Jump to content
Awoo.

Sonic-related pet peeves?


Aero

Recommended Posts

Shadow is as fast as Sonic,

True.

physically stronger than Sonic (or it would at least appear that way),

At least, Knuckles is still stronger

has got the typical tough-guy attitude,

As does Knuckles

is black,

Well aren't you racist?

has all these abilities nobody else has,

Sonic and Silver have Chaos Control. Pretty sure they could do similar things if Sonic Team could let them. Then again, So do Silver and Blaze with telekinesis and pyrokinesis.

And lest we forget that Metal Sonic can copy all of those powers, as I've said once before.

uses hover-shoes,

Your point?

has a deep emotional story.

And that's bad?

Shadow is an over powered, poorly designed character in every possible way. His sole purpose is just to be the series' badass.

Protip: you lose when you bash. There's a fine line between criticism and bashing, don't cross it again like you just did in your post.

For all Shadow's overpowered abilities, he's no less beatable than other characters on his level. He is no less poorly designed than any other character when all you do is look on the outside, and if you want to incorporate all his abilities and personality, that's not something poorly designed. It's something poorly executed.

And let's not start talking about a character's sole purpose lest I turn this into another Knuckles topic. We've gone almost a year without doing so, and I will be more than happy to break that record.

Edited by ChaosSupremeSonic
Link to comment
Share on other sites

And that's bad?

Well, when you're the only recurring character that has it, that's... kind of a problem...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Running short on time to tackle everything else, but atmospheric reentry is not the same as a punch. We had someone skydive from over 100,000 feet in the air and broke the sound barrier on his way down, yet I'm pretty sure than if you were to punch him really hard then he would go down.

ATMOSPHERIC REENTRY. Meaning Shadow literally survived BURNING IN THE ATMOSPHERE, and the impact itself, with no visible injury on him. A simple punch knocking him out just doesn't seem plausible, hurting him maybe ,but not knocking him out completely.

Well, when you're the only recurring character that has it, that's... kind of a problem...

Because? Seriously if you're going to say simply having an emotional backstory is somehow bad for a character, you can at least tell me why it's so bad.

Edited by Popo
Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is debatable considering Sonic is generally shown as the faster of the two. Shadow at most just rivals his speed, not necessarily equal.

Unconfirmed, and even then Sonic consistently takes down robots half his size anyway..

So did Knuckles before they shat on his personality.

:/

Nobody has Fire abilities, nobody is as smart as Eggman, nobody has Psychokinesis, nobody is as strong as Knuckles. I'd imagine Shadow having unique abilities would set him apart from everyone else rather than ripping off the main character's moveset alone.

Which is a big deal because...?

So did Chip, Shahra, and Merlina.

Ok, I'm not going to disagree that Shadow was handled like a shitty fan character in the past, but are you seriously judging him on those things alone? The reason Shadow seems like such a "poorly designed character" is because he's written terribly, which is the case with basically every character at the moment. No character has been immune to the shitty writing of this series, so I fail to see how Shadow is the only one at fault here.

Shadow's at fault more so than everyone else. Factors about his physical design are simply just to make him look cool is the most typical way. What's cooler than regular shoes? Flying shoes, of course. And the coolest colour? Black! In regards to abilities, he can already do everything the main character can do, and then he's got all manner of over powered nonsense on top. With his backstory, it's a very cliché tragic tale.

I'm sorry, but he's just poorly designed. Any one of his points individually is fine. Many of them work well together. But once you throw them all into the same mix, you end up with something rather shit.

No.

Haha. I can't stand him. There's no good reason for him or anyone else to be scrapped, but if he was then I wouldn't complain.

Protip: you lose when you bash. There's a fine line between criticism and bashing, don't cross it again like you just did in your post.

Cool your head- I'm not bashing. I'm trying to explain why a character bothers me.

Edited by Blue Blood
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sonic 06 is the master of pulling powers out its ass:

"What, YOU never thought Amy could turn invisible? What an idiot you are - I do it all the time in Heroes!"

"Oh yeah, Chaos Control can be used for time travel! Didn't you know?"

"Hey, Silver has a super form now! Great surprise, with no foreshadowing or hints he had one, wasn't it?"

"Guess what? Elise has this glowy orb of death now! Why? MAGIC! :D"

Also, I think Shadow was saved by an Eggman robot BEFORE he crash-landed.

  • Thumbs Up 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Too many simply because they like to play follow the leader with their characters in going by Shadow's example.

The "badass character with a dark past who can do all the things the hero can and more" was a typical fan-character even before Shadow showed up, and not just in the Sonic fanbase but in fanbases in general.

So in a way, its kinda hypocritical for anyone who likes Shadow to criticize fanfiction writers for introducing various "main character knockoff but with a dark past and more power"-type characters when Shadow himself is, as Blue Blood said, essentially the exact same type of character.

Edited by batson
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, when you're the only recurring character that has it, that's... kind of a problem...

Then why not give other character's an emotional backstory? Granted, they fucked up Shadow's original backstory, so that's more of a fault against him at this point than anything.

The "badass character with a dark past who can do all the things the hero can and more" was a typical fan-character even before Shadow showed up, and not just in the Sonic fanbase but in fanbases in general.

So in a way, its kinda hypocritcial for anyone who likes Shadow to criticize fanfiction writers for introducing various "main character knockoff but with a dark past and more power"-type characters when Shadow himself is, as Blue Blood say, essentially the exact same type of character.

Was kinda restricting it to just inside the series, but if you want to branch outside of it, it's even more hypocritical for anyone who likes this series to not see it as a shonen anime knock-off like any other fiction we see out there and not criticize it as such.

The happy-go lucky hero and his superpowered friends who loves to explore the world who ends up stopping the bad guy trying to conquer it. So either you we keep it inside the series, or we make a mess of this whole argument and start tearing every aspect of this franchise to shreds? Because I'll be more than happy to do either one.

Edited by ChaosSupremeSonic
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Because? Seriously if you're going to say simply having an emotional backstory is somehow bad for a character, you can at least tell me why it's so bad.

Having an emotional backstory is hardly a bad trait in itself; when there's only one character that has such a backstory, that's not exactly a good sign of a work's quality...

Then why not give other character's an emotional backstory? Granted, they fucked up Shadow's original backstory, so that's more of a fault against him at this point than anything.

Well, that would imply that Sega actually wants to entertain the notion of developing their characters beyond their current one-note state..

Edited by Komodin
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You know, I'd find it kinda interesting if Sonic's speed could counter Shadow's use of slowing down time...I dunno, use Speed-Break or something. Then again, there's the other chaos powers to look into as well. It's a really not-well-thought-out idea, but I thought it could go something like this:

Shadow: *uses chaos control*

Sonic: *uses speed break or something and breaks Shadow's chaos control*

Edited by Burnt Ash
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Eggman beat Super Sonic which, prior to Unleashed, was impossible at that point, it shouldn't be hard to make weaknesses for a character like Shadow.

What about the beginning of Sonic 3? Knuckles knocked the emeralds from Super Sonic's grip, turning him back to normal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Granted, Rad Red spent his entire life next to the on/off switch for the emeralds, so that may have something to do with it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Cool your head- I'm not bashing. I'm trying to explain why a character bothers me.

Dude, no. You were bashing.

You listed "being black" and having hovershoes as one of the reasons why Shadow is an overpowered, poorly designed character. We have a word for that, and it's called being "petty". You mentioned that Shadow has all these powers no one else has, yet completely disregard that Sonic and Silver also have those powers to an extent, even further disregarded that Metal Sonic can copy all those powers thus rendering Shadow's overpoweredness a moot point. Even more when you consider no one else has powers like pyrokinesis or telekinesis.

Dude, Shadow is one of my favorite characters, and I can damn well do a better job at mentioning everything that bothers me about him, such as how his Chaos Control abilities can give him whatever the writers want to cook up, or how he has the emotional range of a brick, and how his whole backstory is screwed to hell thanks to the addition of the Black Doom. I would expect people who are bothered about a character to not be so fucking petty about it at the very least.

Edited by ChaosSupremeSonic
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You listed "being black" and having hovershoes as one of the reasons why Shadow is an overpowered, poorly designed character.
Rocket shoes on top of everything else is kind of a lot, to be fair
  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I didn't disregard any of that. I was talking about Shadow, nobody else. And when you prompted it, I happily agreed Silver is over-powered. Metal Sonic too. Listing "being black" and "having hovershoes" isn't being petty so much as it's trying to explain the details of his character that throw him into the realms of too cliché cool, even for the Sonic series. I don't know how on Earth you're not getting this, or why you're getting so wound up.

Shadow has absolutely nothing going against him. At the very least, everyone else some minor shortfall. Shadow's got nothing. Blaze's fire abilities come at the cost of her fear of height and stark independence. Silver's ridiculously overly-powerful telekinesis is at least balanced out by his personality. Sonic himself is lacking in shortfalls and is constantly shown to do pretty much anything, though it's somewhat more forgiveable because he's the lead character (he's not totally perfect, mind). And there's no defending Metal Sonic's current copy-cat status. But I wasn't talking about him. I was talking about Shadow- the flawless character.

Rocket shoes on top of everything else is kind of a lot, to be fair

This guy gets it. You don't have to agree with anything I'm saying, but you're not really listening when I say 'Shadow's too much when you look at everything'.

Also, I'm finished. Pet-peeve's topic is for talking about things that bother you. Shadow is one of things in my case. So I've explained it and now I'm done. Enjoy the rest of your topic without two raging fans shooting the odds at each other, guys!

Edited by Blue Blood
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Absolutely- Silver sucks too. I'd happily see him exiled from the series really. At least he has some sort of short fall though.

I agree. Silver is one of the worstvideogame characters ever made.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Silver has tons of potential. Even more than say, Blaze, or Shadow. I don't see why one would want a character out just because they got a tough break by starting in the worst game in the series.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree. Silver is one of the worstvideogame characters ever made.

Because you think he gets in the way of your fanon OTP and must die?

About Shadow, if there's one thing that peeved me about him, it's the way he was Sonic V 2.0 for a while. In '06, he plays like a superior Sonic. In Black Knight, he's drastically overpowered, his only drawback being his lousy wall running and the near-suicidal delay time to his wall attack. Once he has Ddraig Goch equipped as his weapon, he's a game breaker plain and simple. Chronicles is another one.

  • Thumbs Up 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Silver has tons of potential. Even more than say, Blaze, or Shadow.
Like what?

I don't see why one would want a character out just because they got a tough break by starting in the worst game in the series.
He's been just as ugly and boring in every other appearance.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree. Silver is one of the worstvideogame characters ever made.

i could say the same about your precious blaze

Edited by Felix
  • Thumbs Up 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I will skip all the fiery temper people have showed in this thread and say that I see gameplay potential in Silver even though I don't like him and would like him to stay away from the franchise.

His gameplay has potential and the fact that the Telekinesis-user staple isn't entirely original is exactly what makes it easier for us to analyze it, since we can have a lot of references. For one, I'll useNyxQuest, a sidescroller game about a girl... who... does stuff... and there is a whole Greek mythology setting and her mission is to rescue some guy... and even though her name is Nyx, her powers have nothing to do with the night.

nyxquest_boss.jpg

Winged chick conquers the Sahara

But I digress.

The point is that the game is all about moving objects around without touching them so that you can clear the puzzles, as you can see from the screenshot. There is a pointer and you move around while moving things to get your job done. It' interesting and it's fun, albeit lacking some sense of progression and general appeal.

However, Silver can benefit from this and still be fast, effectively tying momentum and puzzles, telekinesis and speed. One very simple example I can think of is this one:

magicworks.jpg

MAGIC

So it's your common speed and your common slopes, but you have to drag the box to the floor right next to it, both because it is blocking your way and because even if it didn't exist, Silver's jump wouldn't be enough to go up, so he needs the crater. Therefore, one goes off the slope and, in the meanwhile, drags the box. Then, one lands and keeps going.

If it's too weird to control, you can always add a bullet-time feature to his telekinetic powers or an Okami-like time stop in which you have to predict the movement of the stuff you move.

Edited by Palas
  • Thumbs Up 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Like what?

Combine momentum based gameplay with telekinesis.

Boom. Fun as hell gameplay style right there.

Edit: Palas knows what I'm talkin 'bout.

Edited by Wraith U
  • Thumbs Up 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, hey, one of my pet peeves is how wishy-washy Sonic Team is with their character statistics.

Shadow's Chaos Powers are the most obvious example, but another one is a fairly large point: Is Metal Sonic actually faster than the real one? I know it's been said that he is, but also there's the constant "Sawnik is the fastest evar". Then again, he's referred to occasionally as "The Fastest Thing ALIVE", so that wouldn't include Metal Sonic.

-shrug- What do you guys think?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree. Silver is one of the worstvideogame characters ever made.

I wasn't being particularly seriously with this. I may not like Silver, but I can't see why he should be gotten rid of.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, hey, one of my pet peeves is how wishy-washy Sonic Team is with their character statistics.

Shadow's Chaos Powers are the most obvious example, but another one is a fairly large point: Is Metal Sonic actually faster than the real one? I know it's been said that he is, but also there's the constant "Sawnik is the fastest evar". Then again, he's referred to occasionally as "The Fastest Thing ALIVE", so that wouldn't include Metal Sonic.

-shrug- What do you guys think?

Considering that everyone and their mother has outran or outflew Sonic by now, I think the whole "Fastest Thing Alive" thing is something sonic keeps telling himself so he doesn't feel inferior to his superpowered friends. q:

Hell, in Sonic Generations, Silver stays ahead of him for the entire boss fight.

  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

You must read and accept our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy to continue using this website. We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.