Should we have another game where we can raise chao?

[Blacklightning]

You know, it doesn't really speak volumes for the confidence people have in a gimmick when you're actively telling others they should just ignore it. If it's really as simple as you say (it isn't), then surely they could be developing a system that isn't entirely arbitary and contradictary to the point of the game while they're at it.

[Chauvel]

I say yes only because I'm a bit biased. I was the type of person who ate up things like giga pets, nintendogs, or any type of virtual pet simulator. Does it belong in a Sonic game... no, not at all. Would it be nice? Sure, why not. As long as it doesn't effect the main game in anyway and raising a Chao is optional, I don't see why it would be a problem to include it like a little bonus mini game.

Edited February 25, 2013 by Scarz

[Tani Coyote]

You know, it doesn't really speak volumes for the confidence people have in a gimmick when you're actively telling others they should just ignore it.

 

I'm acknowledging the fact the fanbase is hard to please and so there really should be things that can get ignored. I want more cutscenes and chao garden. If people don't like that, there should be the option to skip such. Everybody wins!

 

If it's really as simple as you say (it isn't)

 

I find it really hard to believe that a Chao Garden can hold a candle to the work that goes into the rest of the game. I need some actual numbers here.

[Blacklightning]

I'm acknowledging the fact the fanbase is hard to please and so there really should be things that can get ignored. I want more cutscenes and chao garden. If people don't like that, there should be the option to skip such. Everybody wins!

Not when you can make Chao gameplay that actually meshes in some way with the existing game to appeal to the better part of both. Making it a completely irrelevant, non-offensive gimmick that could easily have been its own thing and saying "oh well you don't need to play it" just begs the question of why it's even there in the first place and what purpose it serves in the grand scheme of things. It's such a non-argument that I honestly don't understand how people can take themselves seriously saying it.

 

I'm not saying I want Chao gone, mind you. Is there something inherently wrong with wishing for a Chao mechanic that doesn't actively clash with the rest of the game?

 

 

I find it really hard to believe that a Chao Garden can hold a candle to the work that goes into the rest of the game. I need some actual numbers here.

Comparing a game full of FMVs and miles-long arcitecture and a virtual pet sim only makes one seem easier by comparison - despite my distaste for the latter it's easy to acknowledge that the AI is quite complex to the point that there are some things still not entirely understood about it, and you know as well as I do that they only try to better it should they ever try again. AI's a very tricky subject too, arguably the hardest you can find in a programming environment, and that's assuming the gameplay engine is built with that kind of complexity in mind. Remember that this is a series where something as simple as removing touch-of-death and making robots actually make animated swings at you was considered an innovation as far as Sonic is concerned (not that I've seen it again since Unleashed day, to my recollection).

 

But really, this is just dancing around my point. If Chao are in the game they ought to have some relevance and/or resemblance to the bigger part of the game like a good gimmick does. Removing the game's dependence on it is really just a band-aid fix and just a step short of outright admitting they fucked the whole thing up.

[Tani Coyote]

They were somewhat relevant in Adventure 1, for certain. They were creatures that seem to form colonies around Chaos energy. They were actually plot relevant, given that they were for Chaos what Maria was for Shadow: an excuse to go from a docile creature to a genocidal monster.

 

Not sure why they made it into 2 or any game beyond that. They seem to be there purely for nostalgia.

 

This can be chalked up as another thing Sega should probably divulge some details on. Exactly what are they?

[Blacklightning]

I... was actually referring to them on a gameplay basis. Considering shoehorning a pet sim into a speedy platform constitutes part of a genre roulette (even if one that can work independent of the rest of the game) I figured that would go without saying, but I guess I should've been clearer on that.

 

That is a pretty good point though. I figured just using them for the multiplayer component of the game would be enough, but some references or roles in the plot might not hurt that much depending on where they go with it.

 

Exactly what are they?

Aliens.

[Badnik Zero]

I don't know why I'm so inclined to say no to Chao - I wouldn't mind cute mini-games in Sonic. Like the boat travel business in Rush Adventure was really not bad to me, it was fun. It was a minute of screen tapping between levels. But I don't see Chao as a mini-game, it's freakin' complicated. There's a whole system involved with hidden values and you gotta sink hours into it, you invest so much in it. In the end I gotta ask what the value of it is if it only appeals to niche players. And here's why I brought up Tamagotchis - that kinda thing was absolutely not niche in 1999, virtual pets were in high demand and flying off store shelves. But there's no trend for Sega to ride anymore, Chao don't have the same appeal as they did ten years ago. I know it seems natural to some that there are pet raising games in everything Sonic titled Adventure but it's like, what if you could have your own herb garden in Resident Evil, and grow your own herbs right? So I hear people saying, well why not. But the rest of us are saying, well why the fuck would I want to do that?

Edited February 28, 2013 by American Ristar

[Blacklightning]

That's one way of putting it. But the thing about Resi Evil is that it's not the kind of survival game that's built around being rooted to one spot, micromanaging supplies and waiting for stuff in some description to be ready for you to use. Slow paced though it may be, you still have a set goal to progress to at any given time, and those kinds of hunting/farming kinds of things are seen as a pointless barrier of sorts, particularly when it's been established from the beginning when you can just pick healing items up in ready-to-use form to start with, at best mixing two of them for better results at the press of a button. The difference that makes this practice tolerable in say, Minecraft or Skyrim, is that the goals are set entirely by the player, and the game rarely pressures you to complete them at anything other than your own pace.

 

This leads back to one of the big reasons Chao Gardens stick out against the rest of the game - they're an anomaly in pacing and structure. Even when it comes back down to the way they influence the main game more often than not you're forced to stop completely or backtrack in order to get Chaos Drives that you probably missed on the first pass, and it doesn't reward any skills you learned naturally through the course of the game - namely the ones necessary to attain consistent A ranks. And I think I've already made it quite clear how badly the gardens themselves fit in with the rest of the game, but I still think it begs emphasis to point out its lack of fast pacing, total absence of platforming, zero emphasis on pathfinding and ofttimes an almost complete absence of interactivity altogether, and ask what part of this exactly is supposed to appeal to the target audience. Which isn't something I'd ordinarily ask of a side game on every occasion, but considering its mechanics actually depend on the main game it more or less requires the audience to be fans of both for the latter to work, which is really asking a lot when there's that kind of dissonance between them.

 

Ultimately I don't mind people advocating for Chao to return, but I think everyone needs to take a good, long look at what they used to be, and question whether they really need to be a pet sim to work. Considering their modular nature I think they'd work perfectly fine as an avatar of sorts, but to each their own I say.

[BlueMist]

I rather enjoyed the Chao as well and wouldn't mind their return but like the others have said it doesn't really fit Sonic. It was a really big pace breaker for the kind of game Sonic is, maybe even more then the Werehog was... Actually now that I think about it, if Sega made Chao a separte game series with more complex things in it plus with a lot more extras...I'd be all over that!

 

What I'm saying is I don't really mind the Chao in Sonic games, just let it not be a important part of the game. *coughlookatmysigniturefreakingSA2emblemscough*

yeah if sega brought out a game just for chao or they brought out an app for it that would be amazing but i still dont mind them in sonic games

[Tani Coyote]

yeah if sega brought out a game just for chao or they brought out an app for it that would be amazing but i still dont mind them in sonic games

 

Actually with the popularity of the Sims and the Chao Garden concept, I'm amazed SEGA hasn't compromised and released a Chao-themed game separately in this day and age. It'll please the Adventure crowd, make a quick buck, and avoid bogging down the main titles.

 

Heck, for all we know maybe it could catch on and become more mainstream if sufficiently addictive. Before we know it we'll get ChaoCity.

[Aquaslash]

I always thought it was a nifty idea, so yes. Just don't tie it to the game advancement.

 

This in a mother freaking nutshell.  I personally enjoyed the whole aspect of Chao.  Farming the levels to get animals, spending the otherwise completely useless after the fact rings I picked up, making the chao look like Sonic and Friends, competing with other chao.  It was my Minecraft before there was minecraft.

 

Just keep it free of game advancement, as in not needed to beat the game to the fullest, and it's a win win for everyone.

 

Except maybe achievement whores.  Give it a bunch of simple achievements.

 

EDIT: OMG MAKE IT A PHONE APP.  I will be on that slag all damn day.

Edited March 24, 2013 by Kyoryu Aqua

[Frank Sinatra]

I don't have a problem with them making a game for just raising Chao but I would most likely not buy it, the 3DS seems the perfect system for it though. But really i'm not sure the idea is substantial enough to warrant it's own game, 

[Tani Coyote]

I don't have a problem with them making a game for just raising Chao but I would most likely not buy it, the 3DS seems the perfect system for it though. But really i'm not sure the idea is substantial enough to warrant it's own game, 

 

People have an unhealthy desire for simulations over the real thing. The popularity of the Sims and the plethora of virtual child care games can attest to this.

 

Logically a Chao game, being a pet simulator, would be able to find enough of a following to warrant its development. It wouldn't be game of the year but really, what is the likes of Pokemon besides a game where you catch and raise a bunch of fake pets to fight each other?

[SkyLlama]

People have an unhealthy desire for simulations over the real thing.

 

This is only proven when you consider that such games as Farm Simulator, Bus Simulator and others exist while selling well.

 

As far as a chao game goes though? I think something like that would make an excelent portible game for the iPhone.

[Generations]

Yes. Raising chao was so fun, and it's a great thing to do after you've beaten the main game.

[Tani Coyote]

This is only proven when you consider that such games as Farm Simulator, Bus Simulator and others exist while selling well.

 

Never mind those cases of people spending so much time on simulation games they forget about real life, like that one Korean couple who forgot about their real baby while raising a virtual one.

 

Grim as that is, the ultimate fact is simulators sell. Presumably because they let you do things you can't do in actual life.

 

As far as a chao game goes though? I think something like that would make an excelent portible game for the iPhone.

 

Most definitely. Mobile gaming is lucrative because it takes advantage of the fact people often have long commutes. If you're not driving, you're taking mass transit, and if you're not one for striking up a conversation with people you'll never see again, it's best to be able to whip out your phone and play something on it.

 

So, mobile could definitely be a good platform for a chao game.

[SkyLlama]

Never mind those cases of people spending so much time on simulation games they forget about real life, like that one Korean couple who forgot about their real baby while raising a virtual one.

 

That happened? Crazy. Now Ive got to go search it up.

 

I can't imagine getting involved with a game to the point for forgeting the things I have to do.

 

Most definitely. Mobile gaming is lucrative because it takes advantage of the fact people often have long commutes. If you're not driving, you're taking mass transit, and if you're not one for striking up a conversation with people you'll never see again, it's best to be able to whip out your phone and play something on it.

 

So, mobile could definitely be a good platform for a chao game.

 

Yep. I also see mobile games as good because they can help introduce people to a series such as Sonic who would have never bothered playing console games. The casual gaming market is one that too many people complain about, but it's also to big to ignore.

 

I like mobile games because they're different from console games. Sometimes I just want to have a quick game of something and what better then on a phone or a tablet?

 

Plus it gives the rest of us something fun to do while on the bus, like you said.

Edited March 26, 2013 by SkyLlama

[Tani Coyote]

That happened? Crazy. I'm now going to have to go search it up.

 

I can't imagine getting involved with a game to the point for forgeting the things I have to do.

 

Long story short, the baby eventually passed away due to neglect. But ahem, more on topic and on a brighter note...

 

Sims are addicting! They are definitely a viable market.

 

Yep. I also see mobile games as good because they can help introduce people to a series such as Sonic who would have never bothered playing console games. The casual gaming market is one that too many people complain about, but it's also to big to ignore.

 

This is probably the best argument for mobile titles; they have a very low barrier to entry for both producer and consumer. They're lower cost than an HD title, and also very low cost for the casual gamer. You can pay only a few dollars instead of 50; the average consumer will readily part with small amounts rather than large ones, regardless of the overall efficiency of the purchase.

 

So mobile gaming definitely would be a good way to reel people into the franchise... maybe they'll like it so much they get an actual title.

[Neens]

in any case! I loved raising Chaos so much, that was the main reason why I couldn't put the two Adventure games away! It was awesome.

[Jolt_TH]

How would one make a chap title though?

I can't see how you could farm for animals/chaos drives/something else on a phone? Unless you were to use rings to buy fruit and crap, just how would you earn rings because I HATE games with a vengeance where it is nigh on impossible to do anything with any degree of advancement for months because its faster to just buy whatever you need with real money. I pay for the games not so I CAN play the game :/

[Blacklightning]

I can't see how you could farm for animals/chaos drives/something else on a phone?

Just... make another set of gamemodes that rewards you with them? We had this sorted out as early as the Tiny Chao Gardens... even if most of them were admittedly crap.

If it were up to me, I'd just MMOify the Chao Races and such, regularly setting up matches with other players and being rewarded Chaos Drives and such for participating. Because fuck microtransations, seriously.

[Tani Coyote]

If it were up to me, I'd just MMOify the Chao Races and such, regularly setting up matches with other players and being rewarded Chaos Drives and such for participating.

 

Stuff like this would be a good way to earn prizes. While microtransactions should be available for those who have money to burn, it should still be viable to obtain goodies through non-paying means.

 

As another idea, with how many Sonic mobiles there are at this point, have it so you can spend rings earned in Jump or Dash on things in the Chao sim. Same as the old Adventure titles, playing through the regular gameplay should yield rewards in the Chao gameplay.

 

To help things further have it so a Chaos Drive or something is given every few days of play.

 

Just a few ideas, anyway.