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DEAR SEGA // Sonic Re-design (Video)


Kaze no Klonoa

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Speaking of blue arms, I spent an embarrassingly long time wondering why his redesign gave him fat, stubby little arms...before realizing they're just bent.

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I too thought the arms were stubs at first.  It's a major readability problem, though in a different shading style it may not be as big a deal.  In a flatter style with thicker outlines it would probably be easier to make out at a glance.

 

Blue arms still suck tho.

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I'm gonna have some fun and defend the design.

It's interesting to use the Japanese image of Classic Sonic as an example of how Sonic should look and express himself (especially when he consider his Generations personality,) when the plain fact is that if I took both designs at face value, I would be hardpressed to find either of them endemic of Sonic's attitude. They're both cute and inoffensive, with any attitude Sega says Classic Sonic had relegated to the in-game animations which this man's design isn't immune from simply on the basis of its design. Rig him to be able to express half-closed eyes and allow an animator leeway to give him some jackassy gestures and acting and you'd have nothing fundamentally different from the Sonic we're familiar with.

And who says lanky features aren't cute? Deer, sighthounds like salukis and greyhounds, and cheetahs among other animals have long legs, and each is sufficiently cute and/or appealing to most people, especially when these species are young. What child doesn't find Bambi- with his big head, innocent eyes, and yet silly, unstable stilts for legs- utterly adorable regardless? The idea that something cute must be a Mickey Mouse retread with stout features seems like a narrow definition of the word. Cuteness is a general result of a multitude of features on a character that simply suggest innocence. It doesn't have to be limited to short characters. That Sonic design, with his big eyes, even bigger ears, stubby arms, and deer legs is cute to me. Just as well, the legs go well in emphasizing his physical prowess at running, exactly like the three species I named.

Also, I need people to demonstrate what the perfect ratio of blue needs to be on Sonic's body, because the it seems to be a statement made without any regard for characteristics like saturation or hue which affects how the amount of color is received by a viewer. Ignoring the fact that blue is the easiest primary to get away with splattering everywhere because it doesn't stimulate our brains as much as hotter colors, the blue on that design is fairly sedated and easy on the eyes on its own, and with the differences in proportions, clothing, and markings limiting how much blue can exist there, I don't see where the blue is overwhelming to the point of being too much.

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It's interesting to use the Japanese image of Classic Sonic as an example of how Sonic should look and express himself (especially when he consider his Generations personality,) when the plain fact is that if I took both designs at face value, I would be hardpressed to find either of them endemic of Sonic's attitude. They're both cute and inoffensive, with any attitude Sega says Classic Sonic had relegated to the in-game animations which this man's design isn't immune from simply on the basis of its design. Rig him to be able to express half-closed eyes and allow an animator leeway to give him some jackassy gestures and acting and you'd have nothing fundamentally different from the Sonic we're familiar with.

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I feel like you're reading a bit too much into classic's facial expression. His focus seems to come from the fact that he's looking at the viewer, and without his pupils being too obscured by his brow or any eyelids, or without drawn wrinkles in his brow to suggest furrowing, he reads as wide-eyed and happy. The smile doesn't come across as a smirk to me either, due in no small part to the fact that his mouth being on the "side" reads as an aesthetic quirk of the design versus a gesture where he's deliberately throwing a smile to the side of his face. It's for all intents and purposes a generic cartoon character smile meant to convey cheeriness.

I give you that he has a more definable personality on account of having more features, but I don't read that personality as cute badass. All I see in that render is cute.

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How a character looks doesn't matter so much as how they move and act. 

 

Sonic was a little cute blue puffball, but he gave you a sour look if you didn't touch the controller for too long, and he's always expressing himself through his animation and action.

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I think it does as much matter how a character looks considering the Sonic fan community has been negatively denoting buttbrows, creepy mouths, too-long spines, too-long legs, shiny textures, unrealistic fur, and blue arms for years, well beyond what we've discussed in terms of animation. Not that I'm downplaying animation's role in defining a character at all, but I think it's a bit much to say the design doesn't matter as much.

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Might you not reversely be, albeit not consciously, but purposefully reading it only as cute for the purpose of the argument? Because I dunno, the way the eyes make kind of a frown, that even goes over one of the pupils, definitely gives it a touch more of a serious look than Mickey's frank and open face.

Contrast with Amy, who has wider at the middle and closer-at-the-top-peak eyes that prevent the "frown" and make her look more innocent and wide-eyed, in the classic at least.

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Might you not reversely be, albeit not consciously, but purposefully reading it only as cute for the purpose of the argument? Because I dunno, the way the eyes make kind of a frown, that even goes over one of the pupils, definitely gives it a touch more of a serious look than Mickey's frank and open face.

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Less dishonesty, more genuine uncontrollable bias inherent from the "luggage" the viewer brings. Much in the same way you can argument I'm the one maybe subconsciously exaggerating to myself the "serious" features of the image in contrast to Mickey's, who's not even posted and thus utterly dependent on whatever image I'm conjuring mentally.

EDIT: Also worth mentioning that beyond the artwork, the sprite itself looks positively pissed.

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I've always found those specific renders cute regardless of any arguments to be had. This lifelong opinion potentially being subconsciously skewed in some ambiguous, indeterminate way is ultimately irrelevant to the points I'm actually making. Unless of course there actually is a greater point to be derived from this other than I'm being subjective, which I don't think I was arguing otherwise, I would be happier not being psychoanalyzed.

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Uh, I'm just going to ask, what is this boundary between cute and serious you guys seem to have? Personally, I find the Classic Sonic sprites to look pissed and at least focused.

 

sonics_standing_b.png

Especially in the Sonic 1 and 2 sprites. His eyes are more slanted and his pupils are a bit sharper. (If that makes sense). But the thing is that, just because he looks pissed, does that mean he cannot look cute at the same time? I find these sprites adorable, even if Sonic is not happy at all. There are many things that manage to look both cute and pissed off. 

 

And to add to this, lets take a look at some JP classic art to get what I'm saying. 

 

c2QHw.png

Look at him here. He's not really pissed, but he's still serious. And he's still cute. He's not all wide eyed, but he's still cute. 

234B1F190.png

Here, Sonic looks positively annoyed, but he's still pretty cute. 

 

Just to add to my argument, I'm going to dig up some more obscure Classic Sonic art. 

FkSnxi6.png

This is from the Sonic 2 JP manual. Sonic looks pretty fucking cute here in my opinion. Is he all smiley and happy? No, he looks pretty serious. These things can coexist guys. Cute doesn't suddenly go away when the brow comes down, and the smile goes away. 

 

There are many pictures of JP Classic looking happy, but there are just as many showing him serious. 

 

Sorry if I'm dabbling on, but I feel like I have a point. Sonic is both cute and serious. 

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Uh, I'm just going to ask, what is this boundary between cute and serious you guys seem to have?

It seems most of the members here are arguing that Sonic has both cuteness and an attitude to his design and that the proposed redesign lacks the attitude.

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It seems most of the members here are arguing that Sonic has both cuteness and an attitude to his design and that the proposed redesign lacks the attitude.

 

Ah. 

 

Well, then my post seems to reinforce that fact that Sonic has both cuteness and an attitude. XD 

 

That redesign does lack an attitude, and people above have said why better than me. 

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Okay, saw this a while back...

Sonic's design reminds me of Max Rebo a lot. Little shrimpy arms, bead eyes, mostly blue... I guess that's what he's going for. That strikes somewhat of a chord with me, because Max Rebo is adorable. That's something Sonic shouldn't be. The additional air actions were a neat idea for the series as a whole. That puzzle-shield element was a nice choice of a novelty element. No-dialogue story? No. I really don't like the thought of making an Oozi out of Sonic.

I feel his ideas could be poured into a Tikal spinoff. Have her get the Rebofication (it fits with her design better) and the shield puzzles, and build the game around her strengths instead, and add in full cutscenes.

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when I saw his redesign I thought it was meant to be an icon for illustrating a point, but no that's what he's going with.

"Puzzle" as the most popular genre - "puzzle" game is a tricky label, a lot of times it also applied to games like Tetris.

A lot of his ideas remind me of that SatAM game pitch video with those attacks, and Sonic with a backpack certainly doesn't help avoid the comparison.

Attaching a finite resource like rings to important in game features also seems iffy.

Flashy motion graphics were off putting to me. I associate them with trying to hide a lack of substance. Something morphing into a lightbulb is the motion graphics equivalent of "think of the children."

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