Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS - Settle It In Smash!

[JaidynReiman]

I don't really care about Lucina being a clone with the very original addition of Robin, who definitely brings something entirely new to Smash Bros. and represents central focal points of Fire Emblem very well, namely tactics, plus Robin uses four of the five different types of magic from throughout the series with at least three tomes of each of the types of magics separately, plus even uses a magic sword along with it, and includes weapon durability: a central focal point in Fire Emblem games.

 

Captain Falcon announced alongside Robin further dampens the addition of one clone whose actually justified in being a clone. So honestly, I don't see it being that big of a deal.

[Wraith]

They aren't though. Lucina is a clone and that's what I'm mad about. 

 

You mentioned "work" in the context of the 3 original FE reps. Not Lucina.

 

Either way, I can't see why Lucina is worth getting worked up over to begin with. She's there as a bonus. You can either take her or leave her. You still have a new character with an original moveset to work with, so it's not like we're loosing out on anything by just having her there.

[JaidynReiman]

You mentioned "work" in the context of the 3 original FE reps. Not Lucina.

 

Either way, I can't see why Lucina is worth getting worked up over to begin with. She's there as a bonus. You can either take her or leave her. You still have a new character with an original moveset to work with, so it's not like we're loosing out on anything by just having her there.

This exactly, and its why I'm so annoyed by these complaints about Lucina. Who cares? We've got probably the most original character in Smash Bros. to date in this update. If we JUST got Lucina, I'd be pissed, and I'd be irritated if it was Chrom and Lucina, but Robin is extremely original and represents a huge part of the Fire Emblem franchise, so... I really can't be angry about Lucina being an easy clone.

[Chaos Warp]

 

You mentioned "work" in the context of the 3 original FE reps. Not Lucina.

 

Either way, I can't see why Lucina is worth getting worked up over to begin with. She's there as a bonus. You can either take her or leave her. You still have a new character with an original moveset to work with, so it's not like we're loosing out on anything by just having her there.

 

 

She also takes up game disk space when we already have a perfectly good Marth. I would rather Sakuari made her more different them Marth or made a original moveset for her. 

[Xenos]

Time constraints exist. And while it's not a complete certainty, there were probably other priorities compared to Lucina, thus she's a clone.

 

The idea of clones were to add more reps into Smash an easier way due to development issues or time constraints, so aside from DLC it's the only good compromise I can think of. Plus, we don't even know how different she actually is yet when it comes to how she works.

[SuperLink]

She also takes up game disk space when we already have a perfectly good Marth. I would rather Sakuari made her more different them Marth or made a original moveset for her. 

The game disc isn't going to be filled up :v

 

If all this can fit on a 3DS cart there's nothing to worry about. She hasn't affected anything negatively, she's a bonus. She's a "why not" character.

[JaidynReiman]

 

 

 

 

She also takes up game disk space when we already have a perfectly good Marth. I would rather Sakuari made her more different them Marth or made a original moveset for her. 

 

This isn't Brawl with an entire story mode filled with numerous cutscenes that took massive amounts of time to develop and filled half the game disc.

[SilentDoom]

This exactly, and its why I'm so annoyed by these complaints about Lucina. Who cares? We've got probably the most original character in Smash Bros. to date in this update. If we JUST got Lucina, I'd be pissed, and I'd be irritated if it was Chrom and Lucina, but Robin is extremely original and represents a huge part of the Fire Emblem franchise, so... I really can't be angry about Lucina being an easy clone.

The people complaining care. That's why they're complaining. People like Lucina and want to see her well represented. It's not about the proportion of unique characters within a franchise, it's about characters that are well designed and interesting on their own merits.

[Chaos Warp]

 

 

If all this can fit on a 3DS cart there's nothing to worry about. She hasn't affected anything negatively, she's a bonus. She's a "why not" character.

And I believe she deserves better then a simple "why not" character placement. Lucina is one of the main or at least more prevalent characters in FE:A right? For that reason I think she deserves proper newcomer treatment and not just cloning. 

 

Time constraints exist. And while it's not a complete certainty, there were probably other priorities compared to Lucina, thus she's a clone.

 

The idea of clones were to add more reps into Smash an easier way due to development issues or time constraints, so aside from DLC it's the only good compromise I can think of. Plus, we don't even know how different she actually is yet when it comes to how she works.

Yes clones are an easy way to add more reps, but gameplay wise they're either mostly or completely redundant, and I think gameplay is the most important aspect of any game soooooooooooo I'm against them. 

 

I would rather have DLC but knowing Nintendo and their being stuck 1 to 2 generations behind everyone else stuff.......

[Wraith]

I understand wanting her to be her own original character. I do too. What I mainly have a problem with is all the talk of character slot and disc space limitations that don't even really exist.

[Solly]

The past like, 3 pages of this thread have been a back-and-forth of people saying "I don't like clones" followed by someone responding with "yeah but it took no effort to do this so don't complain."

 

I think it's fair to not like seeing clone characters for a number of reasons, whether you find it cheap, or boring, or poor realization of something potentially fun and interesting. Or maybe you just don't like getting the same character twice as often when playing random matches- I dunno, who cares. Alternatively, if you're really glad a clone is in, that's fantastic. People shouldn't be telling each other what they should and shouldn't be satisfied with.

 

I feel like the "character slot" argument is moot whether we're talking about clones or completely original creations, though. Yes, one takes a lot more effort than the other, but what matters is that just because one character gets in doesn't necessarily mean that another was on the table for consideration. People shouldn't look at roster choices as being "X instead of Y." Obviously the amount of time and resources they're willing to spend on a game is finite, but it's not as if they say "we're gonna have 50 characters, now let's start deciding who they are." It's a more intuitive process than that. 

[SuperLink]

And I believe she deserves better then a simple "why not" character placement.

So do a lot of people, for all we know Sakurai might do too, but like Xenos said, time and money constraints exist. Hypothetically, if Lucina as a fully fledged character, another Newcomer would likely be cut instead. For example, we could get Lucina instead of Villager, instead of Rosalina, instead of Palutena, instead of Mac, either way, time stacks up and there's only enough time in 2 years to add so much to a game. Smash isn't just about character variety and balance, it's about fanservice, and if they want to stick in as many characters as they can in whatever way they can, isn't that understandable?

 

Fire Emblem getting one completely original and new rep is great. AND it's getting a bonus character too that it didn't have to get at all.

 

Would yesterday's trailer have been better accepted if Lucina wasn't in it at all or something?

 

Sakurai gave everyone like two cakes, one of them was fantastic and fresh and full of unique ideas, but the other one was kinda disappointing, not terrible, but disappointing and really samey. It was so disappointing in fact that people were more annoyed at the second cake than they were happy about the unique amazing cake. Infact they kinda hate Sakurai for making two cakes. Maybe Sakurai should have only made one cake. Even if people were still hungry after only one cake, they would have at least been happier than they are now.

 

I don't have a problem with people disliking clones. I have a problem with people acting like Sakurai is somehow a worse developer for wanting to put as much in the games as he can with the time he has.

[Senator NinjaShark]

considering Lucina has actually a decent reason being a clone, while further considering that we got Robin as a fully unique character in addition while further considering that The Captain made his glorious, glorious, oh so glorious Return I cant really say I am too bummed about Lucina being a clone to be honest.

 

would she have potential for her own Moves? Probably, I havent played Awakening yet, but considering she is like trying to Copy Marth in every way I would say she has more of a reason to be a clone than Ganondorf had.

 

 

 

also Stop crying about Disc space and character slots already, dear lord. We are at 38 Characters, wich is, mind you, just one short of Brawls roster, and still got a bunch of Veterans left to be announced and who knows how many Newcomers, the roster is gonna be decently sized.

[Marcello]

I would rather have DLC but knowing Nintendo and their being stuck 1 to 2 generations behind everyone else stuff.......

 

Plenty of Nintendo games have DLC.

[Falco]

Plenty of Nintendo games have DLC.

Since we're on the subject of Fire emblem awakening also. That game had loads of DLC.

[JayRaR]

Oh boy, Marth clones from Melee are back in this game. >.>

 

Don't misunderstand, I can get behind clone characters like Falco and Doctor Mario as I find their movesets more fun to play with than Fox and Mario respectively but Lucina seems more like a clone character than Pichu. Granted, we haven't seen Lucina's entire moveset but from what I'm seeing her A and B moves are almost the same as Marth without the sweet spot extra damage. I just don't understand why she needed to differentiate herself from Marth since, from what little knowledge I have about the FE series, Lucina is a descendant of Marth with all if not most of his abilities. Why go the extra mile and change some damage values, the hit boxes, and removing Marth's sweet spot if Lucina will probably play exactly the same as Marth? Wouldn't it be cheaper and quicker to make her an alt instead? For example in Injustice, the Green Lantern has an alt where you can play as a completely different person with the same powers and a different voice. Why not do this for Lucina and Marth? Heck, we have M/F Wii Fit Trainer and M/F Robin with the same body structure, same moves, and different voices. I just don't understand this decision.

[Celestia]

Plenty of Nintendo games have DLC.

 

Since we're on the subject of Fire emblem awakening also. That game had loads of DLC.

Not only that, but I'm pretty sure Sakurai's been quoted as saying that it's been considered for Smash (or something? all I remember is something like "it's not guaranteed, but it's possible"). It's certainly not that out there to assume there will be some extra stuff after the game's released. All things considered, I'll be shocked if there isn't DLC.

[KHCast]

I haven't seen many here complain about the "disc space" honestly. Don't see why people are acting like everyone complaining are using that argument.

Yes, I'm personally annoyed Lucina is a clone as she could have been much more, yes, I would rather less characters for the sake of originality, but one or two clones isn't gonna hurt the overall experience for me, or make me bash Sakurai. I understand why they did it, and good for him for trying to make people happy. I'm just not one of those people. I just again, wish she had more to offer. It's kinda disappointing when all the new reveals so far have had something unique and interesting...

[Solkia]

It's also completely ignored for 90% of the game. Hell I forgot it's in her eye until you reminded me.

 

It's not like you're going to be able to see it in battle.

 

well what do you know

 

[JaidynReiman]

 

 

 

well what do you know

 

 

Yeah, I found that funny, people said that Lucina doesn't have the mark of Naga in the trailer... and then Sakurai confirms the following day that she actually does, its just hard to see. And Sakurai LOVES putting all this attention to detail in, so it makes a whole lot of sense.

 

 

EDIT: On a related note, I'd be very surprised at this point if Ike didn't have Chrom's outfit as a costume. Chrom is definitely part of Robin's Final Smash, but Ike may very well at least have Chrom's outfit.

[SuperLink]

I used to get really annoyed about clones but I guess the reason I keep defending Lucina and am so excited for her is because before yesterday I had convinced myself we'd only be getting 3 more new characters and one of them would be Chrom, who I assumed would be similar to Marth or Ike in some way.

 

I expected a similar character I didn't like much, and instead I got a similar character I really like and a completely fresh and unique character. Also it kinda proved the Gematsu leak wasn't gospel, so there are probably more than 3 (including yesterday's) newcomers left, and I honestly can't be annoyed or sad about that no matter how hard I try because the majority of their reveals will probably be very unique characters and if we do get more than 2 more Newcomers that will already be far more than I expected.

[Gabz Girl]

Lucina may just be a clone of Marth, but I honestly wouldn't know how to make her more unique, at least in her moveset. From what I've heard, she has similar moves to Marth in FE: Awakening. How do you change that?

 

You know, if it turns out that Lucina is similar to another clone I don't mind, which is Falco (I like Falco but not Wolf, go figure), then that's fine by me!

[Blitz 'n Burst]

Lucina may just be a clone of Marth, but I honestly wouldn't know how to make her more unique, at least in her moveset. From what I've heard, she has similar moves to Marth in FE: Awakening. How do you change that?

 

You know, if it turns out that Lucina is similar to another clone I don't mind, which is Falco (I like Falco but not Wolf, go figure), then that's fine by me!

"Lucina is physically identical to Marth" doesn't exactly sound like she's going to do much to separate herself

[JaidynReiman]

"Lucina is physically identical to Marth" doesn't exactly sound like she's going to do much to separate herself

Based on the trailer she appears to be faster than Marth, so I think the main difference is her stats and the fact that she has Roy's "not

strongest at the tip" mechanic.

 

 

I used to get really annoyed about clones but I guess the reason I keep defending Lucina and am so excited for her is because before yesterday I had convinced myself we'd only be getting 3 more new characters and one of them would be Chrom, who I assumed would be similar to Marth or Ike in some way.

 

I expected a similar character I didn't like much, and instead I got a similar character I really like and a completely fresh and unique character. Also it kinda proved the Gematsu leak wasn't gospel, so there are probably more than 3 (including yesterday's) newcomers left, and I honestly can't be annoyed or sad about that no matter how hard I try because the majority of their reveals will probably be very unique characters and if we do get more than 2 more Newcomers that will already be far more than I expected.

This exactly. I DID think we were getting more than three newcomers personally, I didn't think Gematsu was everything, but I'm glad the leak was killed because now we can speculate again without people shooting our ideas down because "it wasn't in the leak."

 

And we've got a better more original character than Chrom who is extremely unique and represents Fire Emblem mechanics very well. Don't care they stuck with the Tactician's second weapon being a sword, especially since most of the moveset being based on tomes anyway, and hell, even the sword is a magic sword (at least until Robin reverts to the Bronze Sword).

[jords]

Not like I care about FE by its sucks that there is another clone. Its whatever, as lots of people been saying, its not like she's taking up a slot. Plus sakurai said were nearing the bottom of characters, so the least interesting newcomers are now getting revealed.