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Mighty No.9 - New Inafune title!


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Like I said in the edit, I imagine Inafune has already filed the paperwork ahead of time. Filing copyrights isn't too expensive.

 

I wouldn't put it past Capcom to try to exploit any loophole they can find.

Edited by Solkia
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Then again I recall some fan films getting pulled from Kickstarter recently due to copyright infringement. Final Fantasy 7 and Metroid I think. Although they were specifically referencing the IP so that's firm ground there for termination. My point is you don't need full legal authorization to start up a project on Kickstarter. Whether anything will happen to Mighty No. 9 we'll have to see but it's unlikely.

 

Did anyone point this out? http://kotaku.com/mega-man-designer-says-capcom-hasnt-reacted-to-new-meg-1236079950 Capcom hasn't said anything to Inafune yet regarding the project. They should be finding out about it same time as everyone else though. Wonder how they'll react if at all.

 

 

See, now it's clear that you just simply dislike how the design and look of the project just looks way too Mega Man for you, which I can see why you would think so. There's no need for all this moral or copyright stuff, if you'd been more clear about your main concern with this title, than I think people would've generally understood your point better.

 

I'm just disgusted that some developers, indies no less, would stoop to just copying another property to steal success from that said property. Ignoring the abilities of Inafune and his team I don't see their project as any different from a Minecraft knockoff on Xbox Indie games, or an Angry Birds knockoff on iOS. It's not illegal but it's not in good taste, which is why I started bringing morality into my argument. It's my belief that game developers should be striving to deliver more "original" content, not just rehashing the stuff we already have, especially indie developers who aren't constrained by a publisher. At the very least in the case of a "homage" to a certain gameplay style and mechanic, make the effort to create different story, characters, and graphic style that is set apart from the original source.

Edited by Yong
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Then again I recall some fan films getting pulled from Kickstarter recently due to copyright infringement. Final Fantasy 7 and Metroid I think. Although they were specifically referencing the IP so that's firm ground there for termination. My point is you don't need full legal authorization to start up a project on Kickstarter. Whether anything will happen to Mighty No. 9 we'll have to see but it's unlikely.

 

It won't because it's legal.

 

The others got pulled because they weren't legal. What is hard to understand about this.

 

I'm just disgusted that some developers, indies no less, would stoop to just copying another property to steal success from that said property. Ignoring the abilities of Inafune and his team I don't see their project as any different from a Minecraft knockoff on Xbox Indie games, or an Angry Birds knockoff on iOS. It's not illegal but it's not in good taste, which is why I started bringing morality into my argument. It's my belief that game developers should be striving to deliver more "original" content, not just rehashing the stuff we already have, especially indie developers who aren't constrained by a publisher. At the very least in the case of a "homage" to a certain gameplay style and mechanic, make the effort to create different story, characters, and graphic style that is set apart from the original source.

 

It's my belief that I like Mega Man and if Capcom won't make one then I'm cool with someone else doing it.

 

You must really hate fanart, huh?

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Then again I recall some fan films getting pulled from Kickstarter recently due to copyright infringement. Final Fantasy 7 and Metroid I think. Although they were specifically referencing the IP so that's firm ground there for termination. My point is you don't need full legal authorization to start up a project on Kickstarter. Whether anything will happen to Mighty No. 9 we'll have to see but it's unlikely.

 

 

 

I'm just disgusted that some developers, indies no less, would stoop to just copying another property to steal success from that said property. Ignoring the abilities of Inafune and his team I don't see their project as any different from a Minecraft knockoff on Xbox Indie games, or an Angry Birds knockoff on iOS. It's not illegal but it's not in good taste, which is why I started bringing morality into my argument. It's my belief that game developers should be striving to deliver more "original" content, not just rehashing the stuff we already have, especially indie developers who aren't constrained by a publisher. At the very least in the case of a "homage" to a certain gameplay style and mechanic, make the effort to create different story, characters, and graphic style that is set apart from the original source.

 

The fact you had to bring Penders into it just shows a complete misunderstanding both of what's going on here and what happened there.

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I'm just disgusted that some developers, indies no less, would stoop to just copying another property to steal success from that said property. Ignoring the abilities of Inafune and his team I don't see their project as any different from a Minecraft knockoff on Xbox Indie games, or an Angry Birds knockoff on iOS. 

 

Except it's the same people who made the originals. I think that gives this a little more validity than the cheap cash-ins that you're comparing it to. 

Edited by Phantomime
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Ignoring the abilities of Inafune and his team I don't see their project as any different from a Minecraft knockoff on Xbox Indie games, or an Angry Birds knockoff on iOS.

The fact that the man leading the project is largely credited with creating Mega Man isn't enough of a distinction?

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It's my belief that I like Mega Man and if Capcom won't make one then I'm cool with someone else doing it.

 

 

Assuming that Capcom wasn't going to do anything within the next 2 years. But people need their "fix" I guess.

 

The fact you had to bring Penders into it just shows a complete misunderstanding both of what's going on here and what happened there.

 

I retracted my comparison to that case in an earlier post since others refuse to ignore the minor details. I'll just accept I was wrong to make the comparison and move on. If you want to keep dwelling on that then that's your problem.

 

 

Except it's the same people who made the originals. I think that gives this a little more validity than the cheap cash-ins that you're comparing it to. 

 

The fact that the man leading the project is largely credited with creating Mega Man isn't enough of a distinction?

 

In my mind I don't make any exception when it comes to this situation. Yes they originally created the IP but they handed those rights over to Capcom, it's out of their hands. The quality of the game itself is irrelevant, they still chose to copy another source.

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In my mind I don't make any exception when it comes to this situation. Yes they originally created the IP but they handed those rights over to Capcom, it's out of their hands. The quality of the game itself is irrelevant, they still chose to copy another source.

That's still not really an apt comparison. The obvious and intentional similarities between Mighty No. 9 and Mega Man are an homage by the original creators who have all moved on by now. The game isn't so much a rip-off of classic Mega Man as it is a celebration of it. I get that you might not like what they're trying to do, but whether they signed away the rights or not, they're copying themselves. 

 

The XBLIG Minecraft clones or iOS Angry Birds knockoffs you brought up are shitty, low-budget cash-grab games, with no other goal besides parroting the success of someone else's work with zero creativity and minimal effort. They're completely ambitionless and even using them as a comparison is, in my opinion, really unfair. 

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That's still not really an apt comparison. The obvious and intentional similarities between Mighty No. 9 and Mega Man are an homage by the original creators who have all moved on by now. The game isn't so much a rip-off of classic Mega Man as it is a celebration of it. I get that you might not like what they're trying to do, but whether they signed away the rights or not, they're copying themselves. 

 

The XBLIG Minecraft clones or iOS Angry Birds knockoffs you brought up are shitty, low-budget cash-grab games, with no other goal besides parroting the success of someone else's work with zero creativity and minimal effort. They're completely ambitionless and even using them as a comparison is, in my opinion, really unfair. 

 

The extent of a game being a "homage" shouldn't extend beyond the gameplay itself. The artstyle resembles Megaman's style so much it seems like a deliberate move on their part to grab the attention of Megaman fans who liked the art and characters more than the actual gameplay and were on the fence about backing the project. It could be a limitation on Inafune's part, but I find it hard to believe you absolutely can't create a character without the distinct helmet, boots, and arm cannon of a certain blue robot. It just feels like a missed opportunity for them to create something new that could draw in fans on its own merits. No, they have to feed on the memories of an established fanbase, the same goal as any other game knockoff.

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EDIT: Well apparently Inafune thought up MegaMan in SFxT so just ignore my idiocy.

Edited by LordMetallix
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First off, I want to reply to this one part of one of your posts partially responding to mine, a few pages ago.

 



If there was any worth in this project it would be for its own merits, not because "it's EXACTLY like that old game you liked."

 

I think you have very much misinterpreted what my post was saying, to think that I was saying I wanted  M.N.9. to be "EXACTLY like that old game liked". If I wanted that, I'd wait a few years until Capcom eventually churns out another 8-bit cash in to "revitalize" the series as, I don't know, Mega Man 11 as we truly imagined it? 

 

This seems more like a re-imagining/sequel series, something that, I think you'll agree, Mega Man has tended to do a fair bit over the years.

 

 

 



In my mind I don't make any exception when it comes to this situation. Yes they originally created the IP but they handed those rights over to Capcom, it's out of their hands. The quality of the game itself is irrelevant, they still chose to copy another source.

 

Here we go, back to your argument that an idea, and who owns the rights to an idea, is first and foremost the deciding factor of if a game should be made or not. Maybe it's not my place to decide that.

 

However, this case here is legal, perfectly fine in most people's eyes, and no amount of griping over how it's "morally wrong" to copy your own idea, (which has apparently somehow stopped being the idea of a person(s), instead becoming a corporation's), because of your views of archaic copyright law, is going to change anything. 

 

Again, M.N.9. is perfectly valid under said copyright laws.

 

 

 

Another thing. That part I bolded? That is a really, really stupid argument.

 

By that same logic, Minecraft and Angry Birds, the games you just mentioned as having so many rip-offs, have no right to exist, because games similar to them came out before them, and likely inspired both. Hell, name any cut-and-paste modern military shooter made in the past few years or so. Yeah, the market is full of the fucking things, but does their blatant copying of each other trip your little moral sensors enough to make you believe that they shouldn't have been made in the first place?

 

On a related note, if nobody was able to copy an idea, than nobody would be able to build off of an idea. Copying ideas and improving and altering them is what this industry is MADE of. It's a natural part of what makes this industry grow.

 

 

 

Sorry if I got slightly off topic there. 

 

In any case, I know that you do not agree with what I, or quite a few others are saying, so I'm afraid we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this.

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The extent of a game being a "homage" shouldn't extend beyond the gameplay itself. 

Why not? 

 

The artstyle resembles Megaman's style so much it seems like a deliberate move on their part to grab the attention of Megaman fans who liked the art and characters more than the actual gameplay and were on the fence about backing the project.

wow what. I don't know how you're reaching this conclusion.

 

Although the resemblance to Mega Man is obviously deliberate. That's because this game is pretty much the closest we're gonna get to Inafune working on a new Mega Man game- which isn't a bad thing. It's a spiritual successor. I understand if that doesn't appeal to you but that doesn't mean it belongs in the same boat as stuff like this.

xboxboxart.jpg

 

No, they have to feed on the memories of an established fanbase, the same goal as any other game knockoff.

No. The goal of the XBLIG Minecraft games or cheap iOS shit isn't to appeal to an existing, dedicated fanbase. Their goal is to be an alternative to buying the product they're ripping off in a market where that product isn't already available (i.e, pre-Minecraft XBLA) OR to get quick sales from people who either don't know the difference and/or don't really care. 

 

Than THIS ABOMINATION that Capcom last represented him by.....

megaman127.jpg

 

I understand not liking Inafune for him not using ENTIRELY new ideas for this project, but really, can you BLAME him for giving Capcom a huge middle finger?

Bad Box Art Mega Man's inclusion in SFXT was actually Inafune's idea. He thought it'd be funny.

Edited by Solly
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The extent of a game being a "homage" shouldn't extend beyond the gameplay itself.

Why not?

The artstyle resembles Megaman's style so much it seems like a deliberate move on their part to grab the attention of Megaman fans who liked the art and characters more than the actual gameplay and were on the fence about backing the project.

Why is trying to appeal to the people who liked the characters somehow more distasteful than trying to appeal to people who liked the gameplay? Why can someone say "hey you like that jump-and-shoot game? Well check out this jump-and-shoot game!", but not "hey you like that anime robot kid fighting evil robots? Well check out this anime robot kid fighting evil robots!"
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Okay Yong, let me ask you a question. It is clear that your stance on this will not change regardless of what anyone says. You firmly believe this project takes too many cues from Mega Man's look and so, in your eyes, it is not new or original enough to stand it's own ground, which in turn you think is the developers banking on a fanbase's love of the franchise and nothing else. Fair enough.

 

Now, I want you to really answer me honestly, and I mean honestly, when I ask this:

 

Do you actually believe that Capcom in the next 2, or maybe more years to come, are going to release a Mega Man title that would not only please fans of the series but other non-fans as well? And I don't mean 8-bit, 16-bit or any other bit, because at this point, those aren't going to cut it. I mean a game that tries to be something more that it's predecessors, that is able to do something new and fresh with the established franchise and maybe even revitalize it. Do you truly think this would happen?

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First off, I want to reply to this one part of one of your posts partially responding to mine, a few pages ago.

 

 

 

I think you have very much misinterpreted what my post was saying, to think that I was saying I wanted  M.N.9. to be "EXACTLY like that old game liked". If I wanted that, I'd wait a few years until Capcom eventually churns out another 8-bit cash in to "revitalize" the series as, I don't know, Mega Man 11 as we truly imagined it? 

 

This seems more like a re-imagining/sequel series, something that, I think you'll agree, Mega Man has tended to do a fair bit over the years.

 

 

 

 

Here we go, back to your argument that an idea, and who owns the rights to an idea, is first and foremost the deciding factor of if a game should be made or not. Maybe it's not my place to decide that.

 

However, this case here is legal, perfectly fine in most people's eyes, and no amount of griping over how it's "morally wrong" to copy your own idea, (which has apparently somehow stopped being the idea of a person(s), instead becoming a corporation's), because of your views of archaic copyright law, is going to change anything. 

 

Again, M.N.9. is perfectly valid under said copyright laws.

 

 

 

Another thing. That part I bolded? That is a really, really stupid argument.

 

By that same logic, Minecraft and Angry Birds, the games you just mentioned as having so many rip-offs, have no right to exist, because games similar to them came out before them, and likely inspired both. Hell, name any cut-and-paste modern military shooter made in the past few years or so. Yeah, the market is full of the fucking things, but does their blatant copying of each other trip your little moral sensors enough to make you believe that they shouldn't have been made in the first place?

 

On a related note, if nobody was able to copy an idea, than nobody would be able to build off of an idea. Copying ideas and improving and altering them is what this industry is MADE of. It's a natural part of what makes this industry grow.

 

 

 

Sorry if I got slightly off topic there. 

 

In any case, I know that you do not agree with what I, or quite a few others are saying, so I'm afraid we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this.

 

Yes, legal, but in bad form in my opinion. I believe you can make a good run-and-jump shooting platformer without your character being a blue robot with giant eyes, giant boots, a round helmet, and an arm cannon.

 

I want to be perfectly clear, I don't mind borrowing ideas from another source as long as it's only one part of the greater whole. I would be labeling myself a hypocrite otherwise because I am quite fond of Darksiders, Dead Space, and most importantly Sonic. As long as those ideas are being interpreted and worked upon as a foundation and not as the entire whole then it's acceptable. And yes, the copy-and-paste modern miltary shooters are not following this for the most part. If there was no ambition to build upon what the predecesor did prior with something new or different then nothing of worth was gained and those games deserve to be frowned upon.

 

At face value Mighty No. 9 doesn't look like it's doing anything to differ itself from Megaman in terms of both gameplay and universe. The gameplay might be getting tweaked slightly but from what I am to assume it's going to "stay true" to the "core gameplay" that the original Megaman established. I might have accepted this if not for the fact that the story, characters, and art style, all look like they were ripped right from the original source. Nothing was gained in regard to this game presenting an interesting universe and story to tell, which is just as important as the gameplay itself. Both parts gameplay and universe have not strayed far from the "inspiration," which is why I'm unsatisified with the project as I see it now.

 

In most cases though I can "forgive" lack of originality in one part of the game if the other half was something original and noteworthy. Like I can forgive a game having similar gameplay style to another if the effort was made to create a unique and interesting world, story, and characters to layer that gameplay. That's in response to everyone, not just Phantomime specifically.

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Okay Yong, let me ask you a question. It is clear that your stance on this will not change regardless of what anyone says. You firmly believe this project takes too many cues from Mega Man's look and so, in your eyes, it is not new or original enough to stand it's own ground, which in turn you think is the developers banking on a fanbase's love of the franchise and nothing else. Fair enough.

 

Now, I want you to really answer me honestly, and I mean honestly, when I ask this:

 

Do you actually believe that Capcom in the next 2, or maybe more years to come, are going to release a Mega Man title that would not only please fans of the series but other non-fans as well? And I don't mean 8-bit, 16-bit or any other bit, because at this point, those aren't going to cut it. I mean a game that tries to be something more that it's predecessors, that is able to do something new and fresh with the established franchise and maybe even revitalize it. Do you truly think this would happen?

 

I wouldn't be here if I didn't want to discuss this and quite possibly change my opinion. I am reading everyone's responses. And I think it's an important topic to discuss now that such a major figurehead in the gaming industry has created this situation.

 

It would just be blind faith and hope for me to say that Capcom will most undoubtedly make another Megaman game. No one wants to believe that a franchise they loved has suddenly come to an aburpt end. What I do believe though that it's still too early to assume Capcom has given up on the series. This is why I repeatedly mentioned that Megaman 10 only came out 3 years ago. Does anyone remember how many years it was before the newest Kid Icarus was made? 3 years isn't enough time to justify that someone else has the right to do with their ideas as they see fit. It shouldn't be the case to begin with.

 

Would it be something innovative? Given the recent events I'd think not. Likely the next installment will be something that stays close to its predecesors. All the projects Capcom canceled stray too far off the established formula and that's why they ultimately ended them, or so I want to believe. Wouldn't neccessarily be a bad thing but I'm in the camp that an established game franchise needs to stay close to home, so I don't know if the people wanting something different with each installment has outgrown those that want something similar.

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I personally believe Yong has good points, but this situation is different due to the fact it's made by the original creator AND Capcom shelved Megaman.

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At face value Mighty No. 9 doesn't look like it's doing anything to differ itself from Megaman in terms of both gameplay and universe. The gameplay might be getting tweaked slightly but from what I am to assume it's going to "stay true" to the "core gameplay" that the original Megaman established. I might have accepted this if not for the fact that the story, characters, and art style, all look like they were ripped right from the original source. Nothing was gained in regard to this game presenting an interesting universe and story to tell, which is just as important as the gameplay itself. Both parts gameplay and universe have not strayed far from the "inspiration," which is why I'm unsatisified with the project as I see it now.

 

In most cases though I can "forgive" lack of originality in one part of the game if the other half was something original and noteworthy. Like I can forgive a game having similar gameplay style to another if the effort was made to create a unique and interesting world, story, and characters to layer that gameplay. That's in response to everyone, not just Phantomime specifically.

 

Alright, I see what you mean. While the artstyle might not be going anywhere, the story and characters could surely be given more depth, which thanks to the forums/ backers thing that the kickstarter promotes, isn't that far from being a reality. I'm pretty sure there are people that would like to see a good amount of characterization and a decent story within Mighty No.9. I'd love to see how Beck, Call and other characters interact in the game's plot and such. So I wouldn't count out those things just yet.

Edited by TynenZ
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Alright, I see what you mean. While the artstyle might not be going anywhere, the story and characters could surely be given more depth, which thanks to the forums/ backers thing that the kickstarter promotes, isn't that far from being a reality. I'm pretty sure there are people that would like to see a good amount of characterization and a decent story within Mighty No.9. I'd love to see how Beck, Call and other characters interact in the game's plot and such. So I wouldn't count out those things just yet.

 

Perhaps. Although it's likely most of the fans who are backing the project have no problems with the story as is, if the reception I've gotten here is any indication.

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