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Nepenthe

Retired Staff
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Posts posted by Nepenthe


  1. Quote

    On the negative side, there’s a learning curve to controlling the character. The character cannot roll, jump dash, or perform any of Sonic’s other moves. The way the character jumps feels different, and potentially awkward. I was missing a lot of jumps in my initial play through as a result, but whether this was because I was used to Sonic’s jumping mechanics and need to simply get used to the Avatar character, or if the character’s controls simply aren’t very good, I can’t say without spending more time with the game.

    I'm... not the biggest fan of the fact that the Avatar feels this different from modern Sonic, especially since their levels are far more platforming heavy than his.


  2. 9 minutes ago, Detective Kaito said:

    I'm not sure if anyone has posted this yet, but this is the full playthrough of Modern Sonic's stage. We see Shadow in the end but as soon as Sonic reaches him the level ends. It's safe to assume that there's a cutscene following the stage "explaining" why Shadow is a bad guy, then followed by a boss battle.

    Hmm. Seems like there's a lot of small diversions here and there in the level, but they're going by so fast and the level is so dense with geometry it's hard to make out what is and isn't solid ground. Also, like the song, from what I can hear. Butt rock in Sonic levels just makes me feel cozy. Also I still don't find the chatter too distracting; surprised that Sonic doesn't talk back most times though, as that makes it a bit awkward. Finally, I like that this is shaping up to look like Modern Sonic's opening level- a hectic, dire situation. It's kinda like Sega listened to people who wanted Unleashed's opening playable. But man it's kind of...short. Like, it feels nowhere near as long as Apotos was.


  3. Not caring about the story doesn't really matter much to whether or not the series' identity was based partly in that, just like people not caring about the rolling doesn't really matter much to whether or not the series identity was defined by that. It's one thing to say one didn't like/care about, but now we're talking about throwing away yet another aspect of the franchise that once gave it a reason for being just because, regardless of its effect on the context of the series as a whole, and that's utterly offensive.

    Some people don't care about the story. Okay. But why do they get precedence over determining how the franchise should be dictated for everyone else, especially when for much of its lifespan it was dictated by narrative arcs by Sonic Team's own decisions regardless?


  4. 7 minutes ago, Lord-Dreamerz said:

    What's wrong with the idea of new character development making him a worse person? I'm aware of his past lore of him becoming a better person. But sometimes even heroes can turn bad. I'm not saying he was a badguy all along. I'm saying I want them to turn him somewhat more into one.

    You would have to have a damn good reason to justify an absolute reversion in morals in Shadow's particular case. We've already seen that he's steadfast in his overall ethics and he is, by his own volition, not able to be influenced away from those ethics by anyone, probably because he's tired of anyone and everyone trying to use/brainwash him for his own ends. Him telling Mephiles "thanks but no thanks", even against warnings that humanity would turn against him in the future and that Mephiles could make that go away, was one of the biggest character-defining moments of his narrative arc because it settled the matter of what he was really about. Shadow, from that point on, was effectively a hero. That was it. It was fucking done.

    Now you're telling me that all four of those games/five years of plotting was utterly meaningless?

    Anything less than a Tolkien-level of explanation will be unacceptable to me. And I'm certain at this point Sonic Team cannot pull it off, or don't care to pull it off.


  5. 2 minutes ago, Chris Knopps said:

    It's the Sonic franchise Nep, we really are at a point where you shou;dn't care about anything. If you do, you're just going to get hurt and infuriated.

    Care about nothing, hold no ties, THEN you will enjoy Sonic games again.

    I'm not about to lower my standards to zero.

    1 minute ago, Soniman said:

    ive repeatedly disgreed with the "if better games exist, this game is worthless" logic and will continue to do so, ill let the game stand on its own

    I've never said Forces is worthless. However, money is finite and precious for the majority of people. If you can't sell me on why I should get your game over the direct competition, even if it's not a BotW-level of a game changer, then I'm not buying it.


  6. 7 minutes ago, Soniman said:

    you know that all or nothing strawman logic doesnt really work right ?

    Obviously I would want them to care about gameplay, since this is a video game I thought that was obvious

    I'm merely extending the logic that people are using to justify the narrative issues we've gotten wind of thus far.

    People are telling me that apparently it's alright to stop caring about lore and implying that my feelings towards Shadow's usage are unfounded because "it's a platformer (why is this relevant)/Sonic Team doesn't care (this isn't a fucking good thing), so why should anyone else care? Let them do literally anything with the cast so long as it's entertaining!"

    Well, Forces' gameplay isn't bad-looking (to me), but it's clear as day that it's not got the passion and clarity of something like the two games I mentioned. So, should we just let them slide with that? So long as it's playable, I guess Forces is just peachy then.

    3 minutes ago, Lord-Dreamerz said:

    I know many hardcore Shadow fans hate it when Sonic series fans like me say the following... But I prefer Shadow being a shady jerk that's not hero or full villain. It was such a lovely sight for me seeing him being a big ol meany on Sonic Boom. I  just like him as a rival/antagonist better and not a friend. In fact i hope they come up with a reason to make him a anti-hero/antagonist and stick with it from now on. Not all character development needs to be about becoming a nicer person.

    But that's what HIS character development was about, for literally five years of games, back-to-back-to-back. Seriously, we're acting like this didn't already happen. It did happen. Shadow was characterized from a brainwashed misanthrope to a practical hero who takes stock in his own agency. And it was finished. So why are we making him a villain again aside from irrelevant fan service?

    No one is also saying he has to be super nice or anything. Shadow is not inherently an approachable person. However, him opposing Sonic just because is absolutely fucking stupid, and that's in part due to his previous development. It's like "Knuckles fell for Eggman's lies yet again and is fighting Sonic" levels of stupid.


  7. 2 minutes ago, Plasme said:

    I really don't give a fuck if that contradicts lore, I play Sonic for the gameplay, not the plot.

    You care about the plot insofar as you prefer Shadow being a bad guy than anything else, even if it contradicts lore.

    I feel like if you really didn't care about the plot, you wouldn't actually have a preference either way for how he was characterized.


  8. 2 minutes ago, Whatever the WhoCares said:

    There are perfectly valid reasons for people to push back against the overwhelming negativity. Every single little detail is bemoaned for being awful and terrible. Okay, fine, that's how you feel. But don't get mad when someone suggests that perhaps you're doing yourself a disservice by even following this game anymore. That, just like yours, is an opinion, and Nepenthe, your post on the subject immaculately encapsulates the hypocrisy of the elite in this thread. 

    This must be a record speed from a mod posting a warning to active acknowledgement of that post by a member that they've gotten a strike as a result of deliberately breaking the rules.

    If anyone else wants continue with this nonsense instead of talking about the game, they're free to do so.


  9. Making an update here for all to see, because my original post and accompanying status about behavior in the Forces threads are going to be buried, and I don't want anyone complaining about not knowing what the new deal is:

    Quote

    We play this silly little schoolyard game every single time a new game drops and doesn't get the most glowing impressions. People who like the game get in their feelings and act like the world is against them just because their opinion may be in the minority. Negative opinions are inherently taken as personal attacks or calls for more optimistic people to censor themselves when that may not even be the case at all. For years, people have been allowed to get away with characterizing either specific members or the forum as a whole as being unreasonably intolerant to positive opinions of contentious new releases, sometimes ironically engaging in personal attacks themselves.

    This shit stops today.

    I personally will be monitoring the forum for the foreseeable future and actively handing out strikes or suspensions to any people who engage in this kind of victimization and shit-stirring. I will also make sure to hand out strikes or suspensions to any people who are negative about the game if they also break the rules. We did that yesterday in one of the Forces threads and we'll happily do it again. This is your first and only warning.

    If you want a more positive environment, you are free to:

    A.) Put members on your ignore list who you find intolerable.

    B.) Make a thread asking earnestly the things people like about the game.

    C.) Report actual rule breaking behavior.

    D.) Engage in conversation with members who have posted positive opinions and create those discussion tangents within the bigger topics. You are not obligated to respond to anyone and everyone

    These behaviors would do wonders in better fostering an environment of just basic tolerance. You know what doesn't; constantly complaining that people are not happy, or saying people are "beating a dead horse" for reacting genuinely to new news, or insisting that people with positive opinions are "not being allowed to like the game."

    Get ahold of yourselves.

     


  10. 2 minutes ago, Whatever the WhoCares said:

    Except I only conceded on one of the points,

    You ceded on one and couldn't think of a rebuttal for another.

    Quote

    and healthily countered the others.

    This:

    19 minutes ago, Whatever the WhoCares said:

    1. I don't know. Not everything has to have already happened. 

    2. Good point. I guess it's not about Maria. 

    3. "At the end of the day." Exactly. 

    4. So it's an invalid plot idea?

    5. What does that even mean? Get off your high horse. 

    is not a "healthy counter," especially with the jab at me at the end.

    Quote

    Shadow is not necessarily a believer in freedom for everyone. Just himself.

    This doesn't actually refute anything I've said, nor has this necessarily been proven in this argument.

    Quote

    Every time there was a dilemma, it was between destroying the world and saving it. Now it has to do with shaping it in Eggman's vision. 

    Please point to to me

    A.) a game in which he wanted the world specifically shaped in Dr. Eggman's vision of his own volition,

    and B.) Where in this trailer we've gotten word that he's even potentially working for Eggman and not Infinite in the first place.


  11. Just now, Whatever the WhoCares said:

    "At the end of the day." Exactly. 

    What are you talking about? Shadow takes the same approach to saving the world as everyone else does.

    Just now, Whatever the WhoCares said:

    So it's an invalid plot idea?

    Not invalid. It's just disappointing to the point of being aggravating, and I don't want to have to settle for that.

    Just now, Whatever the WhoCares said:

    What does that even mean? Get off your high horse. 

    It means I don't agree with your interpretation of Shadow's character and subsequently any of the justifications you had for him being antagonistic towards Sonic under these specific circumstances.


  12. 10 minutes ago, Whatever the WhoCares said:

    If we only focus on the games where story was a huge factor, it's abundantly clear that Shadow rarely sees eye-to-eye with Sonic. And again, we don't know much about the plot.

    The very last game in which Shadow had major story relevance, he was significantly in tune with Sonic and the cooperated with nary a complaint. The fact that the game erased itself doesn't mean much either as nothing within their relationship was necessarily dependent upon any factors in the game's timeline. Shadow cooperated and bailed Sonic out of trouble because it's inherently in his present-day character to do so within the situations that call for it, and I would think actual DEFCON 1 would be one such situation.

    Quote

    The fact that Shadow believes the world is worth saving doesn't automatically mean the following:

    - That he also thinks humans are best left to their own devices rather than controlled with an iron fist. 

    When has Shadow ever seriously espoused totalitarianism when in his right mind?

    Quote

    - That he can't be deceived into thinking there's a non-nefarious means of getting back Maria (or anything else he might want). 

    He literally and metaphorically threw his past away at the end of ShtH. He also turned down Mephiles' offer to avoid potentially being oppressed by humanity because he's not so selfish as to throw the world under the bus, even for his own presumed well-being.

    Quote

    - That he's incapable of having a different idea of how the world should be saved. 

    When has Shadow not also punched the bad guy at the end of the day?

    Quote

    - That he's not being forced to do this against his will. 

    I've already explained why I feel this is annoying.

    Quote

    With this in mind, I honestly believe that nothing about this game will clash with Shadow's character. 

    I'm not even sure if you fully understand Shadow's character.


  13. Just now, Whatever the WhoCares said:

    Because all we know at this point is that he is, at some point in the story, an antagonist. You brought up how he has self-serving ideals, and that seems to be exactly the angle they're taking with him here. 

    My argument is that his lack of overt altruism does not necessarily translate into a meaningfully antagonistic role towards Sonic due to the character development he's undergone in the games where Sonic Team decidedly gave more of a damn about him.

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