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Toby

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I think Sonic could have kids with Mina too. I could see Sonia and Manic working with their original appearances if they were with Mina and Amy with Sonic. In anycase I don't really beleive Sally belonged with Sonic or even as part of the Sonic mythos within the series. I feel that because Sonic is supposed to have a vast array of friends and surrogate family, that she should not exist.

Hi, it's called having an opinion. :/ You may dislike Sally, and that's fine and all, but that doesn't mean everyone else has to.

And yeah, she said out in the Great Forest in SatAM, but she hardly ever brought up the idea of taking on the throne in the series; more than anything she seemed more inclined to find her father, and even after finding out that he was stuck in the void, she didn't raise the idea of being queen. More importantly, I always saw her as working with Sonic; he was the guy of action, she was the planner, and even then it doesn't mean he can't use his head every now and then. If anything, I always felt that the two worked great together, and I wish that Archie didn't have to have this whole royalty drama, but eh. And Sonic does have other friends/family in that series (and Archie). In the case of SatAM there's still Tails, Bunnie, Dulcy, his Uncle, Rotor, and... well, okay, not Antoine.

As for Mina and Amy, people have a right to like what they like as well. I'm not gonna rant about disliking them (at least SonAmy), and I'll just stick to liking Sonic and Sally in the case of SatAM.

But eh, this is the Archie topic, so enough of that.

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Hi

Hello. :P

it's called having an opinion. :/ You may dislike Sally, and that's fine and all, but that doesn't mean everyone else has to.

Where did I say that?

And yeah, she said out in the Great Forest in SatAM, but she hardly ever brought up the idea of taking on the throne in the series; more than anything she seemed more inclined to find her father, and even after finding out that he was stuck in the void, she didn't raise the idea of being queen.

Well think about the perspective of the character for a moment. If she says "out here in the Great Forest, title are meaningless" that means she only thinks her position as princess is meaningless because there is in fact nothing to rule. Sally's not yet thinking about becoming a queen because the title is obsolete and has no power in the Great Forest. If anything, such a remark would indicate that Sally would explore her role as a princess once there was a kingdom to rule again.

More importantly, I always saw her as working with Sonic; he was the guy of action, she was the planner, and even then it doesn't mean he can't use his head every now and then.

The thing is: Sonic can plan and think. He just doesn't because Sally's there to do it .So I consider that kind of contribution to the series by and large obsolete. I honestly think they should have all be planners and thinkers. It helps to get into their head if something's going on in there :P

If anything, I always felt that the two worked great together, and I wish that Archie didn't have to have this whole royalty drama, but eh. And Sonic does have other friends/family in that series (and Archie). In the case of SatAM there's still Tails, Bunnie, Dulcy, his Uncle, Rotor, and... well, okay, not Antoine.

SatAM infers Sonic should have bonds with the rest of the cast but he really doesn't in practice. There's no reason to value them highly as individuals because they don't offer any distinct aspects of their personality to completing Sonic's life. After hearing what Ian had to say on the matter, I don't hold out much hope for enjoying Archie that much either.

As for Mina and Amy, people have a right to like what they like as well. I'm not gonna rant about disliking them (at least SonAmy), and I'll just stick to liking Sonic and Sally in the case of SatAM.

To be perfectly fair if anyone says they dislike characters I like, I know that it doesn't mean its the same thing as saying I don't have the right to like them. But even if Sally were paired off with someone else, I still wouldn't think of her as a character that fits in the Sonic mythos. I feel as though I talked about more concerning Sally too, more than the whole shipping angle anyways.

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sth201.jpg

SONIC THE HEDGEHOG #201

"Change in Management": Sonic and his friends are ready to relax after the series-shaking events of #200, but their plans soon change with the explosive arrival of an old villain! A villain who brings grim tidings of a new threat that's claimed the world! Who are the new faces of evil? Will Sonic rise to the occasion, or will he be busy fighting a mystery guest star? "Devotion": Espio the Chameleon gets a visitor of his own, and news that will change his standing in the Chaotix forever!

SCRIPT: Ian Flynn

ART: Tracy Yardley!

Shipping Date: June 3rd, 2009

On Sale at Comic Specialty Shops: June 10th, 2009

On Sale on Newsstands: June 23rd, 2009

32-page, full color comic

$2.50 US

su5.jpg

SONIC UNIVERSE #5

THE LATEST HIT SONIC SERIES RETURNS WITH THE BEGINNING OF AN EPIC

"MOBIUS: 30 YEARS LATER" TALE!: "Five Years of Peace": By popular demand, we're going back to the future! It's now thirty years down the line and King Sonic is on the throne. He has his hands full with the tiny royal twins, but fan-favorite Lara-Su is there to help. As the world prepares to celebrate the new royal family, a deadly plot is hatched from the shadows...and you'll never guess who shows up at the end! It's the action and adventure you've come to expect from "Mobius: 25 Years Later" tales...not to mention all your favorite good guys and bad guys! The future has never been more frantic...and it's up to Sonic to make sure it's infinite!

SCRIPT: Ian Flynn

ART: Tracy Yardley!

Shipping Date: June 17th, 2009

On Sale at Comic Specialty Shops: June 24th, 2009

On Sale on Newsstands: July 7th, 2009

32-page, full color comic

$2.50 US

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From what I've seen, this Tracy Yardley person does covers shitloads better than Spaz does (not taking into account his older stuff, of course). The art itself is pretty fitting for the series, so it's nice to see that there are more artists picking up the slack from Spaz's style-copying tactics and Ron Lim's eye-bleeding massacre from the issue 100 range.

Also just noticed the shout-out to the Sonic band from Sonic 1's concept art. Nice.

Edited by Jake
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From what I've seen, this Tracy Yardley person does covers shitloads better than Spaz does (not taking into account his older stuff, of course).

I bring final proof of that.

33808485rq4.png

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My bets are Mina will be screwed over in 201, if her last appearance was any indication. On the bright side Tracy's SU #4 cover looks pretty good. I usually prefer Spaz's stuff most... but then he went into that whole anime thing. I really don't like how he makes Sally look so...humanish in her proportions. With Yardley I think my main complaint would be the hair. It just doesn't look all that great on her in his style. I think he draws characters meant for the games, or styles eaily compatible best.

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Now I'm not sure if many recall this Mobius (insert number here) years later, but there was one backup story that actually impacted the main series (sort of). There was a series of Mobius year stories that told of a probable story that revolved around Lara Su (Knuckles and Julie Su daughter). Basically she traveled from the future to the past to stop Knuckles (in his choas driven state, the time when he was as green as the Master Emerald) from returning the Floating Island to it's original resting place in Downunda. Long story short this all took place in an alternate universe where Knuckles was the evil villain (leader of the Dark Legion). The whole story followed Lara around with no appearences from Sonic or anyone else besides Echidnas.

The point is that these Mobius (insert number here) Years Later can be character developing as well as not having to focus on the outcome of a SonSal being shown.

Even more convincing is the use of Sally as the main villain while Sonic, Tails, Rotor and Amy remain the heroes. Even though this was a short appearance, made by the Sonicaman: Chaos Force (Sonic Super Special 12), it still shows that there are mulitverses out there where a SonSal match up aren't possible, rather a SonAmy one is the only outcome. If Archie were to explore such universes that would definitely balance out things I think (ex. revisit Sonic X).

With this new Sonic Universe series started we might see such new stories and universes. I know I'd be thrilled if they include the Mobius 20 Years later that was never shown due to the SSS being discontinued. Especially after showing glimpses of it in Knuckles 25.

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That was kind of what I was saying: Is is possible to explore things without a SonSal refference at every turn. It's redundant and annoying if you don't like the idea.

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Well, it's certainly toned down over the years, back in the days when Sally would say shit like, "Sorry guys, but Sonic takes up all ten slots on my list of top 10 Freedom Fighters!"

Edited by Jake
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I've never really considered Sally to have a very consistent characterization. She's not very much like she is in those stories, and the drift from that was never explained.

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Off topic here, has anyone noticed that every now and then characters besides Sonic , Tails and Amy (pretty much all Sega created characters) all of a sudden acquire an extra finger. The normal finger count for the Archie created, DIC created (or whatever you want to call them) is four.

In fact Archie went out of the way to point out that Sonic and Tails were the only characters with five fingers in one of the issues leading up to the Sonic Adventure adaption. It occurred during a conversation with Nate Morgan as he was describing the being who inhabited the area they were about to go to (which is known as Station Square).

I know Sega (and all Japan based companies are strict when it comes to the portrayal of how many fingers their character had, Sonic Underground was impacted by this), but Archie constantly switches between five and four. You think Sega would have picked up on this or would do something. For example count the number of Sally's fingers on the cover of issue 197, then look at her inside, you'll see she mostly is drawn with four.

Edited by MilesDX
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I think that Mina was atrociously handled for most of her time in the comic, but admittedly I don't like how she almost completely dropped out of the picture, either. She would have made a fun friend for Amy. I always thought it odd how she was never made a fighter despite the first thing coming to my mind when I think "mongoose" being the killing and eating of cobras.

Oh, and I'm glad Sonic Universe has been created. Nice that the whole continuity doesn't have to be shoved into one book anymore. I don't know if we'll ever see Blaze and Marine again in the comic, but at least they were really fun while they appeared.^_^

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sth201.jpg

Glad to see that Mach the Rabbit still has his job with the band after being shut down from the running as SEGA mascot all those years ago.

( I thought SEGA told them to do no more cameos.)

33808485rq4.png

Every time I see that cover, it makes me want a poster made out of it more and more. Granted this is one of the very few covers I find to be the hallmark of Yardley's art and amongst the Sonic comic book cover collection's greatest.

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I like Ant's "YEEEESSS!" face on the cover of 201.:D

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( I thought SEGA told them to do no more cameos.)

Did they really tell Archie that? Assholes.

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I bring final proof of that.

33808485rq4.png

I'd be more impressed if he'd draw Rouge a little more accurately. Being the stickler for character detail that I am, I can't stand seeing her so..so...flat.

Mind you, I'm no perv, but seeing Tracy draw Rouge in that manner just annoys me to death.

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I bring final proof of that.

33808485rq4.png

Meh, mediocre at best. I really don't see the appeal in Yardley's work. Most of the time it just reminds me of a kid's (sure a talented kid, but a kid nonetheless) interpretation of Sonic characters....its just sketchy, messy and bland.

Looking a Spaz's covers this just doesn't even register as a comparison.

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I think that Mina was atrociously handled for most of her time in the comic, but admittedly I don't like how she almost completely dropped out of the picture, either. She would have made a fun friend for Amy.

She was at her best near the end of the triangle. Sure she had her quirks but unlike most of the other characters, they were at least rectifyable. Its a shame they rarely use her as she had a lot of potential too. Still does IMO, and she'd be a lot better if they just downplayed her career, and focused more on her characterization. Mina was cool for the kind of complex character she was, not simply for her occupation. Besides, what does her singing career have anything to do with Sonic or his story, anyway? I could see if he was a band member and they occasionally went out, did gigs and had adventures but this? No.

On another note though, Sonic Universe's cover looks great. I wouldn't call myself a fan of Yardley's style (its too tooney and exaggerated IMO), but I think the coloring gives it a nice touch.

Edited by Picchi
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Did they really tell Archie that? Assholes.

It depends of the cameo.

Drawing those obscure "Sonic Band" characters that never appeared outside of a little artwork should be fine for Sega. I bet the employees at Sega nowadays don't even know who they are.

Now if they were to draw Metal Madness or Chris Thorndyke...

The Master Board: you're a bit harsh with Yardley, aren't you? He's at least far better than a few others in Archie (Ron Lim, Magic Hands...), his characters are most of the time on model and very expressive and, yes, well drawn. I even prefer his work over Axer's (too much detail kills the detail).

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Off topic here, has anyone noticed that every now and then characters besides Sonic , Tails and Amy (pretty much all Sega created characters) all of a sudden acquire an extra finger. The normal finger count for the Archie created, DIC created (or whatever you want to call them) is four.

In fact Archie went out of the way to point out that Sonic and Tails were the only characters with five fingers in one of the issues leading up to the Sonic Adventure adaption. It occurred during a conversation with Nate Morgan as he was describing the being who inhabited the area they were about to go to (which is known as Station Square).

I know Sega (and all Japan based companies are strict when it comes to the portrayal of how many fingers their character had, Sonic Underground was impacted by this), but Archie constantly switches between five and four. You think Sega would have picked up on this or would do something. For example count the number of Sally's fingers on the cover of issue 197, then look at her inside, you'll see she mostly is drawn with four.

Actually, I never noticed the changes, but from what I remember of the comics, it was said that the "Overlanders" had four fingers, due to the mutation of the gene bombs or whatever they were called from the Xorda while all the other Mobians had 5 fingers(well, most of them). Nate Morgan was an original overlander which is why he had four fingers...and the -now called humans- of Station square have 5 (I'm sure about the overlanders and their mutation but I don't know about the rest so correct me if I'm wrong) -and it's possible the change in fingers could also just be based on art styles *shrugs*

-

There's something that always bothered me about the 25 year issue, but I really don't mind it seeing how it's a "possible future" and all. (The lack of creativity in Sonic's kids makes me cringe x[ )I'm open-minded about couples (though, MinaxTails kinda threw me off o.o ) yet... I don't know, people say Sonic shouldn't be tied down, but I think he just shouldn't be tied down to a throne, of course that's my opinion, yet at the same time I do really like SonSal... *slapped*

-And here's a totally, completely random question, whatever happened to Muttski? Did the whole, normal dog in a universe of walking, talking animals bother people so much that they just took him out? (Not that I mind, I just now realized that I haven't seen him for a looooooooooooooooong time xD)

Edited by Alejandra Fox
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Actually, I never noticed the changes, but from what I remember of the comics, it was said that the "Overlanders" had four fingers, due to the mutation of the gene bombs or whatever they were called from the Xorda while all the other Mobians had 5 fingers(well, most of them). Nate Morgan was an original overlander which is why he had four fingers...and the -now called humans- of Station square have 5 (I'm sure about the overlanders and their mutation but I don't know about the rest so correct me if I'm wrong) -and it's possible the change in fingers could also just be based on art styles *shrugs*

-And here's a totally, completely random question, whatever happened to Muttski? Did the whole, normal dog in a universe of walking, talking animals bother people so much that they just took him out? (Not that I mind, I just now realized that I haven't seen him for a looooooooooooooooong time xD)

Due to the many artists who have drawn for Archie there probably would be some lack of consistency. Here's an excerpt/quote from Sonic 80: Nate "...completely inhabited by five fingered overlanders. Not four as in the usual case on Mobius" Tails "Five fingers-- Just like Sonic and Me?"

While the Xorda did mutate the population including the wildlife (who turned into Mobians) who except for the Sega created characters all have four fingers. Though my thinking falls short with the original Robotnik, who had four fingers (even though he is a Sega created character).

Now your point of the original overlanders having 4 fingers before the gene bomb does make this part make sense. Though if you want to believe that how come the overlanders who were drifting in space and arrived in Mobotropolis/Robotropolis all had five fingers. After all they were part of the original overlander city (even the original Robotnik's brother was part of that group). I'm sorry if I sorta went off on a rant here...

Anyway about Muttski, I have a feeling Archie is putting him aside due to the Tossed in Space Saga. If you remember, Sonic got a translator device that can translate any language placed in his ear. Due to this he is now able to understand and talk to Muttski.

I have a feeling this was getting to far fetched for them so they put Muttski aside until they could figure out how to resolve this or use it to their benefit (of course I could be completely wrong). Anyway this also resolves a universe with non talking animals and with.

Though if you were paying attention this question was answered way back in Sonic 48. Here's an excerpt/quote from Geoffrey ST. John: Geoffrey "One of the few Mobian races that never fully evolved!".

So there are a number or races that never reached the evolutionary point of Sonic and the others.

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I do believe you may have nailed the problem with Mutski in the head.

But Ian is working on establishing smaller, "non talking" animals in the continuity, like the flickies in the old games.

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I certainly prefer Tracy Yardley's artwork over most others in the comic - even Spaz's, who once was my favorite artist as a kid. Nay, he was my damned hero, and he was what got me interested into drawing fanart in the first place. He was once Archie's equivalent to Richard Elson.

For example, look at some of the masterpieces he's done for Sonic X:

sx01.jpgsx25.jpgsx40.jpg

The fuck is this shit!?

He's not even trying anymore!

I don't need to go far to look for some of the best material Spaz has provided for the comics; take a look at anything between issues 21 to 50 that he's been involved in, and you'll see just how much Spaz can actually stand out from the rest. In fact, just look at "Mecha Madness," the best arc in the run. I actually scoffed when I saw the cover artwork for issue 150. This is the best Spaz can come up with for a milestone issue!?

I was actually incessantly bitching about this with a friend a while back, and for the hell of it, he came up with the following exchanges that I'm dead sure actually took place when Spaz was coming up with issue 150's cover:

Him: "Pat, where the fuck have you been?! We've got to ship this thing IN FIVE MINUTES."

Him: "Cool your jets, bro, I'm on it!"

Him: *FILLS ENTIRE PAGE WITH SONIC'S FACE*

Him: I can imagine how this must've went down

Him: You know, as an alternative scenario to the former "Pat we've got to get this done in 5 minutes" one

Him: So, they're holding a board meeting, right?

Him: "We've gotta do something special for our 150th issue. Our sales are, like, plummeting! What are we doing wrong? It's not the character. Kids still love Sonic."

Him: "Of course the kids still love Sonic! He just keeps getting lost among all the other comics out there. We've got to grab them by the balls. We're gonna give them... The Whole Damn Sonic."

Him: "You've got 5 minutes, Pat." "I'm already done."

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She was at her best near the end of the triangle. Sure she had her quirks but unlike most of the other characters, they were at least rectifyable. Its a shame they rarely use her as she had a lot of potential too. Still does IMO, and she'd be a lot better if they just downplayed her career, and focused more on her characterization. Mina was cool for the kind of complex character she was, not simply for her occupation. Besides, what does her singing career have anything to do with Sonic or his story, anyway? I could see if he was a band member and they occasionally went out, did gigs and had adventures but this? No.

Yeah, it would have been better to try expanding on her personality than turning her into Lyn Minmay from Robotech and using that as a reason to more or less get rid of her. ^_^;;

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I certainly prefer Tracy Yardley's artwork over most others in the comic - even Spaz's, who once was my favorite artist as a kid. Nay, he was my damned hero, and he was what got me interested into drawing fanart in the first place. He was once Archie's equivalent to Richard Elson.

For example, look at some of the masterpieces he's done for Sonic X:

sx01.jpgsx25.jpgsx40.jpg

The fuck is this shit!?

He's not even trying anymore!

Yeah, but thats SonicX. SonicX was lame, as such I'd expect lame covers, though some of those were actually quite nice...while we were stuck with boring, flat, not awe-insipring at all Yardley covers. His lack depth, dimension, detail and quality. I like him as an inside the comic; the panels kind of work - but for a cover you need something epic like #175, or #97, look at the triptec covers of #163,164,165, the Sonic Adventure adaptations....those covers look like real comic book covers...not, well....I dunno I can't call Yardley's covers "covers".

I like Spaz's style, and I also love Yuji Uekawa's style, so I don't mind if Spaz is dabbling a bit with it, but I'd like to see him return to the main story's covers. That being said, with the great work Renae Deliz is doing so far, and the fact her line work is brilliant, I'd love to see if she gets the chance to do some covers, and see what she's capable of, because I am imagining awesome, awesome things!

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