The mysteries of the Master Emerald: why can't Knuckles be in the games?

[Kuzu]

Except you completely forgot that, in the middle of all that, there's a freaking alien invasion occuring across the entire globe. That's as much of an incentive for each and everyone of them to get involved as part of Shadow's past involves said alien invasion and having the invasion be stopped.

And that's partly why that game is one of the exceptions for Knuckles to be off his island, since there's hardly a place were you don't see the Black Arms involved or something that doesn't have their hand in the influence with some exceptions.

The invasion is only part of the plot, if that was the case they should've just been small cameos an nothing else. They're all given lines and show up on the Black Comet in the last story why? They don't even help out in the final battle.

But even Knuckles himself said, "Maybe I should get back to Angel Island". What I'm saying is while Knuckles may have had a reason to be off his island, it still doesn't change the fact that he was a minor character at best in that game, who could've easily been replaced by some generic GUN soldier and nothing would change. There was no reason for him to be in the game, even if there was an in-universe reason.

Not exactly. Silver and Blaze happen to be involved because they're affected by what happens in the present when a monster is unleashed.

Blaze is mostly just there and doesn't do anything until Silver's ending. I mean Silver showed more of a response to his future than Blaze does.

Shadow and Rouge get involved when a mission of theirs go deeper and has them try to avert part of said monster from destroying all existence while having Omega come along to help stop it as well

Ok I'll give you that..

Sonic is practically on a wild goose chase protecting a princess, but said princess is the container of a monster that affects Silver and Blaze's time.

Sonic still has no bearing to the plot though, the whole Protect the princess angle could've been given to Silver.

As could anyone else. But that completely ignores other circumstances that relate to the character for them to be involved.

There's a reason why I didn't question Knuckles being off the island in ShTH, and yet I was critical of that in other games like Heroes and Sonic 06.

....If they have a big role, then obviously the plot the is going to affect them on how they get involved.

I don't question Knuckles being off his island in ShTH, but I do question why he was ever put into the game in the first place, despite not doing anything. At the same time I question why he was off his island in Heroes, but he was part of the whole Team Gimmick, so at least it makes sense from a game-standpoint.

[Ekajra]

Except you completely forgot that, in the middle of all that, there's a freaking alien invasion occuring across the entire globe. That's as much of an incentive for each and everyone of them to get involved as part of Shadow's past involves said alien invasion and having the invasion be stopped.

And that's partly why that game is one of the exceptions for Knuckles to be off his island, since there's hardly a place were you don't see the Black Arms involved or something that doesn't have their hand in the influence with some exceptions.

It also helps that the first level he does show up in are ancient ruins (tying into his knowledge of archaeology and languages and such) which later turn out to be ancient alien airships (tying into his knowledge of giant flying things).

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

The invasion is only part of the plot, if that was the case they should've just been small cameos an nothing else. They're all given lines and show up on the Black Comet in the last story why? They don't even help out in the final battle.

Edited August 10, 2011 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[Sonictrainer]

The question I want to ask is where in the world is its Sol equivalent.

Edited August 10, 2011 by STrainer

[Ekajra]

Was Knuckles on the Floating Island when he encountered Rouge for the first time in Sonic Adventure 2 or was that somewhere in the Desert?

[Kuzu]

Because they were completely affected by the nerve gas that paralyzed them prior to them getting to the leader. If they weren't affected, they would've helped Shadow out but they obviously weren't in a position to do so.

I mean how ineffectual they were to the last story, if the nerve gas never happened, and they maybe were clearing a path for Shadow to get to Black Doom, then I wouldn't have a problem with it. but if they never intended for them to participate in the first place, why put them on the Comet to begin with?

And yet you forget the fact that every GUN Soldier was specifically order to shoot down Shadow on sight right after the first level, so obviously he couldn't have been replaced by GUN. Maybe another character, but not GUN.

That's what I meant more or less.

And frankly, that "Maybe I should get back to Angel Island" could very well imply that Angel Island was invaded like every other patch of earth and that he's out only to root out the aliens doing the same thing to other places. There was every reason for him to be in the game unlike Heroes and Sonic 06, ESPECIALLY since he had an in-universe reason. Haven't you notice that's the very thing that I've been arguing to keep Knuckles from shoe-horning, and yet this is the one game I'm arguing that his apperance isn't shoehorned despite not doing his job and you're trying to use that against him.

It's not a case of him simply being around to help save the world from being in danger, it's a case of him stopping the danger that's already began to wreak it's destruction.

But you yourself said he should never abandon his post even when the going gets tough, because as you said there are other people capable of taking care of it and not just Knuckles.

To make another analogy (I'm in love with these things lately), the former is like having him around to stop a campfire at a small site before it grows into a forest fire which completely ignores that someone else could be around to put it out without needing him so long as they keep an eye on it (Heroes, Sonic 06). The latter is like trying to control a wildfire in a forest that came out of no where, and the character's present to stop it from growing are already struggling to quell it's destruction (ShTH).

But if he's supposed to guard that small spot, AND if there are other characters to contain the wildfire, why abandon your post? ITs been said he takes it very seriously.

She does a lot more than most of the other amigo character. Then again, this is the game that completely jacked up whether she was from another dimension or the future to the fans.

Which is why I say she shouldn't have been with it.

He had less of a bearing to the plot than Silver and Shadow, but he still had a significant bearing to the plot regardless. The protect the princess angle couldn't have been given to Silver, because then you'd have to re-write the entire plot regarding all three main characters.

Silver was there to kill Sonic, thinking he would be the trigger to the end of the world. He didn't know how Sonic would trigger the apocalypse, but he wasn't too far off in knowing that he would in someway. Taking Sonic away from the princess renders the current way for there to be a trigger in the first place nonexistent because you then have to rewrite everything in order to make a new trigger. The trigger was killing Sonic in order to make the princess cry, and killing Sonic would've done that. Take out Sonic and give it to Silver, you have to find another way to make her cry, not to mention you'd have to rewrite how Mephilies goes about his actions and maybe even find someone else to convince to kill Silver.

And this is just the simplified explanation. You can't take something out and give it to someone else and expect it to work the same way, because something this significant does not work that way. Even though the game wasn't fully thought out, it had enough in certain places that you'd be essentially breaking down a pillar and expect the other two pillars to hold the same weight above them when they would collapse along with it.

I admit the giving it to Silver part was kind of farfetched, but I'm pretty sure another human could've been made to replace Sonic, and if the story plays out the exact same way it wouldn't change much.

It's not a black and white case of whether they have a big role or a small one, it's more of a case of what their role is and how it fits within the plot along with what the character's occupation is. I could even go further than that.

But what if that Big role has nothing to do with their occupation?

I've never argued for the game-standpoint, and it doesn't make sense either way you want to cut it considering that Knuckles had more of a reason to be off the island in ShTH than he ever did in Heroes

The game standpoint is part of the argument because he's been shoehorned in many games with nothing to do. Even if he did have a reason to be off his island in ShTH he still had no place in the game, because he had nothing to do with Shadow's past. While in Heroes while he had no reason to be off the island, but he had a place in the game to be the third member of Team Sonic, I admit its still shoehorning but it still made sense from a game standpoint.

First things first, you know full well that ShTH was Shadow's game, and yet you question why Knuckles was given such a minor role? Yet you forget that most of the other character's had equally minor roles as well, so you should very well question why Amy, The Chaotix, Tails, and even Sonic is in the game. For one, I'll remind you, there's an alien invasion going on! Everyone present in the game was fighting them off to protect the world from being conquered by an outside force at large, with said outside force being present at just about every corner of the globe. Knuckles was doing as much as everyone else bar Shadow who was getting deeper to the problem on his own. He didn't have to, but because of what was going on and the circumstances involved, it's not too farfetched to understand why he did as opposed to his involvement in the other games.

I did question everyone's role in ShTH none of them have an impact on the story(Shadow's past) even if they are fighting off the invasion, that has nothing to do with the main plot of the game, that's only a portion of it.

Its like a story about finding an ancient artifact, there's a one off character that helps them locate the artifact, but then he's never seen or heard from again. I don't know if this makes sense, but i think it does.

[batson]

Not to mention that the same logic does apply to other characters so long as it isn't a measure of whether someone likes a character more than the other and more about what this character had wrong in terms of use and portrayal and how to fix it and/or what is this character capable of doing and how can they do it within their restrictions. If you're going to say that character Y should be around to help character X save the world, that's not a very strong reason to have Y around when character Z is just as capable of being around to save the world to the same measure that you would want character Y around.

Edited August 10, 2011 by batson

[Kuzu]

But there can be reasons for why someone feel that a certain character should make more appearances and/or have more important roles in the series than certain other characters that doesnt relate to favoritism or the critera that you describe (im refering to your quote "what this character had wrong in terms of use and portrayal and how to fix it and/or what is this character capable of doing and how can they do it within their restrictions"), but for other reasons entirely

As an example: while i like Knuckles, he is in fact not even among my top 7 favorite Sonic characters. One of the characters i like a lot more than him is Vector. But i would never do something as silly as try to argue than Vector should be considered a more major character than Knuckles and be put in more games than him. So i dont think my belief that Knuckles should be rightfully considered a more important aspect of the Sonic franchise than the vast majority of other characters can really be attributed solely to my own fondness of the character. No, the reason i argue that Knuckles should be preserved as one of the main and preferably one of the most frequently recurring characters is because of his legacy, his prominence and his fame. He is a recognizable staple of the series that has contributed a lot to it for many years, something that simply cant be said about many of the less prominent supporting characters.

(Oh and for the record, i want to take this oppurtunity to say that although i understand that my liking for the character might sometimes drive me to say things that might suggest otherwise, i really dont consider Metal Sonic to be that important to the Sonic series. On an "importance" scale, he is obviously well below at least Sonic, Eggman, Tails, Knuckles, Amy and Shadow, and possibly a few others as well.)

[Ekajra]

So basically, the characters that have left the most impact, and are better known count as main characters?

I suppose that's generally how people would define "main characters".

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

I mean how ineffectual they were to the last story, if the nerve gas never happened, and they maybe were clearing a path for Shadow to get to Black Doom, then I wouldn't have a problem with it. but if they never intended for them to participate in the first place, why put them on the Comet to begin with?

Edited August 11, 2011 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[goku262002]

Wasn't chronicles supposed to explain all this?

Well i think its time we finally had an explation as to why knuckles is the last of his kind, why hes left to guard this gaint emerald and why his island was cut down to just an alter after S3nk.

But at this current time, who knows if we will ever see that happen.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Wasn't chronicles supposed to explain all this?

Chronicles isn't considered canon, so it doesn't actually explain anything other than offer a "what if" idea as any other spin-off.

[goku262002]

Chronicles isn't considered canon, so it doesn't actually explain anything other than offer a "what if" idea as any other spin-off.

Still even if chronicles isn't canon, maybe it can give us some sort of idea as to why. btw, what makes chronicles non-canon again? was it because it had references to other universes or was it something else?

[Kuzu]

...*sighs* Ok...let's do this.

Because clearly Black Doom was manipulating the star character, and they had to be around to convince him the other way. Not to mention in the various other endings where some of the characters invaded the Black Comet, it's not hard to assume that they had to do some heavy fighting to get to that point, even moreso considering that was the enemy's homefront.

But most of those endings aren't even canon, and even considering that, none of them had anyway of knowing what was going on with Shadow, most of the characters were with him for a cutscene or two, and I doubt Shadow shared any info about his connection with Black Doom.

Really? Find those exact words...

Now Shadic, I don't think you meant any problems, but I think I need to let you know this: I am VERY OCD about my wording, and using words with different meanings like that is a good way to piss me right the fuck off because sometimes that small change can very well alter the whole meaning of what I really meant. I don't tend to say much about it because people don't often reword it making it read like something else, and they read it word for word. If I haven't gotten on to them about it, it means that I didn't see anything misinterpreted or out of context.

The part I'm nitpicking about is claiming I said he should never abandon his post, as that makes me come off as too inflexible. For one, why in three green hells would I say he should never abandon his post and yet I directly told you of a point where he did just that and I didn't have a problem with it compared to other moments? Explain that to me, because that makes me come off as a complete hypocrite, and that really doesn't fly with me.

Dude chill, you didn't say it word for word, but you said something similar:

Not to mention the fact that if he's away and the ME does get stolen, the world would be at an even greater risk. Anyone who has the ME can effectively drain or magnify the Chaos Emeralds or power a doomsday machine with it by itself, and that alone makes it a very potent item.

Doesn't that count as putting the world at risk, if he leaves to fight aliens?

I said that Knuckles shouldn't be around just for the sake of helping Sonic when he's not the only character that can be of assistance. I've said plenty of times in the past, and I'll say it plenty more times if I have to, that is too vague a reason to have him around and said reason could be used for any other character.

Or if you have an event that is currently happening worldwide at the moment, and Knuckles just so happens to be around for the hell of it, you've managed to somehow dodge that bullet. You know during the opening in Unleashed where Eggman cracked the world into pieces or the Black Arms invading the planet? Those are examples of the worldwide events I'm talking about, where there wouldn't be much of a question why he or any other character is around. But Sonic 06 where the danger is focused in a single area like Soleanna and the area around it as opposed to the whole world at large? That's a very weak reason for him to be around. Now if Iblis was released earlier and went on rampage in the present period and affected Angel Island, that's when I would have to shut the hell up regarding why Knuckles is around.

But other than that, if you want Knuckles and only Knuckles to be around with Sonic, have something more specific to Knuckles as a character to have him involved that can't be used by any other character as an excuse to bring them in as well.

Let me give you some examples:

-Have someone invade the Floating Island with no intention of having the master emerald.

-Have the Master Emerald be affected by certain anomalies that require Knuckles to venture out and fix to save the emerald.

-Have another character indirectly be affected by the ME so that Knuckles has to go and keep them under control. Say Shadow is using too much Chaos Energy for something, and said energy is being detected by the ME and is causing problems globally that only Knuckles is aware of at that moment and needs to stop Shadow from abusing said energy.

-Have the Master Emerald be the cause of an environment or global problem that requires Knuckles to stop

-Have the Master Emerald be the one indirectly causing destruction across the globe

-Have Angel Island contain more mysteries that even Knuckles isn't aware of

-Have someone try to steal the Master Emerald

-Have someone do something that only the Master Emerald can stop, i.e. like they did with the Chaos Emeralds in SA2

-Have an all out war on Angel Island that draws the attention of every character even though the ME isn't what the war is about.

-Have an event that affects the entire globe to the point that every character is affected, Angel Island included even if it isn't a place you're going to explore

-Have one of the heroic character turn into an antagonist because of them being affected by the ME's power

Christ man, I just thought of 11 ways you could get Knuckles involved off the top of my head, each one different from the other in some way. Do you want me to add a few more examples? Because I can keep going deeper in using those examples.

But Eggman's plans ARE Worldwide, Eggman isn't trying to conquer one section of the planet, he's wants the whole damn thing so I'm pretty sure it falls under the worldwide rule you're going by. I never said I want Knuckles and ONLY Knuckles around Sonic, obviously other characters would get involved if the M.E. was in trouble: Maybe Rouge was trying to steal it and got caught up in the trouble, maybe Amy sees the terror and decides to help, perhaps Tails wanted to check on Knuckles and finds out he's missing. If the trouble is in one area than I agree Knuckles shouldn't get involved because as you said there are other characters that can help Sonic, but if Eggman's plans for BEYOND one area then Knuckles can get involved because Eggman is a global threat and not just bound to one area.

Because said small spot is part of the wildfire the other characters are trying to contain. After saving that small spot from a portion of that fire, it would be greatly appreciated if you could help the other characters struggling to contain it in other places so that the spot you just saved doesn't get reignited again. And if it does, you could help the other characters with theirs and get their help to re-quell the reignited fire.

That a good enough explanation?

But once again didn't you say if he leaves the small spot, that puts it in jeopardy while he's putting out the rest of the wildfire?

Not to mention the fact that if he's away and the ME does get stolen, the world would be at an even greater risk.

You'd be changing some pretty big areas, such as Super Sonic being required to deal with Solaris as one example. I could go on, but really, something like that would require restructuring in someway. Not every piece can be put in a different place, and this is one that fits in place to the point that other pieces are dependent on it as much as it is with them.

\Yeah,I'll concede to this,

Then they probably shouldn't have that big role in the first place. Either whatever is going on somehow affects them to the point they have to get involved (be it a major or minor role) or they should be left out. Not too different from my above example of where to use the character regarding what's going on.

But if their role is minor why should they be put in at all? Unless its for the sake of cameo, especially if said character is technically one of the main characters?

The thing you're not getting is that Shadow's past was only part of the plot. Not the whole thing; he had to figure out what he was created for, but in the midst of that he also has to stop an alien invasion from taking over or help said invasion conquer the world, which was the other part of the plot.

And with that being the case, with the invasion being encountered at almost every point of the game, it's not a huge stretch of logic to understand why someone who is supposed to guard his island is off of it, because said island may have been invaded like every other place and him thinking only for himself when the planet at large is in a crisis isn't going to keep said invaders from invading it again, especially if the end up conquering everywhere else

.

But if he leaves to fight off the invasion doesn't that put the M.E. at risk still? What if Black Doom decided that he needed more power for his plan?

Okay, if there's shoehorning, it's a problem, no if, ands, or buts about it. I don't give a damn what place he had to fill regarding him being a member of Team Sonic, and I'm not going to make it an exception when he has no reason to be off the island if it doesn't affect him.

No shoehorning=no problem. Simple as that. I wouldn't make that kind of exception for any other characters, why the hell would I do so for Knuckles?

If he wasn't in Heroes, then Heroes literally could not have happened unless you completely rewrite the story.

God this is good practice for College.

[XavierRussell]

Can't we just accept that the Master Emerald is apart of who Knuckles is? I'd stick to suggesting ways to get Knuckles away from it:

1) Play it out in a humorous way. Have Knuckles show up to help just in the nick of time. When asked about the M.E. cut to a scene of Knux setting up a shoddy looking scarecrow that looks like himself :3

2) Have an adventure that takes place on Angel Island. Red Mountain, Angel Island (Sadv1), Chaos Angel(Sadv3), etc... Angel island is massive and an adventure there would be easy to pull off again.

3) If the M.E. is gonna keep getting stolen, make it a running gag. Get rid of the tension around it. "You lost it again!? Cmon Knucklehead..."

These are the types solutions I think are worth worrying about...

If he wasn't in Heroes, then Heroes literally could not have happened unless you completely rewrite the story.

I always thought he only joined there because the 3 day time limit was a pretty big deal.

Edited August 11, 2011 by XavierRussell

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

But most of those endings aren't even canon, and even considering that, none of them had anyway of knowing what was going on with Shadow, most of the characters were with him for a cutscene or two, and I doubt Shadow shared any info about his connection with Black Doom.

There HAS to be a canon path, because there needs to be something which explains how Shadow went from Westopolis to the Black Comet.

Dude chill, you didn't say it word for word, but you said something similar:

Doesn't that count as putting the world at risk, if he leaves to fight aliens?

Yes, but having the whole world currently being under attack with EVERYTHING in going to the victor (or getting destroyed) is obviously going to affect him in the long run, now would it?

But Eggman's plans ARE Worldwide, Eggman isn't trying to conquer one section of the planet, he's wants the whole damn thing so I'm pretty sure it falls under the worldwide rule you're going by.

I thought I was clear enough with the Unleashed and ShTH examples but if I need to go further, it has to AFFECT it worldwide! Not simply be worldwide to be part of the worldwide rule I'm going by.

Let me show you want I'm talking about for example: Eggman simply making plans to take over the world is one thing, but if his plans of world domination aren't going any further than the city he's in, it's not affecting Knuckles. Or If his plans ARE going further than the city and is reaching across multiple parts of the globe, but isn't affecting Angel Island, that's not affecting Knuckles either. Him simply flying by the island could be enough to put Knuckles on alert, but if he's not intending to invade the island, build something on it, using it in someway, damaging it someway be it direct or indirect, or trying to capture it, then it's still not affecting him.

If Eggman, on the other hand, blows up a part of the earth nearby and Angel Island ends up being caught in the crossfire, then it's affecting him. If Eggman is planning to take over a city, and he happens to land on Angel Island to build a base, that's also affecting Angel Island. And if he's planing to use Angel Island as part of his plans to conquer the world, that's affecting him to. Or like in Unleashed, if Eggman blows up the entire planet into pieces, that not only affects Knuckles, but that affects everyone else as well. If the entire world is at war for it's very survival from an outside force trying to lay waste to everything in it like what happened in ShTh, that's also affecting him since they're not going to leave the island alone once they have everything else.

Or even on the extreme front: If Eggman actually ends up conquering the world, then it's going to affecting him on the count that the entire world and everything in it (such as Angel Island) would now belong to the main villain and Eggman can do whatever he wants to the planet at large. And if someone tried to resist, he is capable of going to whatever extremes he so feels like: he could nuke the island, send millions of robots of defining qualities to invade the island, or if he had the Chaos Emeralds in his posession he could use them in some way to control the island. Knuckles would have to be involved in order to stop Eggman since the stakes are higher: Angel Island could be the only place not under Eggman's full control, so with everything else in his ownership he can direct all his resources he would want in order to capture or destroy the island. And that's just the simple way to explain this.

An analogy to this would be someone saying he was going to punch someone in the face. It's enough to put the other guy on alert to be careful for that person, but until the guy actually hits him it's not affecting him enough for him to get involved in fighting him back.

Or to put it another way, you don't start a war until someone declares it on you or commits an outright act of war against you. In the same sense, Knuckles doesn't get involved in a fight to save the world unless Eggman ends up putting Angel Island in the crossfire while in the middle of his plans. Kinda like what he did in SA1: Knuckles was minding his own business on the floating island not being involved with anything that doesn't concern him. Eggman's Egg Carrier is flying towards the island in what seems to be an invasion or an attack towards it. Now once we see cut to Knuckles and see him resting, we hear a sound coming from the Emerald Alter and look up to see Chaos. I would assume that Eggman fired a shot at the Master Emerald in order to release Chaos. Knuckles didn't know that and assumed it was Chaos who destroyed the ME, but upon seeing Eggman and Chaos working together Knuckles ends up involving himself to stop Eggman.

I'd continue, but I'm pretty sure you're all too familiar with SA1's stories.

But once again didn't you say if he leaves the small spot, that puts it in jeopardy while he's putting out the rest of the wildfire?

I said it puts it at risk. But at the same time, it's a risk if he doesn't get involve if said wildfire is also affecting him.

He can put out the fire on his end and not bother with anyone else, but if the other people end up unable to contain it on their end, then the fire will just continue to spread until it destroys everything in its path. Him leaving his spot after putting out his fire may put it at risk again, but since it already affects him, if he helps someone else out in putting their section of the fire out, then they can help return the favor by coming in stronger to put out the flames if it reignites back in his area.

I also said that if the fire was a fire in a more controlled area, or a campfire as I worded it, then it's not much of an incentive for him to help put it out when it can be handled without much of a trouble. But a metaphorical "wildfire" that is currently affecting the entire world at large is not something that is going to be taken care of without much trouble.

But if their role is minor why should they be put in at all? Unless its for the sake of cameo, especially if said character is technically one of the main characters?

Simply because of the fact that not every character is going to have a main role all the time. A minor role is a support role for the major role: it has a purpose to the plot, but it's much smaller compared to the major role that has a much bigger purpose to the plot.

Seriously, try and make a plot where everyone is a main character all at once. That's some very tough work (damn near impossible actually), because you won't have a character you want to focus on since everyone is a main one of equal importance in the plot involved and you can't make every character involved be at the same place at the same time for the same reasons and with the same significance unless you're going to completely go without a character to be the focus at that given moment. And It's for that very reason you can't have every character be the main character of a plot at the same time. Some are going to be less prominent than others, some will be more prominent than others, and some won't be there at all.

You're essentially crafting a world, and in that world not everyone is going to be in it for the same reasons because they are different people with different interest and attitudes and so on and so forth. That's why certain characters will be in one place, some will be somewhere else; some will be threatened, others won't; some can be at the same place, but at different times; some can be at the same place at the same time, but for different reasons; some are involved, some are not; some are affected, others are not; some care, others don't. And when they are in it for the same reasons, someone or something has become so significant and so great an obstacle that it forced everyone to focus their priorities on it at the same time because it will affect everything if they don't work together and put their all to halt or completely stop and fix the problem.

That's what makes the character's different from each other, and that's what makes them who they are. And if you have two or more of them fighting the same problem for the same reasons at the same time and so on, you're better off not even bothering to have anymore than the one you started with since everyone else is in for the same thing as the first guy. There's no point in having a different character, when there's not much of a different motivation or interest or so on to make them different; that's what we refer to as "clones" even if they look completely different. So in other words, having Knuckles around to stop Eggman from conquering the world like Sonic is would essentially have Knuckles be "like Sonic but with super strength instead of speed."

And I'm explaining this as best as I can within how much I'm able to type, but if I have to make a 10 page essay (or more considering how this has gone) explaining this, I WILL! Although, this would be much easier if you were to use TV Tropes regarding major and minor roles that can end up differing for main and minor characters. Although considering how much of an encyclopedia the site is on story telling and how it covers this and various other elements, it ends up becoming even more complex than a mere 10 page essay would be able to explain.

Still, I'm not above doing it myself. And i'll go as far as to use TV Tropes myself in it.

But if he leaves to fight off the invasion doesn't that put the M.E. at risk still? What if Black Doom decided that he needed more power for his plan?

It does put it at risk. But it's a risk whether he does or doesn't.

On one hand, he stays on his island and protects it and the M.E. from falling into the hands of the alien invaders. To his advantage here, Knuckles can fight a more concentrated battle while the rest of the cast and the world is fighting on it's own front. But with that comes the risk that if the aliens conquer everywhere but his island, then they're going to claim that last piece of earth to complete their victory. Knuckles would essentially be one man against an entire planet of the invaders that laid seige upon it, and even he isn't going to be able to fight forever.

On the other hand, he leaves the island and helps prevent other places from falling into the hands of the alien invaders. To his advantage in this case, the aliens are more focused on the Chaos Emeralds across the globe than they are the Master Emerald. Even more so, that he can fight along side other friends and help add as a force multiplier whenever they travel to re-take lands that are under attack from the aliens. That comes with the risk of the aliens conquering his home island, and it would be a matter of time if they were to discover the M.E. which who knows what advantage that would give them.

This isn't the same case that was presented in Heroes or in Sonic 06, because his home wasn't in danger, nor was the world under attack at large.

In Heroes, his home was safe. Even the Chaos Emeralds were safe, although using them according to Eggman was no guarantee to stop the threat that was about to be unleashed. But the world wasn't being attack en mass to the point that you saw the GUN soldiers get involved en mass.

In Sonic 06...well, I think we already get the message regarding this one.

If he wasn't in Heroes, then Heroes literally could not have happened unless you completely rewrite the story.

Then I'd say you'd be doing Heroes a favor.

There wasn't really much to rewrite because Heroes' story was very paper thin in comparison to that of ShTH, Colors, Sonic 06, Unleashed, the Adventure, and such, at least regarding Team Sonic. Need I remind you, this game randomly brought back Shadow with no explanation as to how he survived until we get 10 minutes into the final boss in the the game after it. And from me, Heroes could definitely do with a rewrite whether Knuckles was involved or not.

In fact, that would work in favor for Knuckles because in the process of rewriting it you can then add the material and things that should involve him, which would make this whole argument moot regarding the game's rewrite.

Edited August 20, 2011 by ChaosSupremeSonic