Jump to content
Awoo.

Popular and unpopular Sonic opinions you agree and disagree with!


KHCast

Recommended Posts

Add The Fox and the Hound to that list, as well.  In that movie, not only is the lead protagonist's mother killed at the very beginning of the movie, but Todd must also face separation from his best friend, who then turns against him towards the latter half of the movie, and then is forced to re-adapt to life in the wild as his motherly figure (lovingly) abandons him.  They brighten the tone a bit with the pop music and stuff, but at the end of the day, justice is never served and there's no overlying message of right vs. wrong or good vs. evil.  It's just about the tragic life (and death in the book) of an orphaned fox, and not much else.

 

If that isn't dark and brutal, I don't know what is.

I'd add that if the death wasn't off-screen and non-explicit as per what E-122-Psi outlined, or if there was torture, or mental distress.

 

Although it has a lot of paranoia fuel, so who knows?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 7.8k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • Kuzu

    565

  • E-122-Psi

    416

  • CrownSlayer’s Shadow

    397

  • DabigRG

    347

Top Posters In This Topic

Posted Images

And yet the Storybook games can strike a fair balance between dark and light and yet a leaf is hardly ever taken out of their books?

 

As far as I'm concerned, Sonic Team nailed it fairly well there. And it's a shame we don't get game stories as balanced as those games' stories were any more.

 

I don't think people are going to care unless it happens in a main game....which is sad honestly because I agree.

 

 

Its like people are so focused on Shadow or 06 that they forget that this series has had better writing in the past.

Edited by Azure Yakuzu
  • Thumbs Up 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm sure people don't take the story book series seriously because it isn't a main series entry sadly. The stories in those games are pretty good, but I'm sure people don't take them seriously because they are story book series. That and part of the story is already prewritten for them in some cases, in that they are only slightly following some characters personalities and other such things based off the real things right?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Its like people are so focused on Shadow or 06 that they forget that this series has had better writing in the past.

 

Or mabye people like me don't find the Storybook games stories to be all that and a bag of rings.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well we don't find Heroes story to be a bag of rings, yet that still gets brought up despite not being as bad as ShTH or 06.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm sure people don't take the story book series seriously because it isn't a main series entry sadly. The stories in those games are pretty good, but I'm sure people don't take them seriously because they are story book series. That and part of the story is already prewritten for them in some cases, in that they are only slightly following some characters personalities and other such things based off the real things right?

 

The Storybook games are inspired by 1001 Nights/Arthurian Legend and don't follow them to the wire so in effect, no, they're not 'pre-written' for Sonic Team, they stand independently and are still examples of well-written and competently-told Sonic game stories.

 

The character's personalities are irrelevant to the point I was actually making - That those game's stories have greatly-balanced tones.

  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Popular/unpopular (not sure which) opinion, relevant to the discussion:

 

Sonic does not need a consistent tone from game to game, as long as it has consistent characterization. Why pick sides when you can have some of everything?

 

  • Some games can be lighter, some can be darker.
  • Sometimes the threat is good ol' fashioned world domination, sometimes it's planetary destruction.
  • Sometimes Eggman's the big bad, sometimes he's a secondary villain, sometimes he's even an ally to the heroes. He excels at all three roles, and I look forward to his appearances no matter what (as long as he's in the game).

liked that Colors' story was incredibly straightforward, because there is a precedent for that in the Sonic series; Sometimes, Eggman just tries to take over the world in an incredibly direct way without all the ancient powers and hocus-pocus, and that's fine. Do I want every game to have Colors-level simplicity? No, but I think an occasional game with a "Colors-esque" story is fine, and I welcome it.

 

Of course, I liked Adventure 2 quite a bit as well. I definitely don't think every single one of Sonic's adventures needs to be this humongous affair where all life hangs in the balance, but it's good sometimes too! Eggman as an ally is also good, but if he did that in every single game without any spots as the main villain in between, it'd get old too.

 

It's not unlike how the Mario franchise can have a plot about Bowser kidnapping Peach as kind of an afterthought on his family vacation in one game (Sunshine), and have Mario and Bowser teaming up to stop the destruction of all reality in another (Super Paper Mario) without it seeming disjointed or contradictory. The characters act the same way, and have the same personality in remarkably different situations. And that's all I want from Sonic, for the characters to still stay who they are and handle situations - no matter how light or dark - as themselves, without having their fundamental personalities drastically altered to suit the tone of the plot.

Edited by Dr. Mechano
  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Or mabye people like me don't find the Storybook games stories to be all that and a bag of rings.

 

How you feel about it is honesty irrelevant; just like how you like Sonic Colors and Sonic Generations for what they are, people like myself and Verte like the storybook games for what they are and feel they are just as much a testament to good writing as you feel the aforementioned games are. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How you feel about it is honesty irrelevant; just like how you like Sonic Colors and Sonic Generations for what they are, people like myself and Verte like the storybook games for what they are and feel they are just as much a testament to good writing as you feel the aforementioned games are. 

 

1: Uhh no, I don't like Gens's story like at all...huh?

 

2: I was speaking more of the fact that you implyed how we are supposed to "realize" how good these stories are when poeple talk about how most of the pre-WarrenKen games' stories/writing were crap, when in truth plenty of people just don't feel the same way you do about the "good" stories that they apprentley overlook.

Edited by Soniman
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think people are ragging on Colours and Gens for their simplicity persay. I think they're ragging on their simplicity because they're incompetently-told stories that fail to fulfill their potential.

 

I don't think I quite get why incompetently-told simple stories get away with so much more than incompetently-told 'srs business' stories :| Very much feels like a double standard. I'll defend Colours when compared to shit like '06 but I'm not going to deny it's story had problems and missed opportunities.

  • Thumbs Up 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Storybook games are inspired by 1001 Nights/Arthurian Legend and don't follow them to the wire so in effect, no, they're not 'pre-written' for Sonic Team, they stand independently and are still examples of well-written and competently-told Sonic game stories.

 

The character's personalities are irrelevant to the point I was actually making - That those game's stories have greatly-balanced tones.

 

I hope you aren't getting the wrong idea by what I meant. I like the stories and the games. I was more saying people see the term story book and assume they are copying other things or they are going to be super kiddy games and such like that. Most people in the teenage range and such are going to hear storybook and assume the series isn't important and is geared towards little kids stories  that they hear when trying to go to bed and such like that. I know they are well written, just don't get me wrong ok?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1: Uhh no, I don't like Gens's story like at all...huh?

 

2: I was speaking more of the fact that you implyed how we are supposed to "realize" how good these stories are when poeple talk about how most of the pre-WarrenKen games' stories/writing were crap, when in truth plenty of people just don't feel the same way you do about the "good" stories that they apprentley overlook.

 

You must have a weird way of reading things, because all I was doing was showing appreciation for those stories and some lamenting how everyone seems to write them off as nothing special. If you don't like them fine, but you know, I do so I don't know why you felt you had to tell me you didn't. :\

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think people are ragging on Colours and Gens for their simplicity persay. I think they're ragging on their simplicity because they're incompetently-told stories.

 

I don't think I quite get why incompetently-told simple stories get away with so much more than incompetently-told 'srs business' stories :| Very much feels like a double standard. I'll defend Colours when compared to shit like '06 but I'm not going to deny it's story had problems.

Incompetently told stories always get a free pass when the people who like it are in the majority, but GOD FORBID anything that doesn't fit their niche shows up, competent or otherwise.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hope you aren't getting the wrong idea by what I meant. I like the stories and the games. I was more saying people see the term story book and assume they are copying other things or they are going to be super kiddy games and such like that. Most people in the teenage range and such are going to hear storybook and assume the series isn't important and is geared towards little kids stories  that they hear when trying to go to bed and such like that. I know they are well written, just don't get me wrong ok?

 

You said that the Storybook games' stories are already partly pre-written. I don't agree with that because they take a ton of liberties and do their own thing. The games' stories merely are influenced by the source material they adapt.

 

Besides the point anyway, my original point being that I still think those games stories had struck a great balance between lightheartedness and darkness that didn't come off to me as excessive when it came to either direction, hence more games should take a leaf out of their books. I don't see how them not being a part of the main series is an excuse not to exhibit what I think is an ideal direction narrative tone-wise.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The only flaw I can really give the storybook games are being a tad simple and generic in terms of presentation, but that honestly works for it a lot more.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Incompetently told stories always get a free pass when the people who like it are in the majority, but GOD FORBID anything that doesn't fit their niche shows up, competent or otherwise.

Man, please don't do this. Strawmanning people's arguments like this is meh. Besides, you know that this is not as black and white as it appears.

  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You must have a weird way of reading things, because all I was doing was showing appreciation for those stories and some lamenting how everyone seems to write them off as nothing special.

 

 

I think that was his point. You're basically lamenting that people don't like them like you do.

  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Man, please don't do this. Strawmanning people's arguments like this is meh. Besides, you know that this is not as black and white as it appears.

I can only wish it were that black and white...

 

Then again, it would also backfire on me if I ever wrote anything that fell into the dark area, so it's probably a good thing it isn't.

Edited by Wonder ED
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that was his point. You're basically lamenting that people don't like them like you do.

 

And? Is there something wrong with that?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that was his point. You're basically lamenting that people don't like them like you do.

 

What? And others don't do this either?

 

Because it is very, very prevalent.

 

Specifically when anyone credibly criticizes Lost World, Heroes or Colours in particular.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that was his point. You're basically lamenting that people don't like them like you do.

Well, man, I wouldn't really chastise him for that, considering what happens here every time someone brings up some criticism with Sonic Colors and Generations...

  • Thumbs Up 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

What? And others don't do this either?

 

Because it is very, very prevalent.

 

Specifically when anyone credibly criticizes Lost World, Heroes or Colours in particular.

 

Heroes' story isn't that defended, is it? All I see when its brought up is how much of an excuse plot it is.

 

Even I'd say that Team Sonic's and Team Rose's stories weren't worth jack all to anything. 

Edited by VEDJ-F
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Okay, looking at the previous discussion, I will admit I can't really pinpoint the argument against SA2, I do however still not think it works in terms of being dark as a Sonic story. The whole setup as mentioned feels like it could have been ripped out of a sci fi horror, the backstory even utilizes humans and organizations that prior to this game, have little connection with the Sonic universe (especially adding Shadow's generic aliens into the mix) and such grim implications would have been completely and utterly out of the blue for fans of the retro games. It felt like you could have placed it in any mature game and there would be little to notice it's relevance to Sonic originally.

 

Disney I admit I may have made a double standard about, but Disney also never uses the same characters and universe, adapting from different stories that are all made to be separate from one another. Dumbo does not represent Fox and the Hound's universe.

 

SA2 might be a good display of a dark story, but not a dark Sonic story, and that's why I felt it wasn't that great a direction. SA1 and Lost World had darker elements but at least kept them somewhat relevant to the series' mythos, you felt it was representing a more serious take on the series rather than trying to change it into something completely different to make it work. The Storybook games may also get a pass since the whole premise is Sonic entering a universe different from his.

 

This is my beef with some other medias that try to make Sonic dark, they're making things dark but by trying to make it less about Sonic. I believe someone pointed out Penders wasn't really interested in the SEGA mythos when writing the comics, more just using characters like Knuckles as pivots for his own original characters and universes. Basically it's the same as wanting to make an original story, but when you have to use an existing franchise, you write it as far as you can place almost all the elements of your original story and then dump everything about the franchise you don't need. The goal for making a Sonic story is to bring Sonic's universe to life, no matter how dark and 'depthful' your story is, if it doesn't do that it's not a good SONIC story.

Edited by E-122-Psi
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't see what's so odd about wanting people to like the same game you do . Lost World ended up being one of my favourite games in the series, so you can imagine how I feel about it's overall reception. There's nothing inherently wrong with simply being a little disappointed that a game you like didn't go over well with some people, as long as you don't let it consume you.

 

On another note, unpopular opinion. I don't really find SLW that hard, outside of a few zones here and there. Even

Lava Mountain Zone 3

, while hard, isn't "Eggmanland-tier" like I've seen some players suggest.

  • Thumbs Up 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Popular opinion: The storybook games have great characterization for the cast

 

I have to agree and disagree with that. The storybook games have great characterization for sonic and some of the new characters they introduce in the games. For sonic's friends(and eggman) i really have to disagree. thats mainly because they are not them theyre just people that happen to look like them. I feel as if i shouldnt care about them at all. Take Amy for example I tolerated her in Black Knight but thats because its not really her. The characters are ok but why cant i see good characterization from them when they arent some knight or fairytale character i want to see them as themselves not somebody else also why the heck blaze titled as "sir" that made no sense.

 

Edit:if my post didnt make sense ill try to repharse it better

Edited by Dejimon11
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

You must read and accept our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy to continue using this website. We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.