Sonic Lost World in PAX Prime 2013

[Narukami07]

What a down to earth review.

 

Also, no FPS drops from either version? Neat!

Edited August 31, 2013 by Narukami07

[Blitz 'n Burst]

Overall I'm really glad that the Wisps are a lot more optional this time, which is how they should have been in Colours. Instead they were almost necessary to enjoy the game fully. I think part of it just came from the fact that the Wisps were the focus of the game though - they were the nnew thing, so SEGA felt the need to emphasize them in it, whereas in Lost World they're just a small footnote, useful for reaching hidden paths or speedrunning, but not in-your-face. Just how powerups should be.

[SilentDoom]

Overall I'm really glad that the Wisps are a lot more optional this time, which is how they should have been in Colours. Instead they were almost necessary to enjoy the game fully. I think part of it just came from the fact that the Wisps were the focus of the game though - they were the nnew thing, so SEGA felt the need to emphasize them in it, whereas in Lost World they're just a small footnote, useful for reaching hidden paths or speedrunning, but not in-your-face. Just how powerups should be.

 

Indeed.  Even just looking at the WiiU levels we've seen in full so far.  Desert Ruins 2 (honeycomb), Des(s)ert Ruins 3 and Frozen Factory (casino) don't have the Wisps at all, whilst Windy Hill 1, Windy Hill 4 and Silent Forest have Wisps placed such that they're very much optional.  Heck with Windy Hill 1 and Silent Forest you could potentially go through those levels without even realising the Wisps are there.

[Narukami07]

Wait, woah woah woah.....Wisps can actually be an OPTION to insert in levels now? As in, could just get rid of them and have levels with zero Wisps in sight????

[SilentDoom]

Wait, woah woah woah.....Wisps can actually be an OPTION to insert in levels now? As in, could just get rid of them and have levels with zero Wisps in sight????

 

Um, no.  I have no idea how and where you read that from.  I was saying that because of how the levels are designed and because of how the Wisps are positioned there's the potential to take a route through them that means you don't encounter the Wisps at all.  Look at the gamespot footage of Silent Forest for example.  That level has the Eagle Wisp, but we don't see it at all in the playthrough.

[Blitz 'n Burst]

Um, no.  I have no idea how and where you read that from.  I was saying that because of how the levels are designed and because of how the Wisps are positioned there's the potential to take a route through them that means you don't encounter the Wisps at all.  Look at the gamespot footage of Silent Forest for example.  That level has the Eagle Wisp, but we don't see it at all in the playthrough.

I think his point was that you could remove the Wisps and the game would still be able to stand on its own, as opposed to Colours where you'd be missing out on a pretty sizable chunk of the game

 

Not to mention the Wisps look more fun overall in this game as well, as long as the gamepad controls don't feel too forced,so there's even a possibility I may find myself wanting to use them this time. Fun powerups that aren't necessary top complete the game but still give you an advantage are far better than shitty powerup that you have to use to play the game properly, certainly. The only really good wisps in Colours imo were Hover and Frenzy - Hover has been buffed with the Eagle wisp and Frenzy probably can't really appear anyway, considering they were all probably saved at the end of Colours. Drill looks like an improvement in this game as well, so I can see myself enjoying that.

 

Red Burst was a decent concept, but the level design ended up making me hate it. Hopefully it's improved upon in this version.

Edited August 31, 2013 by Blitz 'n Burst

[Narukami07]

Um, no.  I have no idea how and where you read that from.  I was saying that because of how the levels are designed and because of how the Wisps are positioned there's the potential to take a route through them that means you don't encounter the Wisps at all.  Look at the gamespot footage of Silent Forest for example.  That level has the Eagle Wisp, but we don't see it at all in the playthrough.

 

I was actually referring to this guy:

 

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=79327481&postcount=20

 

Specifically when he said this (though i think i read i wrong....)

 

They weren't used automatically in Colors either. When you say inventory, did it look like you could hold more than one?

 

You can

Carry one of each type of Wisp and they don't disappear for any circstance and can be used whenever.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Narukami07

[Sir Tynen]

I think the thing that Lost World is lacking right now, the thing that would help players understand how to play said game a bit better, would basically be this: 
 
                                        ~Tutorials~
Not like this:

 

 

But more like this:

 

Or at least something of a similar fashion to this.

 

Even a simple tutorial stage, like Unleashed had, would help the communicate this new gameplay style better, since Sonic has more moves at his disposal than he ever had. Nothing fancy or overly bearing/ hand-hold-ish. Just clear, simple and to the point. It is this reason why I think people like Hogfather who have played the game, among other viewers who are the fence about this new style, have had problems adjusting to the gameplay. So I think their criticisms with this new style are pretty valid and something for the developers to take in consideration. It would make the otherwise iffy learning curve much more smooth.

 

 

 

(Also, hello there. I'm new to the forums and recently made this account, even though I've just been lurking around with it, haha. Hope you're having a good day.)

[Sega DogTagz]

and Frenzy probably can't really appear anyway,

 

The essentially re-tooled it with Asteroid, which is exceedingly similar to both sets of Nega-Wisp's Frenzy and Void.

 

 

While we are on the topic of Wisp's I can't help but shake the feeling that we are going to get a pretty nifty curve ball of a stage featuring the Rhythm wisp. You could conduct and orchestra through a level, or god help us if we get a music plant playground.

 

From what I've seen, this game is being pretty inventive with some of Sonic's levels. Here's hoping that carries over to some multifunctional uses for the wisps too.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Sega DogTagz

[StaticMania]

Having a button prompt to tell/remind you to do what you already would've done anyway isn't really the same as a proper tutorial. I'd say that if the ones in Colors didn't stop you when telling you "How-to" like the "? "bubbles in Heroes and let you continue moving while explaining it'd be better.

[Sir Tynen]

Having a button prompt to tell/remind you to do what you already would've done anyway isn't really the same as a proper tutorial. I'd say that if the ones in Colors didn't stop you when telling you "How-to" like the "? "bubbles in Heroes and let you continue moving while explaining it'd be better.

 

That is a good point. I think doing it like that or maybe something similar would be better than a prompt.  I was just more implying the idea of having the prompts in a tutorial stage rather than the whole game, or at least the first level.

[Tails spin]

I think the thing that Lost World is lacking right now, the thing that would help players understand how to play said game a bit better, would basically be this: 

 

                                        ~Tutorials~

Not like this:

 

 

But more like this:

 

Or at least something of a similar fashion to this.

 

Even a simple tutorial stage, like Unleashed had, would help the communicate this new gameplay style better, since Sonic has more moves at his disposal than he ever had. Nothing fancy or overly bearing/ hand-hold-ish. Just clear, simple and to the point. It is this reason why I think people like Hogfather who have played the game, among other viewers who are the fence about this new style, have had problems adjusting to the gameplay. So I think their criticisms with this new style are pretty valid and something for the developers to take in consideration. It would make the otherwise iffy learning curve much more smooth.

 

 

 

(Also, hello there. I'm new to the forums and recently made this account, even though I've just been lurking around with it, haha. Hope you're having a good day.)

 

The 3DS has a Tutorial level so I'm good

[KrazyBean]

So should Sonic Lost World have a tutorial level like Sonic Heroes?

Edited September 1, 2013 by KrazyBean

[Straw Hat]

Yeah. But I'd also like the option to switch on/off button prompts, like in Colors and Generations.

[Blitz 'n Burst]

I think the current 3DS tutorial level is just fine. It's short and simple and designed to let you get a hang of the game. I think they would have shown the Wii U tutorial level if there was one, though.

[azoo]

I don't think there's not a tutorial stage in the Wii U version. After all, the demos of Unleashed featured Apotos Act 2 but the game itself featured a tutorial Act 1.

[Blitz 'n Burst]

But if there was a tutorial level then they would have shown it. Why would they throw you into a game without a single clue of how to play it if they actually have a level dedicated to teaching you how to play the game?

[SilentDoom]

But if there was a tutorial level then they would have shown it. Why would they throw you into a game without a single clue of how to play it if they actually have a level dedicated to teaching you how to play the game?

 

Unleashed had a tutorial level which I'm pretty sure wasn't shown off straight away.  Demos consisted of the main Act of Apotos, but not the preliminary tutorial act.

[Badnik Mechanic]

And now for a break.

 

 

And now we're back.

If you're one of these people who doesn't believe we should post 'negative' criticisms.... Might wanna skip this one.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lirYtiUp5Lg

 

19 seconds into the video "I don't know what I'm doing"

 

37 seconds into the video "I don't know whats going on so...."

 

It's not until the very end of the video does the player figure out how you attack enemies. Now to those people who say 'well they're not trying to engage with the game' or 'well people just don't like change' or something along those lines.

 

How is this not a problem? We have a new Sonic game and players do not know or can't figure out how you attack enemies without being told or shown?

 

And before someone accuses me or 'we get it you hate the game' or 'stop showing all the bad videos' These are the only videos/previews I can find/that have been uploaded! 

[Narukami07]

So basically the player is new to what the game is offering? Is not like everyone else has had similar problems, not that i'm dismissing the existence of players that did.

 

Also looking at the video, how could it take someone a minute and thirty nine seconds to perform even a homing attack? Especially when there is a tutorial prompt on the gamepad in which he could have just looked at it instead of ignoring it if he was having problems. I'm sorry but i just question if the player has played past 3D Sonic titles beforehand.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Narukami07

[Wraith]

Tutorials are poping up on the bottom screen. If the player doesn't look at them then well yeah.   

[LordMetallix]

Tutorials are poping up on the bottom screen. If the player doesn't look at them then well yeah.   

That's the problem though, if the player hasn't used the Wii U much then they are not going to know to look at the bottom screen. Which is going to cause them to stumble around. A tutorial level is necessary for this game or more intrusive prompts like Omochao.

[Wraith]

That's the problem though, if the player hasn't used the Wii U much then they are not going to know to look at the bottom screen. Which is going to cause them to stumble around. A tutorial level is necessary for this game or more intrusive prompts like Omochao.

 

There is a prompt on the main screen literally pointing you to the bottom screen. 

[Jango]

Isn't that a case of get used to it? I bet the 1999 E3 had the same problem with people playing Sonic Adventure for the first time. It's not like the game is hard, it's just new. Don't forget the Wii U gamepad is also new for many. I can't see where's the problem, you can't expect anyone to do a perfect run on his first try.

[Blitz 'n Burst]

Anybody who can't figure out how to play the game despite there being prompts telling you how to play teh goddamn game has no sympathy from me

 

Tutorials exist to teach you things. If you're not going to pay attention to them then you have no right to complain when you don't know what the hell you're doing.