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Dragon Ball (Warning: Untagged Spoilers)

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9 hours ago, Sapphirine Wind said:
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I knew that the special was made by Toriyama, but he mainly struck me "his canonocity is on thin ice" for the longest time. Also saw a loooot of people say "he wasn't mentioned in Super, so he's non-canon", so it's nice to see that the guy has been "finalized" in a major film canon to the franchise.

I'm also with you there with the alterations thing, but I guess if he turns up, they might wanna make him more "fighty" to endear him to the fanbase. In terms of "like Cabba" he is, Cabba's more willing to fight for the sake of others. His job is defending Sadala if not other planets.

Tarble's peaceful. he just doesn't seem as hero oriented unless it's affecting him/his new home planet. He was never there for Vegeta to train, just to be a vehicle for the villains to show up. Vegeta training him up would actually make for a good few episodes or so. Maybe he could deal with his confidence in himself as a result of being effectively disowned by his father. But that's speculation; other than that there's not a lot of going further with him, unless they give him the motivation to get stronger.

I get that. It's probably not going to show up in the anime, since it's a bit too fanservicey as Xenoverse. Thinking about it now, they're probably a smidge canon; Toriyama did work on DBO in terms of history and design.

 

Spoiler

BoG and RF are canon either way, you can just simply take the movie version or the show version as your preferred version as Super's version is simply expanded adaptions more than anything. Tarble getting a mention in BoG is about as canon as Ginyu coming back only to get murdered in RF in Super. 

 

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7 minutes ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:
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BoG and RF are canon either way, you can just simply take the movie version or the show version as your preferred version as Super's version is simply expanded adaptions more than anything. Tarble getting a mention in BoG is about as canon as Ginyu coming back only to get murdered in RF in Super.  

Spoiler

You're right. I was a bit caught up in "the anime basically wrote over the movies so they're not canon anymore, the anime adaptations are" thing someone tried, and it's probably not even a thing to get stuck on when the movies could be played over the adaptations with not that much being different consequentially. Even if he wasn't mentioned in the anime, Toriyama still had a lot of influence over that movie. It's not likely someone snuck him in then.

Now I hope there is no anime adaptation of Broly so the whole song and dance doesn't have a chance to start all over.... and we can get right to the good stuff instead of retreading.

Wow, people treat Dragon Ball canon kinda weird.

 

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1 hour ago, Tornado said:

I didn't know this Broly was canon. I mean, Broly still sucks, but I was on the fence about going to see the movie.

He's actually a much better character in this movie I've heard by virtue of...well...actually being a character now. 

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3 hours ago, Tornado said:

I didn't know this Broly was canon. I mean, Broly still sucks, but I was on the fence about going to see the movie.

I went to see the movie Wednesday and marathoned the three old movies on Monday as a warm up. This is very different character from the old Broly. They may follow similar character beats, but the new Broly's reasons for acting the way he does, what he wants out of his life, etc. are not only different from the previous version, but in many ways are even the opposite. While I admit I didn't hate the original character (the original Broly film was my second favorite DB film after Battle of Gods, and I actually like Second Coming to a decent extent), there's no question this is the superior version of the character in pretty much every facet. Better design, better arc, better relationships with other characters, better potential, pretty much better across the board.

Don't get me wrong, the reason you should see the movie is that is looks absolutely gorgeous from start to finish (ymmv regarding the CGI parts, they didn't hurt it for me), but Broly's character is definitely one of the strong marks for the film, regardless of the character's history.

I plan on seeing it again some time next week with friends. There's a ton I could go into with regards to this movie, but the short version is I love it a lot. Not as good as Battle of Gods in my opinion, but easily second place.

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Goddamn this was a visual treat. This animation style just flowed everything so well when in motion. When Goku was warming himself up at his crack at Broly I knew something special was gonna go down. This looser, less detailed and not-as rigid art style worked wonders for this film far as fight scenes went. The CGI...yeah it was very noticeable at points but it didn't distract from the action any worse for wear. Also, this is a personal observation since I dropped watching Super after the Future Trunks arc but was aware here and there of what happened after...I actually liked how the transformations were handled here. Stakes were raised each time Broly powered up and the heroes did accordingly and not just like "oh man we gotta power up to beat him". More like...wow It feels...consistent? It was satisfying to actually see that 

 

SSJB Gogeta just curbstomb LSS Broly the way he did after systematically overpowering/one-upping the others in sheer power on par with SSJ Gogeta. Nice to not see any fluff beyond SSJB here, least for me. God Gogeta was just a badass. Also when he went to use the God Kamehameha right before he was gonna be anniliated the pupils in Broly's eyes came back and it was full of fear and helpnessless was also poignant towards how I felt towards Broly the whole movie. Lile damn I kinda felt bad for the guy.

Also yeah Broly's characterization is league's better than the psychopathic meathead he was previously. Wow, he made the guy actually sympathetic didn't know you had it in you Toriyama. 

Apparently the screenplay for this is twice as long as the theatrical release. Maybe the home releases will expand/flesh out the first third of the film on Minus' inclusions.

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I will say, the looser character designs are great, but it makes Takahashi's detailed portraits and more rigid animation stick out like a sore thumb. You can tell the guy just wants to draw those ultra-intense Buu-era Yamamuro designs and doesn't care about the character sheets at all. He's great but I feel like now that the series has actually good animation direction he could tone it down a bit.

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Moro is probably the most intriguing new villain since the Goku Black Mystery. Interesting powers, mysterious which I hope they keep that way for as long as possible, and a similar menace feeling to 1st form Cell before the mystery was yanked right out from under him too soon.

And also for kicks.

NMhUjYp.png

Furry's gonna love dis guy right? All dah rule thirty Moro XD. The new furry lord right? For furs and furettes everywhere 😘

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Like Merus, Moro seems to be constructed entirely from Toyotaro ensuring us that he's going to be cool, what we've seen has been stock-standard for vague "magic" ability.

I honestly have little confidence that his full strength will fight any different from you standard DB villain.

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The "stock-standard" magic Moro has shown has explicitly been pointed out to be magic he just recently recovered after eons. We don't know what Moro has other than his OHK trump card and the magic he's shown at his weakest.

 

He's steadily getting his magic back, and if he got his wish from Porunga, he'd have all it back at once. So there's still a ways for him to go to show off his repertoire. 

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What evil can he do at this point? The only thing he's been very insistent in the past was trying to convince Goku to become the next GoD. And I don't think that'd have any evil intent.

Damn, he even reverted time to help them prevent Freeza from destroying Earth. And that's something too kind for someone potentially evil

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Well I mean I dont see why someone would smile that evil at the sight of gogeta trying or about to kill broly. Yes he wants him to be a God but maybe he esmts him as one so he can erase more things than beerus currently seems to care to do 

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Whis is all but stated to be biologically incapable of doing anything beyond a neutral stance when it comes to physical realm matters. 

 

Whis smiling is probably more to do with him being proven right that Goku and Vegeta can accomplish anything when they work together, an idea that Gogeta proved in spades.

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Seriously this right here. Maybe others see noting but thats not a simple they are winning smile that is i want to see you wipe broly off the earth grin.

evil.JPG

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What I'd also add is that it's likely a smile of satisfaction that Gogeta very likely surpassed Beerus in power, given Broly was hinted to be on Beerus' power scale. His job was to train Goku and Vegeta to surpass Beerus and give him satisfying fights, and eventually birth a new God of Destruction from either of them, likely Vegeta as that was the terms he agreed to when he began training under Whis.

Wouldn't surprise me if this sparks a fight with Gogeta VS Beerus, and cause Beerus to begin training - similar to Frieza. We know that Whis trained him for a time, but he's slacked and got lazy. Now that his power is truly tested, we could see Beerus train himself to be stronger again. 

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My biggest wants:

1. Characters are aged up and get updated looks. Especially Trunks, Goten, and Marin. Vegeta finally getting rid of his dumb armor again would be nice. I'd love for Goku to finally get is End of Z clothes.

2. Shintani's art style

3. Gohan looks like Gohan and not Vegeta.

 

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11 hours ago, Ice Vec said:

Well, I hope it's the episodes about this Moro character and not a retelling of the Broly movie

I personally wouldn't mind a retelling myself just to slow things down a pinch and help the pacing feel more comfortable and less rushed. And honestly, if they were to do a retelling all I'd really want is for them to splice the movie footage with any necessary extra scenes to flesh out certain aspects of the story so everything just flows a little better. At most I wouldn't see a need for more than a grand total of 5 to six episodes in that way. Regardless though at this point I'd rather when it finally comes back that they finally skip past EoZ. They can't really linger in the ten year gap for much longer if they still intend to tie into EoZ without having to practically redo the entire scenario.

7 hours ago, Marcello said:

2. Shintani's art style

3. Gohan looks like Gohan and not Vegeta.

I think point 2 will address point 3, but personally I'd just prefer giving Gohan either his Bojack Unbound haircut or his Resurrection of F haircut. Bojack Unbound haircut cause it just feels nostalgic to me and RoF because I feel it fits his current character and it actually changes if he goes Super Saiyan (unnecessary now to be sure but that's just how I feel regardless, besides, I like Classic Super Saiyan over Mystic and every other form).

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I do not see Hogan as vegeta they look noting alike. But I want to see more of berryblue. She looks pure evil and the fact frieza did not kill her for speaking up shows he respects her more than most

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1 hour ago, Sonic Fan J said:

I personally wouldn't mind a retelling myself just to slow things down a pinch and help the pacing feel more comfortable and less rushed. And honestly, if they were to do a retelling all I'd really want is for them to splice the movie footage with any necessary extra scenes to flesh out certain aspects of the story so everything just flows a little better. At most I wouldn't see a need for more than a grand total of 5 to six episodes in that way. Regardless though at this point I'd rather when it finally comes back that they finally skip past EoZ. They can't really linger in the ten year gap for much longer if they still intend to tie into EoZ without having to practically redo the entire scenario.

I think point 2 will address point 3, but personally I'd just prefer giving Gohan either his Bojack Unbound haircut or his Resurrection of F haircut. Bojack Unbound haircut cause it just feels nostalgic to me and RoF because I feel it fits his current character and it actually changes if he goes Super Saiyan (unnecessary now to be sure but that's just how I feel regardless, besides, I like Classic Super Saiyan over Mystic and every other form).

Yeah:

image.png.f9426d07f169c179a2fa7de1e953b3a2.png

I like the hair here. Maybe a little longer. It's a nice continuation of his Cell Games haircut.

But, I wasn't really talking about the hair. Just the way they drew his face, especially in the ToP.

image.png.ca5032b28ac345a425a7c2738dd91e5b.pngimage.png.e87b3848453baea5031e242ecd5bf1b6.png

 

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