Jambone

My ideal single player would be Melee Adventure mode with a branching path system. Each big franchise gets a platforming level, two or three enemies, then you fight a guy at the end. Rinse and repeat. Say there are five different endpoints, each one gives you a trophy of a palette swap of your character.

So teleport dashing, which I covered, or a screen clearing move. Outside of a Rush-style gauntlet I fail to see how that would be useful, unless you put in Metroid or Kirby-style "buttons behind walls" that open doors or a Zelda-style "hit all the buttons at once" thing. It's not really novel but I guess it's something? You clearly have very different ideas of how gameplay in these games should be than I do, so I'm not going to argue with you about the inherent ability to easily destroy enemies in a Classic Sonic game. Covered this. If only there was a character that could fly that was intended to be easier than the others, damn, shame Classic Sonic is missing such a simple idea. You're not doing yourself any favors with all this talk about "broken" moves and making bosses easier, because Classic Sonic is already pretty easy and it's bosses aren't any exception, especially with Tails. I will say something about this Silver's telekinesis, though, and it's that if worked similar to Ori's projectile deflection move, it'd be pretty cool. In that case, though, Ori just kicks off of projectiles to reflect them and propel himself in the opposite direction, so that's something anyone could do and would be pretty in-character for Sonic. I think a big difference here is that you're bringing up a lot of these abilities that have to do with combat rather than movement. Think of the abilities we have now: Sonic's Drop Dash, Tails' Flight, Knuckles' Glide & Climb, Mighty's Hammer Drop, and Ray's Cape Flight. Out of those, only Mighty's is really an attack, but the primary use is to destroy obstacles beneath him and to drop to the ground faster. Tails and Knuckles have damage hitboxes on their attacks but they're mostly secondary to the movement granted instead. Adding more ways to attack was added in the Advance games, later, but they were mostly useless because the fastest way to kill things is always just to "Sonic" them. Some abilities made bosses easier, but I hardly think a move that makes the already shaky bosses in the series even easier is a reason to include an entire character. The exception to this is Sonic's Insta-Shield, I guess, which is pretty much an attack, straight up. I think it can deflect projectiles with precision timing? I'm not really sure. That's why I suggested that those ideas would make good level gimmicks, or even a fun boss. A projectile or reflector is going to be bare-minimum useful in a Sonic level without a bunch of turrets or purposely out of reach enemies to serve them, which will actively hamper other characters. Some sort of object manipulation would be pointless unless every level was littered with stuff to throw or enemies purposely charged at you Samus Returns style to force you to fling them away (or you could just jump or charge a spin dash). Tails' and Knuckles' abilities operate using basic level design. Tails is forgiveness for lack of platforming prowess and Knuckles climbs walls, which exist everywhere by default, as well as letting you skip some horizontal platforming sections at the cost of being committed to a glide. There aren't Flight Rings placed around the level like Sonic Adventure or Grip Walls that Knuckles is only allowed to climb like in Sonic Boom, they just do their thing when you want them to explore. Combat and reactionary abilities aren't nearly as useful, especially in a game all about exploration and moving forward like Classic Sonic. Whoof, man. I'll be the first to admit that I don't care for most Sonic characters, but it sounds like you're taking it personally. I don't even think your ideas are bad, they just don't fit into my personal view of how Classic Sonic games should play. If anything, they should make games where levels can revolve around these abilities in particular to get the most out of them. Are you trying to imply that something being optional means anything at all for how a game is received? Something being optional isn't going to cause people to ignore its existence. People get upset for no reason over easy modes and the like all the time, despite being optional. I'm not condoning it, but it would absolutely happen. Shadow is not a particularly beloved character outside of the Sonic fandom. He's still remembered as the cartoon hedgehog who guns down civilians while edgy nu-metal plays. This kind of seems like a general problem you have with a group of people. I think Mighty and Ray are pretty pointless, honestly, as their abilities don't really add anything to Mania. I'm not going to die, because it's literally just more Mania and I'm fine with that, because Mania was incredibly well-made, but I'm not going to act like "WOAH MIGHTY AND RAY DEEPEN THIS GAME SO MUCH, BEST ADDITIONS OF ALL TIME". I wouldn't die if Shadow and Silver were added to Mania 2 or whatever hypothetical game, either, but much like Mighty and Ray, I can't see them adding anything other than fanservice. As long as the game was well-made, I wouldn't care. But everything you've said simply doesn't sound fun to me. It sounds like added tedium on top of a good formula simply for the sake of throwing in more characters. If they're going to add more characters, I'd prefer they just be skins of other characters so they can still fine-tune the levels for three characters instead of adding a bunch of extra new combat shit to cater to new abilities. And in that case, if they're just sprite swaps? Go ham! Add in fuckin' Sanic for all I care. I'm starting to realize that my argument is more just "I don't want there to be a ton of playable characters in these games" rather than any certain ones being barred.

Alright then. Since Classic Sonic works on a one-button control scheme, pray tell how will Shadow and Silver's illustrious Dragonball Z-esque list of super powers fit into the games in a meaningful and unique way? Shadow can shoot a projectile or do a dash, and Silver can shoot a projectile or do a hover. For the sake of the argument, we'll assume that there are two buttons to work with in Shadow Mania. If you're looking to expand the Classic Universe's list of playable characters (of which there are plenty, and I think five is pushing it) then there are still plenty of characters who can do anything that Edgy and Mr. Oh Six can do. Silver's telekinesis is the kicker, which would be either completely useless (capturing and returning enemy projectiles) or require an unnecessary amount of work to integrate ('06 style object grabbing and throwing, which requires a physics engine and/or scattering throwable objects across every single level) ultimately for it to just be annoying because it makes you stop what you're doing and fiddle with boxes instead of moving forward and exploring. Meanwhile Shadow's Chaos Powers basically boil down to teleportation and shooting energy. Teleportation in the form of a jump dash could be something but it's not really something that absolutely no one else could do, because Teleport Dashes are just dashes that make you invincible, e.g. something that would work on Sonic, Metal Sonic, or basically any character considered fast. Mighty could probably even do it with the justification that his shell protects him while dashing. Projectiles in Classic Sonic are pointless, because nobody wants to come to a full stop and then hit the projectile button, then watch their dinky projectile fly into the badnik and pop it. Meanwhile you could have just pressed down and it would be equally dead and you wouldn't have wasted seconds of your life watching a cartoon hedgehog Dante shoot a hadouken at a robot shaped like a pig. There are justifications for these types of abilities, but I feel like requiring segments of the level where you slow down and shoot things or manipulate boxes or whatever would ultimately A. get boring really fast and B. be better served as a one-stage gimmick and then forgotten entirely. Nearly anything that Shadow or Silver (or even Rouge or Omega or Big or whoever else) would offer to the Classic formula would either be better done by someone else or better not done at all. Could they work? Absolutely. Anything could work if you put effort and thought into it. But what's the point? You're serving one sect of fans by alienating another. They could just make them do something in the Modern games and then they wouldn't need to be in the Classic games to be relevant. But to be fair, you're not going to get me on board with this idea without ripping my toenails off, so I'd say efforts to convince me would be better spent elsewhere.

We're not even two games into this supposed Classic Universe and people are already complaining about the canon.

What dimension do you live in where Generations had a satisfying ending? You have the worst Super Sonic boss in history (Mania's isn't great, but a painful electrical shock is better than Time Eater) and then Sonic tells his past self to start drinking because things are going to get rough. I mean, I know He-Man episodes with better stories and endings than both Generations and Mania but at least Mania has the excuse of being a tie-in to Forces. I'll give Generations the Robotnik name drop though, that was nice. Generations also literally ends with Eggman lost in a void.

Yeah, no thanks. The Classic cast is big enough to support itself without drawing from Modern characters I don't give a shit about. Most Modern Sonic characters don't really have a "role" anymore so much as they just exist to be drawn upon when needed to fill a quota, so it's not like there's some sort of dire need to bring them to the Classic game(s) because they're missing out on some amazing features or story. Tails and Amy pretty much fill the same roles as they do in the Modern games, except Tails is actually useful and Amy...hasn't done anything yet. Metal and Knuckles play Shadow's two main parts already and don't have his baggage. Metal is the doppleganger (except he has an actual motive to fight Sonic instead of just being another friend) and Classic Knuckles is the friendly rival that isn't always around but he's really strong and fights for his own reasons (protecting the Floating Island at all costs instead of...government...or something? Neither are great but Knuckles' is at least personal while Shadow works for the people who killed his human sister-girlfriend for some reason). Fang has plenty of potential to be a Wario-type character who isn't necessarily evil but selfish and it puts him at odds with Sonic. He'd probably take jobs from Egg as well, and bigger rogue's gallery is always nice. Rouge would be his most direct counterpart, likely. Bean and Bark are pretty much blank slates, although if they ever actually show up I'd imagine they'll probably be anti-heroes like they were in the comics if Mania is anything to go by. Again, rogue's gallery. They don't really correlate to any characters in particular. Mighty and Ray fit the "extra friends that are just there" category that Silver and Blaze fill. Silver hasn't done anything of note since his debut, but then neither have Might and Ray, so it works out. Blaze barely exists anymore. The Chaotix are also classic characters, but I'm not sure we'll see them show up. Even without the Chaotix, Classic's cast is big enough without introducing more dumb characters who will stand around and do nothing. Shadow and Silver already add next to nothing to Sonic as is, and people who don't like Modern Sonic (read: most non-Sonic fans) will start to get leery when Modern characters start showing up for no reason other than "Remember THESE characters that most people associate with why Sonic is shitty?!" It's a bad idea on all accounts. If you like Shadow or Silver and want them to be in better games, stop buying mediocre games from Sonic Team and encourage them to make better ones.

Make a couple more pinball machines and throw some dumb story on it and you could probably sell this for $3 on Steam. I'd pick it up.

So, there was a """leak""" on 4chan earlier on the week that was the same usual bullshit about a Nintendo Direct script. However, two of the things they mentioned (Nintendo FunkoPOP figures and Mario Kart 8 Deluxe DLC) have been confirmed so it looks like there MIGHT be something to it. Operative word might, and it could very well be a lucky guess on two counts, but it pays to keep these sorts of things in mind. This is relevant because said person also "revealed" that Metal Sonic will be a downloadable character at some point after Plus launches. Again, these leaks are a dime a dozen, but Metal has been pushed alongside the other playable characters a lot, so it wouldn't be completely unreasonable to think that there's something to it. Grain of salt and all that, though. The direct that this information is supposed to come out of is said to happen on July 22.

Hopefully. Sega may be dumber than a brick but they do at least follow the money, which Mania seems to bring (and relatively cheap with great publicity). Fingers crossed.

There's only two tracks and some real not-fun sounding gimmicks to talk about otherwise. And I mean, honestly, Sumo's racing gameplay is fun but I already have that with better characters. My girlfriend wants this game so I'm hoping it's good so I can enjoy it too, but I'm not seeing much of interest here, especially nothing worth poring over in discussion.

I really hope Classic Sonic doesn't end here.