what is the general perception of the deadly six?

[Maxtiis]

Part of the problem is the Deadly Six are a collective, not individual villains in their own right. People love the Legion of Doom, the Sinister Six, and other villain groups because they're villains that have had time to each leave their mark on us and were still able to show their personality even when part of a team. The Deadly Six didn't have that luxury. And they weren't really all that unique from one another as far as their abilities go.

Plus they're not very deadly whatsoever considering how piss-poor their boss fights were.

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

That's one of the things I've been heavily against in general after Heroes cemented this as a thing--treating characters as a group first and individuals second.

Characters that are strong, colorful, and layered on their own often make the group stronger as a whole given how the dimensions of each one builds and synergizes (or competes) with the others. I don't care if they "served their purpose," a collective group of three-dimensional characters would have far more to offer than a two-dimensional one.

[Shadowlax]

7 hours ago, Maxtiis said:

Part of the problem is the Deadly Six are a collective, not individual villains in their own right. People love the Legion of Doom, the Sinister Six, and other villain groups because they're villains that have had time to each leave their mark on us and were still able to show their personality even when part of a team. The Deadly Six didn't have that luxury. And they weren't really all that unique from one another as far as their abilities go.

Plus they're not very deadly whatsoever considering how piss-poor their boss fights were.

This is an excellent point I feel, and I feel its in combination with other things. Another one being, I personally don't feel like their designs are good, and more so than that, sonic-ey. They feel like bad mario or rejected Disney villains rather than anything sonic would cook up . And I feel like it ties into your point, they are just a bunch of people shoved on a team and we don't care about them. But I feel this is reflective of their anything, they just feel... shoved in. LIke sega is shoving them in our faces " hey new villains don't you like they, they aren't edgy and they are silly a colorful " and they are just kind of bad. Like not understanding what made their previous popular villains stick in the first place,  they feel unfinished. They feel unfinished a half idea, not understanding the criticism lodged at them. But then again, that describes lost world too. 

 

6 hours ago, Conquering Storm's Servant said:

That's one of the things I've been heavily against in general after Heroes cemented this as a thing--treating characters as a group first and individuals second.

Characters that are strong, colorful, and layered on their own often make the group stronger as a whole given how the dimensions of each one builds and synergizes (or competes) with the others. I don't care if they "served their purpose" collective group of three-dimensional characters would have far more to offer than a two-dimensional one.

I also agree with this

[RictalRose0]

On 10/3/2017 at 5:09 PM, Conquering Storm's Servant said:

But even Mephilies has a strong following due to him being the only villian to legit kill Sonic. (Still doesn't top Eggman being one of the few to defeat Super Sonic tho)

That whole game had hiccups, and as much as I criticize the direction of things as of late I don't think that's something to fault Pontac and Graff that much.

Dude, that doesn't make any sense. You can't put blame on Pontac and Graff for the poor writing even though they are the writers? What? That's like saying "I can't blame the chef for the bland flavor of this meal, they're just the chef".

[CrownSlayers Shadow]

7 hours ago, RictalRose0 said:

Dude, that doesn't make any sense. You can't put blame on Pontac and Graff for the poor writing even though they are the writers? What? That's like saying "I can't blame the chef for the bland flavor of this meal, they're just the chef".

Yeah, that doesn't make sense because I literally did not say that.

What I said was that I don't think that's something to fault Pontac and Graff that much, and the reason why is because while they may be the writers they're not in charge of the direction that they're writing for. Much the same way they weren't the ones who created the D6 they were writing for as I called out earlier -- I don't even see Ian Flynn doing a better job of writing them in that game given that he wouldn't have any control in how they're portrayed than Pontac and Graff, and chances are the D6 would have still came off poor given that they would still be stereotypical cut-outs that would lack depth since the characters weren't given much of it to begin with.

That's not saying they hold no blame whatsoever, but it's more like saying "blame the manager in charge also for not letting the chef add more flavor to the meal."

[RictalRose0]

Except this time around, they did. We have an article about this in this very own site.

https://www.sonicstadium.org/2013/08/ken-pontac-on-lost-worlds-story/

" Actually, this WAS the first time that Warren and I were asked to come up with the story. On Colors and Generations the stories were already in place. "

 

[FriendBot]

5 hours ago, RictalRose0 said:

Except this time around, they did. We have an article about this in this very own site.

https://www.sonicstadium.org/2013/08/ken-pontac-on-lost-worlds-story/

" Actually, this WAS the first time that Warren and I were asked to come up with the story. On Colors and Generations the stories were already in place. "

 

They may have had more control over the story, they didn't had complete control voer it. Sonic Team still wanted to include the Zeti into the mix.

[CottonCandy]

Deadly Six. They were a thing, I guess...

I remember loving the designs when they were revealed. Although, they, and the world they lived, felt a bit out of place in a sonic game. Granted I only seen cut scenes of the game but I don't remember the game explaining much about them or their home. And the way they were portrayed was mediocre at best, they acted more like genertic saturday morning cartoon villains than anything. Honestly, I think their general perception is just being forgettable. I don't hear alot of people caring or remembering them clearly nowadays.  

[RictalRose0]

I had more problem with how Sonic and Tails were setting up some sort of tension only for it to be dropped by the end of the game with no explanation. That bothered me a lot more that the Deadly Six being rather flat.

[Dr. Detective]

I would never outright defend the Deadly Six, seeing as how the complaints laid at their feet are generally correct on all fronts. That said, I bare no hatred towards them (I almost did towards Zazz when it was revealed he was "playable" in the newest Olympics and not my favorite bumble bee buddy but then I realized it literally didn't matter and got over it).

I was mostly entertained by them at the end of the day and I think it's mostly due, not to their merit as characters, but to their merit as a villain group with a dynamic that was somewhat close to what I was desiring for the Sonic series to do again. I wanted villains who talked to each other and could bounce off of not just one another but also Sonic in ways that were different then the typical Black Doom taunting Shadow about how he's the ultimate PC Master Race. 

Zavok in general gave me the first scene in years that made me give a shit about the well-being of the characters when he showed up to tell Sonic that they were gonna turn Tails into a robot and I absolutely love the fact that despite being the leader, he still considers himself beneath his master. That's an interesting tidbit that I wish were explored more.

Speaking of Master Zik, I love the fact that they have a master. Something about that feels really cool in a cosmic sort of way. The execution leaves a lot to be desired but his being their master while also not being the main villain was something I liked.

And Zazz and Zor were just entertaining in general for what they were, regardless of any relative talk about how primitive and basic their characterizations are. 

Zomom and Zeena are... ...eh... 

Anyway, despite managing to find something to like about them, I don't see myself clamoring for their return. If another villain group comes around that's on the level of something Eiichiro Oda were to write you can bet I'd forget about these fuckers in a heart beat.