Strangest thing(s) you found in a Sonic game?

[StaticMania]

Mustache Monkey?

[Person]

At about 1:15

Sonic: "Once every 50 years, that black comet passes by this planet...hehehehe, oh! Do you think those black creatures are somehow connected to that comet? "

.................

Like, really, Sonic, what was so funny about that? Why did you laugh? I know it has to do with the original script, but they could have at least tried to make that laugh actually fit in with the conversation.

Edited October 12, 2012 by a person

[EveningEmma]

I could never get over Big the Cat grinding the rails with his crotch in Sonic Heroes. And he sounds so pleased about it!

[Blue Blood]

I could never get over Big the Cat grinding the rails with his crotch in Sonic Heroes. And he sounds so pleased about it!

"Feels good"

[Vertekins]

At about 1:15

Sonic: "Once every 50 years, that black comet passes by this planet...hehehehe, oh! Do you think those black creatures are somehow connected to that comet? "

.................

Like, really, Sonic, what was so funny about that? Why did you laugh? I know it has to do with the original script, but they could have at least tried to make that laugh actually fit in with the conversation.

One thing that bothered me slightly about ShTH was how it characterized Sonic as being overly excitable and hyper. IMO, it was clearly done to really really separate him from Shadow's broodiness and solemn attitude and it just comes off as Flanderization to me despite it's endearing-ness. Just look at how he reacts to the Black Bull;

[JezMM]

I could never get over Big the Cat grinding the rails with his crotch in Sonic Heroes. And he sounds so pleased about it!

Big is generally quite disturbing in Heroes.

The way he stares at Cream while waving to Amy in the final ending is pretty creeper-ish too.

[Diogenes]

One thing that bothered me slightly about ShTH was how it characterized Sonic as being overly excitable and hyper. IMO, it was clearly done to really really separate him from Shadow's broodiness and solemn attitude and it just comes off as Flanderization to me despite it's endearing-ness. Just look at how he reacts to the Black Bull;

I wish he acted like that more often.

[Blue Blood]

I wish he acted like that more often.

In ShTH, it's like he had absolutely no sense of danger or concern for anything. It was like the entire Black Arms invasion was just a game to him. Every so often he'd say something like "Oh I feel so sorry for all the people here" and then it was "Hey Shadow lets have a race through this burning city of genocide! It'll be fun!". For a change, I'm gonna have to side with Verte.

[Diogenes]

It was like the entire Black Arms invasion was just a game to him.

Yes, that's the part I like.

I mean, yeah, it doesn't really fit ShtH's serious business alien invasion thing, but in a game with the kind of tone a Sonic game should have? I want to see a Sonic that's excited about what he's doing. Yeah, even the parts where he "should" be serious. Those have been some of his best moments.

[JezMM]

Yes, that's the part I like.

I mean, yeah, it doesn't really fit ShtH's serious business alien invasion thing, but in a game with the kind of tone a Sonic game should have? I want to see a Sonic that's excited about what he's doing. Yeah, even the parts where he "should" be serious. Those have been some of his best moments.

I dunno, with Eggman that's fine, but I do agree Sonic being this overconfident when faced with a brand new, unknown enemy just makes him come off as stupid.

Contrast to how much more focused he is when he encounters Erazor Djinn or King Arthur. Sure he's a LITTLE silly in Black Knight's intro with the chilli dog malarky, but he still looks King Arthur RIGHT in the eye the entire time, showing he's not to be screwed with.

With the Black Arms he's just... yeah, a bit TOO cheerful. Especially in the midst of a completely wrecked Westopolis.

With Eggman it's fine and charming, because he's faced off against him a ton of times and has justification for overconfidence.

Edited October 12, 2012 by JezMM

[Diogenes]

Man who wants a character who needs justification for everything he does? I'm not saying he should act randomly, but I don't see why he should be criticized for not following perfect machine logic. <Beep boop -- enemy unknown -- must gather data before initiating cockiness protocols>

I mean, there's two possible outcomes of Sonic being a cocky bastard. Either he beats down the bad guys like he always has and he's retroactively justified in being cocky, or he gets beat down due to his overconfidence and he actually has a flaw for once. Good flaws make characters interesting! Sonic is just too perfect anymore, his "attitude" too clean, too mechanical, his reactions too subdued. He rarely has to struggle, and when he does it's only because of A Big Enemy, which is hardly the most compelling conflict. Where's the edge, where's the rebelliousness? The real kind, not just the family-safe cooldude?

[Jack / Joker]

How in the hell does Eggman get that beautiful mustache like that, anyway?!?

[StaticMania]

How in the hell does Eggman get that beautiful mustache like that, anyway?!?

Modern Eggman doesn't really comb his mustache anymore, its just really messy.

[Amomynous]

At about 1:15

Sonic: "Once every 50 years, that black comet passes by this planet...hehehehe, oh! Do you think those black creatures are somehow connected to that comet? "

.................

Like, really, Sonic, what was so funny about that? Why did you laugh? I know it has to do with the original script, but they could have at least tried to make that laugh actually fit in with the conversation.

That is a pretty big 'WTF?' moment.

One thing that bothered me slightly about ShTH was how it characterized Sonic as being overly excitable and hyper. IMO, it was clearly done to really really separate him from Shadow's broodiness and solemn attitude and it just comes off as Flanderization to me despite it's endearing-ness. Just look at how he reacts to the Black Bull;

Oh lord he annoyed me in that game.

Yes, that's the part I like.

I mean, yeah, it doesn't really fit ShtH's serious business alien invasion thing, but in a game with the kind of tone a Sonic game should have? I want to see a Sonic that's excited about what he's doing. Yeah, even the parts where he "should" be serious. Those have been some of his best moments.

It's not like it's unusual for him to be cocky and excited about the prospect of a new challenge, but something about this is off, it reads more like he's punch-happy and is looking for an excuse to beat something up, and I think your looking at the line in isolation rather than as a part of his general behaviour in his game, he is flanderised, his condition in the game is comparable to Robotnik's, they were both reduced to ineffectual goofs.

Edited October 13, 2012 by Mysterics

[JezMM]

Man who wants a character who needs justification for everything he does? I'm not saying he should act randomly, but I don't see why he should be criticized for not following perfect machine logic. <Beep boop -- enemy unknown -- must gather data before initiating cockiness protocols>

There's a difference between being robotically predictable and being a consistent, believable character. If you're able to ACCURATELY predict how a character will act in a given situation then that's a pretty well established character. If something a character does is unpredictable and doesn't make sense, people will cry foul that they're acting out of character. I mean... Sonic is an idiot in ShTH.

I mean, there's two possible outcomes of Sonic being a cocky bastard. Either he beats down the bad guys like he always has and he's retroactively justified in being cocky, or he gets beat down due to his overconfidence and he actually has a flaw for once.

Quite right, that can and has happened! See the Unleashed intro. And as said, with Eggman that overconfidence was justified. But a brand new army of enemies that has reduced a city to ruins within minutes of their arrival isn't the right antagonist to do that story with.

And yes I do think characters need justifications for their actions. Sonic may be a cartoon hedgehog but he's also a person. When I meet a new friend I don't talk to them like I'd talk to my fiancée, Dad or best friend. I seize them up a bit and keep my wits about me. Granted, in a battle of good vs evil, such reactions are and should be exaggerated, but the point is it makes no sense for Sonic to be so casual about an alien invasion, when, hell, he was MORE serious with Eggman in the very previous game.

Edited October 13, 2012 by JezMM

[Diogenes]

There's a difference between being robotically predictable and being a consistent, believable character. If you're able to ACCURATELY predict how a character will act in a given situation then that's a pretty well established character.

Established, sure. But he's kind of boring. Predictability wasn't what I was talking about, though; I'm railing against a character that always does the "logically correct" thing.

I mean... Sonic is an idiot in ShTH.

I don't think so. He's excitable, sure, and in a way that doesn't mesh well with ShtH's serious business attitude, but that's not being an idiot.

Quite right, that can and has happened! See the Unleashed intro. And as said, with Eggman that overconfidence was justified. But a brand new army of enemies that has reduced a city to ruins within minutes of their arrival isn't the right antagonist to do that story with.

Why not? Sonic's got some new friends to play with, why wouldn't he be excited about it? Okay maybe when they are actually destroying a city that is not the best time for fun and games, but that is the thing that should be changed, not Sonic being excited.

And yes I do think characters need justifications for their actions.

They need character justifications more than they need logical justifications.

When I meet a new friend I don't talk to them like I'd talk to my fiancée, Dad or best friend. I seize them up a bit and keep my wits about me.

And that's you. That's your personality. Other people act differently. Some people are really open, even with people they've just met.

Granted, in a battle of good vs evil, such reactions are and should be exaggerated, but the point is it makes no sense for Sonic to be so casual about an alien invasion, when, hell, he was MORE serious with Eggman in the very previous game.

Heroes is a shittily written game and I can't blame them for not taking cues from it. But even if you roll it back to the Adventures...are we going to lock his personality to how he's been written, whether or not it's the best direction to take him, just so he's never OOC?

[JezMM]

Established, sure. But he's kind of boring. Predictability wasn't what I was talking about, though; I'm railing against a character that always does the "logically correct" thing.

It's logically correct even for Sonic though, which has been proven in his much more in-character games such as Secret Rings, Black Knight, and Unleashed (Dark Gaia), all of which he took rather seriously.

I don't think so. He's excitable, sure, and in a way that doesn't mesh well with ShtH's serious business attitude, but that's not being an idiot.

Not taking a serious threat seriously is a pretty dumb thing to do. He certainly looks like an idiot next to the level-headed Shadow (which was probably their intention, for shame).

Why not? Sonic's got some new friends to play with, why wouldn't he be excited about it? Okay maybe when they are actually destroying a city that is not the best time for fun and games, but that is the thing that should be changed, not Sonic being excited.

Not entirely sure what you mean by this bit. As in the scene was the problem rather than Sonic's reaction to it? Well... yeah changing the scenario would make Sonic's exciteableness work. That's all I'm saying, it wasn't appropriate for that context.

They need character justifications more than they need logical justifications.

Character justifications can be logical though. I mean yes there's an element of surprise to everyone but at the end of the day we are all just squishy organic machines. Sonic can only draw from his own experience and it comes off as OOC to me that Sonic would take his confidence in beating Eggman time and time again and applying it to every enemy he meets.

And that's you. That's your personality. Other people act differently. Some people are really open, even with people they've just met.

Then other people are stupid. >8[

Heroes is a shittily written game and I can't blame them for not taking cues from it. But even if you roll it back to the Adventures...are we going to lock his personality to how he's been written, whether or not it's the best direction to take him, just so he's never OOC?

Of course not. I'm just saying ShTH was shittily written too, just in a different way.

I guess if nothing else we could see Sonic's casualness in ShTH as actually having some behind the scenes development for him. It's the first time an enemy other than Eggman has really threatened the planet on a long term basis, and he was running around having so much fun and just uhh... going to the ARK because why not.... and stuff... in the end he kinda dropped the ball and it was a good thing Shadow was there to take it all seriously. Then note that the next time he's faced with a new enemy, Secret Rings, he's not quite so cocksure, learning his lesson from Shadow.

But honestly ShTH isn't the kind of game I care enough about to worry about making up elaborate headcanons. Sonic was probably just drunk or something.

Edited October 13, 2012 by JezMM

[Kuzu]

I don't really see a problem with Sonic being cocky towards all of his foes, as far as Sonic was concerned they were just more enemies for him to fight, and Sonic being a natural show off is excited by this. It's not like the Black Arms did anything personal to him, so he has no reason to treat them seriously.

[StaticMania]

Sonic has gotten more cocky with each installment of the 3D games, Like in Sonic Adventure he went so far as to say he hated Eggman, way after he insulted him in his first boss fight, in Sa2 he still took him seriously but still made fun of him in some way, going his way to say Knuckles was more dangerous than him. Sonic Heroes he was more excited to go on another adventure to stop him than take him as a threat even though he did still. In Shadow the Hedgehog, it was full blown cockiness. He treated the whole thing like a game, in every cutscene he was in except in the final story.

[Diogenes]

It's logically correct even for Sonic though, which has been proven in his much more in-character games such as Secret Rings, Black Knight, and Unleashed (Dark Gaia), all of which he took rather seriously.

Why are these "more in-character"? also why should i care about "in-character"

Not taking a serious threat seriously is a pretty dumb thing to do.

That depends on whether or not you can handle it.

Not entirely sure what you mean by this bit. As in the scene was the problem rather than Sonic's reaction to it?

Pretty much.

Well... yeah changing the scenario would make Sonic's exciteableness work. That's all I'm saying, it wasn't appropriate for that context.

ok

Character justifications can be logical though. I mean yes there's an element of surprise to everyone but at the end of the day we are all just squishy organic machines. Sonic can only draw from his own experience and it comes off as OOC to me that Sonic would take his confidence in beating Eggman time and time again and applying it to every enemy he meets.

I don't see how it's very OOC for a cocky, rebellious character who's saved the world several times over from everything from mad scientists to near-gods to be cocky towards some jerkass aliens.

Then other people are stupid. >8[

well maybe they think you're stupid for not giving that dude a big bear hug

in the end he kinda dropped the ball and it was a good thing Shadow was there to take it all seriously.

Not really. They just contrived a way for only Shadow to be relevant. It's got nothing to do with what Sonic did or didn't do.

[Jack / Joker]

I've always found "Silver Episode" from Sonic 2006's ending really strange. Just... what exactly is happening here? It makes no sense...

Edited October 13, 2012 by -The Joker-

[JezMM]

Why are these "more in-character"? also why should i care about "in-character"

Simply, because overall there are more games where Sonic acts like this than the one game where he acts like he does in ShTH.

I don't see how it's very OOC for a cocky, rebellious character who's saved the world several times over from everything from mad scientists to near-gods to be cocky towards some jerkass aliens.

Really? Coz uhh... at the time of ShTH the only near-god he's faced is Perfect Chaos, and he was Super Sonic at the time. Before he turned Super he was pretty unconfident in terms of how to deal with it.

well maybe they think you're stupid for not giving that dude a big bear hug

I'm sure they do, but I have the upper-hand in that they only think I'm stupid. I know they're stupid. <3

[Komodin]

I've always found "Silver Episode" from Sonic 2006's ending really strange. Just... what exactly is happening here? It makes no sense...

Silver tried to seal away Iblis in his body (it didn't work); Blaze offered to do so (succeeded); asked Silver to seal her away in another dimension (Silver didn't have the nerve to go through with it); and either warped herself away or died.

Crappy? Well, yeah.

Nonsensical? Not really.

[Jack / Joker]

...asked Silver to seal her away in another dimension (Silver didn't have the nerve to go through with it); and either warped herself away or died.

This is the part I don't get. It's the way he doesn't want to seal her away, pretty much getting an assist for her death-type thing. He says he can't go on without her... so he lets her (presumably) die? How could she have went to another dimension just like that? Were the Emeralds even necessary then? In turn, why wasn't she present at the end if she was just sent to some another dimension? As well as this, if Sonic went back to save Elise, this future version of Iblis wouldn't exist, which...

*takes migraine tablets*

Fuck it. None of it happened anyway. Which is also strange. I hate this game.

Edited October 13, 2012 by -The Joker-

[Kuzu]

Because I can never get enough of character discussions.

Simply, because overall there are more games where Sonic acts like this than the one game where he acts like he does in ShTH.

I think the point was, Sonic tends to be more interesting when he's acting like he's a rebellious teenager rather than standard hero protagonist.

Really? Coz uhh... at the time of ShTH the only near-god he's faced is Perfect Chaos, and he was Super Sonic at the time. Before he turned Super he was pretty unconfident in terms of how to deal with it.

I think it's more these Black Arms haven't really done anything major, or anything more than what Sonic has faced in the past, so to him they're just another bump in the road.