characters, or because he just wants to make money about things related to Sonic for reasons we all know already.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Oh, I know that. It's the way you phrased it, made it sound like Archie was helping Penders make it rather than it being a simple continuation of his Archie Sonic stories.

[Maeson]

My bad then. 

[Adamis]

Not to mention that his translations have been so crap on at least two separate occasions that actual native speakers of the language have called him out on it. I'd sooner wager that he's running his lines through Google Translate first.

And now he pays me to translate it in French, so at least that translation will be good

[horridus]

Aaand now we have his justification for why he doesn't start this off as a Webcomic. 

"In your sleep"? You screamed at people that you were handling things on your own and that was why it was taking so long. This is a rich statement coming from a guy who can't even release more than a single crappy page in a single month. 

 

[Verb & Noun]

For some reason that offends me more than anything. Slamming people who do web-comics as it's too 'easy'.

From a man who's taken years to produce two pages (and one unseen, translated page) and a handful of promo images.

[Blacklightning]

I don't even know why Penders is trying make excuses about this - we all know he's in this just for the money, and for once nobody would've blamed him if he just said nobody would've paid real money for a webcomic.

[Monkey Destruction Switch]

For some reason that offends me more than anything. Slamming people who do web-comics as it's too 'easy'.

Agreed x 1000.

It's been a while since Penders' said anything that's actually angered me...I'm usually just amused by his ludicrous statements. But this? Geez.

I don't even know why Penders is trying make excuses about this - we all know he's in this just for the money, and for once nobody would've blamed him if he just said nobody would've paid real money for a webcomic.

It's hilarious thinking about this fact in light of how much money he's likely to make.

Edited October 14, 2015 by Monkey Destruction Switch

[Shaddy Zaphod]

Who exactly is buying this? I can think of three groups:

1. FuhrerMustang (though I'm pretty sure he's a troll account)

2. People who want to see just how possibly bad this piece of shit could become

3. Confused old ladies who saw something sort of-Sonic looking and bought this for their grandkids by mistake

 

How much do those budget Disney knock-off films make usually, anyway?

[Zaysho]

... "In his sleep?"

Seriously? Is this what we're going with? Webcomics are super easy?

I certainly don't consider myself a proper representative of the webcomic community (that'd require some kind of consistency and timeliness on my part), but this is probably one of his most pompous statements I've read in a while. It's certainly right up there with his dismissive attitude toward inkers, letterers, and colorists.

Honestly, if making the comic was so easy, why didn't he just produce the damn thing and then have its format adjusted for the app? And exactly how much designing does he have to do across these platforms? Had he at least produced the comic first, then he could've had some kind of justification for the end result of the Archie lawsuit. I mean, the thing will likely be mercilessly mocked and torn apart, but at least it'd be out (and it's not like he'd care what anyone would have to say, even if they wrote a reasonably worded and honest critique). And from there he could work on expanding the thing's reach and spend all the time he wants on designing apps and whatever else. It's respectable he wants to make this as accessible and widespread as possible, but realistically speaking, he is not a big company, he's one guy making a comic, he needs to dial things back. Grabbing a bunch of darts and throwing them all at the board at once doesn't mean they're all going to stick.

[biznizz]

The real reason that Pen wouldn't want to make the LSC into a webcomic is because he doesn't want a chance for his material to ever be free to the public. He wants cash immediately, thus the supposed apps and the promise of a OGN only release.

Homestuck, from what I understand, is a free webcomic/thing first, which Hussie then serializes in OGNs. People buy them because they 1) Like the story, and 2) want to support the author so he can keep releasing new material. There are very few people who'd qualify for either category for Pen's cause.