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Sonic Live Action Movie Thread (Read OP for topic rules) "Trailer 2 on Page 482)

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59 minutes ago, Almar said:

SatAM's Robotnik was just a Captain Planet villain planted in Star Wars. He didn't have enough personality to take advantage of Cummings' voice and didn't have the later nuances to his character we saw in Underground and the comics after awhile. He's the least interesting an Eggman has ever been short of Sonic Forces.

I agree about SatAM Robotnik; easily the most overrated thing in the show, but his one-dimensionslity has nothing to do with whether Sonic is a terrorist.

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53 minutes ago, Rosaleia said:

I don't think making her design more 'cartoony' would have made it any less cringe for people. Unlike something like Roger Rabbit or Looney Tunes, The story took itself way too seriously for that kind of ship. If Sonic was a more zany cartoony kind of series maybe but it wasn't.

As I said, the problem isn't really that Elise is human. It's that she's not an appealing character, her design doesn't fit next to Sonic, and her plot was poorly done. Just saying "elise bad she human" and leaving it at that just pushes the same poor communication/suggestions that helped gave us Two-Worlds.

1 hour ago, Rosaleia said:

To a degree, I will agree with that, although I feel like Cummings really helped make the character somewhat more dramatic and entertaining to watch.

He wasn't expressive/animated enough to take advantage of Cummings' talent.

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28 minutes ago, Rosaleia said:

To a degree, I will agree with that, although I feel like Cummings really helped make the character somewhat more dramatic and entertaining to watch.  I've felt there were various issues with SatAM, including with characters like Sally (who imo, felt kind of Mary-sueish and a little too 'adult', especially in the comics) and Antoine for obvious reasons, but I feel like a lot of these problems can be tweaked and ironed out. Archie's already proven you can make a similar premise with a more charismatic variation of Robotnik/Eggman.

Don't forget Dulcy.  Actually, maybe you should.  But maybe you can't.

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2 hours ago, Almar said:

As I said, the problem isn't really that Elise is human. It's that she's not an appealing character, her design doesn't fit next to Sonic, and her plot was poorly done. Just saying "elise bad she human" and leaving it at that just pushes the same poor communication/suggestions that helped gave us Two-Worlds.

It was really the tone of the world in addition to her design that probably steered people away from the pairing, aside from obvious roadblocks like the occasional Amy fan. The more serious nature of the story and her design didn't lend itself too well to the more wackier, slapstick atmosphere that would have been more accepted in.

 

2 hours ago, Almar said:

He wasn't expressive/animated enough to take advantage of Cummings' talent.

Its not that he wasn't expressive or animated. SatAM Robotnik had epic tantrums. And he could occasionally be funny, at least to me under Cummings VA, but a VA can only do but so much. Getting the occasional chuckle from Cummings' voice going on a rant-rave every now and again doesn't make SatAM Robotnik well rounded or interesting overall.

He was just a bad man who did mean things and that was it. And that's not to say Eggman is anymore dimensional beyond that either (and its one of the criticisms I have with making trying to make the characters 'timeless'), but he at least in Archie he had more charisma to keep you engaged. By the time the end of the reboot happened, I found Eggman and his underlings more interesting to watch than the heroes, and would have sooner picked up a comic or even games about THEM than Sonic.

 

2 hours ago, Scritch the Cat said:

Don't forget Dulcy.  Actually, maybe you should.  But maybe you can't.

Don't underestimate my capacity to erase her from memory! After all, Archie clean forgot her after awhile until the reboot, LOL!

 

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They might've made SatAMnik more expressive in Season 2, but not enough. And like I said, Underground's version was honestly the more interesting character with how he had to appease the nobility (at least sometimes, other episodes had him be at odds with nobles) and how he didn't seek to pollute just to pollute.

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I don't mind having more menacing villains in Sonic, especially not now after years of villains being mostly a joke, and a more evil Robotnik would be one option, but the problem with SatAM Robotnik is that he has no personality traits besides evil.  He's supposed to be a selfish dictator, but he never feels like he actually has an ego or agenda to go along with that role.  Instead of all of those robots and factories existing to serve his whims (which barely exist to serve), it's like he exists just to justify all of those robots and factories being there.  

This sort of villain doesn't make the show "weighty"; he just reminds me I'm watching a children's cartoon.  He's no less a caricature of despicable people than AoSTH Robotnik is, but without the comedy that makes caricatures work, and the final nail in the coffin is that he's really not that scary, either.  Because again, it's a children's cartoon, which means a lot of the worst implications of a ruthless villain have to be avoided.  There's no long shots of people being tormented.  The SWATbots aren't a match for most of the characters they usually interact with, Robotnik doesn't seem able to deploy many at once, and characters get in and out of Robotropolis with ease since the show is episodic.  Robotnik looks and sounds scary, but he isn't.

While he is too often treated as little more than a joke, I prefer SEGA Eggman in that he has things he actually likes and will utilize resources and exploit others to get, like toys and amusement parks.  Instead of just being an unambiguously despicable embodiment of pollution, he's a topical example of why most pollution really exists--as a byproduct of hedonistic, materialistic lifestyles that all too many modern people actually lead.

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1 hour ago, CaptainRobo said:

Well, Happy New Year, guys! Here is a video that the movie's Twitter had released.:

 

Beijing, London, Rio and Tokyo, huh? Probably just a coincidence since they're famous places, but Olympics anyone?

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17 hours ago, Rosaleia said:

Appealing to authority by using SEGA doesn't mean squat. SEGA is a business. Businesses require people to give them money to stay afloat. Its not just about their pride or what they want, they're here to give consumers a service. If they want to act like fanboys who continue to alienate their fans because of personal preference, they'll go under like all the other businesses who fail to consider practical matters. In this kind of economy, especially with the cost of games going up, and their negative reputation among the gaming community, they can't afford to keep discarding older fans to replace with little kids. Because little kids can't afford Sonic games. And the kids who were abandoned by SEGA in the 90s and early 2000s have grown up and become parents, now. And many of them don't want their kids dealing with Sonic.

They're not acting like "fanboys"  they're doing the logical business thing by having a unified storyline for all regions because juggling a dozen continuities is impractical.  Any negativity they've garnered since 1999 has to do with the gameplay of the games being crap and nothing to do with not following the continuity of some obscure DIC cartoon.

17 hours ago, Rosaleia said:

Except you just contradicted yourself by bringing up Mega Man X. And while sales wise, many of the spin-offs don't sell "as" well as the earlier releases of classic Megaman, they perform well enough to land Capcom a profit, which for them is the important thing. And spin-offs like Legends especially has a fairly positive reception.

How did I contradict myself?  Throwing X a bone while focusing mainly on Classic would be no different from throwing Classic Sonic a bone (mania) while focusing mainly on Modern.  Even if that does end up happening there's still a ton of timelines left in the cold.

17 hours ago, Rosaleia said:

Likewise, many people had their differences in the Sonic fandom but things didn't get toxic until post 1999 when SEGA of Japan overhauled everything and replaced their fanbase with a single story whilst discarding the rest. And have periodically continued to do this ever since. If people had no reason to see each other's differences as a threat and onset of SEGA alienating them, we'd have less fighting and less people put off by the fandom. But because of their history, and how they're known to treat their fans, people will hate this movie just on the premise of it threatening the versions of Sonic they like. And understandably so. And as a result will feel they HAVE to attack it so that they don't get kicked out like the older fans who came before them. SEGA NEEDS to be held accountable for this. And one way or another they will, because they can either listen or fall under.

Sonic's fanbase has always lied with the games.  You're seriously overestimating how many people genuinely give a crap about the non-game stuff.  Most "older fans" really only give a crap the Mega Drive games, maybe the Game Gear and Adventure games for some, and could care less one way or the other about shows or comics.    Going back to Mega Man, the difference between those universes is they all originated as games.  What you're asking for is closer to if Mega Man "fans" wanted games based off the Ruby-Spear cartoon or Mario "fans" whining there are no games based off their equally crappy DIC cartoons.  Like Sega, why should Capcom or Nintendo cater to these niche group of fans?  They're not fans of the games, they're fans of some warped bastardization created by people in another country who wanted to make a quick buck off of someone else's intellectual property with no input from the creators.

 

18 hours ago, Rosaleia said:

they really have nothing to lose at this point making AUs like SatAM.

Then they'd have to AUs for Fleetway, Aosth, Underground, X, Archie, the manga, the OVA, and any other continuity either side crapped out over the years.  There is very little to gain by playing Weekend at Bernie's with a bunch of old corpses.  I wish more episodes of the OVA could've been produced but I've learned to move on.  If you want SatAM just buy the complete series.

 

18 hours ago, Rosaleia said:

Sally and the Freedom Fighters, hell even some of the Archie originals had more fans than the newer characters SEGA has now. I guarantee you more people cared about Princess Sally and the Freedom Fighters, or hell even Mina the Mongoose before Infinite, Dodon Pa or the Deadly Six.

And Classic Sonic games like Mania are practically a spit in the bucket budget-wise for SEGA.

Definitely gonna need a source on these claims.

18 hours ago, Rosaleia said:

Dude, stop reaching. You just admitted what they did wasn't terrorism. Sonic and the Freedom Fighters weren't using methods of violence or intimidation to intentionally hurt innocent civilians, Robotnik was. point blank.And even in the comics, where the Robians tried to hurt them, the Freedom took measures to AVOID harming them. And neutralized other people's attempts to do so.

Also fighting in self-defense is not terrorism.

Just because they sanitized it a bit doesn't mean the overall tones and intentions aren't still there.  But fine:  Breaking and entering, destruction of property, hacking.  If not terrorists then they're definitely hoodlums.  What's the difference between this and game version I can feel you asking?  Simple.  Julian is a legitimately established government authority who took over from his idiot predecessor who had dismantled the army and was dumb to trust someone who looked like Julian in the first place.  In the games, Eggman's the instigator imprisoning animals to use as batteries, has bombed or threatened to bomb places, unleashes gods of destruction he can't control and end up terrorizing the planet, etc.  In the games, Sonic leaves Eggman and his bases alone until Eggman starts causing trouble.  You never see Game!Sonic attack Eggman's bases until Eggman throws the gauntlet first.  In SatAM, it's usually the FFs kicking the hornet's nest.  I can only think of a few episodes, like the pilot, where Julian instigated things first.  Only under those instances can what the FFs do be considered "self-defense".

Also wanna point out the irony of the Freedom Fighters fighting to reinstate a monarchy.  Progress?

18 hours ago, Rosaleia said:

Then don't compare Sonic to the likes Bin Laden, ISIS, or other terrorist organizations who hurt and killed innocent people to further their own political agendas. Thats extremely disrespectful.

I didn't say those things.  Don't put words in my mouth please.

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Ngl, the extreme lack of advertising is scaring me a bit. I haven't seen any ads or TV spots here in America (why the hell weren't those animations ads on YouTube?), and they're just barely now selling toys right?

This is probably one of the reasons why people are concerned with box office. I don't understand why Paramount WOULDN'T advertise this movie in December. 20-30 people viewing the redesign trailer shows that many people are aware of this film.

 

Imo, people NEED to see this movie because one of the few times Hollywood actually listened to criticism.

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1 hour ago, Gamecuber64 said:

Ngl, the extreme lack of advertising is scaring me a bit. I haven't seen any ads or TV spots here in America (why the hell weren't those animations ads on YouTube?), and they're just barely now selling toys right?

This is probably one of the reasons why people are concerned with box office. I don't understand why Paramount WOULDN'T advertise this movie in December. 20-30 people viewing the redesign trailer shows that many people are aware of this film.

 

Imo, people NEED to see this movie because one of the few times Hollywood actually listened to criticism.

Relax. TV spots are starting to pop up in Canada. Only a matter of time till the US gets some. 

Side-note: This came up. Can anyone tell if it’s fake or not? 

Also: Movie merch has shown up on the US SEGA shop.

https://shop.sega.com/collections/sonic-the-hedgehog-movie?ref=ESGA200101&utm_source=marketing&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=ESGA200101

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50 minutes ago, Badnik Mechanic said:

 

 

I thought it might after Playing With Fire was sponsoring Power Rangers last Sunday.

7 minutes ago, Operationgamer17 said:

Side-note: This came up. Can anyone tell if it’s fake or not? 

No but we are 6 weeks out from release and should be getting a final trailer that might coincide with tickets on sale and a bunch of TV spots.

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8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

They're not acting like "fanboys"  they're doing the logical business thing by having a unified storyline for all regions because juggling a dozen continuities is impractical.  Any negativity they've garnered since 1999 has to do with the gameplay of the games being crap and nothing to do with not following the continuity of some obscure DIC cartoon.

 

Which was why they made Sonic Boom, right? A series no on asked for?

And as a veteran of the Sonic fandom since the 90s I can tell you that's not true. Back when forums and websites like the Sonic Foundation, Team Artail, Mobius Forum, etc. were still around editorials and debates regarding the concerns of the franchise's direction story-wise were a constant concern to people. Even now, with a "centralized" story (that contradicts itself), SEGA every five years or so just ... Abandons their fans after awhile to appeal to a newer demographic. Games like 06 for example had originally been intended to be a reboot, but was cancelled because of how poorly recieved its had been. Even after SoJ ditched the western stories SEGA ALWAYS has a history of replacing their fans to do what they want, which makes it impossible to maintain ANY brand loyalty.

Also, a steady veiwership of around 4.8 Million for a cartoon facing the constant hurdles SatAM did is nothing to overlook, though. Especially now that SEGA can't even sell a million copies in its own games and struggled to even sell 2 million by the time Sonic Adventure rolled by. Hell, Sonic Spinball sold better than Forces.
 

 

8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

Sonic's fanbase has always lied with the games.  You're seriously overestimating how many people genuinely give a crap about the non-game stuff. 

Please stop speaking for the rest of the fanbase. I at least tried explaining through sources how SatAM had a good enough veiwership to at least be given a chance at revision. SatAM had more viewers in 1994 than people buying SEGA's games post 1999. And that's not to say I feel like Japan's version should be ignored or forgotten, but... that's as good a reason as any for me to suggest, why not have both? Hardly anybody cared before 1999 that the two co-existed until Japan decided to make it a problem.

Secondly, your over-estimating SEGA's capacity to rely on gameplay. SEGA has to start branching out to other forms of media, anyway. That's why they made Boom and the movie. because they can't rely on the games and being simply a gaming franchise, anymore. Because while good gameplay should be the ultimate goal for their company, and something SEGA's TRYING to do, all their better programmers keep getting bought out by the big boy, console companies like Nintendo, who offer them better wages and hours for their work, thus making SEGA a permanent underclass with no hope of mobility. Which means they need to find other ways of making money that these companies either don't have as much control over or that they can partner with them on. Like TV media and comics.

So, if they're going to keep creating new cartoons and movies anyway, why not just..... Bring back things people actually said they wanted instead of generating completely new AUs with random stuff all the time? Wouldn't that fit more within your interest of keeping things more consolidated? Because even if you do hate the show, its better to have it there than SEGA making something new every other year. Granted I feel like SatAM's too dated to go on as is, and would NOT want a continuation of it. But something that improves upon the show's premise, shortcomings and characters might be a start in the right direction.

 

8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

They're not fans of the games, they're fans of some warped bastardization created by people in another country who wanted to make a quick buck off of someone else's intellectual property with no input from the creators.

Need I remind you, Sonic's conceptualization was a team effort? And SatAM was being observed by SoA? Meanwhile Japan's story couldn't even sell in its own country. Again, SEGA is a BUSINESS. What matters is ultimately that the core basics of the series remained intact and that it SOLD to people. Your acting like Sonic's some webtoon or Korean comic somebody uploaded and is illegally being used by someone else make money. There is no such thing as "single author-ship" in a franchise. People submitted their ideas to a company knowing full well what that company was going to use it for. If you wanna be a creator with full control of your product, don't submit you stuff to a corporation.

 

8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

Then they'd have to AUs for Fleetway, Aosth, Underground, X, Archie, the manga, the OVA, and any other continuity either side crapped out over the years.  

Most of those concepts can be consolidated and revised, and ultimately re-created into a single entity, though. There's no need to make different stories for all of them. Archie, Fleetway, SatAM and Underground all have similar premises. And the OVA had enough ambiguity to it that certain concepts could have been added to most universes. Meanwhile Certain parts of Sonic X like Cosmo could also be added as Robotnik/Eggman potentially expands his empire beyond Mobius. Or alternatively, Seedrians can just be a native race to Mobians alongside humans and Mobians. This isn't rocket science.

8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

Definitely gonna need a source on these claims.

Google is your friend. Or hell, look at Deviantart, Ao3, Fanfiction.Net, etc. and check the results. If you type any individual names of recent game characters in the search their results always pale in comparison to Sally, the Freedom Fighters or hell even some of the Archie and Fleetway originals. Most gamers and the general public could care less about Modern Sonic anymore.

 

8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

Just because they sanitized it a bit doesn't mean the overall tones and intentions aren't still there.  But fine:  Breaking and entering, destruction of property, hacking.  If not terrorists then they're definitely hoodlums.

So by your logic, I guess Batman, Superman and the whoooole Justice League are nothing but a bunch of hood-boogers for occasionally breaking and entering places/property to save civilians and hostages from criminals

Also, if your selective concerns bothers you so much, why are you even IN this franchise? Sonic has been destroying Robotnik's property since Sonic 1.

 

8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

What's the difference between this and game version I can feel you asking?  Simple.  Julian is a legitimately established government authority who took over from his idiot predecessor who had dismantled the army and was dumb to trust someone who looked like Julian in the first place.  In the games, Eggman's the instigator imprisoning animals to use as batteries

So I guess your saying its not okay to fight slavery and defend yourself? Wow I guess Abe Lincon and the Union were THUGS in the civil war because their fighting ended slavery. And I guess WW2 veterans are THUGS for fighting Hitler and trying to save Jews from being enslaved and killed during the Holocaust, by your logic. Its okay Julian to enslave people without their consent, but god forbid Eggman imprisons small, sentiant animals to use as batteries. Also you conveniently forget there's no evidence of a ruling authority on classic locations like Westside Island in the games until Robotnik/Eggman came there. He BECAME the active authority and the "legit" established government authority. So its essentially the same thing. Stop grasping straws.

8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

 In SatAM, it's usually the FFs kicking the hornet's nest.  I can only think of a few episodes, like the pilot, where Julian instigated things first.  Only under those instances can what the FFs do be considered "self-defense".

 

Yeah because Julian TOTALLY didn't instigate anything first by enslaving innocent people who didn't consent to being Roboticized. But keep grasping.

 

8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

Also wanna point out the irony of the Freedom Fighters fighting to reinstate a monarchy.  Progress?

Compared to being robbed of freedoms to the point you have no bodily autonomy whatsoever? Yeah, it is.

 

8 hours ago, andrewtuell1991 said:

I didn't say those things.  Don't put words in my mouth please.

Just because you don't "say" something doesn't mean it isn't implied, pal. When you call Sonic a terrorist, your comparing him to other terrorists who previously and presently exist. Also, you were the one who said "Just because they sanitized it a bit doesn't mean the overall tones and intentions aren't still there." So that's fine to apply that against SatAM because you hate it, but not towards your own words?

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6 hours ago, Rosaleia said:

So by your logic, I guess Batman, Superman and the whoooole Justice League are nothing but a bunch of hood-boogers for occasionally breaking and entering places/property to save civilians and hostages from criminals

Well actually, it's been pointed out by the likes of Alan Moore and other writers that superheroes by their premise are either immoral or dangerous. Since they're ultimately just vigilantes and them not largely being like the Punisher or The Authority or Golden Age Superman (who took on slums and threatened government men to stop war) and other contrivances like Batman somehow not ever killing anybody is more from writer's fiat than them being believable

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Freedom Fighters are by definition terrorists by the same light that Superheroes are also criminals. its 99% perspective. Justification and greater good don't apply to the base definition of the terms. Its just semantics at this point.

 

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Note, however, that justification and greater good notwithstanding, Sonic would probably never be depicted attacking civilians to exert influence over their governments, which is what most people think of terrorism as being these days.  The franchise is conveniently structured so that this never happens; Eggman usually only ever uses robots, and when he convinces other sentient beings to help him it's always the sort tough enough to survive Sonic.  The most brutal you will likely ever see Sonic get towards civilians is him smashing into presumably occupied vehicles in City Escape, and none of that was on purpose (unless the players made him do it).

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16 hours ago, Badnik Mechanic said:

 

 

Channel 5...Space Channel 5?

Yeah, I'm reaching too hard for easter eggs. But these coincidences (like the Olympics locations) are pretty fun.

 

Also judging by that leaked screenshot, it looks like the "basically I'm gonna have to save your planet" shot. So some parts of the old trailer are staying. But still, what we got from the second trailer seems to indicate a good time overall. And its not like all of the first trailer was bad either (all the parts with Robotnik were great IMO), and without Gangster's Paradise or that disgusting abomination of a first design, I think the first trailer bits will be passable and the second trailer bits will be great.

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Nice! Also, new scene revealed.:

 
1 hour ago, Myst said:

In other news, we finally have the MPAA rating for the movie. What we all expected, PG. (Personally, I was hoping for a PG-13 like TMNT and Transformers)

https://old.reddit.com/r/SonicTheMovie/comments/ej7m6g/sonic_movie_official_mpaa_rating_revealed/

I was kinda expecting the movie to have a PG rating. So, I'm not surprised.

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On 1/1/2020 at 3:49 AM, andrewtuell1991 said:

They're not acting like "fanboys"  they're doing the logical business thing by having a unified storyline for all regions because juggling a dozen continuities is impractical.  Any negativity they've garnered since 1999 has to do with the gameplay of the games being crap and nothing to do with not following the continuity of some obscure DIC cartoon.

How did I contradict myself?  Throwing X a bone while focusing mainly on Classic would be no different from throwing Classic Sonic a bone (mania) while focusing mainly on Modern.  Even if that does end up happening there's still a ton of timelines left in the cold.

Sonic's fanbase has always lied with the games.  You're seriously overestimating how many people genuinely give a crap about the non-game stuff.  Most "older fans" really only give a crap the Mega Drive games, maybe the Game Gear and Adventure games for some, and could care less one way or the other about shows or comics.    Going back to Mega Man, the difference between those universes is they all originated as games.  What you're asking for is closer to if Mega Man "fans" wanted games based off the Ruby-Spear cartoon or Mario "fans" whining there are no games based off their equally crappy DIC cartoons.  Like Sega, why should Capcom or Nintendo cater to these niche group of fans?  They're not fans of the games, they're fans of some warped bastardization created by people in another country who wanted to make a quick buck off of someone else's intellectual property with no input from the creators.

 

Then they'd have to AUs for Fleetway, Aosth, Underground, X, Archie, the manga, the OVA, and any other continuity either side crapped out over the years.  There is very little to gain by playing Weekend at Bernie's with a bunch of old corpses.  I wish more episodes of the OVA could've been produced but I've learned to move on.  If you want SatAM just buy the complete series.

 

Definitely gonna need a source on these claims.

Just because they sanitized it a bit doesn't mean the overall tones and intentions aren't still there.  But fine:  Breaking and entering, destruction of property, hacking.  If not terrorists then they're definitely hoodlums.  What's the difference between this and game version I can feel you asking?  Simple.  Julian is a legitimately established government authority who took over from his idiot predecessor who had dismantled the army and was dumb to trust someone who looked like Julian in the first place.  In the games, Eggman's the instigator imprisoning animals to use as batteries, has bombed or threatened to bomb places, unleashes gods of destruction he can't control and end up terrorizing the planet, etc.  In the games, Sonic leaves Eggman and his bases alone until Eggman starts causing trouble.  You never see Game!Sonic attack Eggman's bases until Eggman throws the gauntlet first.  In SatAM, it's usually the FFs kicking the hornet's nest.  I can only think of a few episodes, like the pilot, where Julian instigated things first.  Only under those instances can what the FFs do be considered "self-defense".

Also wanna point out the irony of the Freedom Fighters fighting to reinstate a monarchy.  Progress?

I didn't say those things.  Don't put words in my mouth please.

What you’re basically saying is that the MMZ series should be ignored because it had a definitive ending/it was too dark/etc. The alternate media versions of Sonic contained more new material than most video game adaptations. 

 

What people want is not a direct continuation. Rather, simply having elements of those other versions incorporated into the games or other future versions will do. Just toss us a bone every once in a while, just like Megaman does. Not direct revivals. Even just merchandise would do.

 

Also, I still really like the new trailers coming out. They're really building up hype for the film.

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