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Your Unanswered Sonic Questions

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3 hours ago, Miragnarok said:

In early games and media, the two types were more or less inferred to be one and the same, with Sonic and company being larger for gameplay purposes and due to importance. This was de-emphasized over time, with Sonic Adventure sealing the deal by making the Sonic-types bigger and more anthro and the small animals less so.

Yeah, I understand.

But:

dEXgOd4.jpg

They clearly weren't the same even back then. Their traits differ too much.

Even with the Sonic Band:

HreyU5Z.jpgGD_Sonic1_GDC2018_Band.png

They weren't playable, but they were still the same anthro race as Sonic. (Mobian...whatever)

4 hours ago, DabigRG said:

Weren't the Mobini of Runners said to be living in some sort of village? 

What did Runners say about them?

1 hour ago, BaronGrackle said:

Then riddle me this. Is it possible that any of the Knuckles Chaotix lived on Angel Island?

In Sonic the Fighters, Espio's stage was Mushroom Hill.

Espio lives on Angel Island in the Archie comics IIRC. In Chaotix Espio does investigate Newtrogic High Zone to discover its relation to Angel Island with the statement that he's envious of Knuckles, which suggests he doesn't live there.

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25 minutes ago, MainJP said:

Yeah, I understand.

But:

dEXgOd4.jpg

.

Oh, that's such a tease. Where did that come from? 

25 minutes ago, MainJP said:

 

What did Runners say about them?

 

That's what I was asking.

I vaguely recall something from what I played back then. 

25 minutes ago, MainJP said:

 

Espio lives on Angel Island in the Archie comics IIRC. In Chaotix Espio does investigate Newtrogic High Zone to discover its relation to Angel Island with the statement that he's envious of Knuckles, which suggests he doesn't live there.

Wait, envious of Knuckles?

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41 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

Oh, that's such a tease. Where did that come from? 

 

Where did what come from?

43 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

 

That's what I was asking.

 I vaguely recall something from what I played back then. 

 

Well then idk.

43 minutes ago, DabigRG said:

 

Wait, envious of Knuckles?

The original Japanese manual states he's envious of Knuckles.

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Infinite never really actively took part in that battle, he just kind of held back and watched. I don't think that's meant to be the Sun or Infinite, looks like some sort of projectile blast Zavok is about to throw, although I can't recall if the real Zavok ever had that kind of ability. But meh, "Phantom Ruby" explains it away. The Phantom Shadow seems to be doing a Chaos Spear version of the same attack.

Question of my own: Is Eggman’s Interstellar Amusement Park actually meant to be populated by visitors during the events of Sonic Colours? Even though I’m starting to believe so now, I never got that vibe playing through the game back when it came out. I had imagined that Sonic and Tails had kind of snuck on board to investigate before its grand opening or something. Sonic comments (in the English version) that “somebody was dumb enough to leave the keys” in the space elevator which implies it wasn’t meant to be in use at that point, but in the Japanese language version Eggman mentions that he’s only denying entry to evil people.

The park always felt really empty to me as we never actually see any other visitors in-person for the entire game. But I guess the hover vehicle traffic in the background of Tropical Resort and Eggman’s P.A messages seem to imply that the place is open for business. Hope everyone made it off before the giant black hole implosion!

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5 minutes ago, Gotta Go Rational said:

Infinite never really actively took part in that battle, he just kind of held back and watched. I don't think that's meant to be the Sun or Infinite, looks like some sort of projectile blast Zavok is about to throw, although I can't recall if the real Zavok ever had that kind of ability. But meh, "Phantom Ruby" explains it away. The Phantom Shadow seems to be doing a Chaos Spear version of the same attack.

Good point. 

Looking at the image again, I am noticing a number of things:

a. there are a couple of similar colored blasts zipping through the air,

b. you're right--one of those pink blasts is coming from Phantom Shadow, 

c. a Phantom Chaos in the background is charging similar energy on it's claw; this may be a reference to an attack he could do in at least one of his forms,

d. [Phantom?] Zavok's blast is shaped more like a ball of ki; he had the ability to fire blasts from his palm at Lava Mountain, but they were orange,

e. there is only one Zavok.

 

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This is a question I wish someone would ask the devs that worked on Sonic Adventure.

In Sonic Adventure there are 3 skipped level ID's: STG11, STG13 and STG14. 

https://tcrf.net/Sonic_Adventure_(Dreamcast)#Japanese_Level_List

Z61gaVq.png

If we look at the order of levels on the Japanese level list it perfectly matches the order of the levels in the internal ID order in 1ST_READ.BIN, which also includes the skipped level IDs.

DJFGMz0.jpg

 

That means that STG11 is Mushroom, STG13 is Jungle and STG14 is Desert.

Since Angel Island plays a sizable role in Sonic Adventure and Ice Cap Zone was remade for the game:

SA_IC1.png

What are the chances that "Jungle" was indeed Angel Island Zone, "Mushroom" was Mushroom Hill Zone and "Desert" was Sandopolis?

Angelisland.pngMushroomHillAct1.pngSandopolis.png

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It's possible, but SA already has jungle and desert areas, in the Mystic Ruins jungle and Sand Hill, so it could easily go either way. "Mushroom" is a bit more particular of a theme so I'd probably give that one better than even odds of being based on S&K's Mushroom Hill, though.

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On 8/11/2019 at 3:57 PM, Gotta Go Rational said:

Infinite never really actively took part in that battle, he just kind of held back and watched. I don't think that's meant to be the Sun or Infinite, looks like some sort of projectile blast Zavok is about to throw, although I can't recall if the real Zavok ever had that kind of ability. But meh, "Phantom Ruby" explains it away. The Phantom Shadow seems to be doing a Chaos Spear version of the same attack.

Question of my own: Is Eggman’s Interstellar Amusement Park actually meant to be populated by visitors during the events of Sonic Colours? Even though I’m starting to believe so now, I never got that vibe playing through the game back when it came out. I had imagined that Sonic and Tails had kind of snuck on board to investigate before its grand opening or something. Sonic comments (in the English version) that “somebody was dumb enough to leave the keys” in the space elevator which implies it wasn’t meant to be in use at that point, but in the Japanese language version Eggman mentions that he’s only denying entry to evil people.

The park always felt really empty to me as we never actually see any other visitors in-person for the entire game. But I guess the hover vehicle traffic in the background of Tropical Resort and Eggman’s P.A messages seem to imply that the place is open for business. Hope everyone made it off before the giant black hole implosion!

It was supposed to be the day before the actual opening. Probably why Eggman was still in the process of recording PA announcements. 

2 hours ago, Diogenes said:

It's possible, but SA already has jungle and desert areas, in the Mystic Ruins jungle and Sand Hill, so it could easily go either way. "Mushroom" is a bit more particular of a theme so I'd probably give that one better than even odds of being based on S&K's Mushroom Hill, though.

Sand Hill was added fairly late for Tails' story, so it's possible what was made the desert went into it. 

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4 hours ago, DabigRG said:

Sand Hill was added fairly late for Tails' story, so it's possible what was made the desert went into it. 

Desert and Sand Hill (Sandboard) both being present raises some questions as I can't help but wonder if those were separate assets, but it's definitely possible.

Another interesting tidbit comes from the Autodemo prototype, where Hot Shelter itself is also a skipped ID and lacks an entry in the developer level select.

As far as action stages are concerned STG12 , along with STG11 have the most minuscule amount of data left in that version; Hot Shelter only has Amy's starting coordinates leftover but literally nothing else while STG11 has a leftover camera file: 7hLd2mW.png

The same compile date as the camera file for Practice/test stage (STG00). STG13 and 14 still lack any data at all.

What I want to know is when exactly these stages were scrapped. If we were to ever somehow find a proto compiled around the date you see above there's an incredibly likely chance all 3 scrapped levels could be there in some capacity kinda like how there's a leftover object file meant for the Tokyo International version of Twinkle Park Act 1 with a build date of September 9th, meaning that if we had a build of SA from around that date we would have access to that version of TP.

Spoiler

feUv6Bt.gif

I'm at least almost 100% certain that "Mushroom" was Mushroom Hill Zone since that's a pretty blatant theme.

Jungle and desert are a bit more unknown since yeah, there is a jungle area in the Mystic Ruins where we could have entered those stages, but since we have development screenshots of Sonic and Tails cruising around Angel Island, the role it plays in-story coupled with the jungle and desert levels in Sonic 3 & Knuckles gives me vague hints that a quite a few S3 levels were to be remade à la Ice Cap...maybe.

qABqj2X.png

 

 

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On 8/16/2019 at 2:21 PM, DabigRG said:

Sand Hill was added fairly late for Tails' story, so it's possible what was made the desert went into it. 

4 hours ago, MainJP said:

Desert and Sand Hill (Sandboard) both being present raises some questions as I can't help but wonder if those were separate assets, but it's definitely possible.

Now that I think about it, Sand Hill borrowing assets from the Desert level is probably more likely than I previously thought.

Supercoolsonic pointed out on Github awhile back when the Beta Windy Valley restoration mod was being worked on that the Chao Race map does reuse (albeit edited) textures from the original Windy Valley.

0711_2crs_g2420sea3_6alm_sgo03w_wv9

With that in mind Sand Hill could perhaps be reusing the art direction and perhaps even some geometry from Desert. That was probably the intention even if Desert had ended up in the finalized product for all we know.

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1 hour ago, Splash the Otter said:

I've asked this before, but I never got an answer. Why is Team Chaotix called that in-universe?

I don't think there's ever been an in-universe explanation given - it seems that's just the name they chose for their detective agency for some reason. 

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'Nother SA development related question I guess.

Was Tikal meant to be playable during the past segments?

upgQ12R.gif

And what about Eggman? Perhaps he was meant to be playable prior to E-102 Gamma's awakening?

OMpBFPW.gif

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I'd guess probably not. I know they can be controlled via hacks, but I'd assume that's just because they're the most complex NPCs in the game; they're major players in the story, so they need more complex animations than the random townspeople and such, so they probably reused a bunch of code from the player characters.

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Ohtani made a tweet various months ago, teasing whether we will see him again or not.

 

Plus there is that IDW thing, SEGA told Ian (apparently) that he's off limits, without saying he's dead, they just told him not to use Infinite. 

Besides, he has some potential, and his appearance hyped a lot of people prior to the game's release, so… and he appeared in various merch (new Monopoly, Tomy's action figure, Sonic Battle Racers), his spirit in Ultimate is just a bonus I guess.

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