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Doesn't stop him from taking down warmachines on his own, so a lack of strength certainly doesn't hold him that far back.

Tails needs prep-time for that. He can't storm in guns blazing like Sonic during critical moments, and he's far less adept at combat.

Lost World makes it clear that Tails mostly has ego issues, which is probably the first time a Sonic character seems to have actually exhibited that trait. It's not too surprising seeing how he's the youngest member of the cast and that he takes too much pride in his work. That bites him when he tries to fix Cubot in the most "no duh" way possible. He fixes it but it doesn't work the way it's supposed to, because he's too fixated on one-upping Eggman rather than making actual use of his intellect in a reasonable way, so even though he's right about Eggman in the end it's sort of a two-way street.

I wish the game was a lot more elaborate about the character interactions rather than resolving most dilemmas in one cutscene though.

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Y'know, I really liked how Tails was a bit of a smarmy teenage brat in this game. It's not perfect, but it's excellent progress from his previous state of "no personality at all" that he's had for the past decade (save for Colors, to an extent).

The thought of that is very unappealing to me. I'd rather he stay more polite.

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Tails needs prep-time for that. He can't storm in guns blazing like Sonic during critical moments, and he's far less adept at combat.

Yeah, post-Unleashed (and maybe even Sonic 06) he can't do that and was less adept.

 

Previously he was more adept than Amy was in combat. He may not have been as strong as Sonic, but he was just as capable of jumping straight into the fire to help fight Eggman directly, or help fight Chaos in SA1, or even solo Eggman's mech in his final story, fight Eggman on his own twice in SA2 (albiet in his own mech) and storm through a ultra-high security military base practically by himself to break out his friend (which was him literally storming in guns blazing) before going after Eggman in space, help stop Metal Sonic in Heroes (for whatever that's worth, regardless of who we're talking about), and help stop an alien invasion in ShTH.

Edited by CreepySpiritSonic

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Yeah, post-Unleashed (and maybe even Sonic 06) he can't do that and was less adept.

 

Previously he was more adept than Amy was in combat. He may not have been as strong as Sonic, but that never stopped him in jumping into the fire to help fight Eggman directly, or help fight Chaos in SA1, or solo Eggman's mech in his final story, fight Eggman on his own twice in SA2 (albiet in his own mech) and storm through a high security military base practically by himself to break out his friend (which was him literally storming in guns blazing) before going after Eggman in space, help stop Metal Sonic in Heroes (for whatever that's worth, regardless of who we're talking about), and help stop an alien invasion in ShTH.

 

This really bugs me. I just don't see why Tails even has anything to do with Sonic if he doesn't want in on the action. It's cool for him to be sarcastic and have an air of superiority sometimes, but he's also supposed to idolise Sonic. Even if he's not going to be playable, the cutscenes should show him being useful.

 

The elevator scene in Colours showed that Sonic didn't consider Tails be of assistance in battle, and then it happened again in the scene where Sonic gets rid of the conch in this game. Really annoying

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I took the elevator scene as Sonic being protective of Tails. :/

 

You speak for most people when you say that, but I just didn't think it was necessary. They've faced bigger threats together before, and Tails is (or use to be) more than capable of holding his own. After a whole game of doing nothing outside of tinkering with a gadget, he gets a chance to do something and yet gets pushed out of harms way.

 

Lame

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I can't say I would have done the same thing tho. If anything, I would certainly have had Tails fighting alongside Sonic or being physically there to help.

 

If anything, I blame the whole "Shitty Friends" Syndrome and "Solo Sonic" being a catalyst for this change in characterization. Looks like the Adventures' plots hold a stronger grip than we realize.

Edited by CreepySpiritSonic

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Times change, and so do characters; nobody is going to have the same personality they've had ten years ago, especially since we've gone through a revolving door of writers. I think the reason everyone finds Tails` attitude so jarring is because everyone is so accustomed to seeing him a certain way(i.e. the kid sidekick who idolizes Sonic).

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Times change, and so do characters; nobody is going to have the same personality they've had ten years ago, especially since we've gone through a revolving door of writers. I think the reason everyone finds Tails` attitude so jarring is because everyone is so accustomed to seeing him a certain way(i.e. the kid sidekick who idolizes Sonic).

But with changing times usually comes some gradual progress and development in characters as it sets in.

 

A change in personality is one thing, but a change in ability is another. Tails was no slouch in combat despite not being as strong, but he's undergone a regression if anything over that ability which comes off as a bit contradicting when previously he was capable of at least holding his own. I could accept that much easier if the shift did that gradually as Tails became out of shape in that area and was less capable, although I'm not sure that wouldn't stop the same questions from being asked. Then again, you could say that even towards Knuckles given what they've done to him, but it's whatever.

Edited by CreepySpiritSonic

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The thought of that is very unappealing to me. I'd rather he stay more polite.

He's not very teenage bratty, he's just they type of kid who blows up his own ego due to his talent.

 

Obviously this was already a thing, and to add a more "realistic" take to it, the story shows that hanging out with Sonic and looking up to him for some time that Tails picked up on Sonic's traits of cockines and ego-blowing, as he blows his own ego a bit when saying how easy it was for him to fix the plane. He still stays a naive child, but still as one it shows more depth to his character, that he holds his talent for tech with passion as he knows he's able to be reliable to Sonic(being his sidekick/best friend)

Edited by Chrononego

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But with changing times usually comes some gradual progress and development in characters as it sets in.

 

A change in personality is one thing, but a change in ability is another. Tails was no slouch in combat despite not being as strong, but he's undergone a regression if anything over that ability which comes off as a bit contradicting when previously he was capable of at least holding his own. I could accept that much easier if the shift did that gradually as Tails became out of shape in that area and was less capable, although I'm not sure that wouldn't stop the same questions from being asked. Then again, you could say that even towards Knuckles given what they've done to him, but it's whatever.

 

I wouldn't even say Tails is "weak", just that his forte isn't being a fighter but the tech guy; The brain to Sonic's brawn, which I will admit is simplifying the character, but it is what it is. Lost World clearly shows he's not helpless, so the "weak" argument doesn't make much sense unless you're speaking strictly physical ability.

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I wouldn't even say Tails is "weak", just that his forte isn't being a fighter but the tech guy; The brain to Sonic's brawn, which I will admit is simplifying the character, but it is what it is. Lost World clearly shows he's not helpless, so the "weak" argument doesn't make much sense unless you're speaking strictly physical ability.

I'm speaking strictly physical ability, and even that becomes a grey area when he can make up for that lack of strength when he can make use of gadgets for any kind of offensive capability he needs done.

Him not being a fighter never made him incapable of it. Mind you, I haven't seen all of Lost World's cutscenes than I have been going with the flow of the discussion.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free

Edited by CreepySpiritSonic

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I'm speaking strictly physical ability, and even that becomes a grey area when he can make up for that lack of strength when he can make use of gadgets for any kind of offensive capability he needs done.

Him not being a fighter never made him incapable of it. Mind you, I haven't seen all of Lost World's cutscenes than I have been going with the flow of the discussion.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free

 

The only thing I can attest his non-fighter status to is the fact that he's simply not a playable character anymore, which is where most of his physical prowess came from; he doesn't need to be playable to show that he's capable.

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I kinda like the idea of Tails being a bit more boisterous and 'bratty', partially because it reminds me of the older incarnations of Tails and because I feel it evens him out and makes his foilage of Sonic more two way rather than just limiting him to a Straight Man. I feel Tails needs to be less mature anyway, precocious yes, but not have the demeanor of a dull old sage.

 

One of the things I liked about this story was that it provided a good balance for Sonic in terms of flaws and strengths. That's hardly ever done in other incarnations, where he's either the Ace miles above everyone else (eg. Sonic X) or an obnoxious manchild in a bunch of sane young adults (eg. Satam and Archie). We get a good display of Sonic's ego and recklessness, how it can be detrimental and how Tails acts as a foil to it. But Tails also has broader flaws that compliment Sonic's redeeming aspects, having a more obnoxious temperament that Sonic's easy going nature tries to soothe and his over fixation with his machines to the point of attention deficit, which I think makes a nice full opposite to Sonic's focused approach and showing 'reckless is bad, but the opposite extreme can be just as deadly' (something they've NEVER done for Sally, Sonic's other opposing meticulous foil). For good measure they've also made Tails more enthusiastic, willing to join in on Sonic's quips and showing a tad cocky attitude, making clear they have some relatable facets between them.

 

Lost World to me has confirmed the games Sonic as the most well rounded incarnation of the character.

Edited by E-122-Psi

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It's true that Sonic and Tails could of easily taken down Eggman together, but remember what happens after Sonic beats Egg Nega Wisp? Yeah that huge black hole/vortex that not even SONIC could out-run and barely made it out, so after that I wonder to myself if Tails would have survived it, and it's a good thing Sonic saved him by putting him out of harms way.

 

*shrug*

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The fact that he wasn't the one to end up correcting his machine isn't what bothered me

But he was. Remember the cutscene before the boss? "Now to shut this off, hold on, it's off already?"

Tails just does again what Eggman did already. I'll go as far as to say it's implied the whole "the machine will be stuck and unable to shutdown!" deal was mostly malarkey so Eggman could manipulate the heroes.

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But he was. Remember the cutscene before the boss? "Now to shut this off, hold on, it's off already?"

Tails just does again what Eggman did already. I'll go as far as to say it's implied the whole "the machine will be stuck and unable to shutdown!" deal was mostly malarkey so Eggman could manipulate the heroes.

Orbot did say it will be stuck on overload if they continued draining energy in an earlier custcene..FYI.

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I really must unlock Super Sonic now...

 

Yeah. After fooling around with him, I will flat out say that this is the definitive 3D Super Sonic gameplay. The fact that his jingle isn't a 5 second loop also helps.

Edited by KrazyBean

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Lost World to me has confirmed the games Sonic as the most well rounded incarnation of the character.

 

I actually agree with this. Just tone down the awkward cheese slightly and make sure that in future games that Sonic has actually learned not to be so impulsive and think a bit more and it'd be even better.

 

What I particularly like about SLW!Sonic is that he's confident and not the slightest bit prone to intimidation. Just look at how he gets right in Zazz's face and then talks to Zavok in a fairly condescending way upon finding him, he was even going to threaten him until he was cut short by the revelation about 'roboticization'

 

And yet he is very much capable of feeling very put-out by the 'fates' of his friends and allies and admitting culpability for his actions. Unleashed kinda skimmed the 'put-out' bit with his reaction to Amy failing to recognize him and completely failed to elaborate on the culpability bit and this is partly why I consider this SLW portrayal generally pretty superior to his Unleashed portrayal.

 

I think it's very much on-par with Sonic's Storybook portrayal but I come to the conclusion that those two and this game nailed Sonic in different areas whilst providing a very likable portrayal in other aspects.

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I actually agree with this. Just tone down the awkward cheese slightly and make sure that in future games that Sonic has actually learned not to be so impulsive and think a bit more and it'd be even better.

 

What I particularly like about SLW!Sonic is that he's confident and not the slightest bit prone to intimidation. Just look at how he gets right in Zazz's face and then talks to Zavok in a fairly condescending way upon finding him, he was even going to threaten him until he was cut short by the revelation about 'roboticization'

 

And yet he is very much capable of feeling very put-out by the 'fates' of his friends and allies and admitting culpability for his actions. Unleashed kinda skimmed the 'put-out' bit with his reaction to Amy failing to recognize him and completely failed to elaborate on the culpability bit and this is partly why I consider this SLW portrayal generally pretty superior to his Unleashed portrayal.

 

I think it's very much on-par with Sonic's Storybook portrayal but I come to the conclusion that those two and this game nailed Sonic in different areas whilst providing a very likable portrayal in other aspects.

I kinda like the fact that said titles are beginning to show Sonic ending up out of his comfort zone, and showing him losing his cool that doesn't take away his redeeming qualities. This is what I generally don't like about interpretations such as Archie, the moment someone starts stepping in his way, his 'like the wind' attitude that defines him so much falls apart and he turns into a angsty self righteous hot head, which kinda makes him look like he's full of crap.

 

Sonic in Lost World shows signs of feeling the pressure and can get frustrated and even pissy in a way that shows he has emotions, but maintains a sort of controlled 'Beware The Nice Ones' attitude to it. He even shows quick admittance to his own shortcomings rather than lashing out on someone else, but still maintaining some sense of a shattered pride, especially when Eggman berates him over it. I think this works in maintaining one of his best positive aspects, he's a hyperactive show off but all in all an easy going guy (I know endless bios say he has a temper, but I think making him laid back evens things and works better into making his egotism likable).

 

I'm not sure about him learning not to be impulsive altogether. I would like some progression and showing he can wise up to his mistakes to some degree that avoids Aesop Amnesia (especially given how medias like Satam milked the crap out of it), but losing that cocky spontaneous side after it's just started getting humanized greatly I think would take away from him. I HATE when writers think characters can just naturally lose all their flaws. Tails already suffered a lot from this before. Just as long as it isn't Flanderized and Sonic doesn't end up a perpetual Leeroy Jenkins every story I think it works.

Edited by E-122-Psi

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