Sonic-related pet peeves?

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

Fan 1: I want a Sonic Adventure 3

fan 2: 

This shit gets really annoying fast. Just to clarify, I don't mind when people think that Sonic 06 is Adventure 3, my problem is that Sonic 06 is used to silence those who want an Adventure 3 because of some fear they have that if enough fans ask for it, they will make it and think it would be Sonic 06 2. Sonic 06 was meant to be it's own game. In many interviews, they stated that this game was supposed to be a reboot, a re imagining. In order for Sonic 06 to be Sonic Adventure 3, it would have to be a squeal to Sonic Adventure 2. Sonic 06 doesn't leave off from Sonic Adventure 2, actually it ignores Adventure 2 completely. 

Also, Sonic Unleashed was originally going to be Sonic Adventure 3, name and all, before they changed it to Sonic World Adventure. Why would they make Sonic Adventure 3 in 2008 if 06 was going to be Sonic Adventure 3? I dunno. Anyway, it doesn't bother me when people say Sonic 06 is Adventure 3, but it bothers me when it's being used to silence those who have different game ideas than others.

 

[Darinian]

That people think that platforming should never be in a sonic game. UGH 

[Monkey Destruction Switch]

This is a different kind of pet peeve from most of those mentioned, but I hate it when I'm trying to think of the Emerald Hill Zone theme, a song I love, but accidentally think of its 2-player counterpart and then can't get it out of my head x) I don't like the 2-player song nearly as much, but it's "catchier". It's a bit of an annoyance, so I guess it qualifies as a pet peeve

[shadowmanmax]

That I feel like I have to critique modern sonic games against a lower standard than most other games and it always seems to come to: Well its not too bad but its really nothing amazing either. Yes it may be a good SONIC game but as its own game its just okay :/

[Semi-colon e]

It bothers me how in 06, the way you enter levels is with shitty mirrors. You go back to Adventure 1 and you have different things like trains, going inside of buildings, the entrance to Twinkle Park, opening up the pyramid for Lost World, all things that made the game feel more alive and like an actual place. Yet when you get to 06, which is trying really hard to be "realistic", you just get magic mirrors that take you to places.

[Phos]

On November 7, 2015 at 0:43 PM, Nepenthe said:

The amount of realistic detail in the classics increased as time went on, culminating in a near-abandonment of the abstract geometric patterns that littered earlier titles' natural environments and making for stages that were more believable and tactile. Nothing in those S3 screenshots or indeed most of the locations in the classics were particularly out of bounds for real life with the exception of just how damn saturated the color was (probably because the Japanese designers were operating under the assumption that the planet was indeed our Earth). Just as well, it probably wouldn't have been anymore difficult to do basic color texturing on the Dreamcast than it would have been grass texturing, considering most of them are pictures the team had to go out and take themselves. It's just that- to me- SA1's fidelity is merely the logical culmination of the direction they were always heading in to some extent. For reference, look at the OVA that Sega happily signed off on during a time when Sonic's look was supposedly more tied down and consistent and note how realistically the environments were painted. Subsequently note just how little people complain about it as a Sonic cartoon. Crayola colors and simplistic geometric shapes aren't the only facets of Sonic's art style and general character.

The geometric patterns didn't go away, they got finer. Take a close look at the backgrounds in Angel Island Zone, what at first blush just look like regular trunks actually have a lot of square profile protrusions, in some spots these also serve as waterfalls. One of my favorite details in that level. Ice cap zone has a lot of ice chunks in that have Quartz like cleavage, with extremely regular shapes for chucks of ice, and take another look at those ICZ trees: their trunks are blue with alternating thick and thin bands. 

[Rexeljet]

On 20/04/2016 at 10:41 AM, Semi-colon e said:

It bothers me how in 06, the way you enter levels is with shitty mirrors. You go back to Adventure 1 and you have different things like trains, going inside of buildings, the entrance to Twinkle Park, opening up the pyramid for Lost World, all things that made the game feel more alive and like an actual place. Yet when you get to 06, which is trying really hard to be "realistic", you just get magic mirrors that take you to places.

This. Another thing that I felt cheapened Sonic 06's alleged realism was the fact that- like the classic trilogy- the whole game took place across a relatively small area that had an impossibly varied climate and geography, with no explanation behind it. Oh it's nice and sunny round by the coast, but there's a blizzard going on a few hundred yards away and a desert somewhere nearby. 

It's one of the reasons why I feel that Unleashed did a better job of being "realistic" than 06 did- it had a reason for everywhere to look so different because it took place across the whole world.

Obviously I'm not saying that Sonic 06's levels should have been beaches, forests and warehouses all the way through- just that having completely different areas within such a small space goes against the whole "Sonic in the real word" gimmick that the developers were going for.

[Multikaris]

1 hour ago, Rexeljet said:

This. Another thing that I felt cheapened Sonic 06's alleged realism was the fact that- like the classic trilogy- the whole game took place across a relatively small area that had an impossibly varied climate and geography, with no explanation behind it. Oh it's nice and sunny round by the coast, but there's a blizzard going on a few hundred yards away and a desert somewhere nearby. 

It's one of the reasons why I feel that Unleashed did a better job of being "realistic" than 06 did- it had a reason for everywhere to look so different because it took place across the whole world.

Obviously I'm not saying that Sonic 06's levels should have been beaches, forests and warehouses all the way through- just that having completely different areas within such a small space goes against the whole "Sonic in the real word" gimmick that the developers were going for.

I agree. They needed to have added Angel Island and the Sol Dimension into the plot and gameplay so we could access more levels realistically.

[Nepenthe]

2 hours ago, Rexeljet said:

This. Another thing that I felt cheapened Sonic 06's alleged realism was the fact that- like the classic trilogy- the whole game took place across a relatively small area that had an impossibly varied climate and geography, with no explanation behind it. Oh it's nice and sunny round by the coast, but there's a blizzard going on a few hundred yards away and a desert somewhere nearby. 

Ignoring the fact that most of these areas are accessed by portals, meaning it's kind of difficult to accurately gauge the distance between different places, different biomes can exist within close proximity of each other. The state of Arizona for example actually includes every single biome on Earth but a tropical rainforest. Provided you have enough elevation levels within the terrain, you can feasibly get different types of geographical areas within a relatively small area.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Being fair, Sonic 06 was generally designed to be a reboot to Adventure 1. They don't outright say it, but it's so easy to see it in how it's designed. As botched and fucked as they were, the controls and characters looked like they were meant to handle how Adventure 1 and 2 handled them, we had a new hedgehog character introduced, a staple of the Adventure series. We had multiple playable stories in which the characters' stories run aside and cross other with each other. It's got so many to the point where Sonic 06's Sonic Wikia page has an entire section dedicated with the different comparisons of Adventure 1 and 06. Was 06 a bad game? In my opinion, yes it was, but that doesn't change what it was obviously meant to be, a revival of the Adventure gameplay style. Unleashed, as much as I love the game, isn't a true sequel to Adventure and Adventure 2, despite the original concept (Something I actually think is good because I like Unleashed as a title that stands out on it's own with it's own unique gameplay style).

I know Unleashed was originally Adventure 3, but that's what it was. A concept. The starting point, the first idea. It expanded, and changed into it's own project with no ties to the series (Only Sonic, Tails, and Amy are present, no multiple stories, the gameplay is widely different from the Adventure gameplay, and many more). As bad and fucked as it was, 06 is technically more of an Adventure title than Unleashed was because of the simple fact it had far more of the tropes that the Adventure titles had, and attempted to emulate it's gameplay, despite screwing it up big time. 

[Nepenthe]

I wouldn't say Unleashed has no ties to the Adventure games whatsoever. An actual alternate gameplay style, Tornado rail stages (SA2 and 06 lack this), explorable hub worlds connected to the stages (SA2 once again lacks this), a focus on a decidedly Earth-like setting, a giant monster Eggman can't control, even a companion that you can optionally bond with using items gathered from other areas of the game that actually yields rewards for doing so (something 06 lacks), etc..

As for Sonic 06's gameplay, it's not all that similar to Adventure's beyond homages to set pieces and basic goal definitions of getting to point A to point B, which Unleashed also has (whales). Otherwise, the physics, gameplay gimmicks, and forced character switching within the middle of several main characters' stages are different enough from the past games to call it its own style (only SA2 does this for the final level before the final boss like Unleashed, only the former is more context-driven). Even worse, I wouldn't say 06 even has an alternate gameplay style considering every character is squarely within the platforming genre and is also charged with getting to the end at the player's discretion versus doing anything particularly out of the ordinary for the entire run time like gathering items or being stuck in a mech or- like the Werehog- fighting enemies using unique action physics and combo input systems. To me, the lack of that is a huge point against 06 being a true Adventure sequel.

And while Sonic 06 has different viewpoints, its story and goals are not anymore representative of either Adventure game's anymore than Unleashed's is. The Adventures are squarely about characters who were unfairly wronged in the past through the death of their friends seeking to destroy the world as retribution for that wrong, and the heroes confronting both Eggman's ambitions to selfishly use that character to his own ends and the character's indignation about their desire for revenge. Neither Unleashed nor Sonic 06 recycle that plot-line.

So to me, both games are kind of Adventure-ish. They use whatever they want and throw out other things either through deliberate design decisions or incompetence. We could probably sit down and chart out the actual number of agreed-upon similarities (which I might do because it sounds like fun), but after awhile it kind of becomes a little pedantic considering SA2 changes a heck of a whole lot about the Adventure formula anyway, and yet no one is under any impression that it's "less" of an Adventure game than others. Adventure games are just Adventure games, differences and flaws and all. You know 'em when you see 'em I guess. xP

[Muscles Maximum]

This topic is old as dirt but I wanna revive it with a modern pet peeve.

It honestly bothers the heck out of me when people are so adamant about how every character needs the drop dash. Like no, Sonic needs his own unique move. Right he gets the shield powers, but I honestly hate that excuse. Sonic doesn’t run around with elemental shields up his ass to use anytime. It’s not an innate ability of his. The drop dash is a move built around maintaining your speed and makes perfect sense to be Sonic exclusive. 

Honestly to me even the spin dash should be exclusive to Sonic. But I can understand forking that move over to the others for ease of use and lots of the levels are built with the idea of being able to rev up and blast off at any time in mind.

[RedFox99]

One thing that annoyed me was when Forces implied that without Sonic, his friends are incapable of holding off against Eggman's forces. I said used to because I realized that Infinite was very hard to fight against as he curbstomped Sonic (granted, the fact that Sonic and the Avatar get more done in few days than the others did in 6 months doesn't seem right to me, but what do I know?)

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

I don’t think that implication is a bad thing actually.

I think the way went about it was more annoying given that it was a bad case of them not showing it in favor of telling us.

[Mangoaxe5]

The whole "Two Worlds" nonsense.

It just makes no sense, and there's nothing in the games that hints at it.

It really feels like something Sega just made up out of the blue.

Just really bad world building.

[Marco9966]

How Sonic comforts Tails in Sonic Forces.

"Don't worry! We'll see my classic version again, you'll wanna hang out with him more than me, this leaves me more time to hang out with Avatar!"

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[Fire-N-Space]

Metal Sonic himself got to be in Sonic Mania with his boss fight from CD getting remade but all Amy gets in Mania is a look alike bomb.

When Amy haters call Amy's affection for Sonic all kinds of things like fangirl, obsessive, crazed or one dimensional personality but never say love.

Sonic All-Stars Racing Transformed with its overly big tracks that I can drive a bus on.

The Sonic, Tails, & Knuckles word combo.

[A person, that exists]

Sonic's friends. All of them.

Like, I am not against a large cast, the problem is that most of his friends are bland af. Like, if they had some charm and/or character, I wouldn't hate them that much, but the problem is that Sega seems to have two ways to handle the issue: Remove the friends, or bring'em back and make them completely useless and bland.

Not to mention that they have no purpose in the story. At all. They don't mess up Eggman's plans, they don't get saved by Sonic, they don't even talk or interact with Sonic, or anyone for that matter, which makes them very... Boring.

[Marco9966]

1 hour ago, A person, that exists said:

Sonic's friends. All of them.

Like, I am not against a large cast, the problem is that most of his friends are bland af. Like, if they had some charm and/or character, I wouldn't hate them that much, but the problem is that Sega seems to have two ways to handle the issue: Remove the friends, or bring'em back and make them completely useless and bland.

Not to mention that they have no purpose in the story. At all. They don't mess up Eggman's plans, they don't get saved by Sonic, they don't even talk or interact with Sonic, or anyone for that matter, which makes them very... Boring.

That was not the case in SA1 and SA2, EACH character had a purpose and added to the story.

But you're right, recently they're only decoration (Sonic Forces)

[BaronGrackle]

When people say that Knuckles was created with the intention that he would only be in Sonic 3. Sometimes with a quote from Takashi that he was meant to be a "supporting character".

Yes, everyone except Sonic and the Doctor are supporting characters. Tails is a supporting character.

But nobody alive in 1994, who saw Knuckles' introduction and SEGA's advertising around him, was under the impression that this was a one-shotter. And when Knuckles kept appearing in things like 3D Blast and the OVA? Nobody was confused about why he wasn't glued on Angel Island with the Master Emerald.

[Cuz]

 

3 hours ago, BaronGrackle said:

the OVA? Nobody was confused about why he wasn't glued on Angel Island with the Master Emerald.

It loses it's luster when the planet's entire outer-rim happens to also be floating islands.

but yeah, it can be hard to get people to understand Knux was once the Shadow of his day.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

5 hours ago, BaronGrackle said:

And when Knuckles kept appearing in things like 3D Blast and the OVA? Nobody was confused about why he wasn't glued on Angel Island with the Master Emerald.

That’s because continuity wasn’t a big deal at the time until Sonic Team started making more apparent and fleshed out, nor was part the fandom as hypocritical over characters back then than it is now.

[Multikaris]

What happened to the Homing Attack in Mania? Didn’t Classic Sonic learn that from Modern in Generations? Why wasn’t it made an unlockable move like the Insta-Shield and Peel-Out? 

[Blue Blood]

13 hours ago, Miragnarok said:

What happened to the Homing Attack in Mania? Didn’t Classic Sonic learn that from Modern in Generations? Why wasn’t it made an unlockable move like the Insta-Shield and Peel-Out? 

Because it's a load of shit in Classic gameplay.

 

[Multikaris]

What happened to Super form extra battles? The last one we had was in Mania, and even then, it’s only for the original mode and not Encore. Maybe it’s due to the Chaos Emeralds losing all relevance starting from Lost World, but...