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Sonic Live Action Movie Thread (Read OP for topic rules) "Trailer 2 on Page 482)


Badnik Mechanic

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This is being amazing from my point of view: it's wrong to be negative about the movie without seeing anything, but it's OK to be positive without seeing anything about it either. "Oh noes, look at him wanting the movie to fail, he must hate Sonic!".

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4 minutes ago, Jango said:

This is being amazing from my point of view: it's wrong to be negative about the movie without seeing anything, but it's OK to be positive without seeing anything about it either. "Oh noes, look at him wanting the movie to fail, he must hate Sonic!".

Am I blindly positive? Or am I saying " let's wait for a trailer" so we can judge better. Anything without seeing something first is a prejudice. It's too soon, either positive or negative.

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13 minutes ago, Jack the Shadow said:

Am I blindly positive? Or am I saying " let's wait for a trailer" so we can judge better. Anything without seeing something first is a prejudice. It's too soon, either positive or negative.

I don't know how long you're here or into this franchise, but it's never too early or too soon. When most people agree something looks bad/off/uncanny, it really end up being true, especially with Sonic. I don't know what to tell you man, maybe the negative energy alone affects the product somehow, you know, I'm talking about spirits, bad mojo and shit at this point 🤷

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Okay, obviously I worded that badly, we can express our opinions, negative or positive whatever. But still, it's too early to say it objectively sucks IMO.

 

Whatever. At this point, I don't care anymore, I'm sick of playing the devils advocate here. I won't leave but I'm not gonna defend everything, because that's dumb. If it sucks, we'll agree, if not I'm gonna enjoy a movie. Simple.

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No matter what, I wish people wouldn't do fake leaks and stuff with the intent of trolling everyone or adding more negativity and hate-fuel to the situation. X_X

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3 minutes ago, Nicky Nicardo said:

No matter what, I wish people wouldn't do fake leaks and stuff with the intent of trolling everyone or adding more negativity and hate-fuel to the situation. X_X

Same here.

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Well then, people liked stuff like Boom, didn’t they? It had completely different settings, Sonic having a very different characterization, etc.

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8 minutes ago, Miragnarok said:

Well then, people liked stuff like Boom, didn’t they? It had completely different settings, Sonic having a very different characterization, etc.

If you try to rewrite history, perhaps. Remember, the people who did like Boom liked the cartoon for it's own sake, and even then, characterization wasn't terribly off-mark or unfitting (in some cases, they were an improvement), the biggest departure were the goofy scenarios they were in and the designs themselves, and compared to what we're getting for this film, it's very tame (Buffles the Enchilada aside) At most, Sonic Boom could be seen as a step towards the pre-Adventure interpretation of Sonic in the West (AoStH and the early Archie comics... not Earth, mostly animal cast, lower stakes), which had it's merits. Also, the premier games were absolute disasters, if you can recall. Sonic Boom is hardly the best example to make a case for drastically changing up the core of the series.

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A bad Sonic adaptation does not equate a bad movie. That's not how critics nor audiences will judge this movie. How faithful the movie is will not be the deciding factor for anybody outside of US. We need to stop equating the two as if that spells OBJECTIVE doom for this project. 

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If you think it won't be judged by how well it's based off of its faithfulness to the product that it was originally supposed to represent, think again. 

Perhaps it could be a smash hit, maybe it could make gangbusters, but it will definitely be a terrible adaptation, and to minimize that is to miss the entire point of a Sonic the Hedgehog movie. The goal is to represent the character and setting on the big screen. That's a fail so far. While correlation does not imply causation, there's still the correlation. Live action movies with CG cartoon characters are almost always a disaster, and no amount of hopefulness and blind faith can erase this statistic.

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Maybe you're right or maybe this movie is hiding a lot of stuff under it's sleeves. Maybe everything is not as it seems? We won't know until November. 

 

But even if the movie is a terrible adaptation of the franchise, that doesn't prelude them from bringing the movie universe closer to the games in subsequent sequels. Sonic's design for instance could be tweaked a bit to bring him closer to the games. That's what they did on Out of the Shadow 

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I'm calling BS on the leak from 'Dreamcast Guy' , if I wasn't going to show anything of a leaked trailer in my possession then why say anything at all other than just to garner attention. Gangsters Paradise is a great tune though. 

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9 minutes ago, Eurisko said:

I'm calling BS on the leak from 'Dreamcast Guy' , if I wasn't going to show anything of a leaked trailer in my possession then why say anything at all other than just to garner attention. Gangsters Paradise is a great tune though. 

They stated in a follow up that they couldn't share it because the person who sent it them's name was all over the footage due to them working on it.

As far as I'm aware this is actually fairly common practice for work prints of trailers (to prevent leaks from being released) - amusingly he probably put someone at risk merely by revealing it was a work print, however inadvertently. 

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16 minutes ago, PeterPancake said:

Maybe you're right or maybe this movie is hiding a lot of stuff under it's sleeves. Maybe everything is not as it seems? We won't know until November. 

 

But even if the movie is a terrible adaptation of the franchise, that doesn't prelude them from bringing the movie universe closer to the games in subsequent sequels. Sonic's design for instance could be tweaked a bit to bring him closer to the games. That's what they did on Out of the Shadow 

Unless the movie is hiding an entirely different premise under it's sleeve, nothing is going to change a single thing that Indy has said. From the very beginning, the representation of the universe the movie itself is based upon has been a complete and total joke, and it's premise strips everything that's recongizable from the character into the blandest amount of crap possible.

I mean, when the height of our excitement here is that Sonic can be in car chases, that shows how much they failed to hit the mark on what this series should be. Let's keep in mind that Sonic's idea of a car chase is literally being chased down by a heavily weaponised military truck crashing and smashing into cars, right after Sonic previously sky-dived from a helicopter, and snowboarded down the actual city from scrap from said helicopter, there's just jack shit that you can do with set-pieces, at least not to the regular extent that the games have shown to us. 

I wouldn't be surprised if a big reason why a lot of people aren't excited is just the fact that this setting heavily limits what can be done with Sonic and his action now. You can't have some of the downright insane shit that you had in the games because Sonic has now been forced into a grounded and realistic setting. Hell, even the concept of a car chase doesn't appeal to me because the entire point of Sonic is that he's so ridiculously fast that police cars can't even keep up with him. How could you even do a car chase without nerfing Sonic's speed?

Not to mention the fact that the concept has been done fifty times better with something like Sonic X, because while it took place in a realistic world, it allowed the craziness of Sonic's world to spill out into it as well. Sonic X fully makes fun of the fact that literally everything in a human/realistic setting would be completely blown out of the water by Sonic's speed. It took a police team with rocket cars and race drivers to make the car chase fun because it was over the top and unique. 

And really, if you need to rely on a sequel, or movie universe to drag things closer to the actual version, then no, that doesn't make things better in the slightest. It would just be a bad superficial attempt to drag in fans again through fan-service, which surprise surprise is what Out of the Shadows did.

Not to mention the fact that Out of the Shadows still managed to completely mess it up by having Casey out of character, Bebop and Rocksteady into annoying goons instead of charmingly idiotic or over the top, Shredder is still a generic as hell japanese man, and Krang is increasingly forgettable. Beyond a superficial level, it was still godawful because they only shoved fan-service in for the sake of it instead of actually doing it correctly.

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I think part of the problem with the movie going so off base from the source material is a matter of brand awareness to raise sales and grow the audience. Regardless of how the movie turns out SEGA's initial hope was that a movie would raise awareness of the brand to bring in more customers, but when the overpriced ad disregards the product it is advertising you create a dissonance that results in unfavorable results. Take the Archie comics for example. There were fans of the Archie run who did not want it to become more like the games as that would drastically alter from the story that it was. They consumed Archie Sonic exclusively for Archie Sonic. You could not sell them the games to get more Archie Sonic because the already knew that everything they loved about the comics weren't in the games. It was just a simple fact. Even Sonic himself was a radically different character.

I personally expect the movie to have the same problem. It will have its fans, but it won't bring new fans to the games because they won't find their movie Sonic there. It will be a completely different beast and will not succeed at why SEGA wanted one, which was to sell more games. I personally think that is part of the reason SEGA has so distanced themselves and not done any promoting of their own as Paramount is who will make the most bank off of this movie and not them. They want to sell their product and the movie should have been their fancy add, instead it's Paramount's movie franchise starter to make them big money (I don't see how when you are trying to sell off of a brand name that is arguably not very reputable anymore and then disregarding it and the concerns of the IP owner and fans) and will not create the bridge it is supposed to. Does that mean that the movie will be bad? It honestly has no effect on the quality of the movie as the quality of the movie is entirely in the hands of the cast and staff making it. All it really says is that if you were hoping to see your favorite video game character on the big screen that you will be sorely disappointed because that is not at all what Paramount and the staff want to sell you. In that regards this movie is as much a failure as an add for the franchise so SEGA can sell games to new consumers they normally wouldn't reach as it is a realization of seeing the Sonic from the games on the big screen. That in no way means that the movie will fail or be bad, just that it won't be what SEGA and the (most) fans want. In that regard I think the fans have the right to be disappointed and should express as such. However, using your disappointment as evidence that the final product will be bad is disingenuous and discourteous.

Now I'm just as guilty as others for bashing the movie based on my disappointments, and realistically I need to improve at providing the distinction between my disappointment and the quality of the movie. I don't know the quality of the movie as I haven't seen it so I can't judge as such. Conversely though, I can say that I don't like what I have been presented as it dos not appeal to me as a Sonic fan. In the end that means more like than not I will never be able to judge the movie and it's quality because I will likely never watch due to it not appealing to me and going against everything I want out of a Sonic movie. I mean, I still don't understand why you would go for a buddy cop set up instead of Indiana Jones since the latter is closer to what I would have wanted from a Hollywood Sonic movie. Goofy yet dangerous villains, globetrotting adventure, wondrous and amazing locals, diverse biomes for the film to take place across, mystical artifacts and legends that pull in Sonic and Eggman for their own ends, and so much more. Best yet, you can still have a human faction just by using GUN and making Tom a soldier who gets in over his head when deployed to stop Eggman and doesn't back down even when Sonic offers the better solution simply because of his duty as a soldier. That would be a movie I could get behind, but instead we get a buddy cop highway drive from Montana to San Francisco. Nothing about that sells me Sonic as I know him or even gives me a facsimile that I can buy into so naturally I'm disappointed and turned away by the movie offering. As a result, I'm just not a customer Paramount will make money off of directly (I subscribe to Netflix and Hulu which I'm positive it will end up on eventually so...).

Anyway, TLDR; personal bias =/= product quality. The product is different and what Paramount wants is not what we want, but the movie still has to prove itself as good or bad. Our biases do not control that, only our perception of the movie. Unfortunately, for most of us that means it will suck to us because our biases have already convinced us of that.

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Worth noting that the 'apology movie' is a trend that's been going on in Hollywood recently. Bumblebee, the last Smurfs movie, the newest batch of DC offerings etc all wound up closer to the source material coming off of series assumed to be failures. 

If they try to make 'Sonic' happen again I think that's what they'll do. If this movie is a big enough disaster I doubt they'll bother at all,  though. It depends on if this manages to scrape back it's extremely lean budget come november.

I'm not hankering to see Sonic on the big screen either way and feel pretty indifferent toward this movie. Still food for thought for those feeling anxious.

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Honestly I'm far more interested in the production story behind the movie than the actual movie itself. So we find out about it in 2014, find out Sony is making it, we have a writer and then...years and years of silence. (Here I just kinda figured the movie was canceled), and then suddenly Paramount picks it up and shit is happening. Those like, 4 years of dead air are far more interesting to me than any bullshit this movie is going to have.

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1 hour ago, PeterPancake said:

A bad Sonic adaptation does not equate a bad movie. That's not how critics nor audiences will judge this movie. How faithful the movie is will not be the deciding factor for anybody outside of US. We need to stop equating the two as if that spells OBJECTIVE doom for this project. 

That doesn't make any sense. If it's based on an existing brand, an almost 28 years old that is, then why in the name of heavens use the titular character and name? Just call it Speedy the Porcupine then. People will judge and compare to the source material and they are 100% right to do so, like, you really think the writing and acting will be something to write home about it if you're taking the adaptation factor out of the equation? The only big caliber actor in this is Jim Carrey and he is reaaaaally far from his prime. "Oh, but Tim Miller directed and wrote Deadpool which is a good movie!". Because Ryan Reynolds set his foot and said "we're doing this exactly like the source material or we are not". 

And what is that they are doing now? None of those things!

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To me, Sonic has been used in so many wacky and weird ways, and in different settings that are vastly different from each other... that I don't see this movie, with it's weird plot and weird setting and everything, as being anything THAT farfetched that it couldn't work. I don't know if it WILL, but from everything I've seen... yeah, it's weird, but Sonic's done weird before and it wasn't that big of a deal.

And the thing about him being a 'juvenile delinquent'. When I first saw that, I remember being like "...yeah, I can see that." That definitely didn't seem 'out of character' with the character that I've grown up with.

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17 minutes ago, Jango said:

That doesn't make any sense. If it's based on an existing brand, an almost 28 years old that is, then why in the name of heavens use the titular character and name? Just call it Speedy the Porcupine then. People will judge and compare to the source material and they are 100% right to do so, like, you really think the writing and acting will be something to write home about it if you're taking the adaptation factor out of the equation? The only big caliber actor in this is Jim Carrey and he is reaaaaally far from his prime. "Oh, but Tim Miller directed and wrote Deadpool which is a good movie!". Because Ryan Reynolds set his foot and said "we're doing this exactly like the source material or we are not". 

And what is that they are doing now? None of those things!

@Ryannumber1gamer

It's completely fine if you want to disregard the writing and performances and only focus on the creative decisions. That's your prerogative. But there's a fine line between deeming this movie a horrible interpretation of Sonic and being a horrible movie. And I know that these two factors will overlap for many people (maybe even myself to an extent) but all I'm saying is that this is not how the general populace will judge the movie. If the script is tightly knitted and strong, the character arcs have satisfying conclusion and the movie succeeds in communicating it's thematical messages about friendship, it will click with film journalists/critics. 

 

I can EASILY see a scenario where this movie is a hit in being a fun popcorn blockbuster, crowd pleaser like the Fast and Furious films. 

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49 minutes ago, Wraith said:

Worth noting that the 'apology movie' is a trend that's been going on in Hollywood recently. Bumblebee, the last Smurfs movie, the newest batch of DC offerings etc all wound up closer to the source material coming off of series assumed to be failures. 

If they try to make 'Sonic' happen again I think that's what they'll do. If this movie is a big enough disaster I doubt they'll bother at all,  though. It depends on if this manages to scrape back it's extremely lean budget come november.

I'm not hankering to see Sonic on the big screen either way and feel pretty indifferent toward this movie. Still food for thought for those feeling anxious.

Apology movies aren’t a guaranteed ticket to success; after The Lost Village, the Smurfs seem to have subsided, for instance. 

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I find it weird that this poster came out of nowhere on December, when the movie won’t be releasing until November. I guess theaters starting to put this up to get prepare to promote the movie.

I’m kinda scared and nervous about the movie, but I think I will wait till we get a trailer for this before I judge. Maybe this Friday or at the SXSW? Who knows?

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Just gonna give my own two cents on the situation without being too fixated on either side on this debate.

In terms of the optimists like PeterPancake, I can understand and empathize why he has such high hopes for the film and the decisions it makes in every step of the way, no matter how inaccurate and unservicable it is to the portrayal of the Sonic we all know. His goal, his sort of dream in a sense is to have Sonic in the public eye again to make him as successful as he was since the 90s. I speculate that when Boom was a thing, I bet Peter was one of the guys with the same amount of hopes in regards to the push in both show, games and merchandising Boom presented.

And I can totally understand that. This is why he talks about box office a lot and what the turnout could be, he just wants as many people as possible to see Sonic again and maybe become a mainstream figure in pop culture once again since let's be honest, he's definitely been a lot more niche as the years go on due to the negative reception of his games and not having as big of a public presence as say, Mario compared to his hayday. He's still recognizable by many, but you know what I mean.

So he'll take things like realism, PG-13, swearing, hip music, whatever it may be because he knows that'll draw the mainstream crowd due to these tropes' presence in other financially successful films.

It may be considered shallow that Peter just wants people to enjoy what has Sonic's name on it, regardless on if it's truly what the franchise represents, but it's not without well-intent. He wants to see kids on the playground talk about Sonic again, Sonic advertisements whereever you go due to how gosh dang populsr the movie got, toy shelves chock full with the blue blur, he longs for the days where Sonic was big. And he believes the movie is that stepping stone, no matter what sacrifices had to be made.

At least, that's what I believe.

On the other hand, I'm one of the people after seeing the poster am not confident in the film. While I hope the kids who see it would enjoy the original Sonic as they look for more content regarding him, similar to how I watched Bayformers and am now a massive fan of many Transformers continuities, and that being the one thing I hope the movie delivers in terms of the outcome... I obviously can't shake the fear that it would only drag Sonic's name in the mud further.

Because the fandom would only become further divided with new fans joining the fray, when it's already split as is. Fans, and potentially critics alike would hate on the film for its lack of loyality to the source material and potentially being an unoriginal, lackluster hollywood product as well. Most importantly, it just would hurt to see this beloved hedgehog be portrayed like this. The hedgehog we loved, we cared for and endured years and years of fandom conflict and disappointment over... be depicted as this muscular freak with a setting and premise devoid of all charm and personality the games ooze, all the fans have the right to voice their disdain over this film. I already did in a video, for crying out loud.

Say what you want about Bayformers, but at least at its core, it still felt like Transformers in its plot. The Autobots and Decepticons wage war on Cybertron, their conflict comes to Earth, boy and his car story, and there is still a semblance of original source material loyality in there, particularly through the return of Peter Cullen as Optimus Prime and a modern remake of the original movie theme.

The Sonic movie has... Sonic and Eggman. Oh, and Green Hill basically Radiator Springs from Cars. Okay?

And the sad thing is that we went this far back... but it's 2019. 12 years since Bayformers hit the scene. I'm not saying that Bayformers was a masterpiece by any means of the imagination, but you think, especially with Paramount releasing Bumblebee two months ago, a loving homage to Transformers' legacy... you think those same guys would've learned their lesson by now on how to represent a franchise correctly?

This is not the Sonic I want people to see when we could've gotten much better than this to put the blue guy back on the map.

But yeah, that's just my stance. I understand both sides of this little debate, and while I'm definitely more on the viewpoint of those who despise what this film's doing, I'm not gonna berate Peter for his intent. 

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