Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS - Settle It In Smash!

[SuperLink]

That rumour was absolutely bullshit, I was kinda thinking "this sounds like a wishlist" as I read through it and the wording was strange, but "Snake returning as a trophy" really killed it for me.

 

If Nintendo went through the trouble to get Snake's rights and give royalties to Konami for his use, they may as well have gone all the way to make him playable. Him returning as a trophy is soooo unlikely if he's not playable.

[SilentDoom]

I'd much rather Nabbit be an assist trophy than a stage hazard to be honest

[Radiant Hero Ike]

That rumor was ridiculous. K. Rool an Assist Trophy, Mewtwo playable WITH Jigglypuff, despite Greninja being playable already, Snake a trophy only?

 

That actually hurt to read, nyaghh

 

Anyway, NABBIT WOW. That looks like a fun stage hazard.

[dabbido]

I don't see why having Mewtwo AND Jigglypuff makes it unbelievable, I think there's high chances of that happening. But yeah the rest is Bull xP

[Xenos]

Pikachu, Lucario, Jigglypuff, Greninja, Charizard, and Mewtwo?

 

Yeah, no thanks...

[Gabz Girl]

Nabbit is cute, though I hope he's an easily avoidable stage hazard. I don't know if I'd like it much if he grabs you in the bag and it's instant KO.

 

Also, that leak is fake the moment I read Snake is in the game as a trophy. HahahaHAHAHAHAHAno. Forget about it, Snake is not in this game period. There's already three third party characters, highly doubt there will be a fourth added to the mix.

[-Robin-]

Brawl had Pikachu, Jigglypuff, Charizard, Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Lucario, so six Pokemon reps isn't too out there. Especially from a franchise with 720 playable characters in it.

There's no true limit to how many characters from each franchise can be put in, anyway.

[StaticMania]

There's a limit for each game. Also Pokemon would most likely be getting 5 slots or staying at 4 without the excuse of one slot having 2 extras in it.
 

[jords]

I wouldn't be surprised if Pokemon got 6. There is a lot of pokemanz Lol.

Lol snake, he was pretty funny in brawl but I can't see him in the mix of the HD cartoons and him being even more realistic looking Lol.

[SuperLink]

Mario and Pokémon are Nintendo's biggest most popular franchises, them having the most playable characters isn't weird. Mario has 9 playable characters already. Yoshi, Wario and DK may have their "own franchises", but they are still Mario spinoffs. If Mewtwo got his own spinoff series, would it suddenly be "ok" for Pokémon to have more reps because he had his own character logo and stage?

 

I'm pretty confident Mewtwo and Jigglypuff will be playable, and people will complain even though Pokémon is regularly more successful than Mario nowadays.

 

The "slot limit" is also very much unspoken and imaginary. It seemed to exist in Brawl but we all know that Mewtwo was the closest character to being finished out of all the unfinished characters. There isn't really a slot limit. Plus, if Sakurai gave Wario and Yoshi their own "series'" in order to break that supposed slot limit, it means he's more than willing to bend the rules for the most popular franchises.

 

By the way, in the very first Smash Bros. game, the only franchises with multiple reps were... Mario and Pokémon. And even if Pokémon got 6 reps, it'd still be considerably less reps than Mario Universe reps. I really don't see the problem.

[Mr Useful]

. Yoshi, Wario and DK may have their "own franchises", but they are still Mario spinoffs.

Technically, Mario is a DK spin-off. 

 

 

Har Har

[Diogenes]

Mario and Pokémon are Nintendo's biggest most popular franchises, them having the most playable characters isn't weird. Mario has 9 playable characters already. Yoshi, Wario and DK may have their "own franchises", but they are still Mario spinoffs. If Mewtwo got his own spinoff series, would it suddenly be "ok" for Pokémon to have more reps because he had his own character logo and stage?

It wouldn't be Pokemon getting more reps, it'd be Hypothetical Mewtwo Spinoff getting more reps.

[Blitz 'n Burst]

Trying to claim DK and Diddy as Mario characters is grasping for straws. The Donkey Kong franchise has more than set itself apart from the Mario games and barely has any connection to the franchise at all any more.

[SuperLink]

Trying to claim DK and Diddy as Mario characters is grasping for straws. The Donkey Kong franchise has more than set itself apart from the Mario games and barely has any connection to the franchise at all any more.

Both appear in Mario games, you don't get Zelda or Kirby characters in Mario games. They are part of the same universe, claiming they're not part of the same wider franchise is "grasping for straws", regardless of them having their own games.

 

Besides, even if they weren't part of the Mario franchise, Mario would still have 7 Smash Bros. reps. My entire point stands and remains completely valid.

[azoo]

Mario and Pokemon have more than enough reps.

 

I originally cared for Mewtwo to make a return, but if we have both Lucario and Greninja (which share a similar color scheme and body shape, oddly enough), as well as Charizard, Pikachu and the obvious-yet-unannounced Jigglypuff, then all that plus Mewtwo would be six reps, which is way more than necessary.

 

And as for Mario's reps..

 

We have him, Luigi, Peach, Bowser, Yoshi, Rosalina, DK, Diddy, and Wario. That's nine reps. And yes, while Donkey Kong has had the Country series as well as various spinoffs, and Wario's had WarioWare and Wario Land, they're still canonically in the Mario universe. They share some mythos, they have similar gameplay qualities, heck they even make direct references to each other and share enemies / objects at times. And I'm stating that all as if them appearing in Mario's spinoff titles (Party, Kart, the sports games, etc.) didn't already make this clear. 

 

I don't care if Mewtwo would've been good, Waluigi would've been god-tier or whatever. I personally don't want to see any more slots blown on Mario or Pokemon whenever they take up massive chunks of the roster already.

[SuperLink]

I still think 6 reps is totally reasonable for Pokémon considering they had 6 in Brawl and Mario had 7 even back in Melee. Pokémon is huge and is one of the most successful franchises in the world, and is probably currently more successful than Mario, and I don't see a problem at all with Pokémon having 6, especially if that's just one more than Zelda and just one less than Mario.

[Mr Useful]

I'm just joking here but Link is technically a Mario character too.

[Gabz Girl]

I'd love to see Mewtwo join the fight again but Pokemon already having so many reps in SSB4 makes me wonder if he will make a reappearance. Guess we'll just have to wait and see. =[

 

Btw, do we know for certain if Wario is returning? I guess he is since a majority of Brawl's characters are in the game now but, don't you think it's odd that him and Metaknight still haven't been revealed?

[Diogenes]

Both appear in Mario games, you don't get Zelda or Kirby characters in Mario games. They are part of the same universe, claiming they're not part of the same wider franchise is "grasping for straws", regardless of them having their own games.

They obviously have a closer relationship than Mario and Zelda (although Link did cameo in SMRPG and SM3DW), but why should they have to remain eternally in Mario's shadow just because they started in the same series? DK's had his own series for ages, one that's completely apart from the Mario universe.

Besides, even if they weren't part of the Mario franchise, Mario would still have 7 Smash Bros. reps. My entire point stands and remains completely valid.

Only if you're counting Yoshi and Wario, and while Yoshi's arguable, Wario's clearly in the same class as DK. If a Warioware character were playable, would you consider them to be a Mario rep, even though they've literally never been in a Mario game?

[Mando-Whirl-Wind]

Well, what if K.Rool got in, he's definately a DK character not a mario character, and a iconic villian as well, though he showed up in one mario crossover game would you immediately lump him in with mario despite being the defenitive DK villian

[SIXTH-RATE SOMA]

Mario and Pokémon are Nintendo's biggest most popular franchises, them having the most playable characters isn't weird. Mario has 9 playable characters already. Yoshi, Wario and DK may have their "own franchises", but they are still Mario spinoffs.

 

I'm not sure why 'franchises' is in quotes here. Does it imply that, because WarioWare and DKC have roots in the Mario franchise, that it's impossible for them to make a distinct product worthy of their own respect? That strikes me as saying that Kingdom Hearts is only a Micky Mouse game because Donald and Goofy are important characters, or that the Punisher is a spin-off of Spider-Man because his first appearance was in that book. Heck, in WarioWare's case, it's got completely different gameplay, characters, style, and tone from the Mario games, to the point where Kirby has more in common with the mainline Mario stuff. To say that none of this deserves its own recognition or respect for the sake of one character who appeared in one mainline Mario game is actually a bit insulting.

[Wraith]

Honestly, the only character that's not grouped with the Mario series that I think SHOULD be is Yoshi. He's got a far bigger presence in the main Mario series than Wario and DK do and Mario even makes an appearance in the majority of his games. 

 

You could make the argument for Wario too, since he's basically a walking parody of Mario, but I think Donkey Kong's done enough to set himself apart. They could easily avoid the feeling of Mario oversaturation by focusing on what makes Donkey Kong unique. Vast, detailed locations and music that contrast with Mario's simple artstyle.

[Radiant Hero Ike]

I just don't see Pokémon getting 6 characters unless Mario gets yet another character (I'm not counting DK, Yoshi or Wario, as they have their own specific logos and stuff). Pokémon may be more successful (I don't really know, I'm going off what someone else just said here), but Mario is the mascot. Don't get me wrong, I'd love for Mewtwo to come back, he was one of my favorite characters. I just don't have much hope for him.

[SuperLink]

You guys are reading way too much into my argument, I'm not saying that Yoshi or Wario's games aren't worthy of their own fame, I prefer them to Mario games for the most part.

 

I'm saying they're Mario characters, because they are. I'm saying the "character limit" doesn't exist, Pikachu gets his own games, does that mean Pikachu should be counted separately from other Pokémon? He doesn't because he's more iconic as a Pokémon? Yoshi and Wario are more iconic as Mario characters than they are for their own franchises, Pikachu's games sell better than Yoshi or Wario's games do.

 

If Yoshi and Wario didn't have their own games, would all of you suddenly really hate that they were in Smash because if meant something as trivial as the little Mushroom logo indicating Mario characters was used a few too many times? If a popular game franchise that isn't Mario getting more than 5 reps a crime? Fair enough Mario gets special treatment because it's Mario, but I don't think you people realise how vital Pokémon is to Nintendo's success nowadays, Pokémon isn't just "another series", Pokémon is one of the few games that regularly pulls the flow of the industry in its favour just by existing.

 

And no, I wouldn't consider Diddy or WarioWare characters to be "Mario characters", but there's no denying that Yoshi and Wario are popular Mario characters in their own right, not just because of their games. If they never got their own games, ya'll still wouldn't be complaining that they "broke" the character limit.

 

People keep saying the "character limit" exists when it was only apparent in Brawl because of time constraints, and people also despite this keep saying it's ok for Mario to overshoot it entirely just because characters people would expect in anyway have had their own games. If Wario and Yoshi had that little Mushroom logo in Smash Bros. people still wouldn't be complaining about how many reps Mario has, and they'd still think 6 was too much for Pokémon. You know. even if Pokémon is generally more successful nowadays.

[SIXTH-RATE SOMA]

I'm saying they're Mario characters, because they are. 

 

If they never got their own games, ya'll still wouldn't be complaining that they "broke" the character limit.

 

Well yes, this is the point of contention. They do have their own games. More than that, they have their own separate series, with their own separate characters, with their own separate artstyles, with their own separate tones, with their own separate gameplay. Mewtwo does not. Blaziken does not. Pichu does not. Even Pikachu does not.

 

This isn't just some crazy double-standard towards Pokémon, these Mario spin-off character have justified their own existence and respect apart from Mario. They're more than just Mario characters, more than just another Daisy or Birdo, for precisely this reason. Until the day comes that Mewtwo or whoever can justify themselves apart from the main Pokémon franchise, they're just another Pokémon, no matter how popular, and deserve a slot no more than Rosalina.