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Sonic's ideal characterization topic


Chaos Warp

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First of all, I just wanted to say that we are against using image-only posts here, but since you're really new here you're alright. Just make sure in your next post that it's not limited to just that; we love discussion here!

 

As for the point behind the picture you posted, I'm not sure what this post is trying to prove regarding Sonic's personality besides making really vague statements that I guess try to make Archie Sonic look like the ideal? It proves little to nothing that we can't see in other media about Sonic, and even outside of this picture there's much more to Sonic's personality than whatever was given in those shots. 

 

Not even to mention Archie's take on Sonic is a sort-of different beast altogether from Sega's take on him, so they're nearly incomparable when talking about an "ideal Sonic" for something like the games.

I don't really look at that barriar people put up between the games, comics, and other media, all I see is who's handling Sonic better, and while the statesments are vague, I will link the whole article, though I do think they could give more detail then just being awesome in some points. Nevertheless, I had ot add that because the way Sonic's been handled in the resent games since Colors doesn't really sit well with a lot of people outside forums like this, the bit about Sega deciding to aim them only at kids and fanboys who have a problem with anything dark doesn't help, and people only seeming to like the humor for actually being there rather then actually being funny. While you do have a point that we can see in other media in what's posted in the picture, well, that's the point of posting it. It's not just because "IT'S ARCHIE" but because it can work for Sonic in general.

Also, that article, which I do think could use more detail, if anything, the people it's aimed at don't do much of a good job in explaining why it's bad either: http://theezekiel300.deviantart.com/art/Pro-Archie-Sonic-To-the-anti-Archie-Club-383228845

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But Archie Sonic has a completely different background than Game Sonic, which is something that always influences his actions and interactions. Of course there are overlaps that fit both versions of Sonic, but one can never be the complete role model for the other.

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The day many of Archie Sonic's traits weasel their way into Game Sonic's characterization is the day I'll likely lose my appreciation for the character and consign it to having been seriously badly affected. Especially given that such a number of Archie Sonic's traits are downright contradictory to the game one.

 

A big issue with Archie Sonic is that he’s needlessly subordinate to Sally and his romance with her morphs the very basis of his character into something that it isn’t to facilitate it.

 

Yes, Sonic isn’t the sharpest tool in the shed.

 

Yes. He’s impulsive and such.

 

But you know what? Despite that, he’s still a resourceful guy who the comic writer’s have never assigned credibility to regarding his intelligence because surprise surprise, Sally has to point at something and tell him to attack it to make their dynamic look good and to make herself look relevant.

 

That isn’t giving Sonic’s character the credibility it deserves. It degenerates him from impulsive yet quick-thinking guy who does what he wants without regard to anyone’s dictations and yet who can save his own ass since he is quick-thinking and naturally resourceful into an obedient yes-man who has that impulsiveness undermined and therefore a fault of his character largely ignored to elevate the role of this Mary Sue.

 

This isn’t a more interesting Sonic than the game’s version to me for that reason alone.

 

There are many more examples of why Archie Sonic is a notably bad iteration of the character as far as I'm concerned such as his support for the Acorns when they’re a bunch of corrupt monarchs adverse to the real views of the citizens when in reality Sonic is a guy who stands up for what’s right and opposes institutions who are adverse to the views of the people in the interest of personal power or one-sided views i.e The Eggman Empire, Merlina.

 

And I certain as hell never want to see utter BS like this, don't want to see game Sonic ever doing this, nor ever be inclined to doing so in the first place;

 

241tous.jpg

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Hm... Ideal Sonic characterization. I think I like Boom Sonic's personality quite a lot. Like, where he's kind of snarky to everyone. But I don't think that should be his only asset, as I do like Sonic when he's emotional too, like in certain scenes in Lost World, for example, when Tails was captured, or when he was trying to call his friends on Tails' computer thing (Miles Electric?), but no one answered, and the way he said "No!" when Zavok said he'd turn Tails into a robot was really... Satisfactory, I guess. I think Sonic should get a little disheartened at times too. I don't remember if he has before (it's been quite a while since I've played any Sonic games all the way through, bear with me), but I'd like it if Sonic lost confidence after doing something wrong or failing some sort of mission. Not to say I want him to get all broody and depressed.

 

I'm not sure if this is really the ideal Sonic, but it's my ideal Sonic.

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Archie Sonic, being what's more or less a different character entirely, I'll hold him to a completely different standard than I do his game incarnation. That said, I still wouldn't say it's a "great" interpretation or even a better alternative to the games.

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Ok, first, I really want to know what's so "great" about the Post-Colors personalities ? "Hurr durr Sawnik and Taeelz r in a bromance, Sawnik haz attitude, it'z all so light-hearted, funny and simplistic !1!"

 

I... don't remember we were so ungrammatical mellow.png

 

Anyway, if you really want to know, I'll tell why I like the things you stated.

 

I like Sonic and Tails in Sonic Colours because, in my point of view, they act like... like two true long-time friends.

 

-enjoying a trip at an amusement park;

-throwing snarky yet harmless wisecracks at each other;

-laughing for something stupid that only they found really funny;

-eventually putting themselves in danger to protect one another.

 

They mock Eggman like bullies because... well because Eggman is a villainic doctor who captures and tortures cute little critters/aliens to create his army of robots.

 

 

But I can get why you're so mad and angry at all this.

 

Eggman is a very carismatic and funny villain (don't get me wrong, I like him too) so it's easy to symphatize and root for him.

 

As for Sonic & Tails... while acting like two very good friends, they don't provide much to talk about.

 

Fans of their Bromance (who were begging to see Sonic and Tails interacting with each other since Sonic X) are happy and satisfied...

 

but fans who also want to see a complex plot and don't give two s*its about two best friends minding their own business, are pretty much justified to feel like you feel.

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but fans who also want to see a complex plot and don't give two s*its about two best friends minding their own business, are pretty much justified to feel like you feel.

 

I didn't necessarily want a complex plot.

 

I just wanted a story that was competently-told.

 

Colours' one wasn't.

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But Archie Sonic has a completely different background than Game Sonic, which is something that always influences his actions and interactions. Of course there are overlaps that fit both versions of Sonic, but one can never be the complete role model for the other.

But as I said before, I don't look at the mental barriar people put up between the comics and the games, I look at how they are begin handled, and the games are being handled much worse then they seem to think.

 

The day many of Archie Sonic's traits weasel their way into Game Sonic's characterization is the day I'll likely lose my appreciation for the character and consign it to having been seriously badly affected. Especially given that such a number of Archie Sonic's traits are downright contradictory to the game one.

 

A big issue with Archie Sonic is that he’s needlessly subordinate to Sally and his romance with her morphs the very basis of his character into something that it isn’t to facilitate it.

 

Yes, Sonic isn’t the sharpest tool in the shed.

 

Yes. He’s impulsive and such.

 

But you know what? Despite that, he’s still a resourceful guy who the comic writer’s have never assigned credibility to regarding his intelligence because surprise surprise, Sally has to point at something and tell him to attack it to make their dynamic look good and to make herself look relevant.

 

That isn’t giving Sonic’s character the credibility it deserves. It degenerates him from impulsive yet quick-thinking guy who does what he wants without regard to anyone’s dictations and yet who can save his own ass since he is quick-thinking and naturally resourceful into an obedient yes-man who has that impulsiveness undermined and therefore a fault of his character largely ignored to elevate the role of this Mary Sue.

 

This isn’t a more interesting Sonic than the game’s version to me for that reason alone.

 

There are many more examples of why Archie Sonic is a notably bad iteration of the character as far as I'm concerned such as his support for the Acorns when they’re a bunch of corrupt monarchs adverse to the real views of the citizens when in reality Sonic is a guy who stands up for what’s right and opposes institutions who are adverse to the views of the people in the interest of personal power or one-sided views i.e The Eggman Empire, Merlina.

 

And I certain as hell never want to see utter BS like this, don't want to see game Sonic ever doing this, nor ever be inclined to doing so in the first place;

 

241tous.jpg

We're not getting BS like that now. I mean, do you even know how long it's been since that happened, or anything like that? And if anything, I found it to be an interestingly funny isssue due to Tails kicking Sonic's a**, extra points with the banter from the bad guys back there in their cells. Also, underminding Snic's character? pfft, he's an even better and mroe dynamic character even under those circumstances. All I see here is you taking a personal issue you have and making it a bigger problem then it is, and I really can't see the big deal in the games taking some pointers from the comics when again, the games have been handled for less better. It may be the lesser of two evils but one that I'm sure most people would be better off with.

 

but fans who also want to see a complex plot and don't give two s*its about two best friends minding their own business, are pretty much justified to feel like you feel.

That couldn't be further from the truth actually. Complex plot or not, the overall writing of the game was bad and "two best friends minding their own business" doesn't justify it, nor furthers it in anyway. Even at that point, they were there to investigate Eggman in the first place. or should I say, Sonic was and Tails being nieve about Eggman's plans despite the few years they've spent fighting him.

Now, here's some good examples of "Two best friends", especially when a lot of it stems from the action or their own actions:

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That couldn't be further from the truth actually. Complex plot or not, the overall writing of the game was bad and "two best friends minding their own business" doesn't justify it, nor furthers it in anyway.

 

I think you misunderstood. I'm not defending the story.

 

I was trying to explain why I like Sonic & Tails bromance in Colours and what in my opinion are the reasons for danidado to dislike it.

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The less we take from the Post Colors games, the better it is. The most horrid jokes ever heard and the worst characterization of Sonic ever seen.

I didn't say that I wanted Colours lame jokes, though. If I was to write Sonic's character, I'd primarily go for the Adventure and Storybook games, but I'd add in those character flaws from Lost World so that Sonic doesn't come off as being too cool like he was in Unleashed or the Storybooks.

 

Or as Omega Kuzu said: a child-friendly Dante. Especially the one from DMC 3.

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StaticMania's ideal Sonic Characterization

 

I personally would want to see Sonic be the "Cool blue dude with the 'tude" that he's usually claimed to be in the past.

 

Sonic being able to show off how cool he is without boasting, usually remaining with a cool head in a situation, being a quick thinker/resourceful planner, pulling off the snark without over doing it, and being a bit teasing in a playful way with his friends.

 

Sonic's never been one for doing a whole lot of boasting, he usually lets his actions do the talking and maybe on occasion lets out a well deserved claim of cool-ness towards his ego. His actions are a great way to give the audience a taste of his cocky attitude and it can be very funny to see sometimes.

 

I think the snark part of his character can be fun to see as well, another way of showing his cocky attitude when dealing with possible threats. Seeing the way Sonic can work with characters that aren't his friends is always a nice thing to see, especially since he's dealing with the enemies. It also can be a way to show how Sonic can remain all cool and collected in a "serious" situation.

 

Being a guy that keeps a cool head in most situations is a guy who can most always be seen as "Chill"...

He's someone who likes to relax, sometimes with his friends, sometimes on his lonesome. Shows that he can be a cool guy or friend to talk to about some "problems"...it also shows he also doesn't easily panic, which allows him to be able to gain control of a lot of situations if not just be able to take it on with full confidence.

 

A quick thinker/resourceful planner...for one who is not truly known for his intelligence or being patient, Sonic is one resourceful guy. This type of thing can be the the best way to keep yourself in tune with the situation and actually work with what's going on.

 

Sonic when with friends really likes to tease them in a playful manner. Its a fun thing to watch when it happens and it can work much better if his friends can actually provide some good back&fourth or it can push up some funny stuff with other friends.

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I didn't say that I wanted Colours lame jokes, though. If I was to write Sonic's character, I'd primarily go for the Adventure and Storybook games, but I'd add in those character flaws from Lost World so that Sonic doesn't come off as being too cool like he was in Unleashed or the Storybooks.

 

Or as Omega Kuzu said: a child-friendly Dante. Especially the one from DMC 3.

Pretty much this I guess. While I admit Lost World was hap hazardous writing, I think it was the most clear cut case of his personality biting him in the ass and realizing it, which I think is kinda pivotal. Storybook Sonic had better scripting, but he did not have this important piece of development before Lost World (ironic given how some alt medias really dig it into the ground). I also feel, while maybe post Colors Sonic leans too much on the obnoxious side, Sonic works better being a goofball.

 

Unleashed Sonic did have a good portrayal of Sonic, just it was nearly all during his werehog persona, his standard scenes were far less emotive.

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I... don't remember we were so ungrammatical mellow.png

 

Anyway, if you really want to know, I'll tell why I like the things you stated.

 

I like Sonic and Tails in Sonic Colours because, in my point of view, they act like... like two true long-time friends.

 

-enjoying a trip at an amusement park;

-throwing snarky yet harmless wisecracks at each other;

-laughing for something stupid that only they found really funny;

-eventually putting themselves in danger to protect one another.

 

They mock Eggman like bullies because... well because Eggman is a villainic doctor who captures and tortures cute little critters/aliens to create his army of robots.

 

 

But I can get why you're so mad and angry at all this.

 

Eggman is a very carismatic and funny villain (don't get me wrong, I like him too) so it's easy to symphatize and root for him.

 

As for Sonic & Tails... while acting like two very good friends, they don't provide much to talk about.

 

Fans of their Bromance (who were begging to see Sonic and Tails interacting with each other since Sonic X) are happy and satisfied...

 

but fans who also want to see a complex plot and don't give two s*its about two best friends minding their own business, are pretty much justified to feel like you feel.

 

Well, better late than never to respond smile.png ...Where do I begin ?

 

Why I don't like them for how they are represented in Colors, quoting your points ?

 

You said "two true long-time friends"...To me, it looks more like they barely tollerate each other.

 

"- enjoying a trip at an amusement park"

 

I thought they were trying, you know, to investigate on Eggman's sudden change of heart. And for being an amusement park, it looks pretty dead and boring.

 

"- throwing snarky yet harmless wisecracks at each other" You mean like this ?

 

 

 

Seriously, they look more like they don't like that much each other, even from what they say to one another. And Sonic contraddicts himself, since in the previous cutscene...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Le-Cn4p-ESI

 

Pontac and Graff, do you know what consisctency is ?

 

"- laughing for something stupid only they found really funny"

 

And here's the problem : only THEY found their jokes so funny, but instead of just doing it once, they CONSTANTLY rub the bad, tasteless joke in your face, as to say "Did you get it ? Huh ??? Isn't it great ??? Huh ?? Huh ???? LAUGH, YOU IDIOT !".

"Baldy McNosehair", the "Clobbering" joke, the "Copyright" joke aren't funny. They are trying hard to be "smart humor", but they only result in being annoying as hell, repetitive, and as juvenile as a Teletubbies or Dora The Explorer episode. 

 

"- eventually putting themselves in danger to protect one another" 

 

Perhaps you're referring to the Mind Control Ray cutscene (too lazy and disgusted to look for it). Because that's the only cutscene where this actually happens... then they go "Fuck it ! This thing is too dark and interesting...Let's throw EVEN more jokes for the sake of it !!!"

 

Tails is always depicted as pissy-pants wimp, with a propension to be cynical and passive aggressive throughout the game. Seriously, he can't even build a proper translator, just because Pontac and Graff decided to screw his character too.

 

"They mock Eggman like bullies because... well because Eggman is a villainic doctor who captures and tortures cute little critters/aliens to create his army of robots."

 

Well, thanks for reminding me he is the villain. Because he's no more threatening or competent than Team Rocket. He is that pathetic now. And when the villain is so ineffective and silly, of course you start siding more with him than the so-called heroes. Especially when he's got so useless minions. At least, he's trying to fulfill his role as the villain (terribly bad and unthreatingly, but he tries). Those little pricks are nothing more than "LOL MCNOSEHAIR IZ DUMB !!! I'M SO COOL AND FUNNY!!!" and "SONIC, YOU LOOKS SO STUPID AND LAME WHEN YOU TO TALK TO YOURSELF, BUT I'M STILL FOLLOWING YOU ANYWAY !!!"

 

Plus, all this bro-behaviour makes sounds Sonic sooo...dumb, one-dimensional and petty. This is trying hard to be cool by trying to be like "kids these days".

 

Not to mention how every lines sounds even worse in Roger's mouth. He's just the worst choice for Sonic. Period

 

I prefer to spare you the details on how I would represent them, because I already did in my original post.

 

And why should we be satified only with "two friends minding their own business". Where's the action ? Where the energy ? Where the real fun ?

 

Why should I sit through an unbearable lousy sitcom, instead of something MUCH more interesting. Unleashed was also about close friendship, but compared to Colors, it has that whimsical, profound sense of bond and emotions. Colors, and Sonic and Tails' friendship in there, has no soul, no development, no evolution. It's just jokes.

 

And Lost World is even worse, because if by P&G's standards, character development = character butchering and unlikeability, then they are terrible writers.

 

Colors didn't sell much not only because it was Nintendo-exclusive, but also because it was so infuriantingly childish, and the gameplay and the contents (Were there even contents in that game?) were so lazy, so pandering to specific, niche audiences (Classic fans and Nintendo/Mario fans), that the game went pretty much unseen outside the Sonic fanbase. Its successis FAKE, biased critics said it was good, and everybody blindly and hive-mindedly agreed.

 

To a lot of unheard and disappointed people who preferred either to stay mute or to leave Sonic entirely, it was boring and it didn't save anything. It was just lazy and haphazardly made.

Edited by danidado
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I still don't get how people can label post-Colors Sonic a 'bully' and not feel the same about nearly every other Western incarnation of the character, which usually frequently lean as vindictive, self righteous little jocks. Satam Sonic was such an arrogant prat even the retarded surrender monkey of the team couldn't compete (even he didn't want Sonic DEAD like vice versa once implied), Archie Sonic more or less comes off as a guy whose full of crap, preaching free will and then demanding everyone sticks to the guidance of his girlfriends' monarchy or else, and the less said about STC Sonic the better.

 

Colors/Lost World Sonic may lean as bully, but as much as one a Looney Tunes protagonist can be. He's still playful and reserved and a borderline frienemy, leaving his treatment to genuine assholes who dish out as much arrogance as they take, and even then he seems to know at the end of the day, Eggman will just throw a tantrum and start over, as smug and assured of his genius as ever. I'd take 'heckler Sonic' over 'pretentious jock Sonic' any day.

 

I will say that I agree on the quality of Colors' humor however. Nothing said 'Aren't we funny, aren't we, aren't we, AREN'T WE???' more than most of those drawn out self referring one liners. Lost World went in and out with the gags, but at least they didn't bash you in the face repeatedly with them.

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That's odd, I thought pissing each other off in jest like that was big part of having a friendship. 

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I still don't get how people can label post-Colors Sonic a 'bully' and not feel the same about nearly every other Western incarnation of the character, which usually frequently lean as vindictive, self righteous little jocks. Satam Sonic was such an arrogant prat even the retarded surrender monkey of the team couldn't compete (even he didn't want Sonic DEAD like vice versa once implied), Archie Sonic more or less comes off as a guy whose full of crap, preaching free will and then demanding everyone sticks to the guidance of his girlfriends' monarchy or else, and the less said about STC Sonic the better.

 

Colors/Lost World Sonic may lean as bully, but as much as one a Looney Tunes protagonist can be. He's still playful and reserved and a borderline frienemy, leaving his treatment to genuine assholes who dish out as much arrogance as they take, and even then he seems to know at the end of the day, Eggman will just throw a tantrum and start over, as smug and assured of his genius as ever. I'd take 'heckler Sonic' over 'pretentious jock Sonic' any day.

 

I will say that I agree on the quality of Colors' humor however. Nothing said 'Aren't we funny, aren't we, aren't we, AREN'T WE???' more than most of those drawn out self referring one liners. Lost World went in and out with the gags, but at least they didn't bash you in the face repeatedly with them.

While I have to agree on your last line, the whole thing about Sonic being a playful Loony Toon character is exactly why most of his copies failed back in the 90's: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MascotWithAttitude

 

As much as you complain about the SATAM and Comics versions of Sonic, both are more well suited for most gamers these days then what we've got from Colors and Lost World, which is downright depressing to even take part in hearing, let alone in front of other people. Even then, Sonic would actually cut the "jock" whatever personality thing out and get down to business, but most of it came from confidence in knowing him and his team are able to pull through, and the banter that can sometimes come between friends, not to mention him being a teenager as well.

 

However, if you take all that aside, even the tones of each version has a glaring difference, and the Western Sonic is for more dynamic and entertaining then the Japanese version, not just in characteristics, but writing, tone, music, etc. The Japanese version only seems to work with people who want to play it safe and may or may not have huge hate for any game "that tried to hard to be serious". While AOSTH isn't really that great of a cartoon, the westernization of Sonic is what really got people hooked, even if you say it's the games that attracted them and didn't have much of what we saw in SATAM, we still have Sonic's face in most of this box arts, which speaks a lot more then people would like to believe.

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The Japanese version only seems to work with people who want to play it safe and may or may not have huge hate for any game "that tried to hard to be serious". While AOSTH isn't really that great of a cartoon, the westernization of Sonic is what really got people hooked.

 

Are you sure about that? I would agree that the cartoons and comics (StC in my case) managed to keep my attention on Sonic while I had to wait for the next game, but they never felt like "the real thing" to me and I never found them better than the source material. They were/are barely even an extension. It was just another kind of Sonic that I tolerated (to various degrees), it certainly was not what "got me hooked".

Every western incarnation of Sonic seems to have a weird trait that makes it hard for me to like him, all based on the assumption that his Japanese version just doesn't suffice or something (even though they always kept the western audience in mind).

I'm aware that early adaptions like SatAM or StC were created during a time with very little source material available, but even back in the 90s I felt like the authors didn't even get that right. They probably never saw (or tried to get) the Japanese documents on the series.

 

In any case, I feel like the Japanese-written Sonic makes a good effort at appealing to all audiences across the world, while the western-written Sonic only seems to have a specific American audience in mind. I have never been that audience, and I want to see that "Sonic for everyone" again, be it in the upcoming movie or the next main game.

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Are you sure about that? I would agree that the cartoons and comics (StC in my case) managed to keep my attention on Sonic while I had to wait for the next game, but they never felt like "the real thing" to me and I never found them better than the source material. They were/are barely even an extension. It was just another kind of Sonic that I tolerated (to various degrees), it certainly was not what "got me hooked".

Every western incarnation of Sonic seems to have a weird trait that makes it hard for me to like him, all based on the assumption that his Japanese version just doesn't suffice or something (even though they always kept the western audience in mind).

I'm aware that early adaptions like SatAM or StC were created during a time with very little source material available, but even back in the 90s I felt like the authors didn't even get that right. They probably never saw (or tried to get) the Japanese documents on the series.

 

In any case, I feel like the Japanese-written Sonic makes a good effort at appealing to all audiences across the world, while the western-written Sonic only seems to have a specific American audience in mind. I have never been that audience, and I want to see that "Sonic for everyone" again, be it in the upcoming movie or the next main game.

The thing you have to think about is the fact that Sonic was less popular in Japan then anywhere else, and the type of Sonic from Archie and Fleetway tend to be what's popular in most cases. Yeah, you can say it's the games most folks are into, but that's the most exposure you'll get since there's no other cartoons at the moment, the last one being Sonic X which wasn't even that good compared to almost anything, and the comics not even being accessible in all regions, or easily. While I did grow up on AOSTH, I found Underground to be better later on, and I missed SATAM due to hardly ever hearing about it, but once I finally got to watch it, I thought it was really good. Sure, the Japanese version is.... nicer and played as a straight hero, but for one, I doubt Sonic having some attitude would totally make him unlikable in 1 or 2 regions, and he's a more dynamic and entertaining character, with potential to be liked in some way or another in all regions. Hardly anything to worry about for a movie. Also, when I say it's "what got people hooked", I'm talking about his constant snarky expression we were always introduced to before starting the game, a huge difference in most platformers/action games at that time, which is why many of them started copying Sonic in the first place, but not making them cool enough to stick, only a few doing so. One good example being Yoshi's island, a game that spawned out of, I think Miyamoto's, vanity, because he didn't want to make the 3D Mario game that was asked for after Donkey Kong Country, and instead, made a game that one person criticized before it came out in one of their magazines, and the game turning into a flop afterwards. What I'm getting at is while J-Sonic is not all that bad, he is, especially now, missing that coolness that made him popular in the first place.

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Japanese Sonic has plenty of attitude. If anything he's the one that's been accused of being a bully lately for some ridiculous reason.

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Japanese Sonic has plenty of attitude. If anything he's the one that's been accused of being a bully lately for some ridiculous reason.

He has some, but even still, he's not dynamic enough or written well enough to be, and ever since unleashed, the series has been getting pushed more and more into the lighter(Nintendo) side of things. Also, I wanted to post this article that brings up Sonic's coolness:

http://conflictingviews.wordpress.com/2013/06/06/sonics-great-light-and-dark-debate/

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That's odd, I thought pissing each other off in jest like that was big part of having a friendship. 

 

Problem is that they're nothing else but this. When this continuing bickering and pissing each other off is the only thing shown, as Pontac and Graff have done from Colors through Lost World, they don't even look like friends anymore.

 

Sonic is the stereotypical dumb school jock/bully, devoid of any of the good traits he had from SA through Unleashed/Black Knight.

 

And Tails is like one of those emarginated cynical nerds who have sided with the school jock, because it's on the winning side. But he's ready to backstab his "friend"/boss as soon as his ego is threatened.

 

Since when Tails was so odious and self-righteous ? He's like a little blend of the worst traits of Pontaff Sonic and Eggman.

 

What happened to the little modest boy genius in search of recognition ?

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Problem is that they're nothing else but this. When this continuing bickering and pissing each other off is the only thing shown, as Pontac and Graff have done from Colors through Lost World, they don't even look like friends anymore.

 

Sonic is the stereotypical dumb school jock/bully, devoid of any of the good traits he had from SA through Unleashed/Black Knight.

 

And Tails is like one of those emarginated cynical nerds who have sided with the school jock, because it's on the winning side. But he's ready to backstab his "friend"/boss as soon as his ego is threatened.

 

Since when Tails was so odious and self-righteous ? He's like a little blend of the worst traits of Pontaff Sonic and Eggman.

 

What happened to the little modest boy genius in search of recognition ?

Not really? At least regarding Colors. Lost World, for what good it did and could have done better, does has some fumbles that you could make this argument for, but you can't make that case for Colors and Generations when that bickering and pissing each other off was actually mild to the point of playful teasing.

 

Especially in Colors. I mean, for crying out loud, Tails takes a bullet - or mind control blast - for Sonic when Eggman was going to test it on the Blue Blur himself. How can you say their relationship in that game was nothing but bickering and ignore that detail at the very least? Or when Sonic wants to ensure Tails' safety from the final boss by pushing him into the elevator to return to Earth? Most of Colors was in fact them working together cohesively throughout the game, and we can pull up other scenes where their conversations are so casual to the point of being normal.

 

And Generation's plot was too bare bones to really make much of anything memorable of it, but there was barely any bickering or pissing one another off in that game, if any. I think your beef is solely with Lost World, dude. And even then, there are multiple facets of the writing to criticize that isn't so one-sidedly about their bickering.

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He has some, but even still, he's not dynamic enough or written well enough to be, and ever since unleashed, the series has been getting pushed more and more into the lighter(Nintendo) side of things. Also, I wanted to post this article that brings up Sonic's coolness:

http://conflictingviews.wordpress.com/2013/06/06/sonics-great-light-and-dark-debate/

 

Frankly, the only thing that this article has convinced me is that the writer is one of those fans who are so bitter, cynical and angry that they, for whatever reason, can't stand the thought of people liking things that they don't. While they may have a general point that Sonic could get away with being more nuanced in its overall story presentation when handled competently, the article is mired in such a deeply mean-spirited and offensive use of language that they're only making their ultimate argument look horrible.

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He has some, but even still, he's not dynamic enough or written well enough to be, and ever since unleashed, the series has been getting pushed more and more into the lighter(Nintendo) side of things. Also, I wanted to post this article that brings up Sonic's coolness:

http://conflictingviews.wordpress.com/2013/06/06/sonics-great-light-and-dark-debate/

 

Are you sure you're not just trapped in some strange ghost of the console war? If we're going to start arbritarily going "IT'S LIGHTER BECAUSE IT'S PANDERING TO NINTENDO INSTEAD OF ME", I'm afraid the implications are a bit sad (you know what else is on Nintendo's side? quality games).

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