My Reaction to The Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time

[Kuzu]

I never bothered to explore TP's overworld, aside from curiosity. Most of the time I just found rupees and nothing else really. OoT is probably the worse tho, it's so BOOORING. 3D Hubworlds just aren't very good in Zelda games if I'm honest. Even the Great Sea got boring after a while.

[Conando]

That's why I liked Skyward Sword, they basically just went "fuck it" and chose to make them more dungeon like rather than barren field of nothing. The last Hyrule Field I really liked was from like...Minish Cap? I think.

[Old dead account]

I can play the original OoT still, but OoT3D is simply a much more polished game in terms of controls, glitches, visuals etc. I would not call it badly aged yet but it has definitely aged in the dungeon design department. Newer games simply have (for the most part) much better dungeon design. I suppose Twilight Princess would be a better choice for you then.

 

Now that I think about it I haven't played ALttP in 5 years.

[-Mark-]

That's why I liked Skyward Sword, they basically just went "fuck it" and chose to make them more dungeon like rather than barren field of nothing. The last Hyrule Field I really liked was from like...Minish Cap? I think.

 

That's one of the main things that actually really annoyed me in Skyward Sword, personally.

 

Perhaps it's just due to being conditioned as such through every previous Zelda game, but I actually quite liked the fact that the fields were a change of pace from the dungeons. Sure, they were slower and bordered on dull if done badly, but it was a bit of downtime to take things at a more relaxed pace. Skyward Sword just won't let up. It keeps throwing stuff at you non-stop and basically plays like a game full of dungeons for the most part. 

 

It might not have been so bad (since Minish Cap did this to an extent, and I loved it), except in Skyward Sword's case, most of it was stupidly unnecessary yet compulsory fetch-quests that were painfully and obviously forced in to artificially lengthen the game.

[Speederino]

That's one of the main things that actually really annoyed me in Skyward Sword, personally.

 

Perhaps it's just due to being conditioned as such through every previous Zelda game, but I actually quite liked the fact that the fields were a change of pace from the dungeons. Sure, they were slower and bordered on dull if done badly, but it was a bit of downtime to take things at a more relaxed pace. Skyward Sword just won't let up. It keeps throwing stuff at you non-stop and basically plays like a game full of dungeons for the most part. 

 

It might not have been so bad (since Minish Cap did this to an extent, and I loved it), except in Skyward Sword's case, most of it was stupidly unnecessary yet compulsory fetch-quests that were painfully and obviously forced in to artificially lengthen the game.

 

Exactly. I LOVE the exploration element of Zelda, and Skyward Sword just didn't really have that going for it. They could have done something great with the world of Skyloft, but instead it's just a bunch of small, boring rocks that don't house anything except treasure chests. Treasure chests that you have to unlock first and then just show up on the map regardless. There's no incentive for me to want to fly around and see what's on that distant island. By all means, say what you will about Twilight Princess's large fields, at least I could blow up a rock and find a mini-dungeon or something. Skyloft only has a few mini-games.  :/

Edited March 18, 2013 by Speederino

[Diogenes]

That's why I liked Skyward Sword, they basically just went "fuck it" and chose to make them more dungeon like rather than barren field of nothing. The last Hyrule Field I really liked was from like...Minish Cap? I think.

Yeah but...the sky.

Now, Majora's Mask, that was a game that did away with the expansive pointless overworld. Termina Field was the closest equivalent, and it's a fairly small ring. Clock Town is the central hub, and the other 4 main areas (plus the ranch) are easily accessible from it. And those 4 areas are all kind of dungeon-like in themselves, as you work your way to the actual dungeons.

And while Wind Waker went the opposite direction and gave us a massive overworld...it still managed to fit in a lot of stuff to do, with so many islands, sunken treasure, the little impromptu rupee collecting minigame, etc. And hell worst case scenario you can pretty much set the controller down once you're pointed in the right direction, rather than having to manage Epona's stamina and actually navigate terrain.

[lounge]

I found Wind Waker's hub the most tedious of all the 3d games. It just takes too long to get to the islands. That and I have no idea which islands will have something important, or if I can do anything useful after clearing sections of the game. I loved the changing weather, but I never actually explored all the islands. And to warp you have to find that fish on each quadrant and put some bait... a real pain for me.

 

That's why I preferred The Sky because I could pretty much keep track of everything because your map would actually tell you if you could get something special after clearing a section of the game. Flying was more engaging than sailing, and it didn't take long to get anywhere. The Great Sea didn't have this, so exploring (unless you bumped into an island while on your way to the next section of the game) wasn't as interesting for me. I didn't like the whole finding a treasure map concept. Going to the exact spot where it was marked and everything, it was just too tedious and time consuming for me.

 

Twilight Princess's hub while kind of barren, it was still fun to ride around, look at the landscape and find caves. It wouldn't be so bad if there weren't so many stupid rupees. "Hey I found a cave!... oh just some rupees, and my wallet is maxed out..." I still preferred it to the Great Sea though.

[Diogenes]

And to warp you have to find that fish on each quadrant and put some bait... a real pain for me.

Unless I've completely missed/forgotten some mechanic, no; you just had to find a big cyclone after getting the bow, shoot down the frog god, and you'd get the warp song, and be able to warp to any of the available spots.

Flying was more engaging than sailing,

The only sense I'd say it's more engaging is that you're required to keep your focus on it; it isn't any more interesting to do or to look at (quite the opposite, imo).

[lounge]

Unless I've completely missed/forgotten some mechanic, no; you just had to find a big cyclone after getting the bow, shoot down the frog god, and you'd get the warp song, and be able to warp to any of the available spots.

The only sense I'd say it's more engaging is that you're required to keep your focus on it; it isn't any more interesting to do or to look at (quite the opposite, imo).

Oh sorry, I meant to warp to a specific island. The cyclone warps to a few random important spots.

 

As for flying, I like the feeling of flapping all the way to the top and then diving to gain speed and going thru those boost rocks. It's was just more engaging and gave me more freedom. Sailing is more restricted. You can change the camera angles to make it more cinematic, but that's about it.

[Diogenes]

Oh sorry, I meant to warp to a specific island.

Yeah unless I've missed something, I don't think you can do this?

As for flying, I like the feeling of flapping all the way to the top and then diving to gain speed and going thru those boost rocks. It's was just more engaging and gave me more freedom. Sailing is more restricted. You can change the camera angles to make it more cinematic, but that's about it.

You can make the boat jump. Also sometimes there's enemies and sometimes there's rupees, and it's a lot prettier.

[Conando]

Flying is more fun than sailing but, due to the smaller focus on a huge field area, there wasn't much exploration. If they can make the next game not have an empty field, and allow flying; then HOLY RAT SHIT YES.

[Diogenes]

I dunno, flying means not interacting with most things. Kinda boring.

[Nepenthe]

Well yeah, but it's fucking flying. I mean, flight. One of the pinnacles of human dreams and innovation. On a bird companion you can control. What else do you want?

I honestly never got an overwhelming sense of desolation or boredom from flying. It's a mix of the controls, the orchestral theme, and all of the little islands you can visit and discover that makes the whole experience joyous. My only issue is that I'd wish they'd done more with it, like another boss or more games and tasks to do. I mean, it'd be awesome to earn the privilege to be able to fly at night and stop wasting the knights' time. xP

 

[Wraith]

My favorite overworld has to be Twilight Princess's Hyrule Field.

 

 

Because sniping enemies with your  while riding across the field on your horse is fun, goddamn it.

 

I didn't even mind making some of the longer trips in the game because I liked picking on the enemies.

 

 

The Sky is also a favorite of mine, since the landing points are a short distance away so I don't have to take forever getting to them.

[Kuzu]

Gotta agree, Flying is one of the most exhilarating things ever, even if you're not interacting much, it's still an incredible thing.

[Diogenes]

Well yeah, but it's fucking flying. I mean, flight. One of the pinnacles of human dreams and innovation. On a bird companion you can control. What else do you want?

Yeah I get that, by all rights it should be great...but it's not. Flight is kind of hard to do well in a game I think, because games (obviously) lack the physical sensations of doing a thing, and flight removes a lot of the surrounding context that would otherwise patch the gaps, since you rarely interact with anything. It's possible to do it well, but SS just doesn't have the right feedback to make it work.

I honestly never got an overwhelming sense of desolation or boredom from flying. It's a mix of the controls, the orchestral theme, and all of the little islands you can visit and discover that makes the whole experience joyous.

Eh, I thought the controls kinda sucked (one of those instances of putting waggle where it doesn't belong), and the rest is either matched or exceeded by Wind Waker. Plus WW has gorgeous blues rather than dull browns.

[lounge]

Yeah unless I've missed something, I don't think you can do this?

Hmm, I guess the game didn't allow warps for any quadrant then. I could've sworn it did. I do remember it revealed the name of the island.

It's funny cause I felt Twilight Princess had too many warp points, which didn't allow you to use epona as much for the main quest, unless you wanted to actually explore.

[Wraith]

It's funny cause I felt Twilight Princess had too many warp points, which didn't allow you to use epona as much for the main quest, unless you wanted to actually explore.

 

Can't you just not use the Warp points and ride epona everywhere?

[G-Force]

Can't you just not use the Warp points and ride epona everywhere?

Yes and no. 

 

Technically, you CAN continue to rely on Epona after you get permanent access to warping, but the problem is that the game world is pretty poorly interconnected.  You can explore Hyrule Field with her, and that's basically it.  A bunch of areas are arbitrarily blocked off for her and/or are connected in stupid ways, like how Lake Hylia's entrance requires you to pay money for a minigame, and getting back to the field requires you to pay to get shot out of a cannon.

 

The game world was clearly designed around the fact that you're able to warp freely.

Edited March 19, 2013 by G-Force

[Soniman]

Flying can be fucking amazing if they do it right. I still think the Skyward Sword Levias boss battle was one of the best bosses in the series and it shows how fucking amazing flying can be when used to it's full potential.

[lounge]

Can't you just not use the Warp points and ride epona everywhere?

What's the point? If I need to get to Hyrule Castle, and I'm all the way on the other side, I might as well warp. If I want to get to kakariko, I just warp. The game is obviously designed to not force backtracking. My guess is they were scared if they didn't cluster areas with warp points, that new players would give up and get tired. It's designed as the more convenient choice, so naturally any person would use them. If you read the interviews on zelda in general, you'll see that they always design each new game so as to not frustrate new comers.

An example was how they had a warp point right outside of kakariko village and one inside the village. I mean what was the point of that? If the average player is just playing thru the main quest, this won't really allow them to ride thru the fields and appreciate the beauty of the game engine. You don't really even get to watch the beautiful sunset changing because of all the warp points.

 

And as for the flying, you're not supposed to hold the wii remote the same way you would when normally playing the game. This is why some people say it's a pain. I really wish people would experiment.

[Goldenlink64]

What's the point? If I need to get to Hyrule Castle, and I'm all the way on the other side, I might as well warp. If I want to get to kakariko, I just warp. The game is obviously designed to not force backtracking. My guess is they were scared if they didn't cluster areas with warp points, that new players would give up and get tired. It's designed as the more convenient choice, so naturally any person would use them. If you read the interviews on zelda in general, you'll see that they always design each new game so as to not frustrate new comers.

An example was how they had a warp point right outside of kakariko village and one inside the village. I mean what was the point of that? If the average player is just playing thru the main quest, this won't really allow them to ride thru the fields and appreciate the beauty of the game engine. You don't really even get to watch the beautiful sunset changing because of all the warp points.

 

The entire point of the warp points was to make riding Epona mostly optional and I think was mostly in response to Wind Waker's HUGE overworld which got a lot of criticism/backlash. Lots of people love to complain about how boring TP's overworld is, so the game doesn't really force them to explore it. Meanwhile, if you're like me and LOVE the overworld, you don't have to use the Warp points (and I rarely do, unless it's to the Gerudo Desert place).

 

Seriously though, am I the only one who actually enjoyed the hell out of riding on Epona throughout the field. People keep calling it empty, I thought it was just fine provided the entire thing was optimized for riding on Epona. Now if you're traveling on foot... okay, I think I might see the problem there, but seriously, just ride the horse, it's fun. :/

 

Maybe I just have more patience than most gamers, since I rarely used the warp points in Far Cry 3 or even Wind Waker. If you give me a beautiful overworld, I'm gonna explore it. Warping always kinda feels like I'm cheating myself out of the experience anyway...

Edited March 19, 2013 by Goldenlink64

[Diogenes]

My guess is they were scared if they didn't cluster areas with warp points, that new players would give up and get tired.

I wouldn't call myself a new player, but I'd still consider it a point against the game if it didn't have warps. TP's overworld is huge, ugly, and boring. Having to travel from one end of mudville to the other on horseback is not my idea of a good time.

An example was how they had a warp point right outside of kakariko village and one inside the village. I mean what was the point of that?

The first was for the bridge puzzle, the second is more convenient if you've got business in town (which you often do). Not the most efficient use of warp points, but not something I'd consider a problem.

And as for the flying, you're not supposed to hold the wii remote the same way you would when normally playing the game. This is why some people say it's a pain. I really wish people would experiment.

Believe me I have tried. It's a pain because it's awkward waggly bullshit, not because of which way I'm holding the controller.

[Nepenthe]

Not sure how the flying is awkward. Half of the time, I'm not waggling anyway, just making gentle turns. Gaining height's just a matter of rhythmic flaps- a single up motion- which are basically timed out for you by the sound of the Loftwing. Flying actually feels physically good to me, miles better than that crappy cave segment in TP at least.