How to make the main game last longer?

[Old dead account]

I also believe that they could have made much more levels had they not spent so much time on those 90 missions (which were admittedly much better than missions of the past) that contained nothing but blocky platforming and some with tedious tasks (vector's note!) and instead focused on actual act 3-4-5-etc. that has actual terrain.

[PerfectChaos]

<p>

Is there any proof that Generations took 4 years like people are saying? I don't believe that. At all. 2 years maximum.

Edited July 28, 2012 by PerfectChaos

[The future]

More levels is what I say.

But Sonic Team needs to add more vaired levels with tons of secrets and over a dozen powerups to keep the gameplay fresh.

[Chaos Warp]

As much as I like Modern Sonic Gameplay, I'm gonna have to echo what Dio and Silent said and say slow the game down a bit. They are forced to make humongous stages that end up being ran through in like 3 minutes.

[Nepenthe]

The length of time it takes for the average player to beat a modern stage naturally ramps up as you go along: Skyscraper Scamper, Jungle Joyride, Crisis City, and Planet Wisp being a few examples. But the kicker is that most levels in Sonic games are actually this short anyway, ranging from three to eight minutes in length for the average player depending upon where the level sits in the game. Of course you have your outliers like Final Fortress, Eggmanland, and perhaps a few from ShtH, ironically enough these having been lambasted for being too long, but in general the actual stage length of modern games doesn't feel significantly hampered when compared to other entries in the series. The only things that have actually lengthened these titles beforehand in a gameplay context are game overs, alternate gameplay styles, other characters, hubs, and fully mandatory mission systems. So unless you're willing to add one or more of these things, or either increase the level count or design more levels to be Jungle Joyride's length, it doesn't mean that slowing Sonic down will directly correlate with increased length. Sonic gameplay on its own is simply not suited to an eight hour or longer campaign either by its inherent qualities or because Sonic Team just doesn't design the Sonic-only games with that kind of length in mind.

[Diogenes]

Well, at the most basic level, say a modern level takes 3 minutes with boosting, and 6 minutes without. Remove boosting, and the level is longer, yeah? And even if 6 minutes is too long for one level, you can split it into two 3 minute levels. Now, granted, I wouldn't want to play a modern level without boosting, since it's not designed for that; too many long paths made for holding boost and watching the world go by. But you can compress it a bit, make the level design a bit denser, and while you'd lose some time I think you'd still make some gains.

[Indigo Rush]

I think Colors had a nice way of limiting the boost usage by making it a little less usable and harder to refill. Rather than using rings, you needed White Wisps, and more often than not, you found yourself actually platforming (in 2D, but I digress) more than running in that game.

Just keep doing that. It makes the boost more exclusive, the refill items more precious, and the pacing a little less woahspeedloool.

[Diogenes]

Ooooor they could ditch the boost in favor of a far more interesting mechanic.

Y'know

just a thought

[Indigo Rush]

Ooooor they could ditch the boost in favor of a far more interesting mechanic.

Y'know

just a thought

I could go either way, honestly. As long as I can have fun with it.

[WarioBone]

MORE LEVELS

I feel like this discussion is far less complicated than we're making it. I mean, if you want a game to be longer, JUST HAVE MORE STUFF TO DO. It's like, basic problem-solving here.

So, why doesn't Sonic Team make their games long anymore?

Edited July 29, 2012 by HyperMetalWario

[Nix]

MORE LEVELS

I feel like this discussion is far less complicated than we're making it. I mean, if you want a game to be longer, JUST HAVE MORE STUFF TO DO. It's like, basic problem-solving here.

So, why doesn't Sonic Team make their games long anymore?

This isn't as simple as you're making it out to be and has already been addressed in this topic, there are a lot more things to consider like time, budget, and space limitations. I assume Sonic Team probably doesn't have much leeway with their time or budget in particular considering SEGA's current financial situation they dug themselves into and Sonic being one of their larger(est?) sources of income (then again, I don't really know much about business, so don't take my word for it).

Edited July 29, 2012 by Pinkamina

[WarioBone]

This isn't as simple as you're making it out to be and has already been addressed in this topic, there are a lot more things to consider like time, budget, and space limitations. I assume Sonic Team probably doesn't have much leeway with their time or budget considering SEGA's current financial situation they dug themselves into and Sonic being one of their larger(est?) sources of income (then again, I don't really know shit about business, so don't take my word for it).

:V So, essentially...it costs less to make shitty, annoying side missions?

But in turn, less people like the game and it makes less money?

Seems legit.

[Sonictrainer]

Give us a good reward for S ranking everything, besides bragging rights.

No hub levels! They work in some computer games, but good god not in Sonic. They were irritating in the Adventure Series, and fucking stupid in Sonic 2006 (why would you need to talk to people) and Unleashed. The games should progress from zone to zone. It's a tried and tested successful technique, end of.

I think that if they do it like Sonic Generations and just have one big hub that expands and changes as you clear levels and missions, it would be fine.

Edited July 29, 2012 by Son1ctrainer

[Phos]

Maybe they could make some kind of procedural hallway and rail building software, in the vein of speedTree, they could call it speedHall.

<p>http://Sonic.wikia.c...nic_Generations

First off, I should have stopped reading as soon as I saw sonic.wikia, but let's assume for a second that have some clou-hahaha, I can't say it with a straight face.

OK, poker face.

The PS3/360/PC version of the game was in development since Sonic Unleashed, four years prior.

Sonic Generations: November 2011

Sonic Unleashed: November 2008

That's three years. How to math?

edit:

Give us a good reward for S ranking everything, besides bragging rights.

I think that if they do it like Sonic Generations and just have one big hub that expands and changes as you clear levels and missions, it would be fine.

No, you see, that's not making the main game longer, that's just putting a carrot on a stick to get the player to go through it more times.

And Sonic Generations's hub was such a waste of time, they might as well have you just walking around a menu. Just a white blank space that they can't seem to decide what to call with level entrances in it, then they also set almost all the cut scenes there for some reason.

Edited July 29, 2012 by Phos

[LATER BUDDY]

I don't think it's too hard of a fix honestly.

I mean just bring back rewards and a challenge to S ranking everything, and something worth while at that. I mean if I'm awarded a new stage after doing all that, you know, final "thanks, here's one last new level to bask in for spending so much time working for it," then I feel like the work is worth it. Sprinkle more collectables in levels to encourage exploration again like Unleashed and you got some filler within the filler.

Seriously, after hearing back then that in SA2:B, you could unlock Green Hill Zone to play in 3D blew my mind like crazy, so I worked hard to get all those emblems and S ranks. The level was a little lack luster, but when you first got to boot up that stage for the first time, it had one crazy feel of excitement, at least for me.

Longevity in recent Sonic games have been an issue for me, and I think this would do the trick, on my end. I want something to motivate me to 100% the game, something with an edge of challenge, and a great reward for doing so. No shortcuts, no hand holding; give me something I can spend the next month and a half on perfecting. You can add in as many levels as your heart desires, but if your just running the motions over and over again, it's hard to find the motivation to replay it all the time in this day in age.

This is all my feelings with game playing though, just a personal wish.

[WarioBone]

Making a Sonic sandbox would pretty much instantly make it longer. Sandbox games have INSANE replay value (see: the good Spider-Man games, Just Cause 2) and are generally fun as hell. Imagine being able to explore the entirety of one of your standard classic Sonic islands (South, Westside, Angel) in 3D, moving from area to area to engage in missions (similar to what Amazing Spider-Man with missions) that are essentially your standard Sonic zones.

So say, the giant world map would be made up of six different zones, each with their own designs and music, and etc: a standard tropical jungle area to start off in, a fiery, volcanic area, an icy area, a carnival/casino-type area, a mountainous area, and then Eggman's base. Each area has collectables, enemies, missions, and cool easter eggs/secrets to find.

The world would fit really well with The Cheese's Web Rush-type Homing Action/Attack, along with fascilitating Tails and Knuckles gameplay easily.

[Kuzu]

You could give the players more to do than just rushing through a stage as fast as possible, just a possibility.

[WarioBone]

You could give the players more to do than just rushing through a stage as fast as possible, just a possibility.

Impossible.

[-Big The Cat-]

Long games are boring.

And I find the shorter games in the series generally more fun.

[OlenJimi]

There is no need to make them longer.

[LATER BUDDY]

It's probably been mentioned, but alternate yet optional playable characters would sorta fake some "longer game play" really. I mean make them entirely optional with maybe the exception of S ranks and stuff for final rewards and stuffs. That way it gives players who want more play through with a slight breath of fresh air an option, while not making people who want a strict Sonic gameplay play as different characters. The only issue would be the time spent to perfect these other characters, but if they're going to be as formulaic now with the "Unleashed" style gameplay, might as well start now with making standards for other characters.

Honestly if this went down and some of the alternate characters weren't up to snuff, I'm pretty sure most sensible reviewers would be along the lines of "well it's a shame Tails doesn't handle as well as Sonic, but it's an entirely optional experience." Unlike say, "the werehog was atrocious and I just wanted to get back to playing as regular Sonic" for a non-optional...option XD.

Like I said before, it's seriously not hard to make Sonic games have a little more hang time I think. It just all matters in how much extra "umph" they want to put into building it. Reward systems drive the player, not "well uh, there's some red rings out there to collect if you want, but they don't do anything lawl."

[TheOcelot]

Long games are boring.

And I find the shorter games in the series generally more fun.

The gameplay and replayability is what matters.

Take Sonic CD fior example. If your looking for a quick threal then just run through the levels and complete the game and get the bad ending (how sad). Doesn't take long, less than an hour?

If you want longer gameplay, with replayability and speed all in inclusive then play the game properly, time travel and get the good ending. This way you get plenty of hours of satisfaction and value of money and it's FUN.

Edited July 29, 2012 by MilesKnightwing

[Stritix]

For a £40 game, I expect more than just 2 hours of playtime. They certainly need to be longer. If you want a short game, head to XBLA/PSN.

Edited July 29, 2012 by -L-

[PerfectChaos]

I think multiple endings actually has a bit of potential. Maybe if there's a branching path in the story, e.g. after Zone 3, Zones 4,5 and 6 are different depending on which of the two paths you took.

Also, if you could play as the villain or some other character for their story perspective, allowing you to see new cutscenes that explain stuff you previously didn't understand. I'd DEFINITELY replay the game for that.

[JezMM]

Just to say, there's a lot of solutions being posted that talk about replay value and 100%ing, but I'm pretty sure the topic is asking what we can do to literally lengthen the time between "New Game" and the credits without resorting to previously criticised filler content.