ThePrinceOfSaiyans

I have no idea what you're even getting at.

I have, but I only ever saw the first level.

This discussion starts at 10:13 BTW.

It's not like Disney has been any better with the property. 

I've got better stuff to do than talk about the merits of power scaling all day, so we'll simply have to agree to disagree on most of this. I will address few points before I resign.

"You're going to continually criticize the series for ignoring internal consistency for interesting/satisfying payoffs."

More or less. If it isn't both internally consistent and engaging then the payoffs are not interesting or satisfying, full stop.

"The series isn't internally consistent."

Not completely, no. You can't really expect that when Toriyama didn't have a plan. That said, I do think the parts that aren't are poorly written. The problem I have with modern Dragon Ball is that it's significantly more vague, contradictive, and incredulous. The original run of the series had problems, plenty of them when it came to anime only stuff, but Dragon Ball Super has more numerous and more significant problems.

By conceding that battle powers were used effectively in the battle with Vegeta you've conceded that battle powers don't inherently make the story predictable. Whether or not you have a particular problem with how the series has used them before or since doesn't really concern me. Furthermore a story shouldn't be either or. It needs to be engaging AND internally consistent. You can't be one or the other because a lack of one leads a break in the immersion regardless. I happen to think Dragon Ball is engaging despite the fact that battle powers run the show. You may not, but once again, I don't particularly care. 

Frankly whether or not a story is predictable or not shouldn't matter. I'd say it was pretty obvious the Rebels were going to win by the end of the original trilogy. Is the original Star Wars trilogy now bad because the outcome was predictable? 

"Trying to calculate battle powers is predicting the outcome of the fights."

Er, you clearly don't understand the process. People attribute battle power post facto BECAUSE of the constant escalation. In other words the unpredictable nature of this series makes it impossible to project battle powers onto characters until all is said and done. 

And no, it wouldn't be acceptable to give Kuririn an ass-pull power up. In case you haven't noticed, people don't respond well to incredulous power ups. The story needs to engage it's audience by providing reasons for what happens.  It's also not a horrible story when characters fall behind. Characters can still be useful in ways that don't involve power. Once again, I'll point to the battle with Vegeta, where Yajirobe, the weakest person there, was able to use surprise to cut off Vegeta's tail. There's also Dende who can heal people and restore the Dragon Balls. Blooma can create useful inventions like the Dragon Radar or the time machine. Mr. Satan can get people to contribute to the Genki Dama using his status. Hell, they don't even really need to be useful, they just need to be likable. You seem to like bringing up MHA a lot. Tell me, how often are Mineta, Invisible Girl, and Ican'tstoptwinkling useful? They're usually just there to lighten the mood with gags, no? Not every character has to contribute, they can get by on being gags or characters. Piccolo and Gohan aren't terribly useful these days, all things considered, but their relationship leads to some meaningful scenes a lot of the time because they are likable characters. Just because Goku tends to save the day like he always has doesn't mean the other characters are worthless.

Also, what? The Force is still limited to those who are Force sensitive. That hasn't changed at all. And you are totally off base with Rey. People were attributing potential parentage to her because of how strong she was with the Force. It's not BECAUSE she had the Force. Honestly though, people were wasting their time with that one. Rey is already broken because even Space Jesus himself, Anakin, had to train to use the Force. Honestly, I wouldn't be using the modern Star Wars trilogy as a positive "retcon"... Even though Midichlorians weren't retconned, they've just been shoved under the rug so to speak. 

No, it absolutely is. If you aren't going to stick to the rules of your universe, I have flat 0 reason to be invested in it. Battle Powers also don't make things predictable. The best you can do is say the strongest guy wins, but that doesn't tell you how the story is going to unfold. Dragon Ball wasn't terribly predictable when all was said and done. It was able to be internally consistent and still surprise you. The battle with Vegeta is a great example. It was full of twists yet remained internally consistent. 

>Oh no, Vegeta is stronger than Goku's Kaio-ken? What's he gonna do?

>Oh no, Vegeta became a giant ape, everyone is screwed!

>Oh no, the Genki Dama didn't work!

No, Midi-chlorians were avoided because the fans didn't like the fact they demystified the Force. No one cared that it gave Jedi "power levels". Frankly, they didn't even matter much because Jedi battles mostly came down to who could use their lightsaber the most effectively. 

Well, regardless of the problems you might have with power levels being the basis for conflict resolution, internal consistency is important. 

Eh, I'd say fusion is the bigger problem. The Super Exciting Guide at least provides an established hierarchy.

In the wealth of information I could find on fusion, contradictions and vagueries abound. 

Please actually do that.

Sounds like every other Kingdom Hearts game based on what I've experienced through OneyPlays, lol.

If you got the digital version of the game, you probably did. It's just buried. I had to do a manual search for Nintendo in my G-Mail and I eventually found it. 

Well, as long as he remakes Sonic Adventure like he said he wants to.

That's an insult to Sunshine.

Eh, I'm gonna need to see some statistics when you start throwing around assertions like "people care more about the fighting than the story telling."

I don't have any problems getting invested in the Star Wars original trilogy despite seeing it a hundred times. It's also been 5 years since we've experienced the original story in an era where we've experienced Super and these new game stories, so for ME this is a breath of fresh air. Years of crap and I finally get something tried and true.

It wasn't perfect, but it's leaps and bounds better than these attempts to shake things up. They can keep trying all they want. I don't have faith in their ability to improve, especially when games are about the game, not the story. 

As far as I'm aware, Toei and Shueisha aren't as concerned with the international market. The focus Dragon Ball Z gets is mostly the result of the popularity of Z specifically in Japan. 

The original video games stories won't improve. Dragon Ball Super itself is struggling to tell engaging stories. The video games don't have a chance as far as I'm concerned. 

I mean, it's been half a decade since they've retold the story, and all these "original stories" have kinda sucked anyway, so it doesn't bother me in the slightest. 

Same. I do hope they start doing costumes though so they can recreate the SSGSS Gogeta vs Legendary Super Saiyan Broli fight. 

SA2 Sonic

Trailer

>Implying Kingdom Hearts has a story. 

Honestly, just based on what I've watched through OneyPlays, it looks like one big clusterfuck of nonsense, lol.

I mean, I got a 100%, so that wouldn't affect me, lol.

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