Amicable Sonic Unleashed Status Updates Discussion - Mod Approved.

[Semi-colon e]

And things like attaching like hawks to a badly-placed Godwin's law to completely ignore what was being said and cackle instead is pretty sad to see.

 

 

I wasn't calling it out to be funny or to ignore the overall message. It was an event that rubbed many people the wrong way even if they weren't bothered by the stuff before. It was one of those "hold up that's not on" kind of things.

Edited May 6, 2013 by Semi-colon e

[SenEDDtor Missile]

I wasn't calling it out to be funny or to ignore the overall message. It was an event that rubbed many people the wrong way even if they weren't bothered by the stuff before.

And like I've said, I acted rashly and without any thought of the consequences, and I apologize for saying it or allowing the thought to enter my head to begin with.

[Nepenthe]

On the other hand, I've personally seen statuses directly attacking the game and have not been too bothered. Unleashit doesn't rile me up, and if anything I remember having fun mutually ribbing Colors fans in this vain. My problem stems from when Unleashed fans are directly addressed as being having opinions without merit or being idiotic. Not only do I remember several statuses directly calling us out, but I'm roughly 90% sure of the person who posted them (once I get on a computer, I'll go about digging them up.) As I stated before, I think this argument has transcended the game and is now about going on about other members instead, which I don't find tolerable.

[Mauro Fonseca]

Oh no I'm not saying your post here, I'm saying in the status, where Missile made a whole post that, in a dumb decision that he immediately regretted, ended in a godwin invocation.

 

All the following statuses, instead of ignoring or commenting on what Missile attempted to say, decided to instead go "lel Hitler? Are you for real?"

 

It's the equivalent of a guy saying "Guys can we tolk about this game" and 10 replies saying ">tolk learn some grammar man"

[spinny]

Okay, this post is gonna be really out of character for me.

 

Oh boy, here I go.

First of all, let me say the most important part. People have a right to some little things called OPINIONS. Now onto my personal view on this.

 

Okay, for the record, I've played Unleashed a LOT more than Colours, I can SEE why people dislike it, I can also see why people like it. It's really just a mixed bag, a VERY mixed one, and I honestly can't see why the Unleashed fans are being attacked THIS much for liking a game which is TECHNICALLY decent. Bringing in the '06 fanboys/girls doesn't defend jack shit, considering that game wasn't even freaking finished and is TECHNICALLY bad. Is the Werehog game-breakingly glitchy and terrible? NO. It isn't. Is the whole of '06 game-breakingly glitchy and terrible? YES. It is.

 

I personally prefer Unleashed over Colours, even though I do acknowledge that Colours had the benefit of being wide, open, and LOTS of platforming. But no speed. Unleashed? Platforming and speed, but no exploration. (inb4 shitty "UNLEASHED HAD PLATFORMING!? OMG!!! XDDDDD IM HILARIOUS" joke, go play Dragon Road Day, Jungle Joyride Day, Eggmanland, or any Night-time stage, and zip it. 

 

Now all of those "examples" used in the OP however... did you ACTUALLY take those seriously!? "UnleaSHIT"? You took that seriously? Look, Unleashed defenders can be considered at fault for these debates too. Getting riled up over a silly joke like that is pathetic. If someone legitimately unfairly insulted the game, maybe I would understand. That's why I never read the Vs. threads.

 

People can have different opinions, and I don't understand why this is argued about so freaking much. I've seen several stati say "why do people care about the ones who like 06", yet no-one defends the Unleashed fanbase, and it is, to be honest, unfair. This is a forum where we discuss Sonic games, not hate on one instalment and tell anyone who likes it to burn themselves. This needs, I repeat, NEEDS to just... end.

Edited May 6, 2013 by Super Spindash

[Lady Soniko]

Unleashed is fucking amazing, go home haterz

 

>:l

[Xenos]

I think the main problem is both sides aren't considering what the actual side is really saying. They see a comment and take it at face value without any thought, and that causes a swift change in direction for any conversation and the tension only gets worse. Unleashed fans may be taking the "jokes" too hard, but there is really no reason for jokes like that if you're trying to have an intelligent discussion. And definitely when the game in question is such a polarizing, controversial game like Unleashed of all things. When you think about it fans would get defensive because it's a game they already have to deal with unnecessary mud-slinging (to them anyway) and baseless bashing. Fans of say, Colors and Generations don't have to deal with that nearly as much.

 

If that keeps going then it won't be long until there is a point where the actual mockeries lead to the people that actually happen to like Unleashed for it's qualities or vice-versa. But I personally haven't seen any of that yet.

[Jolt_TH]

I wasn't part of this status war but it really saddens me that as a community things like this happen. Sure some people may be joking but there is a time when joking gets too far and you need to stop. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, this is a discussion forum, we are meant to discuss, not blindly attack.

Some people don't like Unleashed that's fine, some do, that's also fine. Anyone can like whatever they want it is not coherently "wrong" to like or dislike something that you don't, no amount of mean statuses or attacks at said thing is going to make them change their mind and will always make them blindly defend it. If you lay out your points politely and with valid reasoning then they are much more open to your opinion, you still won't make them change their mind but they are more likely to see your points, maybe agree with some and then lay out some of their own, you might learn something it have a new point if view on an aspect of it.

Unfortunately I see the same thing happening on various threads regarding games, current and missing characters and even gameplay elements, I love reading insightful discussions between members (sure sometimes they can get slightly heated) such as Diogenes, Verte and Nepenthe who I look up to as members ( and have yet to actually develop a decent argument against). Posts by members like these are insightful and respectful to the other party and provide basis for discussion. Unfortunately at the moment I look at most topics wondering how long the peace will last till someone provides their opinion as "truth" or just ignores others posts and points to fit their argument. Some things can be wrong or right, but most things in this fictional universe are completely up to the individual, especially regarding opinions or games and the like.

[Chaos Warp]

I think the main problem is both sides aren't considering what the actual side is really saying. They see a comment and take it at face value without any thought, and that causes a swift change in direction for any conversation and the tension only gets worse. Unleashed fans may be taking the "jokes" too hard, but there is really no reason for jokes like that if you're trying to have an intelligent discussion. And definitely when the game in question is such a polarizing, controversial game like Unleashed of all things. When you think about it fans would get defensive because it's a game they already have to deal with unnecessary mud-slinging (to them anyway) and baseless bashing. Fans of say, Colors and Generations don't have to deal with that nearly as much.

 

If that keeps going then it won't be long until there is a point where the actual mockeries lead to the people that actually happen to like Unleashed for it's qualities or vice-versa. But I personally haven't seen any of that yet.

But why do we always have to be so uptight about having "intelligent" discussion all the time? What's wrong with a little fun? We have plenty of "intelligent" discussion in the various threads of the SSMB all the time.

[Sean]

Yaaaa, to me, this really doesn't have anything to do with what one's opinion of the game is (or even how they go about expressing it, I don't fucking care about the Unleashit stuff). It reminds me a lot of the anti-MLP statuses that happened last year so I have to agree with Nep who brought it up as an example. You can dislike it, you can hate it, you can say whatever you please but there is a definite point where it becomes hostile toward those who do like these things, and a lot of people tend to make these kinds of statuses not because they necessarily want to express an opinion, but rather to get a rile out of someone while they're at it.

[Chaos Warp]

Yaaaa, to me, this really doesn't have anything to do with what one's opinion of the game is (or even how they go about expressing it, I don't fucking care about the Unleashit stuff). It reminds me a lot of the anti-MLP statuses that happened last year so I have to agree with Nep who brought it up as an example. You can dislike it, you can hate it, you can say whatever you please but there is a definite point where it becomes hostile toward those who do like these things, and a lot of people tend to make these kinds of statuses not because they necessarily want to express an opinion, but rather to get a rile out of someone while they're at it.

How can we be sure of this though? People might just wanna make a joke about a game they dislike without any harm or foul. Over the internet, you don't have tone clues and other human mannerisms to judge outside of the words, so it becomes unclear. 

Edited May 6, 2013 by Generations (Chaos Warp)

[SenEDDtor Missile]

Towards the game, not you. The game doesn't have feelings, dose it?

 

I'm sorry I'm kinda calling you out like this, but I've seen you call out a member and blame all the things in the Sonic franchise that you don't like at the moment on him in a status update (and basically saying that assholes like him were to the barriers to what you consider progress, even though I know those won't your exact words), just because he said that he was fine with the safer direction the franchise is going in. I really think you take this too seriously. 

 

I just never saw the point of getting riled up when someone insults a game you like. In the end, even if you're really passionate about games like I and many others are, it's a trivial thing to get insulted over. 

​EDIT: Oh and the "X member has stupid opinions?" comments? Apply same logic. People are just making jokes and they don't actually intend to hurt you. Me and my friends hurl insults at each other as jokes all the time and we're really close friends so I don't see the problem. 

 

And I regret ever doing something so stupid and shaming him for having a different opinion. I was in the wrong in terms of my attitude, and I apologize.

[Mauro Fonseca]

You can't, really.

Which is why you're expected to be aware enough to notice "oh, the ribbing I was about to do in good heart will likely be interpreted as me attempting to be a troll due to the current ambience of the forum. best save it to... 2, 3 months from now, based on how grudges go." Not censoring you or anything, by the way, just saying this as advise.

[Diogenes]

How can we be sure of this though? People might just wanna make a joke about a game they dislike without any harm or foul. Over the internet, you don't have tone clues and other human mannerisms to judge outside of the words, so it becomes unclear.

If it's not clear, that means it's on you to be extra careful about what you say and how you say it. And intending something to be a joke doesn't automatically absolve you of responsibility if it upsets someone.

[Xenos]

But why do we always have to be so uptight about having "intelligent" discussion all the time? What's wrong with a little fun? We have plenty of "intelligent" discussion in the various threads of the SSMB all the time.

Most of the "Intelligent" discussions lately are few and far between if I'm honest...there have been a few good threads but blah.

 

It's nothing about being uptight. I could not give one or two shits if somebody didn't like Unleashed and liked to mock the Werehog, there are a lot of things easy to mock about the Werehog. even though he's totally adorbs

 

There's something wrong with the "fun" when it's at the expense of other people, it's a simple social thing. You just have to honestly try to make sure you aren't looking like a dick when you really don't mean to. It's hard to tell whether someone is trying to get a rile out of people or just poking harmless fun man.

[S Chrono]

Pointless arguments won't get any of you nowhere. Both Unleashed and 06 are still video games, let's just move on and get along.

[SIXTH-RATE SOMA]

Unleashed fans may be taking the "jokes" too hard, but there is really no reason for jokes like that if you're trying to have an intelligent discussion.

 

This is true, of course, but these sorts of things usually happen in the status updates. The same status updates where I asked people what it would be like to have a rocket bum and made stupid sockpuppets of everyone. The statuses have become a sort of designated "joke zone" to many people, where they can just sit back and make stupid wisecracks at each other. No one was trying to have an intelligent discussion when Member X announced that he had been killed by time-traveling demons.

[Cola]

i just thought "UnleaSHIT" was just a really unfunny joke i dunno about you guys

 

can't we all just forget about video games and focus on the more important things in life like watching reruns of oprah

[Xenos]

This is true, of course, but these sorts of things usually happen in the status updates. The same status updates where I asked people what it would be like to have a rocket bum and made stupid sockpuppets of everyone. The statuses have become a sort of designated "joke zone" to many people, where they can just sit back and make stupid wisecracks at each other. No one was trying to have an intelligent discussion when Member X announced that he had been killed by time-traveling demons.

 

That's understandable, I'm not denying the Status Updates are absolutely ridiculous.

 

But when you attach them to threads and then attach them to posts and then attach them to specific incidents in said thread, that's when things get different. Someone is using the Status Updates as a crutch for something involving the thread. And that's nearly always the hair trigger that causes the shit to hit the fan.

 

You could be just right in the middle of the crossfire trying to make harmless fun, but via text it's definitely hard to tell if you get what I mean?

[Jack / Joker]

Generally I'm just sick of the whole fucking thing. I've realized over time that the "side" I've chosen is provoking just as much of a negative reaction as the side I'm "defending" my beliefs from. Believe it or not with all the general Jokery I've done, I hate making people feel bad. And I have made people feel bad... apparently, so for whatever the hell it's worth, I'm sorry to any Unleashed fans whom I have offended, and I'd gladly offer the internet equivalent of a handshake when the other side similarly accepts that quite frankly they're pretty damaging too, whether it be personal insults to my intelligence or generally looking down on me, which they have done on many occasions. I just can't be bothered with any of this anymore, like most of the Unleashed fans actually, because I feel often like so many of the people I share a common opinion with are fitting the bad description of the Colors-only fanbase that I start to worry that I'm just as bad and doubt my own position on the games.

 

I just want it to stop and henceforth I'm going to try to ignore discussion of either game, just because I feel that's the extent it's gotten to. Even though it's small, just trying to get the troops to fall back one step at a time, no?

[Nepenthe]

How can we be sure of this though? People might just wanna make a joke about a game they dislike without any harm or foul. Over the internet, you don't have tone clues and other human mannerisms to judge outside of the words, so it becomes unclear.

Jokes online proceed to cross a line when they're directly aimed at a subset of the community, especially when you consider the broader context surrounding the joke. When someone says "bu-bu-bu atmosphere" it is clear they're directly mocking a strawman of some fans' opinion about the game, because they have inevitably mentioned this in their arguments before. It's not a joke aimed at the game; it's a direct mischaracterization of people's thoughts, same as Green Eyes is a misrepresentation of the opinion of people who dislike Sonic 4. And like Green Eyes, it is meant to mock a person at the end of the day, hence why I and others get upset when we see it, nor do we understand why others essentially tell us it is okay to be publicly mocked and just put up with it.

[Mauro Fonseca]

Basically, in order for the Statuses to keep their "diplomatic" immunity where they can just be wilder nonsense fun, it'd be clever to avoid tying them to the forum itself. I'd say. Stop using them as a means to MST3k the forum, just let them be their own space of song quotes, daily twitterings, and comments about farts.

[SIXTH-RATE SOMA]

That's understandable, I'm not denying the Status Updates are absolutely ridiculous.

 

But when you attach them to threads and then attach them to posts and then attach them to specific incidents in said thread, that's when things get different. Someone is using the Status Updates as a crutch for something involving the thread. And that's nearly always the hair trigger that causes the shit to hit the fan.

 

You could be just right in the middle of the crossfire trying to make harmless fun, but via text it's definitely hard to tell if you get what I mean?

 

That's precisely the point. The members who are just trying to have harmless fun are all mixed in with the people actually trying to cover the place in bile. I think it's best that both sides try and learn precisely where they and others stand on the issue before charging in headfirst.

[Vertekins]

How can we be sure of this though? People might just wanna make a joke about a game they dislike without any harm or foul. Over the internet, you don't have tone clues and other human mannerisms to judge outside of the words, so it becomes unclear. 

 

Because statuses like these;

 

But WAH where's my NPC's and pretentious friendship story" No Stop. All that level detail alone shows that they fucking love this series

 

B-b-b-b-b-b-b-but all the glorious master of everything there ever was and will ever be always THE ATMSPHERE1!

 

ARE clearly done for the sake of both insulting Unleashed fans and for the sake of trying to get a rise out of them. That is not joking and I cannot honestly see how you can see it as that, it's a low-blow at Unleashed fans by stating that they're arguments in defence of Unleashed are meritless when they're nothing of the sort.

 

What I've noticed? The Colours defenders resort to picking on some flaw of Unleashed when Colours is rightly criticized despite Unleashed not being contextual to the point being made. A fine example of this was when Komo innocently inquired in status updates, without any pretense of mockery or any intention to cause controversy, what was banal about Colours' final boss. 'Penthe, me and Dio came out with perfectly rational reasons as to why we believed that that boss wasn't all it was cracked up to be then someone else comes in and starts bringing up Dark Gaia i.e Something in Unleashed DESPITE that not being relevant to the question Komo asked.

 

Now Unleashed fans aren't exactly innocent of doing stuff like this either but then it's stuff like this that makes the 'divide' all that more petty.

Edited May 6, 2013 by Vertekins

[Xenos]

That's precisely the point. The members who are just trying to have harmless fun are all mixed in with the people actually trying to cover the place in bile. I think it's best that both sides try and learn precisely where they and others stand on the issue before charging in headfirst.

 

Then with that, I think I've finished my point pretty nicely...phew.