Star Wars

[Ryannumber1gamer]

4 minutes ago, Josh said:

Now see, you're actually making some good arguments here. For me, though, I see how many people are deserting the ship regardless due to the situation and I can understand the paranoia on Holdo's part. If they left and got in the Empire's hands somehow or they left and mentioned the plan to the wrong person(which is exactly what happens with Finn) then suddenly the plan is shot. 

Let's consider the alternative. She tells everybody what the plan is. People are disillusioned anyway due to how grim the situation is and some of them desert. The First Order catches even one of them and makes them spill the beans. What happened in the movie is just one of so many ways this situation absolutely would have gone south to me. 

See, this would be an acceptable counter-argument/acceptable explanation to the other side of it. But the problem is that the movie itself establishes a solution that shows this wouldn't have happened. Rose was on constant patrol and mentioned having captured any and all people who tried to pull a desertion, to the point she turned on Finn despite knowing full well who he was because she thought he was deserting. It was only after Finn revealed a plan that could save everyone did she jump on board with it.

However, if Holdo made her plan known in the first place, but assuming Finn still tried to escape for Rey, Rose would've captured him, and he probably would've stayed stuck in a holding cell because Rose was now aware of an escape plan already in motion and already well-thought out. It absolutely stands to reason Finn wouldn't have convinced her otherwise if Holdo wasn't so secretive.

[Wraith]

3 minutes ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

See, this would be an acceptable counter-argument/acceptable explanation to the other side of it. But the problem is that the movie itself establishes a solution that shows this wouldn't have happened. Rose was on constant patrol and mentioned having captured any and all people who tried to pull a desertion, to the point she turned on Finn despite knowing full well who he was because she thought he was deserting. It was only after Finn revealed a plan that could save everyone did she jump on board with it.

However, if Holdo made her plan known in the first place, but assuming Finn still tried to escape for Rey, Rose would've captured him, and he probably would've stayed stuck in a holding cell because Rose was now aware of an escape plan already in motion and already well-thought out. It absolutely stands to reason Finn wouldn't have convinced her otherwise if Holdo wasn't so secretive.

Remember that when Holdo explains the plan at first it starts a Mutiny though. It's only when Leia wakes up and physically forces the plan along that it starts to go into motion. If that mutiny happened earlier in the movie things might have been even messier. 

I also doubt Rose could keep track of every single person trying to desert or stop anyone from communicating with outsiders at all, but that's more of a subjective thing. 

If Leia hadn't been out cold she might have been able to smooth the crew over because she's just a lot more trustworthy than Holdo, but that's not how it shaked out, sadly. 

[Patticus]

1 hour ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

This is one of the aspects I absolutely love in Last Jedi. I love how they finally gave a proper establishment to the fact the Jedi were pretty much as corrupt as the Sith were and weren't looking for balance but actually wanted themselves as the only Force users. It felt somewhat weird to have that established in the prequels because the original trilogy IIRC didn't even touch on these aspects much (obviously, due to the fact it was made long before the prequels) so to finally have it brought back into relevance in a way that ties it all together I thought was really cool.

Here's another awesome scene, echoing across the decades, uniting all three trilogies...

Didn't spoiler it because, well, it spoils precisely fuck all.

The series is full of these things, but that was the most obvious by far. There's at least one big one in Solo. Spoiler alert!

Spoiler

"I hate you."
"I know."

Actually, you know what? Imma talk about Solo for a minute, about something else that irked me, really the only big thing apart from that other thing I talked about a couple pages back in my big ass impressions post. Spoiler alert again!

Spoiler

Han gets the name Solo from an Imperial official on Corellia, to whom he goes in order to join the Imperial Navy. This is the same Han who hates the Empire, wants nothing to do with taking orders etc. But we know why he's doing this - he needs a way off Corellia, and a way to become a great pilot. Two birds, one stone masquerading as a Thermal Detonator, so we get why he accepted the name to begin with.

Remember, though, that this man will eventually play a pivotal role in destroying both Death Stars, bring the whole Empire down, and then threaten its successor state, the First Order, by playing a central role in Starkiller Base's destruction.

He hates the Empire, and yet he keeps the name Solo.

Why?

I feel like anyone else would've picked a different name up, at least after they left the Imperial Academy and Imperial Army to (temporarily) pursue a life in the galactic underworld. Does it mean something to him? Is it a symbol, in his mind, of his lifelong quest for freedom? A reminder of where he's been, and where he's going?

 

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

2 hours ago, Josh said:

So good writing would be the characters understanding the entire situation from the go, including any bumps in the road or traps the villains laid, an acting according? Are you here for a story or a power fantasy? 

I know it's the latter, since that's how Star Wars fans are,

Look, I don't know what exactly a "power fantasy" is or why it has you resorting to generalizing a group of people who don't agree with you, I'll let you know that I'm here for a good story that's well written. A well written story often has enough good points and rhymes to reason that allow people to overlook the bad, unless the bad overshadows any good. Case in point, Last Jedi.

 

2 hours ago, Josh said:

You're citing characters making mistakes as flaws in the writing. 

Not really. I'm a fan of good stories even with that set up. Heck, one of my favorite series is Ace Attorney for crying out loud. What I don't care for, is a story that tries to present to me a character that gets more people killed than the supposed hot shot (who mind you, saved more lives than Holdo in the first place), as someone to be celebrated. Someone who never gets truly called out for the ineptitude and stupidity of her actions while Poe, the one actually trying to get to a point where a mutiny wouldn;t be on the cards.

I daresy that HISHE addressed those concerns far better than Rian Johnson did.

2 hours ago, Josh said:

Tell me what else Youtube told you about this movie. 

It's ironic that you're making assumptions as rash as the characters in that movie. What exactly are you trying to prove with that line? That everyone calling out the movie for its BS is some drone that answers to social media site? Or tha because I'm negative on the movie, I supposedly have some blinded judgement against it? That's some toxic bias if ever I've seen any.

Come on man, you can do better than bull shots like that. Don't resort to picks like that to try and win yourself a debate.

2 hours ago, Josh said:

With some of you guys's logic you should be pinning the blame on the first order for chasing the resistance in the first place and throwing them into a panic by taking their leader out of commission. 

I blame the First order for being terribly written villains who in Hux's case, want to just slowly run them out of fuel instead of just blasting them. Or in Phasma's case, jobbing out in a terribly written fight scene that's inconsistent with her postion, weapons use, or not even bothering to just kill Finn and Rose when she had the chance.

Both sides in this movie have their big stupid moments. The focus is mainly on Holdo's issues as a character.

2 hours ago, Josh said:

but you're not considering everyone on the ship is panicking,

Actually I have. It's because of that, that some peple actively even support Poe's mutiny. Because Holdo handles it terribly.

 

1 hour ago, Josh said:

For me, though, I see how many people are deserting the ship regardless due to the situation and I can understand the paranoia on Holdo's part. If they left and got in the Empire's hands somehow or they left and mentioned the plan to the wrong person(which is exactly what happens with Finn) then suddenly the plan is shot. 

Let's consider the alternative. She tells everybody what the plan is. People are disillusioned anyway due to how grim the situation is and some of them desert. The First Order catches even one of them and makes them spill the beans.

Congratulations. You'd have made a better writer than Rian Johnson, for at the very least that arc. Why? Because you actually provide a reason for Holdo's actions. At no point in the actual movie, is it ever stated why Holdo actively kept that information from them. It's not good writing to leave things like that up to the audience. They shouldn't have to assume those kinds of things, because honestly, anything could be the answer, especially given Last Jedi's fetish for twists and subversion.

[Marcello]

5 hours ago, Ryannumber1gamer said:

This is one of the aspects I absolutely love in Last Jedi. I love how they finally gave a proper establishment to the fact the Jedi were pretty much as corrupt as the Sith were and weren't looking for balance but actually wanted themselves as the only Force users. It felt somewhat weird to have that established in the prequels because the original trilogy IIRC didn't even touch on these aspects much (obviously, due to the fact it was made long before the prequels) so to finally have it brought back into relevance in a way that ties it all together I thought was really cool.

The Jedi had lost their way, but they weren't bringing the Force out of balance. People tend to think the balance means there needs to be the same amount of light and dark side users, but that's not true.

The Jedi let themselves be guided by the Force and use it as an extension of themselves, the Sith and corrupt subjugate it. That's what hurts the balance. Without the Sith or other darksiders, it goes back to normal.

Luke was wrong about the Jedi needing to end, but I think he was right about them being arrogant. The Force is everything, it can't belong to a single group. And it doesn't. There are other Force using groups.

4 hours ago, Patticus said:

Actually, you know what? Imma talk about Solo for a minute, about something else that irked me, really the only big thing apart from that other thing I talked about a couple pages back in my big ass impressions post. Spoiler alert again!

  Hide contents

Han gets the name Solo from an Imperial official on Corellia, to whom he goes in order to join the Imperial Navy. This is the same Han who hates the Empire, wants nothing to do with taking orders etc. But we know why he's doing this - he needs a way off Corellia, and a way to become a great pilot. Two birds, one stone masquerading as a Thermal Detonator, so we get why he accepted the name to begin with.

Remember, though, that this man will eventually play a pivotal role in destroying both Death Stars, bring the whole Empire down, and then threaten its successor state, the First Order, by playing a central role in Starkiller Base's destruction.

He hates the Empire, and yet he keeps the name Solo.

Why?

I feel like anyone else would've picked a different name up, at least after they left the Imperial Academy and Imperial Army to (temporarily) pursue a life in the galactic underworld. Does it mean something to him? Is it a symbol, in his mind, of his lifelong quest for freedom? A reminder of where he's been, and where he's going?

 

Spoiler

I kinda groaned at that. Partly because it's kinda dumb, but mostly because I knew that people, like Red Letter Media, were going to be insufferable about it. I wish they would've left that out. I don't think it adds much. I'm not super bothered by it, though,

For the reason, though, I guess he just didn't care. At a certain point he made a name for himself as Han Solo, so he stuck with it.

What I find interesting, though, is that Han mentions how his dad loved fixing up YT-1000s. So I assume he was alive long enough for Han to know him. So I guess Han knows his actual last name?

 

[Patticus]

2 hours ago, Marcello said:

 

  Hide contents

What I find interesting, though, is that Han mentions how his dad loved fixing up YT-1000s. So I assume he was alive long enough for Han to know him. So I guess Han knows his actual last name?

 

Spoiler

He said that he was boosting speeders by the time he was 10, so I'd guess that his dad died before then. If he had any living relatives at all, they must either have been unknown to him, or wanted nothing to do with him. If he knows his last name, which isn't clear in itself TBH, perhaps it has no meaning to him by the time he reaches the recruiter.

 

[Jovahexeon Jax Joranvexeon]

On 5/30/2018 at 12:08 AM, Ryannumber1gamer said:

  Reveal hidden contents

Uh...no. Finn and Rose going to the Casino planet ended up being a literal direct consequence of her keeping the plans secret. If she'd spoke up to begin with, the two wouldn't have to go to the Casino Planet, they wouldn't be caught by the code-breaker, they wouldn't be backstabbed and captured by the First Order, therefore making it an entire non-issue. If she was just up-front from the beginning, literally the entire destruction of nearly the entire rebel fleet could've been avoided because The First Order never would've captured the two to get the info in the first place.

 

Thinking about that. Another one of Last Jedi's falling issues is how pointless 2 thirds of what actually transpires in that movie are relegated nigh pointless with unenoyable features. 

[Ryannumber1gamer]

It's finally back...

[DarkRula]

I forgot we had a Star Wars thread.

But yes! The Clone Wars is back for twelve episodes and the Siege of Mandalore is going to be there.

[Badnik Zero]

Wow! I hoped this was another Netflix deal, but Disney is using it to sell their new streaming service they’re launching to compete with Netflix. That’s fine, I’ll pay extra for this. I’m gonna binge watch it with my girlfriend. She’s bigger fan of the show than the movies.

[Patticus]

My reaction yesterday upon learning of this news:

This, the other new Star Wars shows, and the prospect of Kenobi being Disney Streaming-exclusive too (thanks to their inept handling of Solo), mean I pretty well have no choice now. I have to have that service.

The twelve new episodes will be divided into three arcs of four episodes, two of which were part-way done and fully voiced by the cast when TCW was canned; these animatics were later shown to fans in their half-baked state. The animatic arcs, the Crystal Crisis and the Bad Batch, will be followed by the Siege of Mandalore, which IIRC is entirely new. So, sadly that means we still won't be seeing Boba Fett and Cad Bane facing off, or the war on Kashyyyk, or Cato Neimoidia, or the innumerable other places and plots that were in the works when the can hammer came down (65 episodes were in the pipeline at time of cancellation).

So yeah, we will almost certainly never see those tales realized, because the Siege of Mandalore story takes place immediately prior to Revenge of the Sith (Mandalore is where Obi-Wan & Anakin receive word of Grievous' raid and Palpatine's capture), which is why the character models have been updated to look as the characters in RotS did.

 

Also announced at Comic-Con, books and comics!

Damn it's a good time for the new Star Wars EU.

[Kevin]

On 7/20/2018 at 1:25 PM, Ryannumber1gamer said:

It's finally back...

To say that this came out of left field and how excited I am for this is an understatement!

[Patticus]

Filoni must've been beside himself with joy when he was contacted and told to do the new episodes. Well, the 8 old ones and 4 IIRC new ones.

Gutted that we won't be seeing the 28 or so other episodes that were in production at time of cancellation - the ones not turned into the Lost Missions episodes, Darth Maul: Son of Dathomir or Dark Disciple, but Mandalore effectively puts an end to the whole show, unless Disney decides it's in its interests to make more to draw more fan attention down the road, but they'll might turn those arcs into individual feature length episodes and treat them like little movies, like Futurama did for a little bit.

[Badnik Zero]

So if we are on Mandalore again I assume we will be seeing the breakout of Maul by Deathwatch? That’s a major gap they haven’t bridged yet, given how much of a role he played in Rebels. So far we have a throw-away line spoken to Sabine about how Deathwatch freed him from Palpatine. I bet he becomes a player in the Siege.

[Marcello]

He was freed in the comic "Darth Maul - Son of Dathomir". Maybe they'll animate some scenes from it for the opening montage and mention his breakout in the episode, but I wouldn't expect much more.

[Badnik Zero]

On 7/23/2018 at 1:35 PM, Marcello said:

He was freed in the comic "Darth Maul - Son of Dathomir". Maybe they'll animate some scenes from it for the opening montage and mention his breakout in the episode, but I wouldn't expect much more.

I'm not sure the comic matters. For continuity’s sake between series, they’re gonna want to include his breakout. For anyone who didn’t read the comic his arc is a big question mark between Clone Wars and Rebels. Deathwatch will no doubt play a part in these episodes. Their arc will likely include him. Especially given his recent appearance in other media, they’re gonna want to include Maul in this series.

Actually, speaking of arcs, do you guys think it’ll be more like the Netflix season, with “movie” length 4-parters, or a more cohesive collection of individual episodes? I don’t really prefer the movie style, because it limits the amount of character POV, if you know what I mean.

[Marcello]

The comic does matter. It's based on unused scripts from Clone Wars and was the first piece of media to be included in the current canon. They'll just expect people to have read it, just like they did with Solo. Except that they'll expect more people who are watching the new episodes to have read the comics since both have a smaller, more dedicated audience.

I'm not sure exactly what you mean with your second part. At this point of the series, they were only doing 4-parters, so everything here will most likely be that way, too. Though, I guess there's the question of if each arc will be split into 4 episodes or if one arc will be cut together into one big episode, allowing more arcs in the 12 episodes.

I expect it to be 3 4-part arcs with 22-minute episodes, though.

[Patticus]

They'll most likely talk about his breakout during the arc's opening newsreel-style monologue, if anything. That's always been sufficient to slap a sizable wad of context and exposition onto other stories. And yes, the comic does matter - they won't want to tread on the toes of the media released after the show was cancelled.

[Mick]

I still haven't gotten around to watching episodes 7, 8 and Rogue One.  I have watched the movie about Han Solo.  I will say that I enjoyed it very much.  I know many Star Wars fans were utterly disappointed by it.  I was not disappointed by it.

[Patticus]

Odd, I've not heard of anyone who was disappointed in it. Although, being a new Star Wars, it wouldn't surprise me at all. Rogue One is every bit as good, and while episodes 8 & 9 aren't super popular with fans, I found both very enjoyable.

[Solister]

1 minute ago, Patticus said:

Odd, I've not heard of anyone who was disappointed in it. Although, being a new Star Wars, it wouldn't surprise me at all. Rogue One is every bit asgood, and while episodes 8 & 9 aren't super popular with fans, I found both very enjoyable.

I think he meant the fact that the movie had lower opening box than Rogue One. Wait... Star Wars 9 already is out? I think you meant 7 & 8.

Talking about the subject now. As being someone who born after the prequels (I'm from 2003), I must say that I'm mostly satisfied with this new movies. Rogue One is still my favorite, much like followed by Episode VI and V. It's been a while I don't watch the prequels (I think the last one was Episode 2 when I was only 10 years old, now I'm 15). Being veeery sincere now, and after analyzing and reviewing my thoughts, I fell the Spin-Offs series are going better than the sequel ones. Rogue One was incredible, meanwhile Solo had some great highs, and a few lows. As many people said, VII was mostly a re-record of IV, but I've enjoyed at all. I think I put too much hype on VIII and now I disliked it.

But something I fell after re-watching a few scenes of Rogue One and Episode VII I often found on TV, I fell the movies are quite getting more of the same. Like, very similar spaceship battles and scenarios. I'm thinking now, how easily I could confuse any scene of Rey, Jyn or Q'ira on a desert.

[Teoskaven]

News and updates from the Disney Investor Day:

*new series announced: an Ashoka Tano solo series and Rangers of the New Republic that are set around the same time as The Mandalorian, both handled by Jon Favreau and Dave Filoni; Lando Calrissian is getting his own series, The Acolyte will be a mystery series around the time of the fall of the republic, A Droid Story will be an animated series about R2-D2 and C3-PO; Andor is a prequel to Rogue One and Visions will be a collection of anime shorts.
*the Obi Wan Kenobi series begins production on March 2021, Hayden Christensen set to return as Anakin Skywalker
*new animated series, The Bad Batch, based on the squad introduced in the last season of Clone Wars.
*Taika Watiti is directing a new untitled movie, while Patty Jenkins is directing a Rogue Squadron movie that will be released in December 2023

[Shadow Chaos Control]

Did anyone see The Mandalorian Season 2 Finale? 

It was epic. 

[Patticus]

Mando season 2 as a whole was top tier Star Wars, between all the fantastic cameos, our boi Din being a total badass thoughout, and great fan service that didn't come across as being too much. Plus Bill Burr's phenomenal performance as Mayfeld.  The finale was outstanding, despite the shaky quality of the deep fake - I couldn't have conceived of any better a second season than this. The tradition of Star Wars shows having okay first seasons and outstanding second seasons continues.

Stuff you might not have heard...

- Lando, Obi-Wan Kenobi and Ahsoka are all limited run shows, likely just a season or two each. Lando was described as an "event series."

- Bad Batch looks like a direct sequel to the Clone Wars. The logo swap at the end of the sizzle reel trailer seems to confirm it:

(Yes, that is a young Fennec Shand, and a young Tarkin.)

- If BB is a TCW sequel, it is possible that it will take the same format - mostly following the journey of a handful of main characters, with a few forays into other characters' stories. Cad Bane and Boba Fett were due to have a climactic bounty hunter showdown in TCW S7 before the show was initially cancelled -- the unfinished episode animatic is now up on YouTube. I hold out hope that the episode will be resurrected for Bad Batch, with more bounty hunter stories being woven into the show. Hard to say if that'll happen, though.

- The Acolyte takes place 80-50 years before TPM at the end of the High Republic era - the same era that's got new novels from Claudia Grey and Charles Soule (among others?) that are set 300ish years before the prequels - the era is long and the stories many. Acolyte seems to have a predominantly female cast, which bodes well, given that Star Wars does female badasses incredibly well; Padme, Leia, Asajj Ventress, Ahsoka, Sabine, Bo-Katan, Rey, Rose, etc.

 

[Teoskaven]

 

Teaser for the shorts attached to Star Wars Visions. Between Studio Trigger working on two of them, having a homage to Astroboy and having a short with Takashi Okazaki as the character design, i'm definetly interested in this.