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Blue Blood

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Blue Blood last won the day on July 7

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  1. Rouge isn't very good at being a government spy. What does she accomplish in SA2? She gets an A4 printout of information on Project Shadow, but not before she first raids a government facility to obtain some Emeralds, assaults a guard, blows up said facility with a bomb and then use the Emeralds she stole to shoot a giant laser that blows up the moon. I know there's such a thing as collateral damage and needing to blend in, but fucking hell she's a menace.

    1. Jack out of the comics!

      Jack out of the comics!

      LOL, leaving aside that it's a videogame so various things are to justify a stage or mission (talking about Security Hall). That aside, yes, I agree, but it's more like the game has plotholes, they didn't care too much about the fact that Rouge was a spy, other than it being played like a twist at the end. Rouge is actually very clever, and she's a good person, so it wasn't in-character for her to assist Eggman in blowing up the moon, lol

      Anyway, that said, Security Hall is in fact my favorite Rouge stage.

    2. Blue Blood

      Blue Blood

      None of this has anything to do with plot holes or just being a game though. It's just some weird ass story that begs you only to look at the broad strokes.

    3. Crow the BOOLET

      Crow the BOOLET

      And she expects to be paid in jewels

      You can't catch a break with her can you?

    4. KHCast

      KHCast

      What do you expect? She’s part of an government agency that couldn’t even get their facts straight on the Scepter of darkness, instead calling it the Book of Darkness. MI6 they ain’t. /s

    5. Pelvic WOO! engine

      Pelvic WOO! engine

      Well, the government waa behind slaughtering innocent people on the ark anyway I think.

    6. Blue Blood

      Blue Blood

      @KHCast True. And on that note, what was GUN's solution to catching Sonic? They deployed an enormous truck as wide as the city streets to chase him down. Now we see the truck destroy all those cars and crash into the bridge, but practically speaking I think the devastation would have been much more widespread.

    7. Won't Stop, Just Go

      Won't Stop, Just Go

      It's more like GUN never acts on the information they're given.

    8. Tarnish

      Tarnish

      Shadow isn't exactly the brightest GUN agent either in 06. He makes a big scene of entering Eggman's base by causing a huge explosion...then uses Chaos Control when he's already inside the base.

    9. Kuzu

      Kuzu

      She went deep undercover

    10. The Tenth Doctor

      The Tenth Doctor

      Also she used her real name. So if Eggman did some prying, he'd find her out in an instant. Heck, Shadow said it.

      "Now I know who you are, your that government spy Rouge the Bat, aren't you!?"

    11. Jack out of the comics!

      Jack out of the comics!

      Uncovering the plotholes and general nonsense in this franchise is easy.

    12. E-122-Psi

      E-122-Psi

      I feel like the whole agent twist was just something to add on needless complexity and tension to the story to make it a 'big boy' plot. It especially makes sense if we consider Rouge supposedly wasn't even part of the game originally.

    13. Chili Dawg

      Chili Dawg

      my absolute favorite thing is shadow, the guy who was asleep for the last 50 years, was aware of the fact that were was a spy for the government named rouge the bat... and he had no idea rouge the bat was in fact rouge the bat... until he did

    14. Blue Blood

      Blue Blood

      I'm pretty sure that Shadow figuring out Rouge's identity was a translation-introduced plot hole. In the original Japanese script, he says something more like "Now I know what's going on. You're a government spy". In the English version, the working of the sentences and definite article implies that Shadow had prior knowledge of a government spy named Rouge the Bat. 

      You get a similar thing in the last story. In English he says "Is that what Chaos Control is?", which sounds wonky and doesn't make much sense contextually, but in the original Japanese script he says "was that Chaos control?".

    15. Won't Stop, Just Go

      Won't Stop, Just Go

      As a quick aside I suggest everyone watch the story with japanese subs if they get the chance because it clarifies a lot of details, like Shadow's memory being tampered with which isn't mentioned in the english script at all as far as I know.

    16. The Tenth Doctor

      The Tenth Doctor

      @Wraith is there a video of it on Youtube, would like to see the differences.

    17. JosepHenry

      JosepHenry

      @WraithSo it is possible that Maria is alive then :)c

    18. Won't Stop, Just Go
    19. Plumbers_Helper

      Plumbers_Helper

      I would agree about Rouge, if her mission was to stop Eggman and she actually worked for GUN. Before Sonic 06 she worked only with the President, but not in any official capacity since she was able to demand her own payment, it's more likely she was a hired mercenary. Her only mission was to gather information on Project Shadow, once she had it she had no other reason to work with Eggman or Shadow anymore. "I thought it was time to take what's mine and get out of this dump." The only reason she stayed as long as she did was because the ARK's computer detected the Master Emerald shards. She also did evidently discover more information then just that report on the Biolizard, according to The Truth of 50 Years ago, though it would have been preferable if that information was in the game itself. One of the biggest criticisms I see people often mention with Star Wars is that important information to the movies is often tucked away in some obscure comic or cartoon, and the same criticism can be applied to Rouge's report.

      Either way, yeah, a lot of destruction does happen because of her.

      The only part about Sonic Adventure 2's story that I still don't understand was why Rouge didn't take the Chaos Emeralds when she said she was going to? Because Shadow told her not to? She mentions latter that she "got a call from my boss." so was she temporarily distracted long enough for both Sonic to get the fake emerald in and for Eggman to latter get the real emerald in? I always felt like there was a missing scene there, something possible as Shiro Maekawa has said "there were scenes that I had to cut tearfully".

      @Wraith, Rouge does mention it once in the English version "Even your memories might not be real, you know.". However, Professor Gerald's line "I also have complete control over Shadow's memories." was changed in the English version to "I designed his mind to be perfect, pure." Shadow's memories being altered was more elaborated on in Sonic X, where we get to see from the perspective of the soldier that shot Maria...and it's different from the memory Shadow has of the event. Normally I wouldn't include information from what is clearly a different continuity, but in this case I think it's worth mentioning because Sonic X did include several cut scenes and dialogue originally meant for both Adventure games.

    20. E-122-Psi

      E-122-Psi

      Wait all that stuff was originally going to be in the games themselves? I thought that was just extra impact the anime added. Okay if they do a remake those HAVE to added.

    21. Plumbers_Helper

      Plumbers_Helper

      @E-122-Psi

      We likely will never know how much was created for the anime and what was originally meant to be in the game itself, all that we know so far is from unused content in the game. One thing that is mentioned in both the game and Sonic X, and few Sonic fans talk about, is that the escape capsule Maria ejected towards the Earth was never found...if that's true, then how did Shadow end up on Prison Island? Rouge doesn't have the answer in her report, but many fans believe inside the capsule...was Sonic himself. Shadow was created while Professor Gerald was imprisoned.

      Hard to believe, but there is evidence that suggests this. The file Rouge finds on the Biolizard specifically mentions the Biolizard has a special organ that allows it to use Chaos Control, Shadow and Sonic are the only one's that use Chaos Control in this game. The Biolizard's roar is just Sonic and Shadow's Japanese voices screaming with an effect played over it. Why both of them? Why those two specifically? Shadow even outright says that Sonic is the ultimate life form during the Finalhazard fight. Shadow has trouble the entire fight maintaining his Super Form, like he can't keep up with Sonic despite being the Ultimate Life Form.

      That's just facts we have from the game, if we want to start getting into fanficy-headcannon territory: During the final cutscene Sonic is seen wondering "Created...to be the Ultimate Life Form, huh..." What was Sonic wondering about? Shadow's comment that Sonic might be the Ultimate Life Form? The very last thing Sonic says in the game is Maria's alleged final words: "Adios/Sayonara, Shadow the Hedgehog." As Ruby of Blue notes in his video I linked, while this might not mean anything, it's possible Sonic knows...or perhaps a better wording would be Sonic remembers more then he's letting on.

      How much of this was meant to be in the game and how much was always intended to be vague is unknown. Most games going forward would seemingly ignore this detail, Shadow the Hedgehog the game being the most notable example. Even then, some details still match, the only other characters in the games to use Chaos Control are Black Doom and Silver. Black Doom is an alien, we don't know anything about his physiology so it's possible he has that special organ needed for Chaos Control. Silver is from a future where everyone has evolved to have psycokinesis, if everyone can evolve to have psychic powers in the future then it's no more implausible for everyone to evolve to have an organ that let's them use Chaos Control.

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