Popular and unpopular Sonic opinions you agree and disagree with!

[Nepenthe]

SA2's story wasn't really all that out of the blue for retro fans considering- at the time- most people didn't have a problem with it or the game as a whole. In general though, I don't see SA2's general atmosphere as a particular outlier, because all of the sci-fi elements are handled with about the same level of realism as Pokemon: The First Movie. We don't get grey, Tom Clancy-esque cutscenes of the president creating covert defensive strategies against Eggman's new weapon. Eggman talks to the President for like two minutes. There is nothing particularly out of place about most of SA2's happenings and themes, especially when the rest of the game is ultimately just the rivals going to and fro trying to best one another and achieve their goals with a positive message about forgiveness and redemption mixed in.

[Wraith]

And? Is there something wrong with that?

 

 

There's something wrong with it when you bring with it the accusation that people are hypocritical for liking what they like. Your argument basically boils down to "People don't give the shitty stories that happened to be lighthearted as much shit as the shitty stories that happen to be dark." Which is probably true, but  maybe the case isn't some bias towards dark elements and more due to the lighter hearted stories generally being better executed on the whole compared to the darker ones? People are obviously going to be biased toward the better game, which is what Soniman's original argument was before you twisted it into something entirely different.

[Kuzu]

There's something wrong with it when you bring with it the accusation that people are hypocritical for liking what they like. Your argument basically boils down to "People don't give the shitty stories that happened to be lighthearted as much shit as the shitty stories that happen to be dark." Which is probably true, but  maybe the case isn't some bias towards dark elements and more due to the lighter hearted stories generally being better executed on the whole compared to the darker ones? People are obviously going to be biased toward the better game, which is what Soniman's original argument was before you twisted it into something entirely different.

 

...Dude, I was making no type of statement. At all. All I said was "I like the storybook games, and I wish other people did too" Where do you even get me accusing anyone of being hypocritical, like how did you even come to that conclusion because I know I didn't say it. :\

 

You're getting defensive over something extremely minor; you like lighthearted stories better than the previously dark ones, ok. I'm not attacking you, or anyone who happens to like that direction, so calm down mang.

[Jet Prower]

I don't see what's so odd about wanting people to like the same game you do . Lost World ended up being one of my favourite games in the series, so you can imagine how I feel about it's overall reception. There's nothing inherently wrong with simply being a little disappointed that a game you like didn't go over well with some people, as long as you don't let it consume you.

 

On another note, unpopular opinion. I don't really find SLW that hard, outside of a few zones here and there. Even

Lava Mountain Zone 3

, while hard, isn't "Eggmanland-tier" like I've seen some players suggest.

 

Yeah, I'm sort of trying to avoid the lost world sections now due to all the negativity there. I would rather just enjoy the game and not have to hear all that negativity that I don't agree with at all. I don't want to be consumed as you say by the dislikes other have for the game, but it is likely better that I just stay out of that section for now.

 

Also I agree with the difficulty comment. I had some troubles with some of the levels maybe on the first play through of them, because I didn't know them obviously. After the first time through, the levels were all rather easy to me honestly. There are maybe one or two hard levels in there, but after one play-through, it isn't hard in the least. I never had any trouble with the controls either. They were pretty self explanatory to me at least. The lava mountain zone as well, after the first playthrough of it, I can easily get through it without losing one life. I went through it more than once getting red rings.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

Disney I admit I may have made a double standard about, but Disney also never uses the same characters and universe,

Yes the hell they do, more often than you think.

 

They've even made entire cartoon series of them.

 

Although, I certainly won't argue that you SA2 wouldn't look too out of place for a different series like Pokemon: The First Movie which it almost parallels. In of these darker and edgier counterparts within their usually lighthearted world, these two stories have: 

• a superpower ultimate lifeform (Shadow/Mewtwo) gets created by humans in total secrecy to be used as a living weapon,
• said lifeform holds a grudge against humans for whatever reason,
• attacks and kills humans (actually Shadow fights robots, Mewtwo blows up the labratory with the humans still in it) 
• said lifeform uses desires to kill all of humanity,
• only to realize the error of their ways and turn around to fix their mistakes

And the similarities come out even more so in the japanese version of Pokemon the First Movie; all that's different is that Pokemon stays on Earth while you go straight into space in SA2. An even closer example (almost the exact same, in fact) to Sonic as far as SA2 goes would be the Megaman series up to Megaman Zero, with government conspiracies, killing humans, gets darker and edgier as the sequels come, and the fourth game of Zero takes you to space where a colony with a laser cannon fall to the Earth that you have to stop not unlike SA2 where you have to stop it at the cost of the character's life (for the second or third time). And the hero (once again) comes back (somewhat, but worth noting) in the next series.

 

What SA2 has done for Sonic is no more outlandish and "unlike Sonic" than anything that's been done to other franchise like that of Pokemon or Megaman being "unlike" themselves either.

Edited November 13, 2013 by ChaosSupremeSonic

[SenEDDtor Missile]

LIKELY SUPER UNPOPULAR OPINION AHOY!

 

I have just been playing Sonic Colors, and while I will admit there were points that I found sorta fun, it ultimately was just very "meh" to me. I feel the platforming in this game is extremely awkward in certain parts of the game, particularly in points where the platforms are very small, which combined with the awkward nature of Sonic's jump (and no, the double jump only helps up to a point), leads to much frustration for me. Boost style Sonic did need platforming, BUT NOT THIS KIND OF PRECISION PLATFORMING.

 

It is so awkward to the point that I feel that Sonic 06's platforming was actually more tolerable simply because the floaty nature of the characters combined with bigger platforms actually made it EASIER to platform, and thus BETTER in this regard. There, I said it. I have my bunker ready!

 

Oh yeah, and don't come in and tell I am wrong because I didn't play the games, BECAUSE I DID PLAY BOTH GAMES, and I found Colors more irritating.

Edited November 15, 2013 by Wonder ED

[Tara]

Some people have been criticizing Colors in the boost topic for its awkward mechanics, and honestly, I don't see them.  Sonic Colors felt the most natural and free-flowing game since Sonic Adventure to me, even though it boxes you in a claustrophobic space for most of the game.

[Pawn]

Okay, looking at the previous discussion, I will admit I can't really pinpoint the argument against SA2, I do however still not think it works in terms of being dark as a Sonic story. The whole setup as mentioned feels like it could have been ripped out of a sci fi horror, the backstory even utilizes humans and organizations that prior to this game, have little connection with the Sonic universe (especially adding Shadow's generic aliens into the mix) and such grim implications would have been completely and utterly out of the blue for fans of the retro games. It felt like you could have placed it in any mature game and there would be little to notice it's relevance to Sonic originally.

 

Humans and their organisations didn't seem out of the blue when SA had already established that Sonic lived in a world somewhat similar to our own. It's not as though the most important humans weren't related to an important character either. The game let's you take part in Eggman's side of the conflict for the first (and only) time and for that reason the darker atmosphere and sci-fi elements made perfect sense for this game.

Edited November 15, 2013 by Pawn

[Narukami07]

Yeah, I'm sort of trying to avoid the lost world sections now due to all the negativity there. I would rather just enjoy the game and not have to hear all that negativity that I don't agree with at all. I don't want to be consumed as you say by the dislikes other have for the game, but it is likely better that I just stay out of that section for now.

 

Now you know how it feels to be a fan of Evangelion 3.33 (me).

[Blitz 'n Burst]

I honestly prefer Unleashed's daytime stages to Generations. Sonic Unleashed had to confusion about what it wanted to be; a thrilling, fast-paced obstacle course designed for quick reflexes. Sonic's moveset reflected that perfectly - the boost, the quick-step, stomp, light dash, all of the moves were designed around this type of gameplay. Sonic Unleashed knew what it wanted to be, and it did it well. Sonic Generations is an uncomfortable mix between Unleashed and a very basic idea of "platforming," and offers neither the pure thrill of Unleashed nor the joy of completing a difficult platforming section, or playing with interesting level tropes and gimmicks.

[Captain Fun]

Possibly unpopular opinion: SEGA should maybe try a studio other than Sonic Team for a main Sonic game. 

 

I have had fun with the past few Sonic games, but I don't feel like they've been up to par with just about any other big platformer series on the market right now (Donkey Kong, Rayman, Mario). I feel kinda bad saying this because I consider myself to be a pretty big Sonic fan, but I don't think that Sonic Team has matched the quality of other platformers in a long time. 

Edited November 18, 2013 by Captain Fun

[MegasonicZX]

Some people have been criticizing Colors in the boost topic for its awkward mechanics, and honestly, I don't see them.  Sonic Colors felt the most natural and free-flowing game since Sonic Adventure to me, even though it boxes you in a claustrophobic space for most of the game.

I agree with this actually and not just for colors but for all of them, I mean sure sonic moves faster in these games but whenever I hear someone say that its hard to precision platform in them, a question mark goes over my head since the jump feels pretty good whenever you do it and it never feels as though its gonna rocket in one direction.

[Dizcrybe]

Unpopular opinion: while I agree that Lisa Ortiz had the best Amy voice, I don't mind Cindy Robinson as Amy at all.

[Jet Prower]

I agree with this actually and not just for colors but for all of them, I mean sure sonic moves faster in these games but whenever I hear someone say that its hard to precision platform in them, a question mark goes over my head since the jump feels pretty good whenever you do it and it never feels as though its gonna rocket in one direction.

 

I think now that Lost World is out, people are comparing the two based on how easy it is to land on platforms now due to his lower speeds. When you compare it to the boost games where Sonic is made to move very fast and you can barely walk with him without him speeding around quite quickly, it can be harder to precision jump sometimes due to how fast he has a tendency to move. It isn't horrible of course as I can make the jumps no problem now, but I can see what people mean by it.

[Nepenthe]

Sonic's jump was the least problematic in Unleashed, but overall precision platforming was never the greatest. Low, fixed height and lack of conserved momentum made platforming a pain in all three modern games, although it was somewhat mitigated by the large platforms in Unleashed and Generations, as well as the double jump in Colors.

[- Eternal Paradox -]

Spoiler'd because wall of text.

 

 

Unpopular Opinion: Ken Penders is not the devil.

 

 

 

Hear me out on this one. Yes, I know you're mad because Ken "stole" your favorite Archie characters away, I know you think he's the main factor for the comic's reboot. And no, I'm not going to talk about the quality of this man's work.

What I am going to talk about is legal rights, and the man's right to earn money of characters he created.

Let's start with the facts. Ken Penders was employed by Archie comics to write stories for Sonic the Hedgehog around 1994. He was - Archie corporation allege - given a contract state stated any characters, stories or content he created for the comic would be sole property of SEGA. Ken claims he signed no such contract, and Archie cannot produce one. In this case, Ken and he lawyers have the higher ground.

Now, I imagine the world of comics was different back then. Sonic was, back then, merely a silly funny comic book with lots of gags and humour. I doubt anyone really imagined it would run so long or that they'd have to deal with consciences.

Ken was one of the longest running writers for the comic, and was there in it's early days, so it's understandable he was responsible for creating the majority of the content that wasn’t created by SEGA.

Ken was let go from the comic in 2006.

And that might have been the last we'd heard of him if it wasn't for one game...

 

Sonic Chronicles. Released in 2008 by BioWare. You can debate it all you want, but it's obvious BioWare borrowed a huge chunk of the Archie story and characters. Julie-Su is Shade. The Marauders are the Dark legion. The similarity is glaring.

And this would have been perfectly fine if SEGA owned the rights to those characters.

See how this all ties back to that contract? Paperwork is important kids.

In 2009, and presumably after conversations with his lawyers, Ken started filing copyright claims for the characters and stories he created. He also started to sue Sega and EA (Bioware's parent company) for infringement.

In 2010, Ken declared that he would "use every legal means at my disposal to protect and preserve his works", Archie took that as an ultimatum and filed for a lawsuit in order to protect the rights to their characters. Archie went in expecting to win - but it didn't end that way. Halfway through they fired their legal team and got a new one. It's safe to assume this legal team advised them to stop any further action that could lead to legal trouble. Has Archie had a competent legal team to begin with, they probably would have advised this before the lawsuit even began. SEGA wanted little part in whole affair.

By hook or by crook, an agreement was finally reached (although there were later disagreements over what entailed). We don't know fully what this agreement entails.

Now, despite a few shaky years, Sonic is still a huge, iconic money making franchise. The comics have helped contribute to that. Ken feels entitled to a piece of all that since he's contributed greatly (for better or worse) to the comic. I can't imagine what the verdict would be if he'd butted heads against a bigger company (DC, Marvel, Disney), but it'd probably be solved quicker.

The comic has suffered due to the legal battle. Endangered Species was one causality. Flynn was now not only having to work within SEGA's mandates but also dealing with legal issues. If it hadn't been for the Mega-man crossover, he probably would have found some other way to reboot the universe. Sometimes it's better to start anew rather than try to fix something that's broken.

This sort of legal trouble is not an exclusive case in the writing industry. Bob Kane is widely credited as the creator as Batman, yet Bill Finger is rarely mentioned. The ownership of Ghost Rider was debated in a legal battle. Writers rarely receive the credit they are due, often treated like shit by directors, and that’s why we had the writer’s strike a few years ago.

The real villain of this piece isn’t Penders. It isn’t even Sega or Archie. It’s a small piece of paperwork that Archie are unable to produce.

 

Edited November 22, 2013 by -Paradox-

[Metal the Mario]

Now that I've started to play Sonic '06 again, I feel I have an opinion that probably isn't too popular.

 

The actual story of '06 is seen by many as subpar, but there's one thing I've always rather liked about it: how it intertwines between Sonic, Shadow, and Silver and their individual episodes. While each character has plenty of time to work toward his own goals, the story still allows for each two of the three characters to interact exclusively-- only Sonic and Shadow face off against Iblis Phase 2, only Sonic and Silver work to save Elise in Kingdom Valley, and only Shadow and Silver travel ten years back in time (my favorite instance). When you take into account the motivations of each character, it also puts a slightly different spin on each of those interactions and highlights the nuances of their actions to the player. It really does make you want to play each episode so that you can see the full picture, regardless of how good it really is in the end.

 

I also liked how the story tied into the level order for each character. What might be an early or middle level for the other characters might be the final level for one character for their own reasons (e.g. Dusty Desert for Shadow because of Mephiles). For me, it helped give the levels an actual sense of progression and purpose.

 

Basically, I kind of miss that form of intertwining between stories in Sonic games and it's a major reason that I want other playable characters to return. We haven't seen that sort of complexity since the Adventure days-- perhaps even SA1.

[Splash the Otter]

I think the current gameplay should be more forgiving toward players who just aren't the best at platforming. This means no bottomless pits (except in places where they would make sense), and never losing more than 20 rings in one hit. I believe this would make the gameplay less frustrating without compromising difficulty.

[Tara]

Now that I've started to play Sonic '06 again, I feel I have an opinion that probably isn't too popular.

 

The actual story of '06 is seen by many as subpar, but there's one thing I've always rather liked about it: how it intertwines between Sonic, Shadow, and Silver and their individual episodes. While each character has plenty of time to work toward his own goals, the story still allows for each two of the three characters to interact exclusively-- only Sonic and Shadow face off against Iblis Phase 2, only Sonic and Silver work to save Elise in Kingdom Valley, and only Shadow and Silver travel ten years back in time (my favorite instance). When you take into account the motivations of each character, it also puts a slightly different spin on each of those interactions and highlights the nuances of their actions to the player. It really does make you want to play each episode so that you can see the full picture, regardless of how good it really is in the end.

 

I also liked how the story tied into the level order for each character. What might be an early or middle level for the other characters might be the final level for one character for their own reasons (e.g. Dusty Desert for Shadow because of Mephiles). For me, it helped give the levels an actual sense of progression and purpose.

 

Basically, I kind of miss that form of intertwining between stories in Sonic games and it's a major reason that I want other playable characters to return. We haven't seen that sort of complexity since the Adventure days-- perhaps even SA1.

That is something I'm disappointed that they've never expanded upon since.  I thought it was pretty intuitively done in SA1, despite the graceless aging of the game itself.  It gave the characters dimension, not to mention has a nice little theme of "intertwining destinies" that I just love.

 

 

I think the current gameplay should be more forgiving toward players who just aren't the best at platforming. This means no bottomless pits (except in places where they would make sense), and never losing more than 20 rings in one hit. I believe this would make the gameplay less frustrating without compromising difficulty.

I always thought the modern games (barring Lost World as I haven't played it) were a little too forgiving to be honest, but then, this is coming from someone who has no problem with bottomless pits or the usual Sonic level pranks.  The fact that they now give a visual cue to indicate when you're approaching a bottomless pit, in my opinion, is an act of lenience on their part.

[Kuzu]

Lost World doesn't look that forgiving, but mainly because it doesn't bother to explain shit about its controls.

[Chaos Incarnate]

Sonic 1>Sonic 2+Sonic 3 & K for me. 

 

Sonic 2's spike and enemy placement gets really aggravating due to focus on speed pisses me off to no end. It's like going on a jog, only for a brick wall to suddenly materialize in front of your face. Sonic 3 & K just drags for me, mainly the Sonic and Knuckles half, due to levels that overstay their welcome, like Sandopolis and Lava Reef. 

 

Sonic 1 had more of a focus on platforming, was more forgiving and felt more satisfying to complete, and I generally have no qualms with Sonic 1's level design. It was a great start to Sonic's legacy, and while I still hold appreciation for the sequels for bringing in series' staples like Tails+ Knuckles and the Spin Dash, I tend to get much more enjoyment out of Sonic 1.

[StaticMania]

Sonic 1>Sonic 2+Sonic 3 & K for me. 

 

Sonic 1 had more of a focus on platforming, was more forgiving and felt more satisfying to complete, and I generally have no qualms with Sonic 1's level design. It was a great start to Sonic's legacy, and while I still hold appreciation for the sequels for bringing in series' staples like Tails+ Knuckles and the Spin Dash, I tend to get much more enjoyment out of Sonic 1.

Sonic 1 has no more focus on platforming than the other 2 games...the only thing it has more of in that aspect is regular run and jump platforming instead of an equal focus on both run and jump along with the faster moving momentum based platforming game-play. Its not that much more forgiving, but the slower pace doesn't make certain areas seem as cheap as they would be.

[Chaos Incarnate]

Sonic 1 has no more focus on platforming than the other 2 games...the only thing it has more of in that aspect is regular run and jump platforming instead of an equal focus on both run and jump along with the faster moving momentum based platforming game-play. Its not that much more forgiving, but the slower pace doesn't make certain areas seem as cheap as they would be.

I guess I should rephrase what I said and say Sonic 1 just felt more consistent with its focus on slower-paced platforming. Having to slow down in Sonic 2 felt like such a pace breaker, where I know exactly what I'm getting into with Sonic 1.

[Jet Prower]

Lost World doesn't look that forgiving, but mainly because it doesn't bother to explain shit about its controls.

 

I simply read the prompts on the game-pad and it explained plenty about the controls to me. The wall-run and such took me awhile to master when I was playing that game though. It is tricky, but the control explanation is there, you just have to look down for them.

[Dizcrybe]

the control explanation is there, you just have to look down for them.

 

Which is stupid. The player shouldn't have to go out of their way to look down at the gamepad figure out how the controls work. They should just be on the TV screen.