Boss battles needs to be more difficult and less obvious.

[thedarkknight]

The bosses needs to be changed to be enjoyable and less obvious. I believe the current boss battles are too lame and obvious

Examples:

Egg Viper- why is Eggman being stupid and allowing Sonic to attack him?

Egg Hornet, why is he leaving himself so vulnerable?

Sonic and the Commander (StH), easy use Homing attack on Sonic and then on the Commander.

Silver the Hedgehog in Sonic 06, when Silver sees Sonic attacking him, why doesn't he drop the items he's carrying and dodge Sonic's attack?

I'm saying that boss battles needs to be less obvious and more difficult to master in order to give us a challenge.

Edit: Oh great now you losers are downvoting me, sad...

Edited July 30, 2011 by thedarkknight

[Koopalmier]

I don't know, bosses in platformers tend to be easy and obvious...

[Vertekins]

As for the Sonic & Diablon Boss Fight, the reason is obvious; To make Shadow look like more of a competent badass and to make Sonic look weak by comparison. Despite how painfully obvious the obscene nerfing of Sonic is, him being utilized as an absolutely ridiculous way of attacking Diablon reflects badly on how Shadow's badassery is unbelievably portrayed. It also blatantly shows just how Sonic has been disrespected. But then wasn't everyone in ShTH?

As Aquaslash once said, a competent Sonic would've made that boss fight TRUE final boss material. This wasn't so in any way, shape or form in that boss fight because of the vain effort in making Shadow look better. At the end of the day, it doesn't stand for anything.

As for Eggman always leaving himself open, well, that's understandable for a variety of reasons; To make the bosses defeatable and to portray Eggman's boastfulness and confidence even in the face of a guy who has defaced his precious creations time and time again.

[JezMM]

It's kind of a rule of fun thing. Platformer bosses tend to be formulaic like this because it makes for fun, timing and movement based gameplay.

If you remove moments where the boss is able to be attacked what do you replace them with? The boss has to be possible, it's kind of like saying "levels need to be more difficult and less obvious, they should just have endless pits of spikes with no floating platforms so the player has to be challenged and THINK to get across". ...So how do they get across.

For example, let's take Egg Viper.

If you remove the bits where Eggman is open to attack, how on earth are you supposed to attack him? Would it just be a case of you can only attack him during tiny windows of opportunity - like say, homing attacking him when he's doing his GET A LOAD OF THIS laser attack? If so I think in the long-run that'd actually make him easier, since you don't have to "survive" through any attacks before you can fight back. If you know how to beat them at every moment you'll finish the boss in record time upon replays.

Another example, let's take Silver.

"Why doesn't he drop his objects and dodge?" Well if he did that every time you attacked he'd be impossible to beat. What do you suggest instead?

Edited July 30, 2011 by JezMM

[thedarkknight]

It's kind of a rule of fun thing. Platformer bosses tend to be formulaic like this because it makes for fun, timing and movement based gameplay.

If you remove moments where the boss is able to be attacked what do you replace them with? The boss has to be possible, it's kind of like saying "levels need to be more difficult and less obvious, they should just have endless pits of spikes with no floating platforms so the player has to be challenged and THINK to get across". ...So how do they get across.

I agree that there needs to be a way to defeat a boss, but I'm saying don't make it so stupid like Egg Hornet and Egg Viper. It could be settled through chance e.g. have an enemy and a spring to jump on, when you jump on the spring there's a 25% chance of hitting the enemy.

[JezMM]

Putting chance elements into the Sonic franchise would be horrifically annoying, especially considering how fun the games are for speedrunning. I also edited my post with some direct examples.

[Kuzu]

Platforming bosses tend to be a lot more easier than the stages so...

[thedarkknight]

It's kind of a rule of fun thing. Platformer bosses tend to be formulaic like this because it makes for fun, timing and movement based gameplay.

If you remove moments where the boss is able to be attacked what do you replace them with? The boss has to be possible, it's kind of like saying "levels need to be more difficult and less obvious, they should just have endless pits of spikes with no floating platforms so the player has to be challenged and THINK to get across". ...So how do they get across.

For example, let's take Egg Viper.

If you remove the bits where Eggman is open to attack, how on earth are you supposed to attack him? Would it just be a case of you can only attack him during tiny windows of opportunity - like say, homing attacking him when he's doing his GET A LOAD OF THIS laser attack? If so I think in the long-run that'd actually make him easier, since you don't have to "survive" through any attacks before you can fight back. If you know how to beat them at every moment you'll finish the boss in record time upon replays.

There should be a spring or something which allows you to attack Eggman on the right moment when he's using his laser for example.

Another example, let's take Silver.

"Why doesn't he drop his objects and dodge?" Well if he did that every time you attacked he'd be impossible to beat. What do you suggest instead?

He has a time-out after using too many of his powers so he's vulnerable.

Edited July 30, 2011 by thedarkknight

[Kuzu]

He has a time-out after using too many of his powers so he's vulnerable.

[thedarkknight]

Exactly, how else are you supposed to hurt him?

The bosses can't be "DIE YOU SON OF A BITCH" hard, because then we have shit like the Sonic 4 final boss, ridiculously cheap.

Edited July 30, 2011 by thedarkknight

[Unknown User]

When I clicked on this topic I was thinking, "Are you crazy?" and then I noticed the poster and I said "oh".

I prefer it wouldn't be hard. It would make the game less fun, IMO.

Sonic 3 difficulty kind of, to me, is the ideal.

Edited July 30, 2011 by Ishtar

[Sega DogTagz]

The bosses can't be "DIE YOU SON OF A BITCH" hard, because then we have shit like the Sonic 4 final boss, ridiculously cheap.

[Kuzu]

Yeah but Egg Hornet was stupid and cheap.

[thedarkknight]

....Not sure if serious, I know you're not talking about the Egg Hornet in Sonic Adventure are you.

Yep, I'm talking about SA.

Fuck that Moonwalk, I spent all afternoon trying to kill that bastard.

I admit the bosses need to be harder, they don't need to be cheap.

[JezMM]

You're saying the second boss of the game wasn't hard enough? D=

[Kuzu]

What's that supposed to mean?

[Sega DogTagz]

Fuck that Moonwalk, I spent all afternoon trying to kill that bastard.

I admit the bosses need to be harder, they don't need to be cheap.

[JezMM]

I think for me the cheapest part of the Sonic 4 boss was that he shoots his arm out at a random timing each time. I could never consistantly dodge it. The only times I beat that boss is when I'm lucky enough to not get hit frequently enough that my rings go flying to unreachable locations. Moonwalk never bothered me, in fact I rather enjoy that attack as an original concept.

[Sega DogTagz]

I think for me the cheapest part of the Sonic 4 boss was that he shoots his arm out at a random timing each time. I could never consistantly dodge it. The only times I beat that boss is when I'm lucky enough to not get hit frequently enough that my rings go flying to unreachable locations. Moonwalk never bothered me, in fact I rather enjoy that attack as an original concept.

[thedarkknight]

How is the Egg hornet cheap? It has only two attacks, which stupidly easy to dodge, if you thought that was hard you need to stop playing Sonic.

[Sega DogTagz]

It was too easy and obvious, why would Eggman dig himself into the ground when he knows Sonic is too fast?

[thedarkknight]

Cheap is not the word you wanna associate with that bro.

[Komodin]

It was too easy and obvious, why would Eggman dig himself into the ground when he knows Sonic is too fast?

[Badnik Mechanic]

Edit: Oh great now you losers are downvoting me, sad...

[TwoTailedFox]

Haha, it's really funny. If they're too easy, people complain. If they're too hard, people complain!

*cough*

Personally, I don't think they're too easy. I think they're kinda hard (Sonic 2 first boss 8-bit version comes to mind). And besides, there HAS to be a part where you can hit him, otherwise, it would be near (if not outright) impossible to get past the first boss!