Females in the Sonic Fandom

[Scarred Sun]

Hello! I am ~a lady!~

I also run some websites! They may have been heard about in the Sonic fandom, idk. The reason I point this out is that The Sonic Show recently released Opinion Zone 12: Where are the Sonic fangirls? and honestly, I was a bit shocked that this content came out of what I consider an otherwise reasonable site. This is not to demean any of the participants of this episode, but it made me realize this is probably an issue that should be addressed, so I'll take a crack at it.

It actually doesn't surprise me that Sonic is ranked (comparably) high by women as their favorite series, because Sonic is a fairly gender-neutral property, and who doesn't love cute animals? For those of us who came of age in the 80s and 90s, there's a very nostalgic spot for what was an accessible game to everyone. Sonic was the first video game for a lot of folks, male and female alike.

That being said, when it comes to actual women in fandom, I think most of what's going on here is confirmation bias—since we're on the Internet, which is mostly a text medium, it's easy to assume that the people you're speaking with are men. That, or you're not really thinking about it all, which is fine but worth keeping in mind. That doesn't mean there are no women in Sonic fandom, though!

I'm not really involved in fanart, for instance, but I definitely know and respect manaita, JennyTablina, peannlui, natsu-no-hi, and Danielle Hardy off the top of my head. Need someone on YouTube? Zenon is one half of Razor & Zenon, one of my favorite Sonic YouTube channels. There are musicians, hackers, researchers, fanfic authors, and so on.

It's just usually not in your best interest to really highlight that.

I've been doing this since before some younger TSS members were born, and I'll tell you that I've definitely seen my share of female friends get burnt out for, among other reasons, unwanted attention and harassment. It's a great way to get written off, pegged as just an artist/writer/attention whore, seen as "desperate" (loooooooI)  or be stalked by really creepy dudes. As a site admin, there have been several times where I've had to intervene with a member sending inappropriate messages to another member or outright told young girls (<13) to not even say their gender and age for fear of someone doing something, because they have. Hell, I'm pretty much the least romantically available person that could be out there and I still get creepy, weird energy and comments from people who should definitely know better. It's enough to turn a lot of people off.

So we go into stealth mode.

We're here. We just don't go on about it because the community (and video game communities as a whole) isn't really hospitable.

[shdowhunt60]

I notice that females in the community tend to prefer sticking to websites like Fanfiction.net, or Deviantart, or Tumblr. Those sites in general seem to have a much larger female demographic going on for them.

[Alienrun]

I never understood why Sonic females act the way they do or why they are so few of them...now I Understand. Thank you!

That stealth mode bit is very interesting tho, you'd think that the sonic fanbase of all fanbases would be more kind to girls/women! Zelda doesn't have that issue!

Though I guess another reason we don't see many "Female Sonic Reviewers" is cause they might be more sensitive to the hate, and might not be as enthusiastic about letting thier opinion out in comedic way!

Why should Females go into hiding just cause Males can't control thier "perverted desires"! That's just messed up!

[Nepenthe]

I've gotten my fair share of sexist crap in gaming circles of which Sonic is naturally included in. This ranges from my own brother telling me to never talk in randomized online matches for fear of retaliation, to standing next to someone at a Microsoft gaming convention who said "girls can't play games" (despite going positive on the winning team in a Battlefield 4 match just minutes beforehand). And in regards to my time in the fandom I've been subjected to: irrelevant comments about me potentially looking like a fat whale the day I was promoted to mod, stalking, having my social media handles posted on porn sites, someone making an anonymous post on the SSMB Tumblr that they got off sexually to my posts, and being thrown a deluge of gendered insults (bitch, slut, whore) and rape threats for doing my job over the course of the few years I've been here. It's not on the level of Anita Sarkeesian's bomb threats, but the nastiness this fandom has personally dealt me on the basis of my gender hasn't been forgotten. Furthermore, we just had a topic on here not too long ago about the poll in question and naturally half of the discussion was casual sexist jokes in the vain of "of course women like Sonic; he's hot", and further back there was a topic asking SSMB who was a girl and why they even liked Sonic at all.

It's draining, but I avoid putting myself in that position by presenting myself in a more gender-neutral or male-centered light as well. I rarely make sexual humor on here and when I do, it revolves around dicks, and my avatar is of a male voice actor. It makes people presume I'm a guy most of the time so they just carry on as normal (that and it's fun to troll people by revealing to the newbies that I'm a black woman versus an Asian dude.)

[LATER BUDDY]

I actually didn't know this was a thing released here tbh.

Other than people that might flat out have their gender displayed (like people that make their own cartoon selves, or use photos as avatars, etc), I actually don't think I normally see a person on here and go "oh that's a guy/that's a girl/etc." Honestly I've always kinda just assumed it was pretty balanced on gender around here, but again, it's not something I've really spent much time thinking about either.

As bullshit of circumstance as it is that women are forced to resort to it, I can totally understand the stealth mode thing. The person I'm seeing now has had her share of stalker type people on this board, and I've seen some pretty creepy stuffs happen to other friends on here as well. Though (and maybe because I'm just seemingly a drifter on these boards anymore and haven't seen much in general), I gladly haven't seen anything lately, and hoping it's really the case and not I'm just not aware of it.

But anyway, cool shout out topic on the dealeo. Was just waltzing in to put my two cents that I don't think everyone around here has the same mentality, or burning thoughts that the Sonic Show might be pondering, but of course still worth bringing up for the ones that do. I haven't listened in on the podcast, though I haven't really been the podcast-type of person either, but *shrugs*

It'd be impossible to know unless someone randomly read this and did, but it'd be neat to find out just for fun to see if anyone thought I was female at any given point just to see if the opposite of the unfortunate male assumption norm has happened on me haha

[Chic]

I am a transgirl. Sonic online fan communities are actually the places that I first started to identify myself as female and use female gender pronouns when I was 10/11 years old, and it was the source of a lot of harassment, predictably. It was combined sexism and homophobia, particularly the latter. People didn't believe that I was female and necessitated proof for validation of my identity, which at the time, when I still presented as my birth gender completely, did not exist. I assume that this is the issue surrounding a lot of Sonic fangirls.

Let's be real. Some Sonic fanboys fit the lonely nerd archetype like a puzzle piece, and many of that subcategory are self-loathing egoists (as fucked up as it sounds) who tend not to have much luck with any human being, much less girls in their actual lives. This sense of entitlement given to many men fails to apply to such bottom feeders and thus causes them to lash out to society, particularly women, because they are the adult equivalents of children who can't reach the cookie jar and pout about it. Except it's long term and exponentially creepier. I can't tell you how many psuedo-rebellious weaboos who jerk off to Lolita hentai laud themselves and loathe the people around them, only to garner sympathy when they're feeling depressed between their times of harassing those they associate with. And some fanboys? Holy shit. I'd rather tap martinis and make out with Jeffrey Dahmer than deal with those lower echelon tools.

I feel so sorry for Sonic fangirls.

Edited August 1, 2015 by Chic

[Alienrun]

I am a transgirl. Sonic online fan communities are actually the places that I first started to identify myself as female and use female gender pronouns when I was 10/11 years old, and it was the source of a lot of harassment, predictably. It was combined sexism and homophobia, particularly the latter. People didn't believe that I was female and necessitated proof for validation of my identity, which at the time, when I still presented as my birth gender completely, did not exist. I assume that this is the issue surrounding a lot of Sonic fangirls.

Let's be real. Some Sonic fanboys fit the lonely nerd archetype like a puzzle piece, and many of that subcategory are self-loathing egoists (as fucked up as it sounds) who tend not to have much luck with any human being, much less girls in their actual lives. This sense of entitlement given to many men fails to apply to such bottom feeders and thus causes them to lash out to society, particularly women, because they are the adult equivalents of children who can't reach the cookie jar and pout about it. Except it's long term and exponentially creepier. I can't tell you how many psuedo-rebellious weaboos who jerk off to Lolita hentai laud themselves and loathe the people around them, only to garner sympathy when they're feeling depressed between their times of harassing those they associate with.

I feel so sorry for Sonic fangirls.

I am curious to know what causes "sonic fanboys" to harass fangirls in the first place?!

[Tori Himemiya]

I am curious to know what causes "sonic fanboys" to harass fangirls in the first place?!

They don't want the cooties

#reasonable answer

[Kaze no Klonoa]

I am a transgirl. Sonic online fan communities are actually the places that I first started to identify myself as female and use female gender pronouns when I was 10/11 years old, and it was the source of a lot of harassment, predictably. It was combined sexism and homophobia, particularly the latter. People didn't believe that I was female and necessitated proof for validation of my identity, which at the time, when I still presented as my birth gender completely, did not exist. I assume that this is the issue surrounding a lot of Sonic fangirls.

Let's be real. Some Sonic fanboys fit the lonely nerd archetype like a puzzle piece, and many of that subcategory are self-loathing egoists (as fucked up as it sounds) who tend not to have much luck with any human being, much less girls in their actual lives. This sense of entitlement given to many men fails to apply to such bottom feeders and thus causes them to lash out to society, particularly women, because they are the adult equivalents of children who can't reach the cookie jar and pout about it. Except it's long term and exponentially creepier. I can't tell you how many psuedo-rebellious weaboos who jerk off to Lolita hentai laud themselves and loathe the people around them, only to garner sympathy when they're feeling depressed between their times of harassing those they associate with. And some fanboys? Holy shit. I'd rather tap martinis and make out with Jeffrey Dahmer than deal with those lower echelon tools.

I feel so sorry for Sonic fangirls.

 

I am curious to know what causes "sonic fanboys" to harass fangirls in the first place?!

Hey, at this day in age it isn't just "Sonic Fanboys". That's a mislabel and misconception. The internet is such a weird place and this kind of sexism unfairly happens all of the time in places like 4chan, Reddit, you know the rest.

[Alienrun]

They don't want the cooties

#reasonable answer

Cooties? I don't get it? please explain!

[Chic]

I am curious to know what causes "sonic fanboys" to harass fangirls in the first place?!

What's disconcerting is that it's spread across fanboy culture in general and not just limited to Sonic. Cosplay conventions and expos have become more and more for perverts looking to get off to the 900th Lara Croft or Hatsune Miku; even girls who cosplay as characters who show very little skin whatsoever are still being preyed on. For some guys, it's mostly about their anime crush "coming to life" and how they can fulfill their fetish by hopefully getting with another cosplayer, or ogling at them creepily. This is partly the reason I have yet to go to a cos convention. I've had enough trouble getting harassed by others in my daily life without having to watch Naruto #9 cream his pants at the sight of anything that isn't male - or dead - or at least partially decayed. God damn.

 

Cosplay perverts and fanboys are essentially the real life version of Pygmalion from Greco-Roman culture. They build a statue to bang and then want it brought to life so they can use it to fulfill their endless libidos.

Edited August 1, 2015 by Chic

[Tara]

I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head, and I think that's personally why I have so many mental blocks creatively.  I'm quite close to having a degree in music theory and have composed a number of pieces, but haven't uploaded them yet, and I think a lot of that stems from the fact that I'm scared of not being taken quite as seriously as other (read: male) musicians.  I still remember things like my brother (who also wanted to pursue a career in music) telling me that -I- shouldn't be the one to know the most about music in the family, that I should be learning from him, etc. and how it subsequently has me absentmindedly limiting my own potential because I'm afraid of making him insecure or otherwise hurting his feelings because I can do something he can't.  On the flip side, I know I'm not the best musician and composer in the world, so naturally I'll never be able to be in line with the best, because I won't be a composer, but a female composer.  And then, I'll be opening myself up to all that attention again, and ugh.

It's not just video game communities, either.  In general, there's not too many safe places to talk about these experiences or to get away from them.  Trying often earns you the label of "feminazi" and claim you're making it up.  I've tried my hand at creating safe spaces in certain fandoms for this sort of thing, but I'm starting to think I'm not nearly prolific enough (or responsible enough) to handle that sort of thing.

Edited August 1, 2015 by Tara

[Alienrun]

What's disconcerting is that it's spread across fanboy culture in general and not just limited to Sonic. Cosplay conventions and expos have become more and more for perverts looking to get off to the 900th Lara Croft or Hatsune Miku; even girls who cosplay as characters who show very little skin whatsoever are still being preyed on. For some guys, it's mostly about how their anime character has come to life and how they can fulfill their fetish by hopefully getting with another cosplayer, or ogling at them creepily. This is partly the reason I have yet to go to a cos convention. I've had enough trouble getting harassed by others in my daily life without having to watch Naruto #9 cream his pants at the sight of anything that isn't male - or dead - or at least partially decayed. God damn.

Unless its within Naruto's character to do that, that guy is a pretty bad actor!

But if a boy goes in awe because he sees a hot girl and starts staring...to be honest some boys have trouble controling their sexual desires and can't help it, and I would hardly call that "harrasing"! From what I can tell if it were on the beach and you replace the cosplay with a bikini, it would be both peoples fault. The girl is guilty of tempting the boy and the boy is guilty of lusting the girl! However if you go to a cosplay you should be expected to see that kind of stuff so boys need get their BS together in that case!

Aside from that I pretty much agree with you! Instead of creepily stalking someone the second you get their contact, just straight up say you think they are hot and wanna have sex with them, will you get a hard NO!...yes, but the one time you get a "yes!" you know you got what BOTH OF YOU WANT!

And for the record I don't belive in sex before marrige, so i just came up with the most reasonable solution that doesn't invole changing those perverts viewpoints...good gosh what is wrong with me!?

[Tara]

From what I can tell if it were on the beach and you replace the cosplay with a bikini, it would be both peoples fault. The girl is guilty of tempting the boy and the boy is guilty of lusting the girl!

This is exactly the kind of thing that Scarred Sun was talking about.  If a boy can't control his urges, that's literally his own damn fault.  Do men just think that a woman's body doesn't feel anything?  Like, if I'm at the beach, it's probably hot as hell outside, so I probably don't want to be wearing too much, because boob sweat isn't fun.  Oh wait, but I have to endure this miserable heat because men can't control their hormones.  Reason #5168484 to just stay indoors.

[Nepenthe]

If you are prolongedly staring like a horn dog at someone you don't know who is dressed appropriately for the situation, you're a creep. And no, it's not the girl's fault for tempting the guy for wearing a bikini at the beach or a cosplay at a convention. What the flying fuck?

You know why girls have far less of a reputation for doing this shit despite the fact that we have sexual urges too for the most part? It's a combination of first hand experience while growing up in a society that expresses virtues of self-respect. While the latter is problematic in our own displays of sexuality, it nonetheless means it's fucking obvious to women in general not to do half the shit men do towards others. Cat-calling, prolonged staring, touching people without permission- don't fucking do it. Use the head attached to your neck for just a second.

[Monkey Destruction Switch]

Personally, I've never seen the Sonic fandom as having less female members than male members, really. But especially after reading this, I can see better how some might come to that misconception. Probably a lot of it just depends on the assumptions people make, or the places they're looking. But the fact that at least a bit of it could have to do with females wanting to avoid harassment is an ugly reminder of how awful and ugly the human race can be. Some people are just jerks.

There are plenty of female Sonic fans if you know where to look - like shadowhunt said, creating fanart, crafting fanfictions, posting on Tumblr, and much more. It kind of weirds me out that some could come to the conclusion that there just are no visible female Sonic fans, but it may be because of frequenting different circles. Overall, I'm not the most active fandom member, but the places I do go house an ample supply of female fans.

And...well, OK, this is just going further off-topic, I guess, but I feel like I want to address the whole issue about males' responsibility for their actions, because being a rather conservative Christian, I hear this kind of argument of women being responsible for men's thoughts and actions a LOT in the circles I frequent, and I'm really sick and tired of it. It's just utter garbage which has no basis in our faith (or anything) whatsoever. If someone thinks or does something wrong, it's their own freaking fault. It's absolutely ridiculous to claim that half the blame for YOUR wrongdoing goes to the person whom you wronged. And I say this as a person who believes in exercising modesty. I'm not doing it because men can't control themselves, I'm doing it as a reflection of my own beliefs about what I believe the proper context of sexuality is.

Even if some men have a hard time controlling their emotions, at the end of the day, it's still their own responsibility. No one else can do it for them, and no one else should be expected to do it for them. The very idea is ridiculous and should be considered extremely demeaning to men.

I'm sorry if I'm getting further off-topic, I guess maybe I needed to vent or something, since I hear this sort of garbage a lot in my ideological and cultural context.

[Tani Coyote]

Throwing my hat in on "control your hormones."

 

Unless I'm mistaken, most of you are against abstinence only because it's not a realistic approach (because people can't control their hormones). Likewise, when people see something that arouses them, it's kind of difficult to just stop it. Sure, one can look away... but it's the beach. There are tons of people you will unconsciously ogle.

 

Allow me to destroy the idea this is sexist in intent, origin, etc. either. When I'm at the beach? Sometimes I see guys who I don't exactly find ugly. And I do sometimes have some trouble breaking my gaze, though I do manage to do so. Objectively, there are some people who just look really amazing.

 

The way I see it, this is just a natural part of the beach. We're all stripped half-naked or near-naked, exposing ourselves (never mind how a lot of the people are wet). Unless you've got no libido or are demisexual, you're going to probably experience some arousal. This is perfectly natural.

 

Now, I was always taught it was impolite to stare, clothed or naked. So no matter how much eyecandy a person's body may offer you, the proper thing to do is look away. You most likely took a mental photograph anyway if they were really that amazing looking, so there's that.

 

The ultimate idea here is respect. That person is exposing themselves and by golly are they hot. But you're probably exposed too and if you aren't, you probably wouldn't want people staring at you if you were. It's a reciprocal thing. Do unto others, etc.

 

...

 

Now, with regards to the OP, I think that pretty much sums it up. Women feel marginalized so they hide the fact they are women when they can. It's no different than the many women who would pretend to be men to get into jobs like the Army in the past. Women are conscious of gender realities... and they're very intelligent in finding ways to work within them to their advantage.

Edited August 1, 2015 by Sly the Tasmanian Ogilvie

[Bowbowis]

I might not be the most qualified person to speak on this subject, but I can say this: Human beings are a stubborn lot, we don't much like change, and when we perceive that the status quo is being threatened we tend to react. Violently. Cultures and subcultures have inertia, just as much as any physical object; the larger they are and the more momentum they have the harder it is to stop or redirect them. Because of that traveling the road to change is a long, grueling, ordeal, it takes more than a handful of people on soapboxes to effect any real change and it ain't gonna happen over night; you need to be smart about it. The cardinal sin people commit when trying to bring about change is trying to do it all at once, trying to force too much too fast is just going to make you enemies, even among people who actually agree with what you're saying, thanks to knee-jerk reactions causing people to go on defense before really hearing what you have to say. This is especially true with gamers; video games are still the media's favorite scapegoat for all of society's ills and as such gamers are already primed to get defensive at the slightest provocation, they have too, lest Fire Emblem be construed as a training ground for terrorists.

Ultimately bringing change is a balancing act, too gentle and people will ignore you, too forceful and people will resist you; the ideal is of course somewhere in the middle, forceful enough to make yourself heard, but gentle enough not to drum up major resistance. I can't pretend to have a magical cure for sexism but if I were to make a suggestion to female gamers it would be this: Increase your visibility. Now by that I don't mean to launch any major campaigns, or really to call attention to yourself at all, quite the opposite in fact; simply put on the headset and try to fade in and become anther player in the game, ideally we would reach the point where women playing video games stops being a big deal and just becomes accepted as a fact of life. I'll freely admit it's not a perfect solution; things would no doubt be ugly to start and would likely get worse before they got better. But then such is life, rarely is significant long-term gain achieved without first accepting short term setbacks.

Even if progress can't be made now that doesn't mean it will never happen. The beauty of humanity is that nothing is static, just like an old and worn shark tooth will eventually fall out and be replaced with a new one so too does each new generation of humans replace the previous one; our children will one day grow to supplant us and their children will in turn grow to supplant them. Each successive generation is a new chance to pass on the best of what we are and to warn against repeating the mistakes we've made. Even if the people of today are too stuck in their ways to accept change that doesn't mean that we can't work to ensure that the people of tomorrow are free of such prejudices... Really the message here is don't raise your kids to be shitheads. Okay?

Finally there's the possibility that I have no fucking clue what I'm talking about, in which case kindly forget I said anything.

[Tani Coyote]

I might not be the most qualified person to speak on this subject, but I can say this: Human beings are a stubborn lot, we don't much like change, and when we perceive that the status quo is being threatened we tend to react. Violently. Cultures and subcultures have inertia, just as much as any physical object; the larger they are and the more momentum they have the harder it is to stop or redirect them. Because of that traveling the road to change is a long, grueling, ordeal, it takes more than a handful of people on soapboxes to effect any real change and it ain't gonna happen over night; you need to be smart about it. The cardinal sin people commit when trying to bring about change is trying to do it all at once, trying to force too much too fast is just going to make you enemies, even among people who actually agree with what you're saying, thanks to knee-jerk reactions causing people to go on defense before really hearing what you have to say. This is especially true with gamers; video games are still the media's favorite scapegoat for all of society's ills and as such gamers are already primed to get defensive at the slightest provocation, they have too, lest Fire Emblem be construed as a training ground for terrorists.

Ultimately bringing change is a balancing act, too gentle and people will ignore you, too forceful and people will resist you; the ideal is of course somewhere in the middle, forceful enough to make yourself heard, but gentle enough not to drum up major resistance. I can't pretend to have a magical cure for sexism but if I were to make a suggestion to female gamers it would be this: Increase your visibility. Now by that I don't mean to launch any major campaigns, or really to call attention to yourself at all, quite the opposite in fact; simply put on the headset and try to fade in and become anther player in the game, ideally we would reach the point where women playing video games stops being a big deal and just becomes accepted as a fact of life. I'll freely admit it's not a perfect solution; things would no doubt be ugly to start and would likely get worse before they got better. But then such is life, rarely is significant long-term gain achieved without first accepting short term setbacks.

Even if progress can't be made now that doesn't mean it will never happen. The beauty of humanity is that nothing is static, just like an old and worn shark tooth will eventually fall out and be replaced with a new one so too does each new generation of humans replace the previous one; our children will one day grow to supplant us and their children will in turn grow to supplant them. Each successive generation is a new chance to pass on the best of what we are and to warn against repeating the mistakes we've made. Even if the people of today are too stuck in their ways to accept change that doesn't mean that we can't work to ensure that the people of tomorrow are free of such prejudices... Really the message here is don't raise your kids to be shitheads. Okay?

Finally there's the possibility that I have no fucking clue what I'm talking about, in which case kindly forget I said anything.

I would concur. While invisibility makes sense on an individual level, it's catastrophic on a demographic scale.

 

We learned about the experiences of Iroquois women last week in my history course. Interesting thing happened here: the histories were primarily written by men, so even though half of all fur traders were women, the fur trader is commonly associated with masculinity, because women were always written down as "friend/relative/etc. of x" instead of by name.

 

But it wasn't entirely their fault either. In Iroquois tradition, when a diplomat came, it was customary to send a diplomat of the same sex to make them feel uncomfortable. European diplomats were always men of course, so even Iroquois political bodies dominated by women would appoint a male representative to meet with them... the result? Europeans got a healthy dose of confirmation bias; it appeared women were subordinate to men in Indian politics as much as European. Had European men seen that women could run a society with considerable competence, it might have changed their ideas on sex, or at least made them doubt them a little.

 

Overall though, I think you're spot on that women don't even need to make a huge point about being women. They just approach the matter casually... and a lot of people will likely find their perceptions changed.

 

Let me speak from personal experience. As the years have gone by, I've encountered more and more female gamers. And I'll be frank - it was initially a mindfuck since I'm used to it being a male-dominated culture. Even now, I still find it odd when it turns out a gamer is a woman (similarly, I'm usually surprised when I find out someone isn't white). But women gamers aren't that different at all. We share laughs. We share rage. We share trash talk. I know some women even go so far as to embrace sexist jokes (e.g. calling someone who shows weakness a "girl," now that's a real mindfuck).

 

And the conclusion from this? I determined there was no reason a woman couldn't be an avid gamer. They're just as cool to talk and hang with. And they didn't have to be feminist activists to get this idea through either; they just had to be themselves.

 

I will say though, I do see a great irony possible in all this. I think the growing number of woman gamers is probably motivated by the fact many continue to be homemakers, granting them more time to play than men on average. And this increased exposure to women's perspectives as a result... might actually help dispel a lot of sexism.

Edited August 1, 2015 by Sly the Tasmanian Ogilvie

[Dr. Mechano]

But if a boy goes in awe because he sees a hot girl and starts staring...to be honest some boys have trouble controling their sexual desires and can't help it, and I would hardly call that "harrasing"! From what I can tell if it were on the beach and you replace the cosplay with a bikini, it would be both peoples fault. The girl is guilty of tempting the boy and the boy is guilty of lusting the girl! However if you go to a cosplay you should be expected to see that kind of stuff so boys need get their BS together in that case!

There is a difference between glancing and leering. 

Noticing an attractive person is a fine, natural reaction. Staring agape at them, following them around, making crude comments about them, and especially touching them without their consent goes far beyond merely finding them attractive. This sort of thing happens at conventions (and indeed, just about everywhere) a lot.

I refuse to to accept "boys will be boys" or "they just can't help it" as excuses. Men are not base animals without any self-control, and I think we ought to have higher expectations for ourselves than that.

[Wittymations]

Reading some of these confessions, I didn't realize it was that bad for females on the Internet. I mean, yeah, I expected the odd random Youtuber making an ass out of himself, for instance. But never so... excessive, I suppose.

Makes me want to do an experiment where I adopt a female persona for a time and see how the Internet reacts to me. See how bad it gets.

[Danj86]

There is a difference between glancing and leering. 

Noticing an attractive person is a fine, natural reaction. Staring agape at them, following them around, making crude comments about them, and especially touching them without their consent goes far beyond merely finding them attractive. This sort of thing happens at conventions (and indeed, just about everywhere) a lot.

I'm glad you said that Mechano, after reading the other posts I was starting to think that I might've been guilty of being a pervert or something myself...

I attended my very first Comic-Con last month and I noticed a really beautiful women cosplaying as Harley Quinn. I didn't even realize I was staring until I saw her a couple more times during the event, I don't think it had anything to do with sexual desires or anything, although I can't deny that I found her very attractive, I just wanted to talk to her, to ask if I could take a picture of her but I was too nervous and ended up just standing there.

I couldn't forgive myself if my own insecurities resulted in somebody feeling uncomfortable in any way. In the end I did finally speak to her before I left and she was happy to pose for a photo.

I've also noticed that my behaviour does change towards a person once I confirm a gender. I'm probably more nervous speaking to girls while with boys I don't change at all. It's not a deliberate act and now I'm wondering if these traits are annoying to others.

[ElectricAngel]

I am a transgirl. Sonic online fan communities are actually the places that I first started to identify myself as female and use female gender pronouns when I was 10/11 years old, and it was the source of a lot of harassment, predictably. It was combined sexism and homophobia, particularly the latter. People didn't believe that I was female and necessitated proof for validation of my identity, which at the time, when I still presented as my birth gender completely, did not exist. I assume that this is the issue surrounding a lot of Sonic fangirls.

As another transgirl on SSMB, I've also had this problem. Granted, not on SSMB thankfully, but on other websites. I find it very annoying when I need to "prove" myself, as if I'm presented as a fake. Be it a "fake girl" or "fake gamer", it's annoying either way. Having people spamming me for pics of my body makes me horribly uncomfortable and makes me see those guys as just people really desperate for a girl. And on the whole "fake gamer" thing, apparently if I don't play a game on the hardest setting and beat it with my eyes closed, I'm not a real gamer. :/ Ok well, that's an exaggeration but you get the point. 

 

What's disconcerting is that it's spread across fanboy culture in general and not just limited to Sonic. Cosplay conventions and expos have become more and more for perverts looking to get off to the 900th Lara Croft or Hatsune Miku; even girls who cosplay as characters who show very little skin whatsoever are still being preyed on. For some guys, it's mostly about their anime crush "coming to life" and how they can fulfill their fetish by hopefully getting with another cosplayer, or ogling at them creepily. This is partly the reason I have yet to go to a cos convention. I've had enough trouble getting harassed by others in my daily life without having to watch Naruto #9 cream his pants at the sight of anything that isn't male - or dead - or at least partially decayed. God damn.

 

Cosplay perverts and fanboys are essentially the real life version of Pygmalion from Greco-Roman culture. They build a statue to bang and then want it brought to life so they can use it to fulfill their endless libidos.

I've always wanted to go to a con and cosplay as either Kagamine Rin or Hatune Miku (Append ver.) but stuff like this make me more afraid than excited to try it out. I've heard plenty of horrible stories of girls getting harassed by boys at cons. What disgusts me even more is how when you see a picture of a girl cosplaying on social media, there are tons of comments going "surprise. it has a dick", "it's a trap", "that's probably a dude, you know". And I just feel so horrible for the people who cosplayed because boys have to be this stubborn and stupid. It feels like they're going "if you have a dick, you're not a girl" which offends me as a transgirl, and "i didn't get to meet that girl that makes me horny, so i'll bully her online". Like, really. What's the reasoning behind this behaviour? It's so immature. 

 

Personally, I've never seen the Sonic fandom as having less female members than male members, really. But especially after reading this, I can see better how some might come to that misconception. Probably a lot of it just depends on the assumptions people make, or the places they're looking. But the fact that at least a bit of it could have to do with females wanting to avoid harassment is an ugly reminder of how awful and ugly the human race can be. Some people are just jerks.

There are plenty of female Sonic fans if you know where to look - like shadowhunt said, creating fanart, crafting fanfictions, posting on Tumblr, and much more. It kind of weirds me out that some could come to the conclusion that there just are no visible female Sonic fans, but it may be because of frequenting different circles. Overall, I'm not the most active fandom member, but the places I do go house an ample supply of female fans.

And...well, OK, this is just going further off-topic, I guess, but I feel like I want to address the whole issue about males' responsibility for their actions, because being a rather conservative Christian, I hear this kind of argument of women being responsible for men's thoughts and actions a LOT in the circles I frequent, and I'm really sick and tired of it. It's just utter garbage which has no basis in our faith (or anything) whatsoever. If someone thinks or does something wrong, it's their own freaking fault. It's absolutely ridiculous to claim that half the blame for YOUR wrongdoing goes to the person whom you wronged. And I say this as a person who believes in exercising modesty. I'm not doing it because men can't control themselves, I'm doing it as a reflection of my own beliefs about what I believe the proper context of sexuality is.

Even if some men have a hard time controlling their emotions, at the end of the day, it's still their own responsibility. No one else can do it for them, and no one else should be expected to do it for them. The very idea is ridiculous and should be considered extremely demeaning to men.

I'm sorry if I'm getting further off-topic, I guess maybe I needed to vent or something, since I hear this sort of garbage a lot in my ideological and cultural context.

I've personally met more female than male Sonic fans online. There are plenty on Tumblr too, all really nice people (of those who I've met). And that bit about men controlling themselves, yeah. For some reason in this day and age, sex is everything to men. I don't get why, but it is. I can only assume they get really creepy and desperate with female anime/video game fans is because they share an interest and so they think it will be easier for them to get laid. I think. I can't see what's going on in their heads, but that's how I view it. 

I think they just need to understand that everyone, regardless of gender, has feelings. If you're being a creep, expect to get slapped. They need to put themselves in other peoples' shoes and see how they would like it if they were constantly hit on or annoyed with dirty questions. 

 

There is a difference between glancing and leering. 

Noticing an attractive person is a fine, natural reaction. Staring agape at them, following them around, making crude comments about them, and especially touching them without their consent goes far beyond merely finding them attractive. This sort of thing happens at conventions (and indeed, just about everywhere) a lot.

I refuse to to accept "boys will be boys" or "they just can't help it" as excuses. Men are not base animals without any self-control, and I think we ought to have higher expectations for ourselves than that.

THIS. SO MUCH THIS. I had an unfortunate incident at school once where a boy came up to me and sat really close to me and started stroking my thigh, really close to my crotch and was asking me dirty questions. I had never felt so uncomfortable and harassed in my life before. And I was seriously freaked out and scared as to what he would do. Thankfully I did the right thing and just called him off and left. 

That's not to say all men are like that. I know more people in person who respect others and treat people equally. Creeps are mostly found online in chat rooms or messaging apps and stuff. 

[MamboCat]

As a kid growing up, I had a loooot of Sonic stuff, and I don't recall the toys, games, merch etc being exclusively marketed towards boys (I think stuff like tees and other clothing were...) so at the time it seemed quite accessible to me. Having said that, as a kid growing up being quite loud about being a Sonic fan, I did get bullied quite a lot, especially as I got older and apparently should've been more interested in boybands(!).... so I think in that bullying there was a gender aspect going on. I didn't have any friends who were also into Sonic, let alone any girls... so as a kid being a Sonic fan was kinda lonely.

Discovering fellow fans online, I do notice there are more guys to girls, but part of me wonders if that's just an Internet thing in general; whether some girls and women consider it safe to display their gender. We don't exactly get the best reception, in forums or in online gaming. On SSMB however, I notice there are female fans and that they aren't afraid to show it, so yeah... go, girls! *high fives*

Also; megapoints for mentioning peannlui/Leeann Hamilton. Her art is faaaaaan-fuckin'-tastic.

Edited August 1, 2015 by MamboCat

[Mogtaki]

I've received harassment in the form of guys trying to 'get to know me more'. In other words they try to get close to me in a way I am uncomfortable with.

I gotta say though, when it comes to Sonic I notice way more females being in the fandom than males. I don't know if it's just a coincidence, but I don't particularly see lots of guys other than those on the forum and only one Sonic artist I know out of many.

Maybe it's the games I play, I dunno, but when it comes to gaming my gender seems to try to get to know me more or just treat me as another person.