4199 replies to this topic

[Remz]

to easily port the shovelware from the iPhone and the Wii (the article itself explicitly mentions how easy Wii ports would be). So why wouldn't the system get clogged up with the same shit that makes up so much of the libraries of those two systems if it is so easy to do so?

Easier to make a shitty app game then it is to develop a DS game

[Xavious]

I never realised that a gaming system was defined by it's shovelware.

[Sean]

Oh no, oh no, I want Gyakuten Saiban 5 to be released on the DS first before having the series move onto another system. I don't think I'll ever be fully able to move on from the DS until that happens!

[Tornado]

Easier to make a shitty app game then it is to develop a DS game

Fair enough, but it isn't as if there aren't minigame schlock-fests on the DS as it is.

The DS2 will get dev-love because the DS gets dev-love.

I don't see how that is any less of a complete guess than what I've been saying. The SNES got tons of developer support, but you could count on one hand the third party games each successor system got.

EDIT: Oh, and before "PS2 didn't have that much shovelware" arises, it did, it was just overshadowed by its otherwise immensely awesome gaming selection (a bit like the DS :3)

It also wasn't comprehensively outselling every other third party game on the system.

I never realised that a gaming system was defined by it's shovelware.

It is when the majority of the software/bestselling software is just that.

Edited by Tornado, 13 March 2010 - 03:15 AM.

[SuperLink]

Fair enough, but it isn't as if there aren't minigame schlock-fests on the DS as it is.

Most of the mini-game fests people pay attention to are actually good.
WarioWare and Layton say hi.

I don't see how that is any less of a complete guess than what I've been saying. The SNES got tons of developer support, but you could count on one hand the third party games each successor system got.

It's a guess because your guess just doesn't make sense given the current state of the handheld industry. Little phone games not included.

It also wasn't comprehensively outselling every other third party game on the system.

Neither is it on DS.

It is when the majority of the software/bestselling software is just that.

This thread has nothing to do with the Wii.

[Peter]

I sold my Ds Lite not so long time ago and have been looking for a used DSi, of course one that's in good as new condition. I still haven't found one so I thought I would get a new DSi XL since I don't care for GBA games that much and I like those big screens. I've been working now and have made quite a good amount of money so buying a DSi XL wouldn't hurt my wallet. Not even if I bought both HeartGold and SoulSilver. xD

I'm down for any new DS system, but I think it's too early to release another new system now since the XL just came out and the older systems are still selling quite well.

Edited by Peter, 13 March 2010 - 11:39 AM.

[Tornado]

Most of the mini-game fests people pay attention to are actually good.
WarioWare and Layton say hi.

You are looking for arguments that I'm not actually making.

It's a guess because your guess just doesn't make sense given the current state of the handheld industry. Little phone games not included.

And your guess is a guess because it completely ignores that there is precedent for doing so.

Neither is it on DS.

Never said it was. Was merely pointing out that the tired "PS2 had shovelware too" argument doesn't have much merit.

This thread has nothing to do with the Wii.

Actually it does, but I only really brought it up to challenge the assertion made by Xavious.

Edited by Tornado, 13 March 2010 - 02:43 PM.

[Professor J]

You are looking for arguments that I'm not actually making.

You're saying there's minigame-fests on DS, and while that is true there are also minigame-fests that are actually good, like SuperLink pointed out.

And your guess is a guess because it completely ignores that there is precedent for doing so.

I'm pretty sure there were more than 5 third party developers for N64, GC and Wii lmao.

Never said it was. Was merely pointing out that the tired "PS2 had shovelware too" argument doesn't have much merit.

Except it does because there was alot of shovelware on PS2.

hai

[Tornado]

You're saying there's minigame-fests on DS, and while that is true there are also minigame-fests that are actually good, like SuperLink pointed out.

And?

I'm pretty sure there were more than 5 third party developers for N64, GC and Wii lmao.

Splitting hairs over what was obviously an exaggeration in the first place does not lend much credence to your argument.

Except it does because there was alot of shovelware on PS2.

hai

Reading all of my posts would be good. Gives them context.

[Professor J]

And?

You talk about it as if it's a bad thing that minigame compilation games exist.

Splitting hairs over what was obviously an exaggeration in the first place does not lend much credence to your argument.

Neither does deciding that an entire series of consoles has barely any third party support without any evidence to back it up. Decent third party games may not always sell as much as shovelware but they are there.

Reading all of my posts would be good. Gives them context.

I did, you're saying the argument that PS2 had lots of shovelware is tired and has no evidence. You are wrong, have a nice day

[Tornado]

You talk about it as if it's a bad thing that minigame compilation games exist.

No I didn't.

Neither does deciding that an entire series of consoles has barely any third party support without any evidence to back it up.

Last I checked I didn't need damning evidence when the statement being made is about as common knowledge as "the sky is blue."

I did, you're saying the argument that PS2 had lots of shovelware is tired and has no evidence.

Didn't say that either. You clearly didn't read all of my posts if you think I ever said that the PS2 didn't have shovelware.

You are wrong, have a nice day

[SuperLink]

Last I checked I didn't need damning evidence when the statement being made is about as common knowledge as "the sky is blue."

If you think the DS has poor third party support then the only thing I can say to you is "roflmao".

Seriously, this argument appears to be going nowhere right now. It all started when Tornado assumed the DS2 would be filled with shitty ports of iPod and Wii games, but wouldn't the DS be filled with ports of PS1 and updated SNES games? Like I said before, people seem to have tons of respect for the GBA for some crazy reason, even though it was also filled with SNES ports and shovelware. Just look at the PSP aswell, where's the legions of ports of shitty Wii/PS2/iPod games? Where?

Give me one good reason to believe the DS2 won't be getting the same rather amazing treatment the DS has been getting. No, shovelware and ports is not one of them, because every console gets those, and you have no reason to believe the DS2 would get any more than its predecessors.

Edited by Lyra, 13 March 2010 - 06:16 PM.

[Tornado]

If you think the DS has poor third party support then the only thing I can say to you is "roflmao".

Since when is the DS the successor system to the SNES? Or a console for that matter. You are again debating a point I never made in the first place.

Just look at the PSP aswell, where's the legions of ports of shitty Wii/PS2/iPod games? Where?

They still come out. The PSP isn't nearly as popular so it simply doesn't get as much games period.

Give me one good reason to believe the DS2 won't be getting the same rather amazing treatment the DS has been getting. No, shovelware and ports is not one of them, because every console gets those, and you have no reason to believe the DS2 would get any more than its predecessors.

I already have explained my reasoning.

Edited by Tornado, 13 March 2010 - 06:22 PM.

[SuperLink]

The DS isn't a successor system to the SNES, is it?

Neither is the DS2 a successor to the iPod. What the hell is your reasoning?
EDIT: Arg nvm, you were talking about the GC/Wii again.

I already have explained my reasoning.

I said one good reason.

The reason why the DS2 won't get clogged up with iPod and Wii ports is the same reason the first DS isn't clogged up with SNES/PS1/N64 ports.

They still come out.

Do I remember anyone saying the DS2 would get zero shovelware/ports? Nope.

Edited by Lyra, 13 March 2010 - 06:41 PM.

[Tornado]

Neither is the DS2 a successor to the iPod.

When did I say this? The closest I've said is that they have similar power and similar functional capabilities.

What the hell is your reasoning?

SNES -> N64/Gamecube: Third Party Developers stopped giving a shit. Assuming that the DS2 will get the same developer love that the current system gets is just that: An assumption.

The reason why the DS2 won't get clogged up with iPod and Wii ports is the same reason the first DS isn't clogged up with SNES/PS1/N64 ports.

The circumstances between the DS and the DS2 are not the same. The DS isn't clogged up with ports because there is nothing to port it from. The most similar hardware to the DS debuted 14 years ago. As one should imagine, it is kind of hard to do a cheap port from a considerably more powerful system. Ergo, it isn't as viable to do lazy shit ports of more recent games because it isn't as easy to do so.

The DS2, meanwhile, looks powerful enough to easily port recent games from two systems absolutely loaded with shit games. And Nintendo being Nintendo will likely advertise the system to the people who would likely buy said games in the first place. I don't see how it is hard to understand how a system similar in specifications to one platform (iPhone) and explicitly mentioned to be easy to port from another platform (Wii) will not proceed to get loaded with the same types of games as those systems when the target market for all three platforms will be roughly the same.

[Professor J]

What in the world are you on about Tornado?

Have you ever even played an iPhone App game? They aren't proper games, they're just little time consuming things you can play on a bus or something. Also they cost about £3, not £30 like a DS game.

I really don't see why in the world you expect iPhone App games to dominate the DS2 market and I can't even imagine how you got to that assumption.

Who cares if they're marketed at the same target audience, god forbid Nintendo should draw in some of the casual audience.

At the very worst I'd expect several iPhone ports to appear as DSWare but never as full retail games.

[Tornado]

Have you ever even played an iPhone App game? They aren't proper games, they're just little time consuming things you can play on a bus or something. Also they cost about £3, not £30 like a DS game.

I've played iPhone games ranging from $$3 to $10. The latter could very easily be passed off for the $25 DS releases and no one would be the wiser.

I really don't see why in the world you expect iPhone App games to dominate the DS2 market and I can't even imagine how you got to that assumption.

Should I put it in all caps or something? Write it phonetically?
The hell with it. You've taken so many of my posts out of context and put so many words in my mouth that it seems to me you are doing it on purpose, and the only thing trying to explain to you is doing is getting childish people to neg-rep me.

Who cares if they're marketed at the same target audience, god forbid Nintendo should draw in some of the casual audience.

Don't you even dare try and lump that shit on me. I made a statement of fact. I wasn't passing judgment, so don't act as if I was.

Edited by Tornado, 13 March 2010 - 10:19 PM.

[Sean]

So much drama. Tone it down, girls.

[Professor J]

I've played iPhone games ranging from $$3 to $10. The latter could very easily be passed off for the $25 DS releases and no one would be the wiser.

Then please give me some examples because the Sims 3 is the most expensive App game I've seen but at least if that was ported it could probably hold it's own as a DS game.

Should I put it in all caps or something? Write it phonetically?
The hell with it. You've taken so many of my posts out of context and put so many words in my mouth that it seems to me you are doing it on purpose, and the only thing trying to explain to you is doing is getting childish people to neg-rep me.

Well maybe you should because I don't see how this:

The circumstances between the DS and the DS2 are not the same. The DS isn't clogged up with ports because there is nothing to port it from. The most similar hardware to the DS debuted 14 years ago. As one should imagine, it is kind of hard to do a cheap port from a considerably more powerful system. Ergo, it isn't as viable to do lazy shit ports of more recent games because it isn't as easy to do so.

The DS2, meanwhile, looks powerful enough to easily port recent games from two systems absolutely loaded with shit games. And Nintendo being Nintendo will likely advertise the system to the people who would likely buy said games in the first place. I don't see how it is hard to understand how a system similar in specifications to one platform (iPhone) and explicitly mentioned to be easy to port from another platform (Wii) will not proceed to get loaded with the same types of games as those systems when the target market for all three platforms will be roughly the same.

could mean anything other than 'DS2 will likely be loaded with ports of shovelware iPhone and Wii games'

EDIT: Ahhahha, sorry Jake, was still typing my post when you posted that.

[Xavious]

My previous post was meant to touch on how the issue of shovelware will never really be resolved unless companies start reviewing all games so that they meet certain "standards"; then you basically have another iPhone app store...

From my experience with the DSi I expect the "DS2" to take a similar route with enhanced support for third party "apps" (if you will) which will be cheap or range in price including the rubbish shovelware cash-ins we all know and love, along with games on cartridge media.

Actually I'm more interested right now in what form of storage Nintendo intend to use for games (if any!?), and if it will be backwards compatible with the DS (which I hope it is). I remember seeing some mock screens a while ago on a site and I do think that some elements of it could be pretty nifty if implemented correctly.