Pokemon Anime General Discussion

[-Robin-]

The harshness the fanbase is giving is equal to the harshness the writing staff is giving to them and its own integrity.

[Radiant Hero Ike]

Just now, -Robin- said:

The harshness the fanbase is giving is equal to the harshness the writing staff is giving to them and its own integrity.

I see... I honestly didn't know Brock and Misty were so loved.

[Dejimon11]

Just now, Radiant Hero Ike said:

I see... I honestly didn't know Brock and Misty were so loved.

Considering the Original series is where a lot of people started watching the show it's completely understandable not to mention folks stopped watching around the time Misty left and people have been asking her to come back. 

[Radiant Hero Ike]

4 minutes ago, Dejimon11 said:

Considering the Original series is where a lot of people started watching the show it's completely understandable not to mention folks stopped watching around the time Misty left and people have been asking her to come back. 

I started in the original series too and I hated Misty. I like Brock but I'm not that bummed he isn't coming back (at least, not as a traveling companion).

I dunno. This alternate reality thing seems really cool to me and two characters missing isn't going to kill my excitement for it.

[azoo]

8 minutes ago, Radiant Hero Ike said:

Isn't that a bit harsh?

A 20th anniversary movie that is trying to sell itself as a celebration of the original series would be one to use the original cast and do it the justice fans have wanted it given for a long, long time.

This movie straight up replaces everyone in the main cast (besides the same two characters we've seen for 20+ years), tries to half-tell the original story and half-spin off into something entirely different, and THEN advertise their newest legendary in it because lol.

 

This is stupid as fuck.

 

[Soniman]

No one is saying people cant be allowed to get excited, my problem is this high and mighty attitude some fans have towards people that wanted Misty and Brock back (you know...since its an anniversary movie) and dismiss them as babies, its tiresome as hell

[Radiant Hero Ike]

I didn't say anyone was like "you aren't allowed to get excited". I wasn't aware of those types of anti-Brock/Misty fans either and I hope I didn't come across as one.

I guess I don't have much nostalgia for the original series (which is odd since I've watched it since I was 3) and so I don't mind this alternate reality thing. Maybe it's the constant negativity regarding the series that I've dealt with all over the internet that's caused me to care less about the series as a whole... I was extremely surprised when I joined this forum and saw there was a thread that wasn't all hate towards the series.

Eh. I guess I was just thrown off by the "hating everyone involved" thing. Probably an exaggeration, I dunno.

[Wraith]

So no old characters like Gary Misty and Brock, aka the whole reason I was interested in this thing is gone. I wanted them to at least try and emulate those old dynamics pretty badly, but instead we're getting Ash and Pikachu, because that shit isn't played out by now. 

But it gets worse! New characters are in it with Pokemon from gen 4 an 7, with one being a recent legendary reveal. They're clearly there to advertise whatever Gen 4 remake and future gen 7 games they have in the pipeline. There's nothing "cool" to me about this "alternate take". They're just dodging something cool to be a commercial again. There's no reason to set it this far back if you're going to focus on new Pokemon anyway, so the Gen 1 shit is just to get older people interested again, I guess? I don't fuckin know.

They wanted to make a new movie for the purpose of advertising new Pokemon like they always do but they wrapped it up in the guise of a Gen 1 throwback because the ticket sales for these movies are in free fall and they need something to grab people again. Fine. Cool. Kinda my fault for thinking they'd be doing something interesting at this point.

[Dejimon11]

Just now, Josh said:

So no old characters like Gary Misty and Brock, aka the whole reason I was interested in this thing is gone. I wanted them to at least try and emulate those old dynamics pretty badly, but instead we're getting Ash and Pikachu, because that shit isn't played out by now. 

But it gets worse! New characters are in it with Pokemon from gen 4 an 7, with one being a recent legendary reveal. They're clearly there to advertise whatever Gen 4 remake and future gen 7 games they have in the pipeline. There's nothing "cool" to me about this "alternate take". They're just dodging something cool to be a commercial again.

They wanted to make a new movie for the purpose of advertising new Pokemon like they always do but they wrapped it up in the guise of a Gen 1 throwback because the ticket sales for these movies are in free fall and they need something to grab people again. Fine. Cool. Kinda my fault for thinking they'd be doing something interesting at this point.

Bruh this show has always been a commercial. Let's not kid ourselves here. I fully understand where you're coming from tho. 

[Soniman]

6 minutes ago, Dejimon11 said:

Bruh this show has always been a commercial. Let's not kid ourselves here. I fully understand where you're coming from tho. 

but for a brief period this movie felt like something made out of love for the fans rather then a cynical nostalgic cash grab.

My mistake for believing the anime staff give a shit about anyone older then 10 that still watches the anime but still.

 

[azoo]

Josh covered all my qualms.

This is going south the same reason the original series went south: who cares about quality and passion when we're in it for the money, honey. Marketability always comes first with this series and I'll never know why I expected otherwise.

Also Deji, of course it has, but back when this series started there was no reason to believe it had priority over making good stories. The first season or two had us reelin' there, believing that there was some sort of care to be had for what stories and worlds they were setting up, only to find out after season 3 or so rolled on in that it was in fact the opposite.

Kudos to the SM anime for being a fresh start with stellar animation, but as a whole? Fuck the Pokemon anime lol. The longest game of "waste my time" ever played.

Even Sonic's doing better, because at least that has Mania lmao. And when Sonic's doing better than you in Azoo's book..

[Soniman]

Like, even if I like the movie I can no longer see it as a labor of love and thats the worst part

[Wraith]

If they want to focus on a new generation of kids, that's fine. I've long since aged out of this series and it's backlog shouldn't be required watching for a kid to enjoy it. I get that. It's the entire reason for that new generation stuff. They want to make it as assecable as when I first started watching and I'll respect that. 

But.. kids don't really know about Gen 1 shit, so this movie is clearly aiming a bit higher. That's why I'm confused now. Who's this for?

[Boomer]

Just when i might be interested in watching the show again this shit happens.

I grew up with the show however i stopped watching when the original voice actors left, i felt the replacements were much worse and found them hard to listen to.

I've caught the occasional episode since and whilst some have been ok there's been nothing to keep me interested as I realised how monotonous the show could be 

I saw M23 as I was a Mewtwo fan who remembered going to see the first movie as a kid. Who got a VHS double pack of Mewtwo Returns and that ponyta race episode. 

TPCi played me like a fiddle.

And now they're doing it again. 

They are playing on our nostalgia for the original series except on a MUCH grander scale. They had the opportunity to say thanks to long term fans but nope, they decided to give everyone the middle finger.

[PC the Hedgehog]

5 hours ago, Kuzu the Boloedge said:

...the original writers of the series are long gone and the head director passed away.

Believe it or not, at least a handful of the original writers are still on the show. In fact, I think one of the writers for the first series was in charge of Diamond/Pearl and Black/White or something like that.

[Celestia]

1 hour ago, Boomer said:

Just when i might be interested in watching the show again this shit happens.

The actual series is at it's best in like, 20 years.

Aside from Volcanion (which rules btw) the movies have been kinda disappointing for years so if this one's bad I won't really be too devastated. It's definitely weird how they're handling it tho'.

...Although now I'm kinda curious how much overlap there is between the show and movie staffs.

[Kuzu]

4 hours ago, Soniman said:

You can list off all the problems you have with then but that doesn't change eye fact that people care about these characters and wanted to see them come back regardless. And this is an AU, there's no reason all the problems you listed couldn't have been fixed or reworked for this movie, I think seeing these character in refined roles could've actually have been interesting. 

Dismissing everyone who wanted these characters back as nostalgia lovers and not people who are genuine fans is pretty presumptuous tbh. Fan entitlement is one thing but expressing disappointment that the original trio isn't reuniting for a 20th anniversary movie and instead we get them replaced by  new characters no one cares about  is more then reasonable from my point of view 

I mean, the most general complaint I'm reading from this entire thread can basically be summed as "The characters I wanted to return are not coming back, therefore I have no interest in this product." You can dress it up as much as you want, but that's going to be the main crutch of fan complaints.

There's nothing wrong with feeling that way,and I admit it's a bit of a betrayal given how the advertising for this movie has been hyping up the original aesthetics. But getting pissed off that a merchandise series is....merchandise driven?

 

 

In any case, I will admit that it's a bit less interesting given that it is just another cash grab to sell new Pokemon and potential Diamond and Pearl remakes. At least it's gonna cover a plot point that's long since been forgotten.

[azoo]

A long plot point since forgotten that carries none of the surrounding substance that made people intrigued about it in the first place.

Honestly I'm not even too bothered anymore, and I wouldn't have been in the first place if they didn't decide to do this lol. Nice job opening old wounds there, TPC ol buddy ol pal. Best of luck to S&M, it looks pretty alright! Hope you're getting lotsa spaghetti money from it!

(I'm not bitter you're bitter)

[Kuzu]

3 minutes ago, Azoo said:

A long plot point since forgotten that carries none of the surrounding substance that made people intrigued about it in the first place.

Honestly I'm not even too bothered anymore, and I wouldn't have been in the first place if they didn't decide to do this lol. Nice job opening wounds there, TPC ol buddy ol pal. Best of luck to S&M, it looks pretty alright!

 

You know, maybe it's because I've longed since stopped caring about the series at all, but why does this seem to have some massive effect on people. It's not like the Anime hasn't been like this since forever. 

TCPI sure do know how to get people hype and then piss all over them I guess.

[Dejimon11]

Just now, Kuzu the Boloedge said:

 

You know, maybe it's because I've longed since stopped caring about the series at all, but why does this seem to have some massive effect on people. It's not like the Anime hasn't been like this since forever. 

TCPI sure do know how to get people hype and then piss all over them I guess.

Huh sounds like SEGA and Sonic Team lol 

[Kuzu]

Just now, Dejimon11 said:

Huh sounds like SEGA and Sonic Team lol 

The difference being the Pokemon Anime still sells despite how much hate it gets lol.

[azoo]

Because when you go out of your way to make a 20th anniversary piece that grabs the hearts of the fans who saw so much worth in it, its expected to actually follow through you'd imagine.

Especially when that worth was dashed in their eyes long ago and they would really love to see it done justice.

Its not a surprise. Its just a shame, is all.

[Celestia]

8 minutes ago, Kuzu the Boloedge said:

It's not like the Anime hasn't been like this since forever. 

I mean, yeah, they've very rarely brought back old characters, but like. You can't act as if it's not especially confusing to make a movie based on the original series and not go all the way with it. I mean, jeez, Clair reappeared a few years back for an episode of BW, of all sagas.

Also if you're ~~desperately trying not to care about the series~~ then why do you care how people feel about something like this

[Kuzu]

1 minute ago, Azoo said:

Because when you go out of your way to make a 20th anniversary piece that grabs the hearts of the fans who saw so much worth in it, its expected to actually follow through you'd imagine.

Especially when that worth was dashed in their eyes long ago and they would really love to see it done justice.

Its not a surprise. Its just a shame, is all.

But if it's a 20th anniversary celebrating the whole series, why would they just focus on Gen 1?

I mean in all honesty, they probably shouldn't have promoted it the way they did. But they probably did it on purpose to get interest before pulling the rug out from under everyone.

2 minutes ago, Celestia said:

I mean, yeah, they've very rarely brought back old characters, but like. You can't act as if it's not especially confusing to make a movie based on the original series and not go all the way with it. I mean, jeez, Clair reappeared a few years back for an episode of BW, of all sagas.

Also if you're ~~desperately trying not to care about the series~~ then why do you care how people feel about something like this

Like I said, I felt it was just a marketing ploy. Show the things people liked about the series once upon a time before dropping in the new stuff. 

As for your second question, because it reminds me of the outcry when Ash lost in Kalos and how everyone was saying basically the same thing on how people shouldn't have been upset :\

[Celestia]

To be honest I don't see a problem with the new characters / post-Gen 1 'mons being there in theory. It's blatantly for marketing purposes, but there's nothing inherently wrong with that. At worst the staff was told to put these elements in, they could still make the most of 'em.

But Misty and Brock apparently being absent (tho' they could still be there in new roles) still bugs me.