Popular and unpopular Sonic opinions you agree and disagree with!

[Kuzu]

I'm kind of in the middle at this point. I really don't think any writer has made the Freedom Fighters really fit in with the rest of the Sega cast. Either they're written with very little quirks, or they're borderline gag characters depending on the era of the comics.

It's really hard to pin down a solid reason, but I don't think it has anything to do with how rounded or flat they are. Personally speaking, I find them all to be well-rounded individuals, quirks or not. My issue is that they aren't very dynamic. Its like, you hardly if ever see them interact with anyone outside their own circle and their inner circle interactions tend to be generic teamwork in battle rather than their traits bouncing off each other. 

To give an example; In the Champions Arc, Honey beats Tails and the latter remains pretty salty about it for the remainder of the arc; Tails, probably one of the most docile members of the cast, is a sore loser. So then we find out he's down because he just wanted to show off what he could do. Sonic reassures him that he's awesome all the same and that his loss isn't a big deal. See how dynamic that is; Tails reveals a new part about himself and Sonic is there to cheer him, that's that standard brotherly relationship at work. 

That is very rare to see among the Freedom Fighters, at least not to my knowledge; I mean there was that one side story with Antoine and Bunny, but the setup for that was nonsense because it dealt with things they should already be aware of. It just felt inherently false and insincere. A good example though was Slice of Life with Sally and Nicole, now that is what made me warm up to Sally's character; she finds out about the origin of one of her closest companions, and while it throws her for a loop at first, she ultimately decides Nicole is her friend and she will support her in any way regardless of the circumstances. If we can get that among the rest of the Freedom Fighters, then my complaints will be alleviated. Although we did get a small moment between Sonic & Rotor in 276, but it's something. Flynn and the post-reboot are addressing this criticism, so I appreciate that.

Also, I want them to be more dynamic with people outside their circle. Like have Bunnie interact with Knuckles sometime, or maybe GUN needs Rotor's help designing new weapons for Omega, Ant and Silver can bond over their efforts to becoming better heroes. Etc etc.

Edited November 6, 2015 by Kuzu the Boloedge

[E-122-Psi]

This is the key problem I already mentioned, most of the characters they interact with, and even between themselves, you can pinpoint their relationship as little more than 'good friends'. Sonic and Sally is about the only one that had a distinct character based back and forth, and even that got Flanderized and run to the ground.

Maybe this is why Antoine felt slightly stronger a character earlier on. He was a one note bastion of flaws, but that got a unique reaction from other characters, they got irritated or pitying towards him. Nowadays his strongest relationship is making kissy faces at Bunnie.

I think this might be why people think Sally is a 'sue', since it means no one really has anything bad to say or pinpoint about her, when in reality it's just how non distinct a chemistry she has with anyone not called Sonic. Even in Spark of Life, they had to give her the out of character flaw of being reckless to generate a quarrel between her and NICOLE. In early issues she could at least irk someone by being stroppy tempered or pushy, but even then she rarely directed it towards anyone but Sonic, the others couldn't provoke her.

Edited November 6, 2015 by E-122-Psi

[Kuzu]

This is the key problem I already mentioned, most of the characters they interact with, and even between themselves, you can pinpoint their relationship as little more than 'good friends'. Sonic and Sally is about the only one that had a distinct character based back and forth, and even that got Flanderized and run to the ground.

Maybe this is why Antoine felt slightly stronger a character earlier on. He was a one note bastion of flaws, but that got a unique reaction from other characters, they got irritated or pitying towards him. Nowadays his strongest relationship is making kissy faces at Bunnie.

I think this might be why people think Sally is a 'sue', since it means no one really has anything bad to say or pinpoint about her, when in reality it's just how non distinct a chemistry she has with anyone not called Sonic. Even in Spark of Life, they had to give her the out of character flaw of being reckless to generate a quarrel between her and NICOLE. In early issues she could at least irk someone by being stroppy tempered or pushy, but even then she rarely directed it towards anyone but Sonic, the others couldn't provoke her.

Yea, but I also mentioned that some of this has been addressed. Its like, you call out Sally for being given "recklessness" as a consistent flaw, but then ignore the point I made about how her relationship with Nicole was reinforced? So what, it doesn't count? Then you say early Antoine got a "different reaction everytime" but go on to just say the extent of it was "irritated or pitited". So how is that making him any stronger than if he was being competent?

Sometimes it feels like you're cherry picking the bad parts of the Freedom Fighters to justify your criticisms against them, despite clear evidence that there is something there to salvage. If we're just gonna rag on their shortcomings at every given opportunity, what's the point of even criticizing them to begin with, may as well just say "Kill'em all" and be done with it since they're so inferior. :\

[E-122-Psi]

Yea, but I also mentioned that some of this has been addressed. Its like, you call out Sally for being given "recklessness" as a consistent flaw, but then ignore the point I made about how her relationship with Nicole was reinforced? So what, it doesn't count? Then you say early Antoine got a "different reaction everytime" but go on to just say the extent of it was "irritated or pitited". So how is that making him any stronger than if he was being competent?

Sometimes it feels like you're cherry picking the bad parts of the Freedom Fighters to justify your criticisms against them, despite clear evidence that there is something there to salvage. If we're just gonna rag on their shortcomings at every given opportunity, what's the point of even criticizing them to begin with, may as well just say "Kill'em all" and be done with it since they're so inferior. :\

Her relationship with NICOLE was reinforced through that flaw, her calling out that flaw and later realising the hypocrisy of it. It revolved around a trait Sally didn't normally have so wasn't really a bit of chemistry developed around her personality. The rest of the bond to me was just the standard 'NICOLE is a close friend of mine' stuff, the only big thing I noticed about it from others is that she tends to get more exceptionally aggressive about her being harassed than some others, and even then both cases of this she can be excused by 'magic affecting her personality'.

I never said Antoine got a different reaction every time, I said he got A reaction at all. Sure it was a repetitive one trick one, but it was something AT ALL. Again modern Antoine is just another good friend.

I maybe exaggerate the negative but this is just what I see of them 95% of the time. Even the times they do get a bit of personality it doesn't really play an effective vice or pivot, something even light hearted interpretations like Boom can do with ease.

Edited November 6, 2015 by E-122-Psi

[Kuzu]

If you're just gonna downplay and undermine every bit of chemistry that is there, I really don't know what else to say without making this debate circular. I can't tell if either you have some standard of writing that will literally never be met by any writer, or you just have something against the freedom fighters in general. Every time I see a post by you in regards to the two mediums, you excuse things from the main video game series that you criticize in the comic, so it just makes me think you won't be satisfied by anything done with the Freedom Fighters period. 

So *shrug* I said my piece and I'm standing by it. 

Edited November 7, 2015 by Kuzu the Boloedge

[Osmium]

I'm gonna step in here and give an unpopular opinion myself. 

Sonic The Comic's incarnation of Sonic is one of my top favourite versions of Sonic. Yes, I know he may not be the most absolutely likable fellow around, and he seems kinda out of character from what you may think from Sonic at times, but I find him to be quite fascinating. He's honestly one of the most familiar versions of Sonic to me too, since STC is one of the first Sonic things I was exposed to. 

I can understand why some may not like him, though. But realize there is more beneath the surface to him than he's just a dick and that's it. 

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

It's worth keeping in mind that Archie Sonic and Boom operate on different structures regarding their storytelling and narratives. Archie is a much more actionize verse that has a certain  direction, things progressing in a path while having characters react to obstacles and setbacks that come their way towards a clear goal before moving to the next one - and different obstacles and setbacks often get different reactions when they get in their paths.

Boom is much more irregular, a more slice of life story where the mishaps often come to the characters. It doesn't run on the same path as Archie, so what it does isn't easily comparable to Archie Sonic.

This would be like comparing AoSTH to SatAM and complaining that the latter doesn't do what the former while ignoring the circumstances that make them distinct.

[horridus]

I'm gonna step in here and give an unpopular opinion myself. 

Sonic The Comic's incarnation of Sonic is one of my top favourite versions of Sonic. Yes, I know he may not be the most absolutely likable fellow around, and he seems kinda out of character from what you may think from Sonic at times, but I find him to be quite fascinating. He's honestly one of the most familiar versions of Sonic to me too, since STC is one of the first Sonic things I was exposed to. 

I can understand why some may not like him, though. But realize there is more beneath the surface to him than he's just a dick and that's it. 

Unpopular, but it's not exactly an illegitimate viewpoint to have; there's a lot to read into regarding the kind of life he's lead and how that's molded him. The closest thing he's had to a family (that we know of) was turned into a megalomaniacal monster in front of his eyes (which would ultimately be caused by him), and said monster managed to conquer the planet and spread all kinds of misery, and because of that, every bad thing that's ever happened on Mobius is ultimately on him. While we don't have any idea of what  he was like before meeting Kintobor, Word of God basically stated that he didn't have much supervision growing up and is poorly socialized as a result. With all that in mind, his somewhat less than pleasant attitude and at times innapropriate sense of humor does in fact make sense. 

Granted, it would have been nice if we could have seen a bit more stuff IN the comic to establish the factors leading to him being how he is rather than taking the writer's word for it and reading between the lines, and it would have been nice if he could have at least deigned to be a bit nicer to Tails, but like I said, it is in fact a rather fascinating idea and dynamic for Sonic. And hey, at the very least? As much of a little shithead he could be, he was still a do-gooder at his core and cared about the safety of others, even if his attitude could make people think otherwise. 

[Shadowlax]

I'm kind of in the middle at this point. I really don't think any writer has made the Freedom Fighters really fit in with the rest of the Sega cast. Either they're written with very little quirks, or they're borderline gag characters depending on the era of the comics.

 

On this note feel the same, but I feel part of the actually reason is because you seem them regularly more than... actual sega game characters. And its actually way harder to justify these characters, when I came there for sega characters. Every time I see them I go " why isn't shadow and knuckles or blaze or literally anyone else on screen" but then they made knuckles hang out with them, and that was great.

 

When the characters folks wanna see take a back seat to... at this point a bunch of who's who hang out with sonic tails and amy. I can kinda seem them not fitting. Especially when they are nothing, and even  more nothing now that a lot of their back story has sort of vanished. 

 

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Their backstory was more "re-written" than vanished, if you ask me. And much more concise in comparison to before the reboot.

[Bolt]

On this note feel the same, but I feel part of the actually reason is because you seem them regularly more than... actual sega game characters. And its actually way harder to justify these characters, when I came there for sega characters. Every time I see them I go " why isn't shadow and knuckles or blaze or literally anyone else on screen" but then they made knuckles hang out with them, and that was great.

 

When the characters folks wanna see take a back seat to... at this point a bunch of who's who hang out with sonic tails and amy. I can kinda seem them not fitting. Especially when they are nothing, and even  more nothing now that a lot of their back story has sort of vanished. 

Well to be fair, the Freedom Fighters were created in the era of Sonic 2, when the only characters were just Sonic, Tails, and Robotnik/Eggman, so it's not like the writers made them just to shove everyone's favorite game characters out of the way. Knuckles didn't even exist yet.

I have not read a single issue (closely at least) since the reboot, so I can't tell you what they're like now.

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

Opinion: Im not a fan of city stages. Most I see are unorginal and no thought put into it. Especially with Sonic 06 where they took Europe and added bonce pads and make it Sonic-like. 

[Yoko/葉子]

I agree with Sonic 06 not being to expectations, but I think Silver's gameplay was really unique and an innovation, as one who never played that style before. Silver's gameplay was ton of fun. Using your opponents weapons and your environment as a weapon was beautiful.

While the time paradox deal of the game did irritate me, I did like how even if for a brief moment, Elise had to give up her time with Sonic and think of others instead of herself, one more time. She said that the festival felt familiar in the ending, so she might have remembered her sacrifice.

To be frank, Shadow I feel is a very human character. I had a misguided devotion to a dead family member and questioned my identity, just as Shadow did in SA2 and ShTH.

I think Maaya Sakamoto sounded beautiful as Elise. No one talks about her performance, but she has an incredible level of expression in her voice. She's been successful enough to start singing and acting when she was 16 and maintain her popularity among fans.

Not sure if this is popular, but I think having another tragic main villain like Chaos would be cool. I think the expression he showed in the Sonic X version really did make him look like a living, feeling creature that is consumed with literal divine wrath.

When it comes to Silver, I think Pete Capella was better with handling his naivety, while Daisuke Ono conveyed his devotion to his mission better. They are both excellent in their own way.

The first game in the series is still fun to speedrun, I can beat it without the emeralds under half of an hour without glitches. Heck, I have rivals aiming for the bugless world record.

Doing one-life runs can also be fun, if the Sonic game is not too long.

[Shadowlax]

Well to be fair, the Freedom Fighters were created in the era of Sonic 2, when the only characters were just Sonic, Tails, and Robotnik/Eggman, so it's not like the writers made them just to shove everyone's favorite game characters out of the way. Knuckles didn't even exist yet.

I have not read a single issue (closely at least) since the reboot, so I can't tell you what they're like now.

I read them, its sort of still a problem, but they let knuckles hang out with them. But still its too many of these character that are like " literally who, what is shadow doing. I do not care about what mary sue bafoonery Sally is going through at the moment, I want to see what the hell this eclipse business is.  "  So you can see, after months of that and the colossal train wreck that was worlds unite. The silver arc was a great breath of fresh air. 

[shdowhunt60]

I can kinda see where Shadowlax is coming from. I mean, I'm far more invested in the SEGA cast than I am the SatAM cast. At the same time, I can kinda respect it, because the SatAM cast is here, they are well liked, and they're here to stay. It would be pretty selfish of myself to sit there and say that I want the SEGA cast only.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Nevermind how the inverse would hold with the SatAM cast over the official Sega characters.

This is the one place where SatAM can continue to live on, and be alongside the Sega characters. Can we at least be appreciative of this amalgamation where old school fans can still have their past cartoon characters instead of dying with their cartoon while Sega fans still have theirs at the same time? It's not like the Sega characters are given the short end of the stick here - they have the Universe series that gives them moments to shine where they wouldn't have had otherwise, and everyone has their favorite characters they want to see, so no one is special here.

Really, people who came here for the Sega cast should be fully aware that 1) they're not the only people reading these comics, as 2) fans of the old school cartoons are also reading along given that these other characters from the cartoon predated most of the Sega characters and were here first to establish the comic's identity - that's not something that's gonna be done away with anytime soon (I'd wager at all, honestly).

Edited November 8, 2015 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[Kuzu]

Nevermind how the inverse would hold with the SatAM cast over the official Sega characters.

This is the one place where SatAM can continue to live on, and be alongside the Sega characters. Can we at least be appreciative of this amalgamation where old school fans can still have their past cartoon characters instead of dying with their cartoon while Sega fans still have theirs at the same time? It's not like the Sega characters are given the short end of the stick here - they have the Universe series that gives them moments to shine where they wouldn't have had otherwise, and everyone has their favorite characters they want to see, so no one is special here.

Really, people who came here for the Sega cast should be fully aware that 1) they're not the only people reading these comics, as 2) fans of the old school cartoons are also reading along given that these other characters from the cartoon predated most of the Sega characters and were here first to establish the comic's identity - that's not something that's gonna be done away with anytime soon (I'd wager at all, honestly).

Keep in mind the demographic that come into the book later than most of us old heads btw. If you're like me and came into this series with Sonic Adventure 2, then you have no emotional attachment to any of the freedom fighters because you never experienced them like most people who've been around since the beginning. 

So with that said, if you got into the comic and expected to see fan favorites like Knuckles or Shadow a lot, but instead got the likes of Sally, Bunnie, and Rotor characters who you barely know and probably have no investment in, I can sort of understand how they could feel out of place. It took me a while to get over that myself. 

 

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

 then?

Keep in mind the demographic that come into the book later than most of us old heads btw.

As should those who came in later keep in mind the demographic that came in before them. You don't demand sympathy and refuse to give it in return. The new crowd isn't special in this regard, and they shouldn't expect their demands and interests be catered to anymore than the old school fans who are invested in these characters - this disregard is the problem exclusively with newer fans feeling sour and entitled over what they think should be in the comic and what should be phased into the background while older fans have never had any issue whatsoever with the comic having more game material so long as they still have the things they've enjoyed in promience for years. Old heads are more than happy to share, but the new fans? Much less so from what it seems.

Simply put, it's a sheer lack of empathy on newer fans - we know damn good and well they'd raise a shitstorm if the reverse was true and comic and cartoon fans demanded this for the games. So right do they think they have doing just that for the comic? That is hypocrisy at its finest - it would be like me coming into a Zelda game after starting with Twilight Princess and questioning why characters like Midna or Zant weren't around in Majora's Mask or OOT, or starting with Mario Galaxy instead of the old Super Mario World games on and complaining who these Koopalings are coming back in newer games like Mario 3D World when I'm more interested in Bowser Jr. And you know that logic wouldn't fly in the face of all that.

Or here's a kicker - how would you feel if a newer Sonic fan started with the Boom series, then jumped to the main series and complained that games you favored and started with like S3&K, the Adventures series, or Unleashed should have been more like Boom's setting like they expected, rather than accepting them as two distinct settings? How would keeping in mind the newer demographic apply here?

Edited November 8, 2015 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[Muscles Maximum]

I prefer the way the Dreamcast Sonic Adventure looks compared to Sonic Adventure DX

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

Or here's a kicker - how would you feel if a newer Sonic fan started with the Boom series, then jumped to the main series and complained that games you favored and started with like S3&K, the Adventures series, or Unleashed should have been more like Boom's setting like they expected, rather than accepting them as two distinct settings? How would keeping in mind the newer demographic apply here?

I certainly see where you're coming from.

However,  there is the elephant-in-the-room difference that unlike Boom or the Archive comics,  the mainstream series is the stronghold of origin for the franchise. So "keeping in mind the newer demographic" isn't as warranted since the main series is the very face of the franchise. 

 

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

I certainly see where you're coming from.

However,  there is the elephant-in-the-room difference that unlike Boom or the Archive comics,  the mainstream series is the stronghold of origin for the franchise. So "keeping in mind the newer demographic" isn't as warranted since the main series is the very face of the franchise. 

 

But that doesn't answer the question of the point I was making an example of. How does that warrant "keeping in mind the newer demographic" over long-timers in regards to multiple alternate settings? Because the mainstream games being the face doesn't justify the hypocrisy of new fans jumping into a long running series being entitled to have the setting in the way they want compared to others to doing that to their preferred setting in return.

If you jumped into a setting that's been established for a long time and got something you weren't expecting, but has been around for years, that's not a problem with the alternate setting. You'd go bonkers if new fans who started with Boom jumped into the mainstream setting and demanded it should be more like Boom, and tell them this stuff has been long established before Boom. It's no different with Archie or even older fans demanding the new Boom to be catered for them compared to the alternate setting it was designed to be, regardless of where you came in from - we're not talking change Sonic from blue to red, but all these multiple settings have been establshed as such for a reason.

Edited November 9, 2015 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

But that doesn't answer the question of the point I was making an example of. How does that warrant "keeping in mind the newer demographic" over long-timers in regards to multiple alternate settings? Because the mainstream games being the face doesn't justify the hypocrisy of new fans jumping into a long running series being entitled to have the setting in the way they want compared to others to doing that to their preferred setting in return.

 

Well in that particular case, yeah you're right about both sides, especially the newr fans, needing compromise and share the scenario. Perhaps alienated fans should at least be somewhat consoled by having the more main characters as they know, getting more equal spotlight here and there, as opposed to outright removing characters like the Freedom Fighters.

Although Sally's for-better-or-for-worse fickle characterization in the comics is a can of worms I'd rather not open at the moment. That sort of stuff not only tends to bug main-series hoppers but also, old veteran SatAm fans too.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Well in that particular case, yeah you're right about both sides, especially the newr fans, needing compromise and share the scenario. Perhaps alienated fans should at least be somewhat consoled by having the more main characters as they know, getting more equal spotlight here and there, as opposed to outright removing characters like the Freedom Fighters.

But this has already been done by way of the Sonic Universe sidestory arc series, which is intertwinned as part of mainstream Archie as it allows other characters like Silver, Knuckles, Shadow, Amy, Blaze, and even Eggman to get their own spotlight without ruining the pace of things by shiwing a different point of view.

So yeah, not really much of an argument for newer fans feeling alienated when they're getting just what they want in other parts. XP

Edited November 9, 2015 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

 

So yeah, not really much of an argument for newer fans feeling alienated when they're getting just what they want in other parts. XP

Not necessarily, again considering how fickle the writing quality in the comic books can be, including in how well they actually execute such.

[Bolt]

Is it considered unpopular to still be grumpy about the Archie reboot? Probably by this point. I will always enjoy more Shadow and Silver though.