What's your envisionment of a Sonic cartoon?

[Dr. Mechano]

Oh no I am agreeing with you Gordo, I meant it to come across as the lack of importance on the separation between today's and the 90's version because they were always different universes. I was saying that because Redmenace seemed to be putting an emphasis on today's Sonic.

I still don't follow.

Focusing solely on the games and disregarding the cartoons/comics for a moment, where did it say that the modern games are a different universe from the older ones? Please point that out to me, because according to the Japanese plotline anyway, the games have always taken place on the same planet, Earth. Sonic Adventure even includes a flashback to what I presume was supposed to be Sonic CD, with Metal Sonic kidnapping Amy. If that's not proof of all games sharing the same continuity, then frankly I don't know what is.

So I'm not sure what you mean by "today and the 90s are different universes."

[Annie-Mae]

I had been wanting to do a few Sonic cartoons myself.

One I thought was a Chaotix cartoon. Where it'd look a little like Sonic X but with a higher budget (TMS who did the better Animaniacs episodes could really push the best expressions). I was inspired by Yuski's Chaotix comics that he's done, which in a CoroCoro Comic style. It'd be random detective stories of them going on missions and explaining some of the creation of the team (and possibly Mighty showing up).

Other one was the Retelling Sonic Heroes in AoStH style. Adding a Ska theme song and bringing back the other American Sonic designs, as well as giving all the other characters the American look. If Sega wouldn't want that I'd like to see them all go back to the OVA style as well. But a more humorous Sonic cartoon is needed now. Regardless I'd love to have Scratch(Flight), Grounder(Fighting), and Coconuts(speed) being in the Heroes battle style.

I was also thinking of retelling Sonic Rush. Done in a different style, not really Sonic X or classic style, but just an accurate retelling of the game's story. This would play a lot on the movements of Sonic and blaze through the levels and the music would be a key factor of the show, because it would need to have the original songs (done in a high quality remix).

[Blacklightning]

Does a game disguised as a cartoon count? Yeah I know, sounds wierd, but hear me out. I mean that more than sheer visual style (whether they use cartoony sprites like the Advance ones or complex cell-shaded 3D is anyone's guess - personally I'm fine with either), but a game that aims to replicate the nostaliga of your classic Saturday morning cartoon by means of gameplay - levels divided by episodes complete with "last time on..." commentary, chatty options that could potentially effect the turnout of the episode, lengthy, choreographed, overly flashy finishing moves (yes,

kind)... it could probably go a lot further than that but personally I think the concept's got a lot of potential to exploit, and personally I'm surprised nobody else has tried to yet.

[redmenace]

First of all the thread asks what's MY envisionment of a Sonic Cartoon, and second of all I think you are under cutting is. You have no right to say those people have no place in the franchise, a lot of people got into sonic through the cartoons, and some just like those and are not big fan of the games. You act as though it would immediately alienate fans, but I think the odler fans of SatAM would watch it, plus all the newer Sonic fans would give it a try out of curiosity, and if it's a good cartoon I think they would stay. It doesn't need to over throw the Conic continuity, they just need to be good, the story needs to be good and the characters have to have good personality, which I think both SatAM and Archie excel at. As far as "today's" version of Sonic I think you need to understand they are different universes, and shouldn't put such little faith in the fanbase.

I wasn't answering only to you, I replied to a lot of people that cannot let go of some cartoon that is dead for fifteen years and a comic that isn’t popular anymore, at least comparing it to the games. It might have sound harsh but it’s painful to see how a small minority of the fanbase can cling to this fantasy of the Freedom Fighters and cannot care about the majority of the fanbase at all, it’s as much as the classic fans that refuse to acknowledge anything in 3D because it’s not what they grew up with, or the small legion of fans that want Ryan back or the Mighty and Fang fans (who I sympathise since I like them a lot though they still annoy me) who cannot accept they’re never coming back. Bawling over things that won’t ever happen seems a pure waste of time to me.

I think people should grown up and start being less selfish and know a compromise has to be done, something that would please the majority of the franchise and not a niche and exclusive part of it. There’s never going to be a SatAM / Archie / Underground cartoon, I’d go ahead and say Sonic X is also pretty much buried even if it was three or four years ago. What was about these continuities that people liked so much? I’m sure some of you want to see Robotnik in some kind of pos apocalyptic scenery, and I agree it would be interesting, but where does his SatAM / Archie / Underground characterization has anything to do with what we have now? And who says Robotnik, says Sonic, which is only a yes-man, Tails, who gets a major dumb down (if he even appears) in each of this media outlets, and Knuckles who didn't even had a time to chance (not speaking about Archie here).

Who is going to see the cartoon? Sonic fans, the occasional kids that has played a Sonic that have liked it and a lot more kids that suddenly switch on the TV. How can they relate to Archie / SatAM / Underground I’d go ahead and put Sonic X there as well? They can’t. How can the kids who ever heard about Sonic make the transition from the cartoon to the games and go ahead without much of a problem? They can’t. From a business view, this will never be done, because it's the same as shooting themselves in the foot. They're not popular either, another shot in the foot. As if not enough Archie / SatAM started as very different from the games already and have distanced themselves even more with time, they have not aged well, neither have their characterizations or stories. A third shot in the foot? Defend a storyline with Robotnik in power and Sonic and the game cast trying to stop him, with characterizations up to date and the same colourful setting, not some dumb forest no one cares about. That’s something that can happen nowadays, but adding the whole cast of SatAM is never going to happen, neither is adding major characters that have no connection with the usual ones, so why even bother point it out as the salvation of a Sonic cartoon is beyond me. Chris was an annoying character that took the shine out of Sonic and Tails, he's hated almost across every Sonic fan's mind, and you people defend that this should happen anyway with the adding of the Freedom Fighters?

I know I sound harsh, but a Sonic comic or a Sonic cartoon ONLY fan has no place in the Sonic franchise, because this was always about the games, not the secondary medias he was distributed in, which have all died or aren’t popular anymore. It’s this clinging to spin-off storylines that are already dead and beaten to a pulp that it’s painful to watch. It’s never going to happen, it stales the franchise and alienates the majority of it. I see no point in this.

[Picchi]

Want to see Eggman or any of the others in their classic design? Sure. Focus on Sonic, Tails, Eggman and Knuckles, maybe throw Amy because she's female? Fine, it was what everyone was used to, what everyone knows, and what everyone in the fanbase likes or should like since the games are what connects everyone together.

That's just the thing, though. Its not enough just to alienate other fans, characters and concepts simply on the basis of appeasing the gaming fans. Yes, the gaming community makes up the largest portion of the fanbase, but while they're important in that sense, its nevertheless crucial for SEGA to incorporate characters and concepts that would market well to the countries they're selling their product to as a whole. For what its worth, the majority of the east and west don't enjoy where the gaming Sonic's direction is going, and while certain concepts and characters may be well-known by people in and outside of gaming circles, that doesn't mean that they're well-liked. For instance, I may like Amy Rose, and she (as well as the SonAmy relationship) may be popular amongst the current fans, but I can already attest that just as many westerners she's marketted to aren't going to like her on the basis that she's far too clingy and obsessive on Sonic for their tastes.

Everyone that dislikes the games and likes any of the spin-offs has no place in the franchise since that's not what it is, escuse me my harshness but I can't grasp this as a logic thought

I understand what you're saying, and I think that SEGA's had a similar mindset for a long time. However, under this logic, they're not going to get anymore customers as people don't even like where the current direction is going.

They're not big enough, not even in the slightest, to overthrow the game's continuity.

Why make them compete against each other when you can have them work together, instead? Characters aside, when you take a very close look at all of these continuities, they're all concepts that can be worked into the game's Sonic at the core. Being a guy who loves adventure, Sonic can face off Eggman's underlings just as he does in AoStH. A Robotnik monniker can always expand territories in some places of the world, with perhaps Sonic having to take a stand to put a stop to it with his friends similar to how he did in SatAM. Sally, Bunnie, Antione, Rotor etc. might not be in it, but the concept for a cartoon, may still be workable.

If anything, the prior cartoons at their core all expressed things that they knew the people in their countries would value. Sally Acorn and Julie-su were based on the feminist ideals of the 90s, AoStH played off the Looney Toons aesthetic and SatAM, Sonic Underground and for awhile Archie took more from popular series such as Star Wars, which needless to say is a western classic. So to just shrug them off and say that they're not worth anything without reviewing them is really a waste in potential marketting opportunity.

Who is going to see the cartoon? Sonic fans, the occasional kids that has played a Sonic that have liked it and a lot more kids that suddenly switch on the TV.

The classic Sonic marketting plan was a lot smarter. Instead of selling the product to just children or the dwindling fans that're left, they instead made cartoons family friendly, which important, especially when you consider how much games are worth these days. By only marketting Sonic to little kids and the current fanbase you hack away at the potential demographic by a large percentage. Keep in mind majority of gamers aren't little kids, majority of gamers don't like the current direction of Sonic and neither does most of the public at large. Furthermore, this won't do but so much for SEGA's gaming sales, which is the ultimate goal here.

SEGA already tried marketting a cartoon for kids with Sonic X. Look how that turned out. It didn't fair well in Japan and it was only a temporary solution at the very best here in the western countries. Some kids might have tuned in to watch, but people obviously weren't interested enough in it to raise the revenue of the games by a substantial amount.

[Flyboy Fox]

I wasn't answering only to you, I replied to a lot of people that cannot let go of some cartoon that is dead for fifteen years and a comic that isn’t popular anymore, at least comparing it to the games. It might have sound harsh but it’s painful to see how a small minority of the fanbase can cling to this fantasy of the Freedom Fighters and cannot care about the majority of the fanbase at all, it’s as much as the classic fans that refuse to acknowledge anything in 3D because it’s not what they grew up with, or the small legion of fans that want Ryan back or the Mighty and Fang fans (who I sympathise since I like them a lot though they still annoy me) who cannot accept they’re never coming back. Bawling over things that won’t ever happen seems a pure waste of time to me.

First of all, who's bawling? This topic is about what we would personally LIKE to see. I admitted that I was in the minority for wanting this, and that I'd be happy enough with just Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, Amy and Robotnik. I really don't understand why WANTING something different from the mainstream is such a crime, anyway. Why have this topic at all if there's only one correct answer.

I think people should grown up and start being less selfish and know a compromise has to be done, something that would please the majority of the franchise and not a niche and exclusive part of it. There’s never going to be a SatAM / Archie / Underground cartoon, I’d go ahead and say Sonic X is also pretty much buried even if it was three or four years ago. What was about these continuities that people liked so much? I’m sure some of you want to see Robotnik in some kind of pos apocalyptic scenery, and I agree it would be interesting, but where does his SatAM / Archie / Underground characterization has anything to do with what we have now? And who says Robotnik, says Sonic, which is only a yes-man, Tails, who gets a major dumb down (if he even appears) in each of this media outlets, and Knuckles who didn't even had a time to chance (not speaking about Archie here).

Why is it selfish to want something? I know that there won't ever be a SatAM-based cartoon again, but that doesn't mean it's selfish for me to say that I want it. It's something I would personally like. This topic is called "What's your envisionment of a Sonic cartoon" not "What would SEGA allow/produce if they made/commissioned a Sonic cartoon".

Heck, if I wanted a Transformers/Sonic crossover cartoon (which for the record I don't), it wouldn't be selfish to say so.

Who is going to see the cartoon? Sonic fans, the occasional kids that has played a Sonic that have liked it and a lot more kids that suddenly switch on the TV. How can they relate to Archie / SatAM / Underground I’d go ahead and put Sonic X there as well? They can’t. How can the kids who ever heard about Sonic make the transition from the cartoon to the games and go ahead without much of a problem? They can’t. From a business view, this will never be done, because it's the same as shooting themselves in the foot. They're not popular either, another shot in the foot. As if not enough Archie / SatAM started as very different from the games already and have distanced themselves even more with time, they have not aged well, neither have their characterizations or stories. A third shot in the foot? Defend a storyline with Robotnik in power and Sonic and the game cast trying to stop him, with characterizations up to date and the same colourful setting, not some dumb forest no one cares about. That’s something that can happen nowadays, but adding the whole cast of SatAM is never going to happen, neither is adding major characters that have no connection with the usual ones, so why even bother point it out as the salvation of a Sonic cartoon is beyond me. Chris was an annoying character that took the shine out of Sonic and Tails, he's hated almost across every Sonic fan's mind, and you people defend that this should happen anyway with the adding of the Freedom Fighters?

Again, so what? I don't understand what your issue is with people who like things that are different from what you like. You're acting as if I, and any other SatAM etc fan, are actually trying to pitch our ideas to SEGA at the expense of your ideas.

I know I sound harsh, but a Sonic comic or a Sonic cartoon ONLY fan has no place in the Sonic franchise, because this was always about the games, not the secondary medias he was distributed in, which have all died or aren’t popular anymore. It’s this clinging to spin-off storylines that are already dead and beaten to a pulp that it’s painful to watch. It’s never going to happen, it stales the franchise and alienates the majority of it. I see no point in this.

Fine. You're probably right, but that doesn't make my WISH any less valid and it doesn't make it selfish. It's just personal preference and you need to learn to let people have opinions without attacking them for it.

[Frobman]

What I think might work well is a cartoon that almost acts like a game plot, in either a span of a few episodes (like an OVA, so not a full 25 episodes a season neccesarily) or a few hours, and each new one has a different plot. I'll use Sonic Unleashed as an example, as if there's no game yet.

Starts with Sonic versus Eggman, Super Sonic power sapped, Dark Gaia released (general plot for this arc) and Sonic becomes a Werehog (The gimmick of the cartoon) and he meets Chip (the original character for this series of stories. All cartoons and games will include an original character regardless). They go through the "stages" to collect and look for stuff (Gaia gates and keys) or beat up people (bosses). He travels around the world with Tails and meets and interacts with people. Considering how Sonic can help them in the games, it's likely that they'll have Sonic helping whoever on the way. Then Chip finds out who he is, they storm to Eggman's place, final battle, story arcs end.

As for the style, I wouldn't know. May not mind as much. But something in that way could work pretty well. Straight forward stories that're similar to what they do in the main video games to begin with (which is what everybody would refer to more so on whatever medium they're working on) with recognisable characters and new ones, and the sense of Sonic traveling from place to place to deal with a crisis of sorts. I guess people wouldn't like the approuch, or maybe the writing if done bad, but that sounds like a way closer to what a Sonic story is in general. As for characteristics, I can expect some variations, based on past incarnations of cartoons and comics and manual translations.

[Legendary Emerald]

I'm of mixed opinion on this matter. As much as I would love a darker, more serious contiuation of SatAM with the modern Sonic char designs, I don't know if anyone but the original writers and some of the very talented fanfiction writers could pull it off. So my second choice would be an anime based on the Sonic OVA. This is similarly unlikely, because almost everyone besides us wouldn't even remember the damn thing.

So the most likely idea I could see SEGA using would be to set the cartoon in the Sonic Adventure-Sonic 2006 world (ignoring the ultra-realistic environments and wacky character designs of Unleashed) and mostly stick to the anthro characters. I also doubt the show would be super-serious, so I'd expect some good writers on board so we don't get any more terrible jokes of the "Chip" caliber. Hopefully the series would have some sort of on-going plot, but take side breaks as well like most normal anime.

Anyways, after the way Sonic X died without so much as a fizzle, I don't think we'll have another Sonic cartoon to chide and make fun of for a long time.

[Kiljoy]

I still don't follow.

Focusing solely on the games and disregarding the cartoons/comics for a moment, where did it say that the modern games are a different universe from the older ones? Please point that out to me, because according to the Japanese plotline anyway, the games have always taken place on the same planet, Earth. Sonic Adventure even includes a flashback to what I presume was supposed to be Sonic CD, with Metal Sonic kidnapping Amy. If that's not proof of all games sharing the same continuity, then frankly I don't know what is.

So I'm not sure what you mean by "today and the 90s are different universes."

I don't think I am explaining my self right, what I meant was that all along the SaTAM and Archie universes were always different then the game universe. I am agreeing that the game universe was always the same.

I wasn't answering only to you, I replied to a lot of people that cannot let go of some cartoon that is dead for fifteen years and a comic that isn

Edited June 27, 2009 by Kiljoy

[Miko]

My two cents so far on this debating about the games:

The modern games are based off the classics just like the comics and cartoons are. They are not the same verse. A popular example I tend to use is Izuka's interview on the Chaotix. There, he explains they are not the same characters but reinvented with perhaps a very similar design and sharing the same moniker. So it's really pointless to complain about ___ just being based off the games, because most of you are in favor of things greatly established from a game storyline based off a game storyline and hence no different. It being mainstream means nothing because just as our mainstream concepts of Sonic have been shaken up for the perceived better good, it could happen again if necessary. It being mainstream also will never change the fact that it is merely based off the classics which means that there are perhaps 2 or 3 gaming storylines with the current interpretation being based off the prior Japanese storyline.

There's really IMO no reason to be debating this. The games never wrote much in the way of storyline so complaining as though we'd be losing some sort of Shakespearean literature is just...no. I couldn't care less if the modern game storyline was ditched altogether for something new as long as it proved interesting. Beyond Knux a lot of people don't care about the additions anyway and even Knuckles is pushing it. Oh I'm sure Sonic fans love Shadow, Rouge, Cream and Big but most people outside this circle don't give a crap. We talk about the fanbase's current state like its all that and a bag of chips when for what it's worth basic concepts like dictator Robotnik proved to be the prevailing interpretation of the character up until Sonic Adventure. For most people it hasn't worked and for me, it hasn't worked. I get so tired of people whining about how we shouldn't care about the story element up until we get into discussions like these. THEN they pull a 180.

So what could I see in a cartoon? i typed too much already. A bit later maybe? lol.

Edited June 27, 2009 by Miko

[redmenace]

That's just the thing, though. Its not enough just to alienate other fans, characters and concepts simply on the basis of appeasing the gaming fans. Yes, the gaming community makes up the largest portion of the fanbase, but while they're important in that sense, its nevertheless crucial for SEGA to incorporate characters and concepts that would market well to the countries they're selling their product to as a whole. For what its worth, the majority of the east and west don't enjoy where the gaming Sonic's direction is going, and while certain concepts and characters may be well-known by people in and outside of gaming circles, that doesn't mean that they're well-liked. For instance, I may like Amy Rose, and she (as well as the SonAmy relationship) may be popular amongst the current fans, but I can already attest that just as many westerners she's marketted to aren't going to like her on the basis that she's far too clingy and obsessive on Sonic for their tastes.

I understand what you're saying, and I think that SEGA's had a similar mindset for a long time. However, under this logic, they're not going to get anymore customers as people don't even like where the current direction is going.

Why make them compete against each other when you can have them work together, instead? Characters aside, when you take a very close look at all of these continuities, they're all concepts that can be worked into the game's Sonic at the core. Being a guy who loves adventure, Sonic can face off Eggman's underlings just as he does in AoStH. A Robotnik monniker can always expand territories in some places of the world, with perhaps Sonic having to take a stand to put a stop to it with his friends similar to how he did in SatAM. Sally, Bunnie, Antione, Rotor etc. might not be in it, but the concept for a cartoon, may still be workable.

If anything, the prior cartoons at their core all expressed things that they knew the people in their countries would value. Sally Acorn and Julie-su were based on the feminist ideals of the 90s, AoStH played off the Looney Toons aesthetic and SatAM, Sonic Underground and for awhile Archie took more from popular series such as Star Wars, which needless to say is a western classic. So to just shrug them off and say that they're not worth anything without reviewing them is really a waste in potential marketting opportunity.

The classic Sonic marketting plan was a lot smarter. Instead of selling the product to just children or the dwindling fans that're left, they instead made cartoons family friendly, which important, especially when you consider how much games are worth these days. By only marketting Sonic to little kids and the current fanbase you hack away at the potential demographic by a large percentage. Keep in mind majority of gamers aren't little kids, majority of gamers don't like the current direction of Sonic and neither does most of the public at large. Furthermore, this won't do but so much for SEGA's gaming sales, which is the ultimate goal here.

SEGA already tried marketting a cartoon for kids with Sonic X. Look how that turned out. It didn't fair well in Japan and it was only a temporary solution at the very best here in the western countries. Some kids might have tuned in to watch, but people obviously weren't interested enough in it to raise the revenue of the games by a substantial amount.

And why don't they tone Amy Rose down? Problem solved.

Ad it isn't what the gamers want it go? Last time I checked Unleashed was popular with the new kids, and the majority of the fanbase, though having issues with some stuff, think it's a step in the good direction.

Things for kids in mind can also appeal to grown-ups, like Disney. You do not need a gritty and drama story to hook adults into seeing it. And in my opinion, it doesn't suit the characters or the world of Sonic. And Sonic X failed mostly because of Chris. Everyone I know enjoyed the show when he wans't around or taking a small lead.

Edited June 27, 2009 by redmenace

[Dr. Mechano]

This is the problem, it's wishing for things that won't ever happen and not focusing on what you have right now that makes the fanbase so unpleasable.

Nothing wrong with wishing for the improbable, or even the impossible.

Lord knows I'd love an Eggman spinoff cartoon, but we all know that'll never happen (Although the Sonic X comic could almost be considered that in print form). SatAM fans can dream too.

Edited June 27, 2009 by El Gran Gordo

[redmenace]

But you know there's a difference between reality and dreams, and you know and accept it. I'd like a spinoff like that but we won't ever have it, so why bring it to a discussion of a supposed Sonic cartoon when it's never going to happen? The majority of SatAM / Archie fans don't have a grasp on this and have to take every chance they have to drop one of these names as the salvation of Sonic, which is nothing but wishful thinking, and contributes nothing to the conversation at hand.

[Dr. Mechano]

But you know there's a difference between reality and dreams, and you know and accept it. I'd like a spinoff like that but we won't ever have it, so why bring it to a discussion of a supposed Sonic cartoon when it's never going to happen? The majority of SatAM / Archie fans don't have a grasp on this and have to take every chance they have to drop one of these names as the salvation of Sonic, which is nothing but wishful thinking, and contributes nothing to the conversation at hand.

I must respectfully disagree.

I'm no SatAM fan- I actually have quite a distaste for that series, its treatment of Dr. Robotnik in particular. But to say that their wishes contribute nothing to the conversation is simply untrue.

This topic isn't about "realistic" propositions. It's about what individual posters desire, or "envision" as their personal Sonic cartoon to quote the title.

It's "unrealistic" to imagine another Sonic cartoon to begin with, so that's beside the issue altogether.

[redmenace]

Well fine, have it your way, I was under the impression this topic was to bring a consense between fans and discuss what could be done with what we have now, but it seems it's about dreams instead.

I still think the stubborness of these people regarding something that is dead or not popular anymore to be painful to watch and brings nothing but bittherness both ways to the franchise nowadays.

[Flyboy Fox]

No one is saying that SatAM etc is popular. It's not stubborness to like something old-school. I'm not bitter to fans of the newer stuff, and most fans of the newer stuff aren't bitter towards me. You seem to have a problem with opinions, and I would say that's far more harmful to the harmony of the Sonic community than merely professing a wish for something that's long gone.

[Picchi]

And why don't they tone Amy Rose down? Problem solved.

Trying to tone down Amy is essentially like trying to change the chasing relationship Tom had with Jerry in their cartoons. The way the SonAmy relationship is characterized is based on Amy's personality, so if you were to tone her down, you'd be changing core personality traits that allowed that kind of relationship to exist. In the sonicverse it was Amy's thickheadedness and her direct, tenacious approach that helped her stand out amongst the other girls. To strip her of that would make her unrecognizable. She wouldn't be "Amy".

Ad it isn't what the gamers want it go? Last time I checked Unleashed was popular with the new kids, and the majority of the fanbase, though having issues with some stuff, think it's a step in the good direction.

Given the topic, only the storytelling and characters are being considered here. Not the graphics, gameplay or any of the other intruiges that were praised amongst critics and/or may have contributed to players enjoying Unleashed. There is

nothing about Unleashed's story that points to it being an acceptable status quo for a cartoon.

Things for kids in mind can also appeal to grown-ups, like Disney.

That's pretty much the gist of what family is. It doesn't mean though, that Sonic's current storyline is interesting enough to grab the older demographic on its own.

[redmenace]

Trying to tone down Amy is essentially like trying to change the chasing relationship Tom had with Jerry in their cartoons. The way the SonAmy relationship is characterized is based on Amy's personality, so if you were to tone her down, you'd be changing core personality traits that allowed that kind of relationship to exist. In the sonicverse it was Amy's thickheadedness and her direct, tenacious approach that helped her stand out amongst the other girls. To strip her of that would make her unrecognizable. She wouldn't be "Amy".

I'm not saying to give up the chase, I'm saying to follow SA and SA2 format for Amy, not SH or S06. The former is very different from the latter, and the former isn't as annoying as the latter. And I thought SonAmy had a boom because of Sonic X, might be wrong though.

Ad it isn't what the gamers want it go? Last time I checked Unleashed was popular with the new kids, and the majority of the fanbase, though having issues with some stuff, think it's a step in the good direction.

Given the topic, only the storytelling and characters are being considered here. Not the graphics, gameplay or any of the other intruiges that were praised amongst critics and/or may have contributed to players enjoying Unleashed. There is

nothing about Unleashed's story that points to it being an acceptable status quo for a cartoon.

I've seen praises to it's story, since it's not overly complicated and doesn't take it self seriously, being funny and interesting when it counts.

That's pretty much the gist of what family is. It doesn't mean though, that Sonic's current storyline is interesting enough to grab the older demographic on its own.

Probably not.

No one is saying that SatAM etc is popular. It's not stubborness to like something old-school. I'm not bitter to fans of the newer stuff, and most fans of the newer stuff aren't bitter towards me. You seem to have a problem with opinions, and I would say that's far more harmful to the harmony of the Sonic community than merely professing a wish for something that's long gone.

Then if it's not popular, why would a company invest on it on the first place? If it's not going to happen why even bring it up to a conversation when there's supposed to be debate?

And I said nothing about liking it being stubborn, it's the way fans try to drop the subject of this over and over again is stubborn. It's as annoying as people who can't see past Drummond and always whine about it and how Sonic it's not the same and sounds weird whenever given the chance. It has no purpose whatsoever.

I have a problem with opinion? It seems to me the people who cannot understand the opinion of the majority of the fanbase and look only to themselves seem to have a problem with opinion.

[Flyboy Fox]

But see, no one with a love of the older stuff is ignoring the majority fanbase. People can like different things without it being a threat... after all, people who like the older stuff are a minority, right?

I think the most wonderful thing about a forum like this is the sharing of opinions and views, and I don't feel that anyone should feel chastised for mentioning an unpopular opinion.

Disagreeing with the opinion is fine. Basically saying that people should stop expressing that opinion or that they are selfish or stubborn for doing so is NOT fine.

[Sean]

SatAM is my second favorite Sonic animation (after Sonic CD) and the only nostalgia I hold towards the Sonic series is through the Archie comics. Plus, my fondest memories of Sonic have always been related to the older Archie issues, not the games. etc.

This isn't about a consensus between fans (hey, I thought you anti-Sonic fanbase guys were the ones who said this was impossible anyway), it's talking about what we like and our personal envisioning of what we'd personally like to see. Not something which caters to the supposedly unappeasable, split fanbase which, according to what others say, is impossible, so why bother.

With all of the guys running around screaming "THE FANBASE IS SO UNPLEASABLE" like it's the new fad, nobody's going to even try to bring a consensus among everyone. Just let others say what they want if they're not being offensive about it.

Edited June 27, 2009 by Jake

[SABRINA]

I'd actually like to see something like a Sitcom style cartoon.

Like AOSTH but more serious and more aimed at older kids.

Like Simpsons or something

[Kiljoy]

I still think the stubborness of these people regarding something that is dead or not popular anymore to be painful to watch and brings nothing but bittherness both ways to the franchise nowadays.

Well you do have something in common with them, stubbornness. I just don't understand why you think the SatAM fans are ruining the Sonic fanbase because they hang on to hope, no matter how small a chance, that it will come back.

[Gatestormer]

I'd actually like to see a 2D, well drawn (so monstrosities like this don't infect our TV's), well animated, well voiced and well scripted TV series that follows Sonic and Robotnik's clashes from beginning to...whenever. Starting off using the classic designs for the characters, with game adaptions of Sonic 1,2, 3K, CD and it's own original stories.

Eventually progressing to explain how the character's appearances changed (similar to how Archie did but obviously different...Robotnik just changed his look, nothing more, nothing less. Not sure how it could be done with the others but there must be some way). Then continuing with it's own series and stories and throwing in game adaptions every once in a while, introducing the new characters within the game adaptions.

The name of the planet must never be mentioned...it's just 'The World'.

There doesn't need to be and shouldn't be any twists to the characters and setting like in SatAM, Underground and X.

Oh and Zach Braff to voice Sonic.

[BakingBluePotatoe]

I'd actually like to see a 2D, well drawn (so monstrosities like this don't infect our TV's), well animated, well voiced and well scripted TV series that follows Sonic and Robotnik's clashes from beginning to...whenever. Starting off using the classic designs for the characters, with game adaptions of Sonic 1,2, 3K, CD and it's own original stories.

Eventually progressing to explain how the character's appearances changed (similar to how Archie did but obviously different...Robotnik just changed his look, nothing more, nothing less. Not sure how it could be done with the others but there must be some way). Then continuing with it's own series and stories and throwing in game adaptions every once in a while, introducing the new characters within the game adaptions.

That could work... But only if each game had like 25 or so episodes. Anymore than that, the show would be WAAAYYY to long.

The name of the planet must never be mentioned...it's just 'The World'.

Perfect. No arguments over "IT's MOBIUS!" "NO! EARTH!"

There doesn't need to be and shouldn't be any twists to the characters and setting like in SatAM, Underground and X.

Yeah. Just good ol' fashion running around jumping on robots. (With the occasional Chillidog eating contest. xP)

Oh and Zach Braff to voice Sonic.

Fuuuuuuuuuuck yeah.

Edited June 27, 2009 by Blue Streak

[BlazingTales]

For the tone, I'd love a cross between OVA, AoSTH, SATAM, and X (and maybe a bit of Underground). I just love the well thought-out universe of SATAM, and the character develpoment in Sonic X (mainly season 3 with Tails, but, while I hate to admit it, Chris was pretty good from the end of season 2 and into 3). Like SATAM and season 3 of X, it would have a loose plot or goal for each season, if not the entire show. The loose plot would alow plety of room for both a serious and somewhat goofy tone. The main plot could be dark, but it wouldn't take itself seriously, just like SatBK.

This style of plot would leave wiggle room for characters ranging from Cream to Shadow to Big, depending on the circumstance. The main characters would be Sonic and Tails (their relationship would be like a cross between X and SATAM, brotherly in a way and good friends), next in the main list would be Amy (still as in love with Sonic as ever), who would occasionally bring Cream with her (Cream would contrast and complement her personality). Knuckles would be up there with Amy, but he wouldn't appear if it didn't help with the plot. For instance, you'd only see him if he had a reason to leave Angel Island (such as a fight), or Sonic and Tails had a reason to visit him. I'd like him to be important to the plot, maybe the plot would revolve around the orgins of the Chaos Emeralds? Shadow would be the rival, appearing to help or hinder Sonic, much like... Vegeta I suppose (I haven't watched that show in years, sorry, I'm not sure if that's a good comparison). He would kind of be like he was in Sonic X, mysterious (but not over dramatic) and cool, someone to put Sonic in his place. Blaze could also appear occasionally, maybe to help the plot of the orgins of the Emeralds if that would be what it was about?

Couple other notes:

- Chili dogs are a must

- Well doen 2D art similar to the games, as much as I like 3D animation, it's just expensive and would be lazy (no laziness! [sonic X! ])

- A musical number during the credits pertaning to the episode would be pretty cool (well, I think...)

- If it has to have original characters, then make them like the OVA ones

- I'd like to see what modern Sonic would look like if he was drawn by the OVA artists, but I suppose that's just preference

- It's not Earth of Mobius

- Personally, I'd like a tone like Avatar, serious and silly!

...Or I wouldn't mind a SATAM revival with X-like art, that would be good too.