Is silver canon anymore?

[Sonic The Badass]

I mean does he actually know sonic and friends based on the storyline. I know he was introduced in "that game." but they also put him in sonic rivals which did somethings with time and space anyways. so did silver ever really meet sonic and friends of the event in his debut game were erased? (and i mean canon wise/ storyline wise

[Diogenes]

Yeah, but it's hard to pin down exactly what he knows, given that '06 erased itself and the Rivals games are in pretty questionable territory canonwise. It's almost like he exists without actually being in anything.

[NocturnalTwilight]

Sonic '06 never happened, the entire story was erased at the end, so basically none of it ever happened. However, I believe that Silver's actual Canon introduction was in Sonic Rivals, so that's how he actually comes into the series instead of Sonic '06.

Edited August 31, 2013 by ThunderCracker

[Chaos Incarnate]

This is pretty obvious, of course he is. He meets Sonic and CO. in Sonic Rivals,  shows up in Colors DS(though I can understand why some would think that game isn't canon), and appears in Generations. The events of 06 being erased don't mean a thing, Elise obviously still existed by the end of the game, even though she hasn't shown up since then.

[LATER BUDDY]

Legitimately a question, was Rivals even canon to the main series anyways?

 

If not he's only been in '06 that I guess never actually happened, and since then has only been a party character if I can recall correctly? He's remained relevant by a thread but I guess I never really considered him much more than an exaggerated one-off character to the main canon in Sonic.

[Jet Prower]

I'd always assumed he was canon. I guess I can see why people would think he wasn't when 06 was reversed and not being too sure where Rivals is located. Since he is from the future, it is hard to pinpoint this with a definate answer. If he is from the future, he likely still knows about them from being there, but actually meeting them is another story. We aren't talking comic universe, so when it comes to game universe, its alot trickier to pinpoint. Yes, he shows up in the party sections and such, which would make you assume he is canon, but can that be counted would be the ultimate thing.

[Sonic The Badass]

Really I'm not sure if generations is even canon, it might or might not be. and really if lost world give explanations of previous things like cubot and orbot and eggman getting out of white space. Before we can even confirm he was in a canon game we have to confirm he's actually been in a canon game. and you can argue the generations is a tribute to the sonic franchise and nothing more.

[Chaos Incarnate]

Really I'm not sure if generations is even canon, it might or might not be. and really if lost world give explanations of previous things like cubot and orbot and eggman getting out of white space. Before we can even confirm he was in a canon game we have to confirm he's actually been in a canon game. and you can argue the generations is a tribute to the sonic franchise and nothing more.

True, it's perfectly reasonable to believe Generations is non canon(it's canon in my book though), but I feel if Silver was truly non canon, Sonic Team wouldn't have him show up ever again. Wouldn't it be pointless if they kept giving an apparent non canon character re appearances? 

[Sonic The Badass]

True, it's perfectly reasonable to believe Generations is non canon(it's canon in my book though), but I feel if Silver was truly non canon, Sonic Team wouldn't have him show up ever again. Wouldn't it be pointless if they kept giving an apparent non canon character re appearances? 

 

Yes, but  he dosen't have any serious roles after 06 which means its not much of a problem to throw him in there. also sonic CD isn't confirmed itself as a canon yet it spawned two of the series reappearing characters: amy and metal sonic. The main problem here is, is he canon? and if so where did he meet sonic? besides 06 what game did they actually act like they never met before?

[Chaos Incarnate]

Yes, but  he dosen't have any serious roles after 06 which means its not much of a problem to throw him in there. also sonic CD isn't confirmed itself as a canon yet it spawned two of the series reappearing characters: amy and metal sonic. The main problem here is, is he canon? and if so where did he meet sonic? besides 06 what game did they actually act like they never met before?

Dude, it's pretty clear CD is canon at this point, Sonic 4 episode 2 directly continues from it, and Amy has a flashback to the game in Sonic Adventure, don't forget Stardust Speedway showed up in Generations.

 

Silver meeting Sonic is simple: he met him in the Rivals series, which I'm pretty sure is canon, as I recall Iizuka saying it was Eggman Nega's canon backstory.

Edited August 31, 2013 by Chaos Incarnate

[Sonic The Badass]

link? i need to see this so i can rest in peace about silver.

[Chaos Incarnate]

link? i need to see this so i can rest in peace about silver.

Sorry, can't find one right now, but I'm pretty sure he said that about Eggman Nega at Sonic Boom 2012.

[Tara]

Yes, but  he dosen't have any serious roles after 06 which means its not much of a problem to throw him in there. also sonic CD isn't confirmed itself as a canon yet it spawned two of the series reappearing characters: amy and metal sonic. The main problem here is, is he canon? and if so where did he meet sonic? besides 06 what game did they actually act like they never met before?

How exactly is CD not "confirmed" to be canon?  It's been referenced numerous times and as mentioned, its story has been continued in Sonic 4.

 

That being said, I can't judge Silver's appearance in Rivals as I've never played the game or its sequel, but since he's only had one major appearance which has been completely undone, I'd say he exists in the universe but all the same doesn't exist in the series.  He exists in the game's canon, but his existence is completely irrelevant because he's from the distant future.  I'm not sure if that makes sense at all, but that's my headcanon.

Edited August 31, 2013 by Akito

[Sonic The Badass]

How exactly is CD not "confirmed" to be canon?  It's been referenced numerous times and as mentioned, its story has been continued in Sonic 4.

 

That being said, I can't judge Silver's appearance in Rivals as I've never played the game or its sequel, but since he's only had one major appearance which has been completely undone, I'd say he exists in the universe but all the same doesn't exist in the series.  He exists in the game's canon, but his existence is completely irrelevant because he's from the distant future.  I'm not sure if that makes sense at all, but that's my headcanon.

Sorry, I forgot about sonic 4 continuing the story.

 

You mean he exist in the future but is irrelevant to the main cast. correct?

Edited August 31, 2013 by Insane121

[Tara]

Sorry, I forgot about sonic 4 continuing the story.

 

You mean he exist in the future but is irrelevant to the main cast. correct?

Essentially, yes.  Like, in the same amount of time that takes place between Sonic's present time and Silver's time in the future, Silver would be born, but since that's, you know, in the future, it's not particularly important unless they do another time traveling story.

[Solkia]

Legitimately a question, was Rivals even canon to the main series anyways?

 

If not he's only been in '06 that I guess never actually happened, and since then has only been a party character if I can recall correctly? He's remained relevant by a thread but I guess I never really considered him much more than an exaggerated one-off character to the main canon in Sonic.

 

Rivals isn't canon, not that it means anything since the canon is more fucked up than the Zelda canon.

 

Silver is still Canon or else he wouldn't be in Generations. I think a better question is what he contributes to the canon. Does he live in the future or the present? What exactly is his relevance? Things like that.

[goku262002]

How is Rivals not Canon? What does it break for it not to be apart of the main storyline? or are you guys brushing it off because its a handheld game?

Yes, but he dosen't have any serious roles after 06 which means its not much of a problem to throw him in there.

Nobody has had a serious role after 2006, save for Tails.

[Solkia]

It resurrects Ibilis out of nowhere and even ties Eggman Nega into it. It's basically a shitfest of fanservice trying to be a story.

[Jet Prower]

How is Rivals not Canon? What does it break for it not to be apart of the main storyline? or are you guys brushing it off because its a handheld game?

Nobody has had a serious role after 2006, save for Tails.

 

I'm guessing people are saying that Rivals isn't canon because its a racing game and not a normal platformer. I'm not too sure. This oh that is  canon and that isn't business  isn't normally something I usually think about on a normal basis. I just go along with what is given and keep it at that. If you over think the canon you will easily confuse yourself over time.

[-Mark-]

Rivals stories were so embarrassingly throwaway that they may as well have not been there. The plots of both were little more than piss-poor excuses for characters who are usually on good terms to race/ fight with one another, and the lack of any proper cutscenes just made them even more forgettable. 

 

Also, it still bugs me when people say 06 isn't canon/ 'never happened' because it undoes itself at the end of the game. Aside from the ending hinting that Sonic still remembers at least something, it still happened prior to being undone. If something is erased, it still happened prior to being erased. Having something happen and then changing history to prevent it from happening isn't the same as it flat-out never happening at all. 

[goku262002]

Okay so the story is low end and/or piss poor, so what? still doesn't explain why it should be written off as non-canon. just because something isn't of the same quality as with the canon main series games doesn't mean that if it does fit into the story it should be written off for that. it was a poor entry but its still an entry just like Shadow which is still reguarded as canon in the main seires.

I'm guessing people are saying that Rivals isn't canon because its a racing game and not a normal platformer. I'm not too sure.

 

Thats just gameplay though, it doesn't effect the story.

[Spin Attaxx]

It resurrects Ibilis out of nowhere and even ties Eggman Nega into it. It's basically a shitfest of fanservice trying to be a story.

Actually aren't the Ifrit and Iblis two unrelated entities instead of one reincarnated into the other?

[Your Vest Friend]

Even if Rivals, 06 and the like are non-canon for Silver possibly, he'd still be canon to the series because SEGA would just turn around and say that he met Sonic at some time prior to whenever. It's the same stance they're taking with Cream, it looks like, since the Advance games seem to be on shaky ground canon-wise as well (although in her case it's somewhere prior to Heroes).

[JezMM]

It resurrects Ibilis out of nowhere and even ties Eggman Nega into it. It's basically a shitfest of fanservice trying to be a story.

 

Actually aren't the Ifrit and Iblis two unrelated entities instead of one reincarnated into the other?

^ This. It's extra easy to get muddled though because Secret Rings had a (seperate) creature also called Ifrit as a stage boss, and in Rivals you do fight Ifrit in a stage that is visually similar to Crisis City.

 

Overall Rivals has no trouble fitting into the main canon at all... UNLESS you consider Rush to be part of the main canon. If you want Rush and Rivals to co-exist, you have to use some serious amounts of fanon bridging to have them connect up and make sense.

It's not flawless, but my personal belief to make them all canon is this:

2006 happens, in the new world created, Silver is still born in the future under different circumstances, Blaze is sealed away in her world from Rush, and becomes a Princess through unknown means. Outside of Sonic's world, she is not affected by the 2006 reset, but does still lose her memory of events that now no longer exist in space-time. If you want to go super deep into this, you could even say space-time "resets her" to have always come from this world, to account for the anomaly. But that's getting a bit too deep and presents problems of it's own. ANYWAY.

Rush, and Rush Adventure happens. Eggman Nega lies to Eggman about coming from a parallel dimension to gain his fuller trust. Nega's goal is to steer Eggman to success and break the chain of his failures that are known of in the future. Nega fails and deems Eggman a lost cause, and decides to try and change the past of Eggman by destruction rather than collaboration, posing as Eggman and trying to succeed himself.

Rivals and Rivals 2 happens, introducing a new version of Silver from a happier future which is often dealing with Nega's schemes all the same.

Sonic Colours DS is non-canon to me since the Silver here doesn't seem to fully know Sonic? I can't quite remember his exact dialogue but he talks about the future being a wonderful place, as if he hasn't met Sonic before.

Sonic Generations happens, has Crisis City appear with no comment from Sonic or Silver and comment about being back from Blaze and fucks everything up in my personal theory monumentally.

 

Also, it still bugs me when people say 06 isn't canon/ 'never happened' because it undoes itself at the end of the game. Aside from the ending hinting that Sonic still remembers at least something, it still happened prior to being undone. If something is erased, it still happened prior to being erased. Having something happen and then changing history to prevent it from happening isn't the same as it flat-out never happening at all.

 

 

I think saying 2006 isn't canon is just shorthand really. Yes it happened and then unhappened BUT the fact that it unhappened does make all major character progression and events not being part of the series canon. In the world Sonic now resides in, Elise was never kidnapped, Solaris never existed.

Edited August 31, 2013 by JezMM

[DarkXZA]

Its hard to tell if Rivals is canon especially since it was never released in Japan (as far as I know) and Sonic IS a Japanese franchise.