Grind rails! What say you!

[ovarloard]

Your destination depends on where your facing when you enter the tubes, as far as I've witnessed.

I think the first automated instance was in Labrynith Zone, where Sonic slid down the waterfalls.

[turbojet]

Doesn't Big grind using his crotch though? XD He did sometimes in Sonic Heroes, I think when you pressed the B button to grind faster.

Big just went up 3 decibels of awesome for me. Now I wished that I played as the Rose Team just to see that shit!

[Solid SOAP]

It was good in SA2 when there was balancing and at least some skill involved, some of them were optional too. Bring back balancing and make most rails optional please.

[Indigo Rush]

Big just went up 3 decibels of awesome for me. Now I wished that I played as the Rose Team just to see that shit!

That, and he occasionally says "feels good" throughout the level.

...hah.

[turbojet]

That, and he occasionally says "feels good" throughout the level.

...hah.

He just went up a level in awesome and has become so bad ass that it's omnipotent.

[Carbo]

I love Grind Rails. In Sonic Heroes and Shadow the Hedgehog they fell flat cause it didn't have that "feel" to it like it had in SA2, it felt more like they were sliding on a thick piece of cord or whatever came across and they were far more mandatory. That and the controls during that point where awkward. Sonic 06 was just borderline awful, lead you through a fixed speed regardless of whether you were going fast or not upon jumping on a rail and is an auto-pilot route.

Sonic Unleashed had amazingly pushed Rails to another level for me. These were majority of the time mandatory but it wasnt just automated scripts like loops or so, these were a bit of the whole challenge as well and you had to keep it up to progress flawlessly, making me imagine that even though I'm on a rail now its different, and I still need to pay attention, there was no rest. Switching rails was now as easy as ever which makes it turn into a bit of a challenge, that and you can boost on the rails too in order to gain speed which adds more plus points to amounts of control put into the Unleashed railing. It was almost flawless.

SA2's rails were amazing, they felt like racing rails and many were optional. These were great fun to jump along during Multiplayer Races and it had that hardcore feeling with the cutting sound effects and the sparkles emitting from their shoes. Not only that but SA2's rails were FAST and action-paced. Sure, switching between rails was a pain, but when you'd come across a rail you'd know that you'd go faster than anything if given the chance, and it generally gave you that feel of "awesome". Back then it didn't feel like a simple "jump on here in order to proceed to the next area", except Final Rush which was 50% rails in theory but face it, that was the cream of the crop of the entire ordeal. Racing stunningly faster than ever with the pumping drum and bass track in the background in the middle of fucking space. I'm never forgetting that moment, easily the best moment of SA2 ever for me.

Edited April 30, 2009 by Carbo

[redmenace]

Big just went up 3 decibels of awesome for me. Now I wished that I played as the Rose Team just to see that shit!

Fast forward to 6.20 until the end.

People only hate the rails in Final Rush and Chase because they don't know how to grind properly. Trust me, I've been there, I know. Once you learn, Jet Set Radio in space are the best levels ever.

Edited May 1, 2009 by redmenace

[Phos]

If you want to put Espio on a rail (Why you would want to do this, I have no idea), I'd have him do the Ninja Run down it rather than grind.

I've been able to use the tubes to take me to different parts of the level. There's at least one set of tubes with a fork. I've always thought the first "whale" sequence was the airship chase on Angel Island in S3&K, even though that was kind of after the level.

You have to hold right or else you'll get bombed. The Whale sequence ignores all input. Technically, the bits where you run up the inside of the tree are automated, but they're quick and require you to have a minimum speed to activate, if I'm not mistaken.

I think the first automated instance was in Labrynith Zone, where Sonic slid down the waterfalls.

You can still jump during those. In fact, you need to jump or else it's an endless loop.

[SuperStingray]

You have to hold right or else you'll get bombed. The Whale sequence ignores all input. Technically, the bits where you run up the inside of the tree are automated, but they're quick and require you to have a minimum speed to activate, if I'm not mistaken.

It is still more of a "press right" scenario nonetheless. But I've got nothing against it since it's short and there's at least something going on.

You can still jump during those. In fact, you need to jump or else it's an endless loop.

On grind rails you can jump and a lot of times you have to.

[ovarloard]

You can still jump during those. In fact, you need to jump or else it's an endless loop.

You can jump while grinding.

EDIT: Never mind, A Ham Sandwich beat me to it.

Edited May 1, 2009 by OvErLoRd

[Badnik Zero]

You have to hold right or else you'll get bombed. The Whale sequence ignores all input.

I've screwed up the whale sequence by pressing the wrong direction and dying in the water. You can slow down. You can spin-dash there if you want to. It's definitely automated, but not scripted. They just made it much harder to screw up by adding all the speed pads.

In Sonic Heroes and Shadow the Hedgehog they fell flat cause it didn't have that "feel" to it like it had in SA2, it felt more like they were sliding on a thick piece of cord or whatever came across and they were far more mandatory.

I know what you mean, the rails were larger and that looked strange, and the speed was slower. On top of that, you got things like the goofy looking 180-spin instead of sparks, and grind loops which can be traveled on at any speed. What an awkward game.

Edited May 1, 2009 by Badnikz

[Phos]

The water slides still have a few things that set them apart from rails:

Rails are a challenge insofar that they require the player to hit them in order to use them. In 2D, that means you need to be above them, and in many games, jumping while on them causes you to pass through them. This type of unforgiving but not particularly punishing challenge is part of this irritating emphasis on "precision challenges", where Sonic has been turned into a game more akin to Trackmania, where the challenge does not come from determining what to do(lol pits from nowhere notwithstanding), but from executing the obvious. The slides are an environmental puzzle, you can't miss them, and the challenge is figuring out what you're supposed to do with them.

I've screwed up the whale sequence by pressing the wrong direction and dying in the water. You can slow down. You can spin-dash there if you want to. It's definitely automated, but not scripted. They just made it much harder to screw up by adding all the speed pads.

Are you talking about the Wiis2 version? In the PS360 version, you have zero control, the controller does nothing.

[Diogenes]

I've screwed up the whale sequence by pressing the wrong direction and dying in the water.

I've screwed up the whale sequence by doing nothing. That part's as buggy and unstable as the rest of the game...

[SuperStingray]

The water slides still have a few things that set them apart from rails:

Rails are a challenge insofar that they require the player to hit them in order to use them. In 2D, that means you need to be above them, and in many games, jumping while on them causes you to pass through them. This type of unforgiving but not particularly punishing challenge is part of this irritating emphasis on "precision challenges", where Sonic has been turned into a game more akin to Trackmania, where the challenge does not come from determining what to do(lol pits from nowhere notwithstanding), but from executing the obvious. The slides are an environmental puzzle, you can't miss them, and the challenge is figuring out what you're supposed to do with them.

The ledges you're supposed to jump on are right on the screen. Not so hard to figure out.

And by passing through rails, you mean from below, right? I don't ever recall falling through rails while jumping between them. Except in Secret Rings, but the rails sucked especially hard in that one.

[Phos]

The ledges you're supposed to jump on are right on the screen. Not so hard to figure out.

It's not a puzzle in that sense, but it doesn;t seem punishing enough to call a challenge. I guess a better word would be level specific set piece.

And by passing through rails, you mean from below, right? I don't ever recall falling through rails while jumping between them. Except in Secret Rings, but the rails sucked especially hard in that one.

Actually, I was talking about Sonic Advance/Rush. And Sonic Unleashed, if you happen to time a rail swap exactly wrong, but that's a glitch.

[SuperStingray]

Actually, I was talking about Sonic Advance/Rush.

Oh, I thought you meant the 3D ones. Regardless, in Rush and Advance I believe you're supposed to hold R when you hit the rail.

[ovarloard]

If by "pass through rails" you mean come right down through the rails and back to the ground, then in the Advance series, you have to land on a straight part of the grind rail (parallel to the screen). If it's slanted, then you'll fall through.

[redmenace]

Oh, I thought you meant the 3D ones. Regardless, in Rush and Advance I believe you're supposed to hold R when you hit the rail.

The whale segment in Sonic Adventure can be screwed up. I've done it before and I just went for a run of the level to confirm it. You can stop, go back and jump on the whale (although it hurts you).

[lounge]

Another complaint I have with the newer grinding are the sound effects for it. It sounds too weak and light nowadays. In SA2 it sounds powerful, and realistic.

[Phos]

The whale segment in Sonic Adventure can be screwed up. I've done it before and I just went for a run of the level to confirm it. You can stop, go back and jump on the whale (although it hurts you).

I thought you guys were talking about the blue whale you run across in Cool Edge.

[Blue Blood]

Another complaint I have with the newer grinding are the sound effects for it. It sounds too weak and light nowadays. In SA2 it sounds powerful, and realistic.

In 06 and Unleashed the landing on a rail sound effect sounds like someone going "Cha-shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh". It's really not quite right, as with the spring and dash pannel sounds.

Unleashed had decent grinding for it's game style by relying on quick reactions. Not to mention that the rail hopping finally worked correctly. SA2 (bar the hopping) was equally as good and relied more of you keeping your momentum through balance. All the other 3D games to incorporate is have done so poorly for reasons noted by others.

Edited May 1, 2009 by Blue Blood

[Surge]

Unleashed improved grinding tremendously! It made switching from rail to rail less dangerous and fun. Plus, if you got hit on a rail you didn't get cheaply thrown off or anything, just lost rings.

[ovarloard]

Unleashed improved grinding tremendously! It made switching from rail to rail less dangerous and fun. Plus, if you got hit on a rail you didn't get cheaply thrown off or anything, just lost rings.

What sucks is they brought this back in Black Knight.

[SuperStingray]

What sucks is they brought this back in Black Knight.

Yeah, that was a bit of an annoyance in the lava level. Fortunately, it wasn't much of an issue elsewhere.

[ovarloard]

At least in Black Knight you can attack on the rails. But that often doesn't help against mine carts that come in groups of two... you attack one and the next hits you.