Are the 2D sections in Modern Sonic gameplay even needed?

[Soniman]

Now don't get me wrong, the 2D sections in the modern games are fun for the most part, since they harbor the only standard platforming to be had in Unleashed and Colors. But then I sarted seeing actual interesting, competent, 3D platforming in Generations (most notably Seaside Hill and Sky Sanctuary), and I got to thinking, do we really need the 2D sections?

I remember during my Colors playthrough and being so mad at how devoid of any developed 3D areas there was in the game, BUT, when the game actually did start to have a semblance of decent 3D design (Starlight Carnival Act 5, Aquarium Park Act 6) I recall being really happy and excited because frankly, 3D platforming is a lot more interesting to me than 2D platforming, and when these nice sections ended, I was all to disappointed to be flung into another 2D section.

After Generations, I have no doubt that they can make brilliant level design that consists of nothing but 3D. It's what most everyone wants and I feel that the 2D sections do nothing but hold back on what is/can be otherwise great 3D level design.

What do you think?

Edited November 3, 2011 by Soniman032-

[Big Boss (legendsneverdie)]

It's about as likely as Sonic's shitty friends becoming playable in the near future.Personally I would like the next game to be entirely 3D, but I don't see Sonic Team doing anything like this in the future.

[azoo]

I think somewhere among the lines of (respectively for 3D:2D) 70:30 to 90:10 would be the best for Sonic. I like the gimmicks 2D areas would have to offer, and I do believe areas with slopes and heavy usage of loops are better off in two-dimensional areas, but they shouldn't take up major space of the stage. 3D areas are really awesome in Generations as they are open and very much built on platforming, exploration and speed; and while 2D is nice to have in the stage at times, I think in future titles they should tone it down some.

I think that was the one major thing Unleashed had good over both Colors and Generations: the fact that 2D sections weren't nearly as apparent or time-consuming as they are in the latter two games.

[Phos]

I've never really found them to be very good, the inability to see ahead of yourself only exasperates the problems I have with the 3D sections.

[Voyant]

I think that was the one major thing Unleashed had good over both Colors and Generations: the fact that 2D sections weren't nearly as apparent or time-consuming as they are in the latter two games.

Now that I think about it...

The 2D sections in Unleashed were....like barely there. The only level I remember it being really apparent was Mazuri Day. If there has to be some the degree of 2D in the next game I say a bit less 2D in than Unleashed and Id be fine.

Edited November 3, 2011 by V0YANT

[Solkia]

Now that I think about it...

The 2D sections in Unleashed were....like barely there. The only level I remember it being really apparent was Mazuri Day. If there has to be some the degree of 2D in the next game I say a bit less 2D in than Unleashed and Id be fine.

Your signature scares me.

It seems to me that the levels are designed to let you bypass the platforming by taking the alternate routes. Could be wrong though.

As for the question, no they aren't necessary. People accuse the 3DS version of having two gameplay styles that are too similar, though one could argue the same about the HD version.

Edited November 3, 2011 by ModernHentaiQuillFan

[Old dead account]

With Generations containing classic Sonic being 100% 2D I think the 2D sections in modern's levels were pretty superfluous but enjoyable. Colors overdid it. If the next game uses the same formula but ^no classic Sonic and 100% modern levels, I think that it should be 3D/2D about 80:20 with most of the 3D sections being platforming and not sidestepping. In Generations, the sidestepping sections weren't as long common or annoying as the Unleashed ones but I'd still rather have 3D platforming at the level of SSH or SS. If it does have Sonic Colors Syndrome then I won't mind it if the 2D is enjoyable like in modern Planet Wisp. Sega needs to stop hiding so much behind 2D though (and get rid of sidestepping. It's just so pointless)

Edited November 3, 2011 by Derpy Hooves

[ArtFenix]

I always thought that 2D sections should be left to handheld titles and the likes of Sonic 4. Never liked them in main 3D Sonic games.

[Chaos Warp]

They are not needed, but they are a nice nostalgic throwback. I would not feel bad at all if they were gone in the next game, but I don't mind them being there. Just don't give us Colours 3d sections and give us all the platforming in 2d.

[Stritix]

I personally find myself rushing through the 2D sections, to get to the 3D. I think that they are not needed. I'd much prefer it if the next game is full 3D, but I also can't see that happening.

[Darth Sonikku]

When I played Sky Sanctuary, Seaside Hill, City Escape, and Crisis City in Sonic Generations, I was surprised with the 3D sections. They did a really good job with the platforming (the developers outdid themselves when it came to the level design and alternate pathways).

However, I don't think Sonic Team is going to drop 2D platforming. That was (and still is) a key part of Sonic's gameplay.

[JezMM]

Haven't played Generations yet but all the same yes, they should be limited. Only use them for specific moments of gameplay that benefit from the 2D viewpoint, as mentioned, slopes/momentum-based stuff points where something in the background is relevant to the point that concentrating on three dimensions in the foreground would be distracting and pointless perhaps (for example circling round a boss a lá Egg Golem or many of the Rush' series bosses).

Edited November 3, 2011 by JezMM

[Gamenerd]

A ratio of 75/25 between 3D and 2D sections would be a nice balance, so long as the 3D sections are as good as the Generations ones and the 2D sections are as good as Classic Sonic in Generations - Classic Sonic's 2D areas feel exciting and interesting, whereas Modern Sonic's 2D sections rarely feel like anything more than filler between the 3D sections. They especially pissed me off in Colours, because although it was a fairly good game overall, I was expecting a 3D Sonic game and that is most certainly not what I was given.

[Jeffhog]

Everyone wants their 3Ds and their Sonic modern styles and the withwhats, but...

Guys. Let's not be hasty, just think for a second:

Underwater 3D sections.

I'd die. ._.

[Diogenes]

They need to make a gameplay style that truly works in 3D before they can make a successful all-3D game.

[Voyant]

They need to make a gameplay style that truly works in 3D before they can make a successful all-3D game.

Works pretty fine in Generations.

Edited November 3, 2011 by V0YANT

[Diogenes]

Guess what, I disagree. Do you really want to start this again? Because I don't.

Edited November 3, 2011 by Diogenes

[Voyant]

Everyone wants their 3Ds and their Sonic modern styles and the withwhats, but...

Guys. Let's not be hasty, just think for a second:

Underwater 3D sections.

I'd die. ._.

I hate water levels in general...I like though that in Generations falling in water seemed more like a punishment than actually having to go through it. the only water level I really like out of the entire franchise is Hydrocity Zone.

Edited November 3, 2011 by V0YANT

[Chaos Warp]

Everyone wants their 3Ds and their Sonic modern styles and the withwhats, but...

Guys. Let's not be hasty, just think for a second:

Underwater 3D sections.

I'd die. ._.

If designed right, it could be quite fun. Fan-Games have done it.

[Gamenerd]

They need to make a gameplay style that truly works in 3D before they can make a successful all-3D game.

Works pretty fine in Generations.

Guess what, I disagree. Do you really want to start this again? Because I don't.

>implying you didn't start it

You might not have personally enjoyed the 3D formula in Unleashed through to Generations, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't "truly work" - it just means it's not the gameplay style for you. I think it's been thoroughly proven that the current gameplay isn't inherently flawed by the fact that each game using the formula has improved it significantly; if we assume the next game improves on the Generations formula as much as Generations did on Unleashed/Colours, then there really shouldn't be a problem. The current gameplay style isn't flawed - it just isn't perfect either.

That said, I'm not a huge fan of the boost. Given how powerful the spindash is in Classic Sonic's sections and in Sonic Adventure, I don't see why they couldn't just use that as an alternative to the boost that gets you up to speed without being completely spammable. But that's really a discussion for another topic.

[Diogenes]

>implying you didn't start it

Shockingly enough, I'm allowed to say I don't like the current gameplay without having to write a 10 page essay explaining myself or getting a bunch of people ranting about how wrong I am.

I'm not in the mood to have this same debate again. I came here to state my thoughts on the topic at hand, not argue about Generations again.

[Gamenerd]

Shockingly enough, I'm allowed to say I don't like the current gameplay without having to write a 10 page essay explaining myself or getting a bunch of people ranting about how wrong I am.

I'm not in the mood to have this same debate again. I came here to state my thoughts on the topic at hand, not argue about Generations again.

Fair play to you, but you didn't say you didn't like the current gameplay - you implied the formula behind it was inherently flawed and that a successful 3D Sonic game couldn't be made with it. Different kettles of fish right there.

Edited November 3, 2011 by Gamenerd

[Diogenes]

So because I don't plaster my posts in "IMO!"s, you decide to assume I am proclaiming something as if it's the word of god, and you must rush in to argue against it. That's more your fault than mine, I think.

edit:

vvv Y'know what, fuck it. I'm not even going to contribute a new post to this asinine butthurt argument. Fine, I am a horrible person for not explicitly stating that Generations having crappy 3D gameplay is my opinion, not an objective fact. Pat yourself on the back.

Edited November 3, 2011 by Diogenes

[Gamenerd]

So because I don't plaster my posts in "IMO!"s, you decide to assume I am proclaiming something as if it's the word of god, and you must rush in to argue against it. That's more your fault than mine, I think.

[Scar]

I don't really care as long as the game is fun.

Though, I would prefer 2D be restricted to areas where it makes sense, rather than being thrown about randomly as in Colours. If you're platforming up the side of a cliff-face, then sure have a 2D section, but not in the middle of a bloody field. Its just not necessary in that position.

Other than that, main issue really is the level design. Generations got a alot of really good 3D level design. Shame they didn't have more of it, because they felt the need to have 2D in there, because its a part of the style of gameplay.

Moveset changes may be necessary too.