Slowing Sonic Down

[Kuzu]

The challenge missions in Generations are more or less just small minigames rather than full on levels, and I have to get medals to play Unleashed's extra acts, and I've done enough of that shit.

[Old dead account]

That's another thing. I don't understand why they don't simply make full out Act 2-3-X instead of those disposable missions you may only play a few times. They clearly spent a majority of development time making those 90 fucking missions when they could have just made more full out acts and with all the time they had...

[Kuzu]

Yeah, I don't understand that. They took the time to make full additional levels in Unleashed, yet in Colors/Generations they just lazy, what the eff.

[Chaos Warp]

This can be rectified if they gave you more to do in the levels beyond "Go Fast". I've only played Unleashed/Colors/Generations only one time, and have never turned back, yes I had fun with it, but when I played it, I felt like I was just doing the same thing over and over, and the game wouldn't let me try anything else.

What about all that platforming, both 2d and 3d in almost all the Modern levels? IMO they aren't just about going fast anymore. That was Unleashed.

[Nepenthe]

There was platforming in Unleashed too yanno, but fuck it, whatever, who gives a shit.

If anything though, I would like a lot more gimmicky side activities to do in the game. I want to go back to Twinkle Park and be able to ride the intergalactic go-karts, goddammit. Things like this also give replay value.

[Chaos Warp]

There was platforming in Unleashed too yanno, but fuck it, whatever, who gives a shit.

In the night stages, which did not fit in a Sonic game at all. There was a few spots of platforming in the day stages, just very little.

[Kuzu]

What about all that platforming, both 2d and 3d in almost all the Modern levels? IMO they aren't just about going fast anymore. That was Unleashed.

Kinda wish they did more than just stick square blocks above a bottomless pit, but whatever.

[Old dead account]

Aside from that, the slippery controls made the little platforming there was in the day stages a pain in the ass. How big was a night stage compared to a day stage anyways?

[Chaos Warp]

Kinda wish they did more than just stick square blocks above a bottomless pit, but whatever.

There wasn't that many bottomless pits in Generations Modern. Sky Sanc. doesn't count because it's in the sky and it makes sense for the thing to be above a bottomless pit.

[Someguy]

That's another thing. I don't understand why they don't simply make full out Act 2-3-X instead of those disposable missions you may only play a few times. They clearly spent a majority of development time making those 90 fucking missions when they could have just made more full out acts and with all the time they had...

Most of the missions wouldn't require too much to make, they often share assets between each other, most of them reuse the the actual level models and use objects to expand upon it. It's easier to take a chunk of existing level location and make one or two obstacles that might pop up in other missions rather than make a full out act with new level models, right? Especially since the art teams are much less required for some(any that need a new gimmick )and not at all for others that reuse old ones in new ways or ones from other missions.

I don't think it's a case of "get rid of all the missions and bonus art and you magically gain 3 acts and 2 zones worth of dev time" at least for Generations.

[Multikaris]

I'd be totally ok with them cutting down the amount of section where literally all you do is run forward while boosting for about 10 seconds. Those parts must be like what, at least 5 miles long going at Sonic's speed? Sounds like a lot of work for a quick thrill that lasts for the first few times you play maybe. Generations and Colors weren't nearly as bad about this as Unleashed was, but still.

Agreed. Sonic 4 is even worse in this regard, but Sonic 4 is complete shit as a whole anyway, so ignore that.

There was platforming in Unleashed too yanno, but fuck it, whatever, who gives a shit.

If anything though, I would like a lot more gimmicky side activities to do in the game. I want to go back to Twinkle Park and be able to ride the intergalactic go-karts, goddammit. Things like this also give replay value.

Agree. Especially Chao Gardens. Here's some ideas for gimmicky side activities:

1) Chao Garden

2) Chao Karate

3) Chao Race

4) Chao Soccer

5) Chao Basketball

6) Twinkle Circuit

7) Fishing Pond (like Big's gameplay, but use a Wiimote and not a normal controller)

8) Stock Market (i.e. Neopets stock market)

9) Art Gallery

10) Alternate Music

11) Pinball tables

12) Sky Chase

13) An arcade were you can access old Sega games

Kinda wish they did more than just stick square blocks above a bottomless pit, but whatever.

Agreed.

[Diogenes]

Agree. Especially Chao Gardens. Here's some ideas for gimmicky side activities:

Eugh. I'd rather they just make a Sonic game, really...

[thatguyfrom03]

Creative and engaging level design is all you need.

Note that the original mod was built around Sonic with a completely nerfed boost. Putting in Generations Sonic with his lengthy boost did very little to break the flow of the level. The level is fun and engaging regardless of whether Sonic can boost or not.

What this means is that the level design itself should dictate whether a stage feels like Speed Highway Act 2 or "At Dawn" from the original SA.

[Kuzu]

There wasn't that many bottomless pits in Generations Modern. Sky Sanc. doesn't count because it's in the sky and it makes sense for the thing to be above a bottomless pit.

That still leaves the problem of square blocks.

[Diogenes]

Note that the original mod was built around Sonic with a completely nerfed boost. Putting in Generations Sonic with his lengthy boost did very little to break the flow of the level. The level is fun and engaging regardless of whether Sonic can boost or not.

While I think Dude's Emerald Coast is the best Generations level hack I've seen, it works well with the original boosting because there's still a lot of big empty areas with basically nothing to do but run forward.

[Person]

I'm completely fine with slowing Sonic down just a bit, as long as we keep the Act 2 level design style from Sonic Generations. Many paths, lots of platforming, etc.

[Chaos Warp]

That still leaves the problem of square blocks.

Okay well you got me there. At least it's well designed square blocks balanced really well with speed.

[Diogenes]

At least it's well designed square blocks

where

[Chaos Warp]

where

The well designed 3d platforming sections in these 2 levels?

And these are just the 2 examples I personally thought were best. This kind of design is pretty much spread through all the Modern levels.

Edited October 5, 2012 by Zero

[Diogenes]

Can you be more specific?

[Chaos Warp]

Can you be more specific?

Well, in terms of Seaside Hill, pretty much every 3d section features tons of platforming with boost hallways lightly sprinkled in between. The same goes for Sky Sanctuary, and that stage adds the cool spinning wheel gimmick from the original stage in 3d.

[JezMM]

The challenge missions in Generations are more or less just small minigames rather than full on levels,

Not all of them. A good 50% are essentially just platforming goodness.

and I have to get medals to play Unleashed's extra acts, and I've done enough of that shit.

No you don't. No more than you need to unlock Jungle Joyride Day anyway. If you've finished the game, all extra acts are unlocked by that point.

[Phos]

Well, in terms of Seaside Hill, pretty much every 3d section features tons of platforming with boost hallways lightly sprinkled in between.

[RK64]

Well, slowing down Sonic will do nothing to better the games, only hinder. If Sega slows sonic down and contiues to use the modern gameplay, it would just not be fun to play. The better question is how to ultize Sonics speed better. Instead of just boosting on a dime, how about the boost having a cool-down machanic or only useable when sonic's as full running speed. Mybe bring back classic macahnics such as rolling and momentum based pyshics in to play. That is the question we should be asking. Sonic IS speed, so slowing him down would be counter-intuitive.

[kalion]

I feel Sonic Colours handle the boost mechanic and the 3D platforming better. (Yes you read that right)

Whenever the sparse 3D platforming section showed it easily let sonic keep his flow of speed while platforming whereas the sudden clunky stop and platforming sections in Generations. (Best example is the waterfall section in Aquarium Park)

And the boost you get is limited and overpowered and it seem to add to the gameplay rather than careen along at impossible speeds where it's hard to stop.

Edited October 5, 2012 by kalion