Sonic Unleashed

[NoirSuede]

Well, I'm not sure SSMB had already had this thread before.

I think Sonic Unleashed is a good game, but most people doesn't like werehog gimmicks at all.

And there were supposed to have some controversies, but it didn't happen after the game's release. Why? Because there were traditional houses in Adabat, just like in my country, but since Sonic fans thought that Adabat was inspired from just Southeast Asia, there hasn't had any controversy. I think it's too late to do it right now.

I don't think annyone from Indonesia would raise a fuss over Adabat considering that the 16-bit console wars never happened there (we got bumrushed by Sony), which means that no-one there really knows Sonic.

 

Also you can just say that Sonic starts in Padang (because of the long houses) and then he runs to Cambodia at the end of Adabat day.

[AshGreninJovan]

I don't think annyone from Indonesia would raise a fuss over Adabat considering that the 16-bit console wars never happened there (we got bumrushed by Sony), which means that no-one there really knows Sonic.

 

Also you can just say that Sonic starts in Padang (because of the long houses) and then he runs to Cambodia at the end of Adabat day.

However, some people who live in Indonesia, including you, myself, and some of my friends, has known Sonic since the 6th-gen console war, when Sega was a third-party game publisher until now.

And don't forget about Phuket, Thailand in the middle of Adabat.

[Roger_van_der_weide]

Funny thing about Sonic Unleashed, ever since games like Action Hank and Tembo the badass elephant have been appearing, I start to notice a lot of reviewers grumble that modern Sonic games no longer have that rhythm and speed based action anymore, where you're on the move non stop and it's all about navigating trough a landscape in one fluent movement.

Which confused me, because Sonic games were never really all about being constant on the move, all Sonic games have moments where you're forced to stand still and wait for platforms to move or observe the level structure.
In fact, everytime I see Sonic newbies play Sonic 1 or Sonic generations, they're doing fine with green hill zone. But then as soon as the actual platforming begins, they're completely baffled that they actually need to do platform stuff and can't just keep mindlessly racing trough.

So outside the Sonic fandom, Sonic is regarded to be more of an high speed obstacle course rhytm game, rather then a speed and adreline fueled action game/ platformer.
And really, the only Sonic game that truly goes with that logic and has that gameplay type for most of it's running time is Daytime Sonic in Sonic Unleashed.

Ignoring the Hubs and Werehog, Day time Sonic is constantly on the move, and unlike Generations and Colors, even the 2d sections are designed to keep Sonic moving.
So if anything, the Unleashed day time stages are the closest Sonic comes to the general public's expectation.

Anyway, as for me, being mostly a casual gamer who plays for fun rather then challenge, I love the Wii version of Unleashed being mostly easy and easy going fun, and found the HD version nightmarish because of the challenge.
As for the Werehog stages, I don't mind them at all, it's the same as I consider the shooting stages in Adventure 2.
Not the reason why I play the game, but perfectly accepteble action stages I'm more then happy to play trough as long as I'm rewarded with a new awesome Sonic stage.
The envirements are a little too much on the real world side, altough I do especially love the European city levels, who they really ramp up and exagerate how houses are build on top of one other and turn seemingly realistic stages in a slightly abstract universe in how a child would see those places.

Exactly the kind of world design philosophy I want in a Sonic game. But yeah, could have used a few more fantastical Eggman base stages.

As for the story, great idea but weak execution. I really hate how nothing has weight or consequence. After the opening, everything just casually happens and nobody cares about anything really.
Eggman finally gets his Eggmanland, his big motivation since Adventure, and it's presented with no oomph or comment at all.
He just magically furfilled his lifelong dream offscreen. Booh.
But compared to the "Sonic doing non-stop stand up comedian routines while the plot evaporates into nothing" stories of later games, Unleashed's story is not too bad.

It was a great game in historical context, giving Shadow a break from his overbearign appearences and finally persenting a moer sleek and finished gameplay engine for Sonic, and it's still pretty good now.
If only a perfect example of the greatest struggle Sonic games have been tripping over since the days of the megadrive/ genesis games have ended:
How to expand a 2 hour platform game to a 40 hour experience?
People just don't tolerate Any form of HUB or slower action levels in a Sonic game, yet also don't tolerate a pure Sonic speed game that's over in 2 hours or the game makign you replay the same stage.

People just demand a Sonic game that can somehow uphold the expensive and hard to develop level design and action from a speed level for 40 hours, which is impossible.

Edited August 30, 2015 by Roger_van_der_weide

[NoirSuede]

However, some people who live in Indonesia, including you, myself, and some of my friends, has known Sonic since the 6th-gen console war, when Sega was a third-party game publisher until now.

And don't forget about Phuket, Thailand in the middle of Adabat.

So basically Sonic starts in Padang, then goes to Phuket by running, and then finishes in Angkor Wat ?

[Diesel]

I think the game is garbage.

The only fun part about it were the Daytime stages, and even those were very flawed. The Homing Attack needlessly takes two buttons and doing a boost in mid air has the same controls as doing a homing attack, which often leads to many cheap deaths. The QTEs are also needlessly frustrating and the level design can be flat out bad in some places.

Then, there's the Werehog and hubs, which are bad altogether.

[AshGreninJovan]

So basically Sonic starts in Padang, then goes to Phuket by running, and then finishes in Angkor Wat ?

Because Sonic runs on the water around big rocks at the middle of Adabat/Jungle Joyride (PS3 & X360 versions).

[LindseyWalker]

You know, I hate Unleashed too. It's the only Sonic game I never completed. Maybe that was partly to do with fatigue of how bad the franchise had fallen, but I could just couldn't force myself to complete it. I actually managed to complete '06 too, even if it was just to see how fucked up the story got (and I wasn't disappointed)! 

Unleashed has kinda got more love with the fanbase in recent years but I can't understand why because I think it's easily the worst game after Sonic '06. The storyline is generic morning cartoon stuff, at least as far as I played with the worst voice acting I have ever had to endure. I'm talking about Chip. I hate his character, his dialogue and that absurd voice. He's by far my most hated character in the game and he single-handedly ruins the story for me. I've heard people defend Unleashed's plot, but I can't see where they are coming from.

The daytime stages were great in concept but someone who is literally the biggest moron at Sonic Team assigned the Boost to the Homing Attack button. This was totally unnecessary and is mind-bogglingly incompetent. The fact Generations changed this and added an air-dash mechanic back to the Homing Attack, ala Sonic Adventure, is the key reason why Generations is significantly better than Unleashed. The levels in Unleashed were terrible too, very stop and start and throwing death pits with next to no warning constantly. Generations is such a massive improvement over Unleashed it's actually really impressive.

Of course, the game has the obvious problems. The fact the Werehog takes on average 60% of the game time and it's a terrible God of War Clone that has nothing to do with Sonic, the way the game forces you to collect Medals (and to go back to the Werehog stages one's already completed!) to progress in the game to artificially lengthen the experience and the boring Hub Worlds that serve no purpose other than padding.

Man, I can't stand Unleashed. I have no idea why some people in this fanbase defend this game. I'd love to hear some good arguments defending it.

Edited August 30, 2015 by LindseyWalker

[Roger_van_der_weide]

Man, I can't stand Unleashed. I have no idea why some people in this fanbase defend this game. I'd love to hear some good arguments defending it.

Well, Sonic's always been more about adreline and spectacle then perfection.
So a lot of Sonic fans can forgive a lot of flaws provided they get the thrills they crave, and Unleashed certainly has thrills.
Not to mention Unleashed's reputation was also boosted by the "well at least it's not Sonic '06" mindframe.
And finally, the people I talked too who love this game mostly love it because of the intense trial and error gameplay and the fact if you play the daytime stages right, it creates that rhythm where you smoothly move from start to finish in one go.

All that said, I agree with you, I vastly prefer Sonic Generations over Unleashed too.
Still, to disregard it entirely over it's mistakes is a bit harsh.
No perfect games exist in the Sonic the hedgehog series. Maybe Sonic 2, but any experienced internet cynic can probably burn that game to the ground too if they want.

As for the Werehog, it's not really BAD, is it?
Sure it feels extremely out of place in a Sonic game, especailly with the Huge sharp contrast with the boost gameplay, but I think most of the Unleashed fans are capable of going into the Werehog stages in a diffrent state of mind.
Some people can just adjust their brains depending on what type of gameplay they're presented, while some just can't seem to escape that "GOTTA GO FAST GOTTA GO FAST GOTTA GO FAST" adreline mentality.

Taking the Werehog stages aside as it's own thing, I consider it mostly.... Accepteble? Run of the mill action.
Nothing good, but not bad either. If anything, a moment to catch your breath from the daytime stages.
Only when you want to get a high score, it becomes a nightmare. Resetting your points when you die, and the darn stages always save up their intense instant death platform sections till the end of the stage.....

[LindseyWalker]

Well, Sonic's always been more about adreline and spectacle then perfection.So a lot of Sonic fans can forgive a lot of flaws provided they get the thrills they crave, and Unleashed certainly has thrills.
Not to mention Unleashed's reputation was also boosted by the "well at least it's not Sonic '06" mindframe.
And finally, the people I talked too who love this game mostly love it because of the intense trial and error gameplay and the fact if you play the daytime stages right, it creates that rhythm where you smoothly move from start to finish in one go.

All that said, I agree with you, I vastly prefer Sonic Generations over Unleashed too.
Still, to disregard it entirely over it's mistakes is a bit harsh.
No perfect games exist in the Sonic the hedgehog series. Maybe Sonic 2, but any experienced internet cynic can probably burn that game to the ground too if they want.

As for the Werehog, it's not really BAD, is it?
Sure it feels extremely out of place in a Sonic game, especailly with the Huge sharp contrast with the boost gameplay, but I think most of the Unleashed fans are capable of going into the Werehog stages in a diffrent state of mind.
Some people can just adjust their brains depending on what type of gameplay they're presented, while some just can't seem to escape that "GOTTA GO FAST GOTTA GO FAST GOTTA GO FAST" adreline mentality.

Taking the Werehog stages aside as it's own thing, I consider it mostly.... Accepteble? Run of the mill action.
Nothing good, but not bad either. If anything, a moment to catch your breath from the daytime stages.
Only when you want to get a high score, it becomes a nightmare. Resetting your points when you die, and the darn stages always save up their intense instant death platform sections till the end of the stage.....

Hi, I just want to start by saying I love your Youtube Videos. Keep up the good work man!

Well, you are right that no Sonic game is perfect. I'd say Sonic 3 comes closest and even that game has Sandopolis Zone! 

The problem is, it's not that Unleashed has some mistakes, the entire game is fundamentally flawed. It's a trainwreck as far as I'm concerned. I too appreciate that the game shook up the Sonic franchise because it badly needed it after Sonic '06. And, hey, I like the concept of Unleashed, which as far as I'm concerned was met by Colours and Generations. It's the execution that lets it down, for the reasons I've given above. I consider trial and error gameplay a cardinal sin, especially when there's no ability to gauge or react to stuff.

As for the Werehog, I'd argue that it's badly made even if it was taken as its own product. The levels are far too long and overstay their welcome (it took me 25 minutes on average to beat the levels) and the levels are very repetitive brawling and don't  offer the variation and flair that God of War does. I like the platforming in them, but they are overwhelmed by the brawling and are too simplistic far me to enjoy. The problem is that even if the Werehog is run of the mill, which I'd argue it isn't (I think it's well below par), that's simply not good enough. I'd take a game that does brawling well over the Werehog any day such as Ninja Gaiden, Devil May Cry or, hell, even Dynasty Warriors. Sonic Team simply aren't good at making spectacle fighter games, they have no experience in it, they should be making the games they are (or at least should be) good at.

That's without even going into the marketing of a Sonic game and what the consumer expects. I don't want a fighting game for Sonic in the same way that I don't want a flight-sim game when I buy Bayonetta. It's not what the team behind Sonic are good at. Can you get surprised by a franchise spreading off into different genres? Absolutely! Metal Gear Rising is a fantastic game that plays nothing like traditional Metal Gears. The difference is that Kojima realised he needed to out-source to Platinum Games to get the quality level he desired. Sonic Team didn't do this.

I love your content, but you won't be able to change my mind on this one  .

 

Edited August 30, 2015 by LindseyWalker

[The Man On The Inside]

In 2008, the series was in a strange place. It was the first game since the 06/Secret Rings era, and the series had a chance to pick things back up again. It needed something that said "That was just a blip guys, normal service has resumed." By 2008 the franchise was developing that reputation it still has for being a crapshoot of crazy ideas that don't fit the series at all. It needed something that gamers could get behind, something that silenced the naysayers.

Sonic the Werehog was not that something. In no universe does the werehog idea make people say "wow, sega are really getting their act together!" After an event like 06, you need to seriously consider how to win people over again, and Sonic the Werehog was probably about the worst thing Sega could have done at that time. Remember, non-fans, reviewers, etc. just said: "I mean....really? A werehog?"

I remember I was one of those people who kept saying "It doesn't matter; it might play well and that's what counts". Yes I know, captain hindsight and all that.The thing is, in the eyes of the general gaming public, all Sonic Unleashed did was reinforce the narrative that Sonic was the perfect example of a "fall from grace". It could play well ( and many are agreed that it's a functional GoW clone that's at least playable), but it's still a completely absurd thing to exist.

The werehog was just simply and fundamentally a terrible idea, in every single way, after Sonic 06. The bigger review sites simply said "omg lol guys werehog exists gg sega lelel people actually like this top kek" and that was that. Of course the game deserves a bit more credit than that (strong enough sonic formula to go into future games where it was later refined, utterly amazing graphics, IMO long-overdue character cull, world-building, music etc.) but these things didn't make the werehog disappear.

So that gets the retrospective out of the way. As for that actual game, people have already expressed opinions that match mine. Padding, medals, hubs, chip, story, day:night ratio, VA etc aren't great. It's a fans-only 6/10 that compared to 06 was a godsend, which is probably why, IMO, you could argue that it's remembered a bit too fondly. In 2008 I think I summed it up pretty well: it's "neither the travesty we feared, nor the masterpiece we wanted, which the franchise so desperately needs."

And still needs.

[Roger_van_der_weide]

Fair points, fair points.
The Werehog stages WERE way too long, I agree.
Tough I mostly remember the Wii version, which cut the Werehog stages up in seperate acts, so that helped.
Well, outside that each world now had one day time stage and three Night stages, but yeah...

And it's indeed weird they went for another gimmick after Sonic 06.
Poor Sega, eternally in their "we need a new hook to be relevant" mindset.
All because they have no idea how to expand a Sonic game to 40 hours.
Which is why I'll always defend Sonic generations' short completion time.
A short game is the price to pay if you don't want padding garbage in your Sonic game.
Sega's at their best when they make a sleek action packed arcade style game.

I desperately hope that the 2016 Sonic game they're undoubtly working on now is finally going to be a clean Sonic game.
It's insane to think we never had a clean non-gimmick 3d Sonic game.
Sonic Generations being the closest.
But yeah, let's not hold our breath for a "master piece".
Especially considering the last few games bombed  and Sega's probably running low on funds now.

I'm hoping they continue on Generation's footsteps.
It's the one with the most potential. Slightly better balance, more 3d exploration/ 2d pinball physics.
Less blocky platforming and boosting. Sleek energetic adventure presentation. The envirement interactivity from Lost world.
I see potential.
 

[Cyalume]

Werehog wasn't quite my cup of tea, but the overall presentation of the game itself is what really turned me off. Not to imply that other Sonic games didn't have cheesy storylines and whatnot, but this game in particular just rubbed me the wrong way. Couldn't get behind the Professor Pickle and Chip were annoying at best to me.

The daytime stages themselves were good fun. I tend to ignore Unleashed in favor of the Unleashed Project on PC.

[azoo]

I find Unleashed to be good fun. It ain't amazing, but it's not horrible. MAJOR step up from the two or three games that preceeded it, though.

The atmosphere to the environments are so warm and lovable, the NPCs are fun to talk to (with very fun dialogue options), the music is great and at times pretty captivating, and though the QTEs (god the QTEs), medal collecting and the general idea of the Werehog were just bad bad bad ideas in general, the boost gameplay and Werehog's gameplay in themselves were both actually pretty fun, though a tiny bit on the clunky side. Really something to get used to though, since neither are anything like the games that came before it.

Overall a pretty good experience, I'd say. Not sure how it (especially the HD version) comes anywhere close to "second to Sonic 06". At all. It did have the problem of needing that 'hook' to attract other audiences they never needed in, and that was a load of crap for sure. But honestly, all Unleashed did was show that there was a light at the end of the tunnel... at least for that time being.

While Generations improved on it's mechanics though I can't say I really want any of the gameplay bits of the game to make much of a comeback. Not a fan of boost gameplay in the long term of things; I'd honestly prefer a game that soaks in the more classic elements of Sonic's gameplay like rolling and Spin Dashing and building speed in a slopey wonderland, but that's just me. I'd kill for hubworlds and NPCs like Unleashed's again, though. That was wonderful.

---

Also, merging topics with our other topic related to Unleashed (I could've swore we had another topic related to it, but I guess this will do...)

 

Edited August 30, 2015 by Azoo

[LindseyWalker]

I find Unleashed to be good fun. It ain't amazing, but it's not horrible. MAJOR step up from the two or three games that preceeded it, though.

The atmosphere to the environments are so warm and lovable, the NPCs are fun to talk to (with very fun dialogue options), the music is great and at times pretty captivating, and though the QTEs and the general idea of the Werehog are just bad bad bad ideas in general, the boost gameplay and Werehog's gameplay in itself are both actually pretty fun, though a tiny bit clunky.

Overall a pretty good experience, I'd say. Not sure how it (especially the HD version) comes anywhere close to "second to Sonic 06". At all.

Also, merging topics with our other topic related to Unleashed (I could've swore we had another topic related to it, but I guess this will do...)

 

The environments are great, I love the art design in Unleashed. I also think the music is pretty brilliant and a massive return to what I associate with the series after Adventure. I disagree completely with your other points.

That said, I think the game is irredeemably terrible for all the other reasons I listed above, that's why I would call it 'second to '06'. That being said, it's still far better than both Sonic '06 and Sonic Boom, even if that's not saying much.

[azoo]

And I can't really blame you, because no one should have the patience to play through the Werehog stages. And yeah the boost gameplay got better with Generations, but just soaking in their merits instead of looking at outside biases, I can't say it was a bad experience by any means. I had fun, and in the end that's all that really matters to me.

And the hubs are going to have to be something I disagree with you on whole-heartedly.

Call it pointless, but sometimes bits and pieces of a game aren't necessarily meant to build progress. Some are meant to liven up and add to the atmosphere, and I think the hubs in Unleashed do that exceptionally well for the most part! Though I'm not going to deny that slowing down Sonic's speed in them to a walk and keeping them separate from the Entrance Stages were both bad ideas, because they were, but that shouldn't render them as some unexcusable garbage that never needs to be done again.

 

Edited August 30, 2015 by Azoo

[LindseyWalker]

And yeah the boost gameplay got better with Generations, but basing both on their merits instead of looking at outside biases, I can't say it was a bad experience by any means. I had fun, and in the end that's all that really matters to me.

I liked some of the Boost levels despite their linearity. It's the horrible controls and the stop and start trial and error that got to me. I'm happy they fixed this in Generations.

And the hubs are going to have to be something I disagree with you on whole-heartedly.

Call it pointless, but sometimes bits and pieces of a game aren't necessarily meant to build progress. Some are meant to liven up and add to the atmosphere, and I think the hubs in Unleashed do that exceptionally well for the most part! Though I'm not going to deny that slowing down Sonic's speed in them to a walk and keeping them separate from the Entrance Stages were both bad ideas, because they were, but that shouldn't render them as some unexcusable garbage that never needs to be done again.

 

I actually liked the Hub Worlds in Adventure, even though I thought they were very vague and bad at explaining where you are supposed to go. Aside from Tikal's Orbs (which were a great idea), you didn't really have an inkling what to do with the Ice Stone or Wind Stone. I think this was the problem with the Hub Worlds in Unleashed, aside from the slow speed problem, which you've already brought up.

I don't think Hub Worlds are an inexcusable garbage like some others think. I actually really liked the Hub World in Generations, even though it was basically a warp zone. I think a Modern version of the Hub World in 3D would have been really cool. I also agree with you that something doesn't need to be necessary to be in a game. I think the problem comes down to how Sonic Team can fuck up Hub Worlds so badly. Case in point, Sonic '06.

[Guest]

Oh goodie, a Sonic Unleashed topic! Anyway I actually really like Sonic Unleashed for the elements of gameplay, and the story! Let's start off with the gameplay, I really enjoyed playing during the daytime stages Apotos Act 2 being my favorite level in the entire game! Also the speed of Sonic in this game is fantastic, I mean you literary hear Sonic break through the sound barrier, which is amazing and awesome! I also found the control of Sonic in the daytime to be a little loose, which is what I like! Another thing is that the stages later on become more difficult in the daytime, but I don't really bother with them so I'm not going to complain.

As for the Sonic The Werehog, he's actually not that bad. I find the Werehog to be really fun and his controls are actually pretty decent. The gameplay doesn't bother me either, some people may call the Werehog not needed or cheap, but I disagree, I think the Werehog was a great ride, and I wish he had gotten his own game or Sonic Team implemented a little more into the game. But that's just me though.

The story was also really good, and probably one of the best in the whole Sonic series! The story was sad, and had it's awesome friendship moments between Chip and Sonic. I was sad to see Chip die at the end, but Chip said he would always be with Sonic. The credits are amazing too! Because it pays homage to the classic game Sonic 2. Which is pretty awesome! So yeah I loved the story!

The music was also pretty good along with the voice acting! My favorite song from the Sonic Unleashed is Dear My Friend! This song is so beautiful and has an awesome meaning! As for the voice acting it was actually really fantastic! I'm actually kind of upset that this was Jason's 2nd last performance as Sonic.

I really liked this game when I finally finished it, I believe this was an excellent experience! I wish they would of made a Sonic Unleashed 2. But that's only just a dream.

[Hedgehugs]

I'm actually kind of upset that this was Jason's 2nd last performance as Sonic.

Oh, thanks for bumping this thread. I Love this game, dude.

And yeah, same. Roger's good and all but man I loved Jason. He kept improving greatly during his time voicing Sonic. His Werehog voice was the bomb.

 

 

[Muscles Maximum]

I love Sonic Unleashed. I think it's the best modern game. It's got charm, it's fun, and it feels like a complete, and wholesome game. It doesn't feel empty or dead, unlike Colors and Generations.

Edited October 29, 2015 by monkokaio

[Haalyle]

I finished this game on the weekend and let me tell you... never again. I have never raged at a game so much before.

It's not a bad game, I don't mind it to be honest, but it's probably not something I'm going to go back to again.

[FantasticMrRobb]

My favorite thing about Sonic Unleashed was how beautiful the world is and how amazing the stages look. Sometimes I honestly just have to stop and look around at how pretty they are.

Least favorite thing, easily the medal collecting. I really feels like it slows me down and I have to go out of my way to find them and progress.

[Kaotic Kanine]

Ah yes, Sonic Unleashed... I love this game! In fact, it's pretty much #1 in my list of favorite Sonic games and, if you ask me, I think it's one of the best Sonic games ever made. The graphics/visuals are absolutely breathtaking, the music is awesome, the overall world it creates is very immersive and gives the game much life, the story is one of the best made in the games, and BOTH Day and Night stages were fun to play (in their own respective ways) and well polished/functional (that is to say, there were very few bugs, glitches, or control issues, which I consider a pretty big thing since Sonic games beforehand were largely plagued by glitches and/or less-than-good controls).

Honestly, it astounds me that Sonic Unleashed has such a (for lack of a better term) crappy reception when, by most accounts, it's a high-quality game. Yeah, it does have it's flaws: medal collecting being a requirement to beat the game is a big no-no, the story could've had more going on in the middle and delved more into the Werehog and Sonic's feelings on it (and didn't have Eggman get usurped by the MOTW again), and while I genuinely LIKE the Night Stages and refuse to call them legitimately "bad", I will admit the choice of gameplay for those levels was not a good one. But in the end I don't think these flaws detract from Unleashed all too much. If it did for you, then oh well. To each their own.

(I should probably point out that everything I said only applies to the HD Version of Unleashed, not the Wii/PS2 Version)

[NoirSuede]

You know Unleashed feels like a transitional piece, while it introduces a radically different gamplay from the games before it, it still has a couple of features from the older games like a free camera and hubs to ease up the vets before Sonic Team truly changes the formula with Colors and Generations.

[sonicDX]

I think Sonic Unleashed is still the best Sonic game ever. It used all the good things from the older Sonic games, and made them new. I really love everything in this game: the graphics, the gameplay, the story, the characters, the places, and the spirit of it. I think SEGA should make games like Unleashed.