Sonic Unleashed: Discussion about Sonic the Werehog

[azoo]

Pff, barely. You can add "linear" and "shallow" to the list, too.

You jumped from platform to platform, onto enemies, up layers of ground that elevated and occasionally escalated. That's platforming for you. You can't really deny it, either. Put it in perspective: "linear" games can still be fun in their own right and thus the idea of a linear game being fun or not is subjective. Same goes for calling it "shallow", since although it may have not done it in the same ways you expected the game to, it still had many places where it variated beyond boosting forward.

[Kuzu]

I like to see the Werehog as a good idea gone wrong; The concept itself was cool, giving Sonic a new form and a different moveset to interact with his environment differently than he normally does, but like every good idea Sega has, they turned it into the most monotonous shit ever.

I also think it was kind of wasted plot potential as well, I mean it starts off thinking Sonic has to hide his form from the public to prevent people from catching on, maybe his friends would be stuck trying to find out what happened to him, and Sonic would have to fight for his identity with this beast, but no that plotline was dropped and the only plot point about it we got was "You're too strong to lose yourself" I get Sonic has strong willpower, but it felt like real cop out to an otherwise good plot thread. It's sad too because the game starts off building this up before dropping it completely until the endgame.

[Diogenes]

You jumped from platform to platform, onto enemies, up layers of ground that elevated and occasionally escalated. That's platforming for you. You can't really deny it, either. Put it in perspective: "linear" games can still be fun in their own right and thus the idea of a linear game being fun or not is subjective. Same goes for calling it "shallow", since although it may have not done it in the same ways you expected the game to, it still had many places where it variated beyond boosting forward.

So basically you're only allowing for positive comments. Because as long as the game has some small scrap of platforming, it's a platformer. As long as it involves doing more than one thing, it isn't shallow.

You aren't even arguing that the game isn't linear, you're discounting it because I framed it negatively and you're arguing that people can find it fun, which unless I'm mistaken is the kind of subjective reasoning you were supposed to be arguing against using.

This is some weaselly bullshit, man.

[Kuzu]

This is going to devolve into another "Unleashed sucks" debate again isn't it.

[Soniman]

This is going to devolve into another "boost sucks" debate again isn't it.

Fixed that. Because a lot of people here have massivev love for Unleashed.

[Wraith]

Funny, guys. We we're having a legit discussion about the WEREHOG a second ago. Diogenes didn't even have to bring the boost bullshit up.

[azoo]

The comment about others being able to find linear gameplay fun was just as a statement to show that really, that type of thing is subjective to speak of. Regardless, the game did have platforming.

Also, people can't have negative opinions? Psch, nah, I never said that nor implied it. I just know this same tired argument comes up all the time by the same people, including statements rolling in not long afterward about how the gameplay is "fundamentally broken" whenever it's not. And I mean, it's like you can't even be positive about the game without it turning into that, like people have to be constantly 'reminded' of it or something.

And with that, I'm out. Gotta finish mah college work. *pschoooooooooooooo*

Edited August 20, 2012 by Azukara

[Diogenes]

Funny, guys. We we're having a legit discussion about the WEREHOG a second ago. Diogenes didn't even have to bring the boost bullshit up.

We didn't need a post talking about the things that Unleashed did right that specifically excludes the werehog either, but no one's going to say a word against that.

The comment about others being able to find linear gameplay fun was just as a statement to show that really, that type of thing is subjective to speak of.

Great, but that shouldn't matter, since you yourself said (unless I'm horribly misinterpreting this) that we should be looking at what the game objectively does/is rather than whether or not we find it fun. I say the game is linear, objectively; whether or not people enjoy it (either because or in spite of that) should not have any bearing on it being on your list of Things Unleashed Objectively Does/Is.

Regardless, the game did have platforming.

Plenty of games have platforming sections without being classified as platformers.

That all said I'm not really interested in either the Unleashed argument or the "what is appropriate to post" argument right now so unless someone says something particularly stupid I probably won't bother posting about it again.

[Chaos Warp]

The comment about others being able to find linear gameplay fun was just as a statement to show that really, that type of thing is subjective to speak of. Regardless, the game did have platforming.

Also, people can't have negative opinions? Psch, nah, I never said that nor implied it. I just know this same tired argument comes up all the time by the same people, including statements rolling in not long afterward about how the gameplay is "fundamentally broken" whenever it's not. And I mean, it's like you can't even be positive about the game without it turning into that, like people have to be constantly 'reminded' of it or something.

And with that, I'm out. Gotta finish mah college work. *pschoooooooooooooo*

I see what you did there Azu.....

Anyway, Unleashed. Great game, but weakest of the Modern 3 in my opinion. Yeah, it has great atmosphere, a good plot, great art style and human designs, and a lot of life in the game world. I like that about it and won't deny that. But it's held back by the fun but un-sonic-y Werehog, the medal collecting and the fun but linear and platforming-lacking level design of the Day Stages. Don't get me wrong, I still have quite a bit of fun with this game. But IMO the flaws it has makes it the weakest out of all the Modern games (so far).

[Eternal EX]

I see what you did there Azu.....

Anyway, Unleashed. Great game, but weakest of the Modern 3 in my opinion.

Seriously? I consider it the strongest of the 3 modern games, putting Colours at the bottom.

[Chaos Warp]

Seriously? I consider it the strongest of the 3 modern games, putting Colours at the bottom.

Yes seriously. It has enough gameplay flaws to hold it back from being higher then the weakest. Colours and Gens don't have the world-building that Unleashed did, but way less gameplay flaws.

[KHCast]

Isn't this a DISCUSSION ABOUT THE WEREHOG? Not the actual game? Just wondering.

Seriously? I consider it the strongest of the 3 modern games, putting Colours at the bottom.

Opinions. Magical things aren't they.(I personally think that Generations is first then Unleashed and then colors.)

Back on topic, I think the best thing about the werehog is Sonic and Chips relationship. Seriously, You can tell one way or another that they are really good pals that joke together and stuff.

[Soniman]

You people and your placement of Colors at the bottom.

PHOOEY.

Anyway, back to the Werehog.

[SenEDDtor Missile]

You people and your placement of Colors at the bottom.

PHOOEY.

Anyway, back to the Werehog.

He is a hog who Weres wacky inflatable tube things.

Edited August 20, 2012 by Enigmatus

[#AR]

I loved the werehog sections.

Yeah, I know he's slow, yeah I know the stages can be unnecessarily lengthy.

That was fine with me since I love beat-em-up games. Hell, I even get some enjoyment out of the Dynasty Warriors games every now and then. Actually, the night stages were the parts of the game that I had the least problems with. I loved the different combos that you could pull off, some of them looking really stylish.

And I really love how you could grab enemies and be all like:

Yeah...

and...DAT MUSIC. Especially Skyscraper Scamper. <3

The battle music, it's a good piece of music, but I wish that it wouldn't PLAY IT ALL THE DAMN TIME AND INTERRUPT THE AWESOME STAGE MUSIC.

I'm going to be completely honest, I enjoyed the Night stages more than I did the Day stages.

Yes I'm serious.

PleasePleasePleasePleasePleasePlease don't kill me...

[Solkia]

Werehog music was so unfitting that it's not even funny.

Gameplay is too easy. Just spam Shory-hog-ken (fucking hate that name) and you're guaranteed to win.

However for what it's worth, the platforming is really good for the most part. This is ignoring Cool Edge and FUCKING EMPIRE CITY AND ALL THE SPIKED TIGHTROPE SECTIONS OVER BOTTOMLESS PITS FUCK YOU SONIC TEAM.

[Vertekins]

Something I found quite interesting about Werehog form is that Dark Gaia's spawn exhibit the same properties as his body, having an elastic quality to their limbs and being able to extend them by stretching. This is best shown by Nightmares, Deep Nightmares, Big Mothers and the Dark Guardian boss of Shamar, who all attack with stretchy arms.

It's such a cool aspect that also makes these enemies additionally threatening. Who hasn't been on the receiving end of a Big Mother's attack in which she spins on the spot and clouts Sonic with her stretchy arms as she does so? Sonic isn't the only one with whimsical-looking attacks XD And it's just plain cool that there's a common factor in the form of that elastic body quality shared between anything that is affiliated with Dark Gaia in particular.

[Wraith]

Speaking of cool edge, that place had badass music. Only night music that really stuck in my head.

[Nepenthe]

Indeed; in keeping with Unleashed's tone there was a lot of deliberate silliness with the Werehog's design and characterization, which is the main reason I could never be hard-pressed to hate it. The ridiculous Bluto-like design and all that fur, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LtsGOCYgGQ, the actual short film (best Sonic animation btw), his jazzy themes, and the comedic disconnect between him and unsuspected people in the story; Really, playing the idea off for laughs was one of the best decisions they could've made in designing it. Imagine if they played it straight as with nearly everything in the game before.

[Solkia]

Speaking of cool edge, that place had badass music. Only night music that really stuck in my head.

This didn't stick in your head? 8C

[KHCast]

Werehog music was so unfitting that it's not even funny.

Gameplay is too easy. Just spam Shory-hog-ken (fucking hate that name) and you're guaranteed to win.

However for what it's worth, the platforming is really good for the most part. This is ignoring Cool Edge and FUCKING EMPIRE CITY AND ALL THE SPIKED TIGHTROPE SECTIONS OVER BOTTOMLESS PITS FUCK YOU SONIC TEAM.

Wait you think the Nighttime music is unfitting?

[Soniman]

Oh yeah, I'm surprised no one mentioned Night of the Werehog. Fantastic piece of charming animation. Really sold me the Werehog as a whole.

[Wraith]

I meant that it was the only night track that stuck in my head.

Everything else was drowned out by the fucking battle music.

[Solkia]

Wait you think the Nighttime music is unfitting?

I guess "bland crap that left no impression whatsoever" is a better description.

[Soniman]

Im surprised no one used that function called sound test or YouTube to listen to the Unleashed Night tracks.