The Space Topic

[SuperStingray]

Earth's a wonderful place, but did you know that 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of everything is NOT Earth? And let me tell ya, the part that's not Earth is pretty damn cool too.

This is Space: a realm where things are so large, so far apart and so old that our flimsy 3-pound brains were never built to comprehend the sheer scale of them, yet we still move forward and await the day that we can put a star in our pocket.

2 billion seems like a large number to us, but next to the true scale of the universe, the fact that it's ONLY taken that many years for a mindless Prokaryotic blob eking it's way through the primordial soup seeking sustenance to eventually beget a creature that could build a machine that could take it to a different gravitational body is pretty damn impressive. And yet, that's only 2 celestial bodies human feet have settled on. We haven't even begun to scratch the tip of the very first atom of the iceberg.

There are still hundreds of other solid bodies in our solar system.

About 300 billion more solar systems in our galaxy.

50 more galaxies in our local group.

100 groups in our supercluster.

Millions of superclusters in our observable universe.

And we don't even know if THAT is where it ends.

It's this boundless mystery that makes the subject so damn amazing.

So I decided it was worth making a thread to appreciate and discuss what lies beyond the exosphere. Current events, facts, pictures, Neil DeGrasse Tyson quotes- anything pertaining to the heavens goes here.

[Wentos]

I usually try not to think about what lies beyond our normal, every-day world. It makes my head hurt...

Edited July 19, 2012 by Hatsune Miku

[Zero G]

I love space! I wish I could see super nova close up!

[Emmett L. Brown]

I'm excited about space. I really hope to see either man on Mars or a proper lunar base in my lifetime. Or, even better; a proper space radiation shielding technology. Because space is just filled with invisible cosmic death rays, and those kinda prohibit space exploration and lunar colonisation at the moment.

[Nintendoga]

I love space! Just to think, the earth is the size of a cell, compared to the Universe. It really amazes me just how big (or hell, small) the universe is. What's at the edge of space? Is there even an edge? What other planets are out there, as I highly doubt out of the trillions of planets and solar systems out there, we're the only planet capable of life.

Even though it's hundreds of years away and we'll be dead by then, I anticipate the day humans are able to travel outside of our solar system, and find out what lies beyond there.

[Aero]

I can't get Space Core quotes outta my head now.

Here.

[Teoskaven]

I apologize for the bump, but i think this is a good thread for talking about this rather than creating a new one.

As you know, people at NASA discover new things in our universe with each passing day, from new space bodies to how some concepts that we know may have to be updated or re-thought. Well, apparently they have discovered something big this time around to a point that they streamed a public announcement about it just a couple of hours ago.

So, what they have found now? Well, and entire new solar system (called Trappist-1) with seven planets, all of the size of the Earth, more or less.

Sounds normal so far, it matches the hypothesis of having potential planets like ours by the laws of probability. Well, there's also the fact that 3 of said planets have perfect conditions for water and atmpshere (and by extension, life) due to the star of the system being a red dwarf, wich means being closer to it doesn't create an infernal temperature like say on Mercury.

Ok, that's good, but here's the kicker. This system is actually just 40 light-years from ours.

Fucking 40.

It's still a huge amount of distance with our current space technology, but compared to all theories and hypothesis made in the past (wich predicted stuff in the hundreds of light-years) it's something that's literally behind a space corner.

Naturally, scanning will be performed regularly with an approximation on the precise state of the planets in 10 years.

 

Here's an article with all the info you need and more: http://www.iflscience.com/space/breakthrough-in-search-for-life-as-seven-earthsized-worlds-found-orbiting-nearby-star/

 

It seems that space colonization may be more in our grasp than we thought. I can only hope humanity can save itself and start its ultimate dream.

[SenEDDtor Missile]

That feeling that somewhere out in the universe, there's probably another planet filled with aliens who are probably talking on their alien forums about people like us like we're the aliens.

[Osmium]

2 hours ago, SenEDtor Missile said:

That feeling that somewhere out in the universe, there's probably another planet filled with aliens who are probably talking on their alien forums about people like us like we're the aliens.

Statistically this has to be true. 

[Soniman]

I mean I doubt even if there is life it's life that's actually intelligent AND has evolved to the point of having similar technology to us (even if they were technologically advanced they could've just not invented the Internet still lol)  BUT your point stands 

[Polkadi~☆]

It's like a game of Civilization, but without meeting any of the other players yet. It really is, when you think about it.

 

On the news of TRAPPIST-1, I really hope to reach it in the next couple of years, but that's currently not likely. Soon, soon...

[Patticus]

Fantastic news about TRAPPIST-1 - a trio of potential garden worlds, all in one solar system, and NASA will be examining these worlds (via spectroscopy) over the next decade to determine their atmospheric makeups, to identify whether life may be present. Without a doubt, this is the most exciting find in astronomy for years. Even if there is no life there, the trio of worlds in the Goldilocks zone of their parent star could well be terraformed by future generations, and will probably be among the first targets of the first extra-solar expeditions.

[Meta77]

Seeing as it takes us a pretty good bit to even get to mars I highly doubt were going to be seeing anyone in our lifetime making out to those planets. Let alone building anything on them. Though the suns also smaller so less heat?

[Patticus]

49 minutes ago, Meta77 said:

Seeing as it takes us a pretty good bit to even get to mars I highly doubt were going to be seeing anyone in our lifetime making out to those planets. Let alone building anything on them. Though the suns also smaller so less heat?

Barring some kind of spaceflight revolution, it'll definitely be several centuries before serious thought is put towards sending human explorers beyond the confines of our solar system. When we do, we won't be hearing back from them any time soon, not without an equally dramatic communications revolution too. We likely won't see any permanent colonies established in our lifetimes - though the commercialization and militarization of near-Earth space are both already underway.

The star is much smaller and cooler than our own sun, yes, but these worlds are all much closer to it than our rocky worlds are to our sun - they're all crammed into a space a fifth of the distance that lies between Mercury and the sun. The inner three worlds are thought to be much too hot to sustain life (the innermost takes just 1.51 Earth days to orbit its parent star - contrast to Mercury's 88ish days), and the outermost world is believed to be probably too cold - its orbit takes around 20-22 Earth days. That leaves three planets in the habitable zone, potentially some or all harboring some kind of life.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Question is if those worlds can even support our kind of life?

It may be earth-like, but what if there's not enough of the oxygen we need or too much of it? How much of the planet do we need to terraform to make it suitable for us, and on the chance we do what microorganisms do we need to be careful of?

That last one being a real kicker given how colonization was during the age of empires here on Earth. Might kill off a lot more than expected should we send any people there to colonize those worlds.

[Patticus]

1 hour ago, Conquering Storm's Servant said:

Question is if those worlds can even support our kind of life?

It may be earth-like, but what if there's not enough of the oxygen we need or too much of it? How much of the planet do we need to terraform to make it suitable for us, and on the chance we do what microorganisms do we need to be careful of?

When you terraform, you're doing it on a planetary scale, as you're altering the whole atmosphere of the world. The process will probably take several thousand years to complete, so it would be a long-term species survival thing. Send fleets of machines out there first in fast craft to get started, send colonizing fleets out in slower, more mankind-friendly ships that'll arrive after the bulk of the process is complete, to begin the process of actual colonization.

Of course, all that ignores the fact that this star emits too much UV light for human bodies to tolerate, and even if we find many habitable worlds that support life (there and elsewhere), the odds that "real" humans as we know them will be able to live there comfortably are low - light, gravity, atmospheric pressure, atmospheric makeup, potential airborne toxins and a variety of other factors will probably ensure that while mankind will lives on and around the Earth, only post-Humans will travel the stars.

Even Mars, with its light gravity, will produce Humans with lighter bone structures who will be unable to survive on the Earth, unless some means can be found to artificially sustain a planetary magnetic field around Mars, capable of permitting full atmospheric terraforming without that atmosphere then blowing away in the solar winds. Assuming a higher atmospheric pressure is even viable as a means of counterbalancing weak gravity...

[Osmium]

On 2/23/2017 at 1:10 PM, Soniman said:

I mean I doubt even if there is life it's life that's actually intelligent AND has evolved to the point of having similar technology to us (even if they were technologically advanced they could've just not invented the Internet still lol)  BUT your point stands 

There are estimated to be 2 trillion galaxies in the observable universe, and the average galaxy has 100 billion stars. That means there are ((2x10^12)(1x10^11)), or roughly 2x10^23 stars in the observable universe. And on average (at least estimates here in the Milky Way) say there are 1.6 planets per star. This means there are roughly 3.2x10^23 planets in the universe. And this is likely a lower estimate. 

You have no right to say that there isn't life out there that isn't intelligent and has developed technology similar to ours. The numbers are much higher than you think. Like, the question of us ever communicating with life forms of this caliber is another story completely, but statistically I'd say there's a pretty good chance that this has happened many times and will continue to happen many times. 

We still don't know if there is other life existing in out own solar system. If there is in fact life, do you know how high the probability of life appearing is (this to be fair is only a question of life, not intelligent life to our standards)? I'm just saying, you can't just say you doubt. The universe is much larger than you and me can comprehend casually. 

[Patticus]

1 minute ago, ShroomZed said:

You have no right to say that there isn't life out there that isn't intelligent and has developed technology similar to ours. The numbers are much higher than you think. Like, the question of us ever communicating with life forms of this caliber is another story completely, but statistically I'd say there's a pretty good chance that this has happened many times and will continue to happen may times. 

I suppose the question then becomes: Assuming via statistics that intelligent life should exist all over the place, when will it exist, relative to us? Is it extinct already? Is it alive right now? Is it not due for another ten million years? And where is the nearest extant intelligent life? It could well be that we are surrounded by dead civilizations, peoples yet to be, or a mix of both.

That's where the Fermi Paradox comes in - where is the Great Filter?

[Osmium]

Just now, Patticus said:

I suppose the question then becomes: Assuming via statistics that intelligent life should exist all over the place, when will it exist, relative to us? Is it extinct already? Is it alive right now? Is it not due for another ten million years? And where is the nearest extant intelligent life? It could well be that we are surrounded by dead civilizations, peoples yet to be, or a mix of both.

That's where the Fermi Paradox comes in - where is the Great Filter?

Most likely a mixture of both I would say, but yeah this is a much tougher question and area to discuss than just statistically guessing if there is life at all. 

[Lucid Dream]

Are astronomers really thinking about using these planets for colonisation? It just seems far too risky, and terraformation could potentially take far too to be worth it. 

Astronomers are looking into ways to get valuable materials from space, and this really seems to hit the jackpot. Unless we can move into them relatively soon or something, I don't see why officials wouldn't want to just mine the planets to destruction. That really seems to be the more realistic action, especcially considering the circumstances Earth will be in by the time we can send spaceships that far. 

Hopefully, they'll leave the most potent, Earth-like planet alone so that people can colonise it someday. Even then, it would take a ridiculously long time to actually reach the planets safely. It'd take a long time for the ship to accelerate up safely to a decent speed (let's say, half the speed of light, although tall overweight/obese people wouldn't be allowed on the ship anymore) and then we'd have to somehow ensure the ship maintains safety throughout the trip, which would be ridiculously hard considering how goddamn fast you're going and how much space debri is out there. Even a small rock could puncture the ship. 

And then you'd have to have at least 1 generation of people living most of their lives on a ship minimum. Unless we cryofreeze, which has it's own problems. It could make for a pretty cool sci-fi novel to write about civilisation on a ship going towards a new planet. 

[Patticus]

38 minutes ago, Lucid Dream said:

Are astronomers really thinking about using these planets for colonisation? It just seems far too risky, and terraformation could potentially take far too to be worth it.  

Extra-solar colonization is still many centuries away, and terraforming is still all theory (and an extremely long-term project at that), so no, the colony talk is all speculative right now. However, it isn't at all implausible to suggest that future centuries' extra-solar exploratory missions will target the best hopes for feasibly Earth-like worlds first, and this system may well be among them.

Astronomers in our time, meanwhile, will be using spectroscopy over the coming decade to determine the individual worlds' atmospheric makeups, in order to determine whether they may harbor life as we know it or not, or if they even have atmospheres at all. That's their priority now, the results of which might dictate whether or not the robotic and post-Human explorers of the next millennium eventually travel out there.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

1 hour ago, Patticus said:

When you terraform, you're doing it on a planetary scale, as you're altering the whole atmosphere of the world. The process will probably take several thousand years to complete, so it would be a long-term species survival thing. Send fleets of machines out there first in fast craft to get started, send colonizing fleets out in slower, more mankind-friendly ships that'll arrive after the bulk of the process is complete, to begin the process of actual colonization.

I know that much. That still doesn't answer the question of how much we need to terraform such worlds, given that if it's already earth-like then much of what we would need is already there. It doesn't stop at just atmosphere, but also the biology of the fauna being compatibility to ours and a matter of whether it can sustain us in the off chance there's life there--otherwise, what we'd risk doing is wiping out the life there to make room for our standard of living. I mean, sure we'd be able to breathe the air, but could we survive off the plants and animals that might be there? Could the plants and animals we bring thrive there as well? And how would they affect this new world when they come in contact? How much of  would we have to changes to fit in to the world, or how much are we willing to wipe away to make room for ourselves?

Might not be as much of a dilemma as I make it out to be, but It's a lot more to think about than people put into it. 

Quote

Even Mars, with its light gravity, will produce Humans with lighter bone structures who will be unable to survive on the Earth, unless some means can be found to artificially sustain a planetary magnetic field around Mars, capable of permitting full atmospheric terraforming without that atmosphere then blowing away in the solar winds. Assuming a higher atmospheric pressure is even viable as a means of counterbalancing weak gravity...

Gravity is more a matter of mass than anything tho, so I'm not sure a higher atmospheric pressure would solve that. You'd probably have a better chance bombing it with enough asteroids to make it big enough to increase it's mass and therefore it's gravity--not that doing so would be a good idea, but that's speculation I guess.

[Âmesang]

Is it bad that it makes me think back to Man of Steel and wondering why the Kryptonians couldn't terraform Venus? Besides the fact that there'd be no conflict, I recall reading several proposed methods such as (and correct me if I'm wrong, please) bombarding Venus with comets to both jump-start its rotation speed (strengthening its magnetic field) as well as "cleansing" its atmosphere—pumping it full of oxygen in an attempt to balance out the carbon and methane levels and alleviate the atmospheric pressure, in turn cooling the atmosphere and surface as well. Further cooling would require redirecting or otherwise storing the abundant amounts of solar energy its constantly being struck by.

There was a lot more to it, but it was all well within the realm of (eventual) possibility; but, no, the Kryptonians apparently weren't capable of doing that with their advanced technology… but they were able to increase the Earth's mass using SCIENCE!! beams. Because comic books.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Most alien invasion stories in general are actually pretty stupid in the whole "kill all humans and take their planet/resources" department. They're generally made for making a message and showing what it would be like to be on the receiving end of something terrible, but as far as the realism of such motives in their invasion? Not so much.

Only reason they would make sense is if said invaders don't want any potential future competition and are invading so make sure we don't have any chance for that, but most motives in fiction are just dumb when you really look at them beyond their "what if" factor.

For instance, aliens want metals, water, something basic like carbon? You know how much of that they can get for free with no trouble whatsoever if they just mined an asteroid or got water from the rings of the Gas Giants? Stuff's worth millions (some even trillions) of dough if we humans could mine those asteroid, but some ultra-advance alien civilization with the technology to travel to other stars passes that up to mine Earth and waste even more resources because they got into a fight with the natives on the surface? That's some dumb shit.

Want a new planet? Why not find one that you can terraform without having to answer to any lifeforms that might retaliate? Funny enough, invasion stories like War of the Worlds (barring it's message of imperialism being horrific at worst) punishes the aliens for being stupid, so that's something that set it apart.