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Thoughts on modern Knuckles?


Connor
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I'm new here so sorry if this has been discussed, seems silly or anything. blush.png

 

Recently I've noticed that Knuckles gets little to no attention in games. This has been pointed out a lot in terms of other supporting characters, but I haven't seen it discussed that much about Knuckles. He was one of the big main characters for some time. It was Sonic > Tails > Knuckles in terms of who's relevant (excluding Eggman). But now it feels like Knuckles has been abandoned and forgotten in my opinion.

 

Anyone else feel the same?

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You know... aside from Heroes, I'm pretty sure Knuckles never stayed right behind Sonic with Tails. Three's a crowd, you know?

 

 

I mean, what do you expect him to do? Do you want him to go break the Master Emerald again just so he has something to do in a game? I don't.

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In all honesty, Knuckles only seemed really close to Sonic/Tails in SA2, Heroes and 06. It wasn't really something that was set in stone right after his debut in Sonic 3; really, he wasn't even that close to them in SA1 and if I recall correctly, Tails never even had a conversation with Knuckles, that one "HAY NOOKELZ, WATS AP" line. 

 

I also think the whole reason he's been shoved aside recently is due to that old complaint with Heroes and 06, where people said "WHY THE HELL ISN'T HE ON ANGEL ISLAND GUARDING THE MASTER EMERALD PEFWIORJF'SDFR", which led to Sonic Team using him less often to stop that, but now... people want him back. And like Sol says above, I don't really want another "lol he broke the master emerald what a clumsy bastard go save the pieces" story again.

 

Really, should he be a reoccuring character? Yes, definitely. But one of the mains? In my honest opinion... no. This may sound weird, but I'd take the current formula of Sonic>Tails>Amy over the old Sonic>Tails>Knuckles anyday.

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In all honesty, Knuckles only seemed really close to Sonic/Tails in SA2, Heroes and 06. It wasn't really something that was set in stone right after his debut in Sonic 3; really, he wasn't even that close to them in SA1 and if I recall correctly, Tails never even had a conversation with Knuckles, that one "HAY NOOKELZ, WATS AP" line. 

 

I also think the whole reason he's been shoved aside recently is due to that old complaint with Heroes and 06, where people said "WHY THE HELL ISN'T HE ON ANGEL ISLAND GUARDING THE MASTER EMERALD PEFWIORJF'SDFR", which led to Sonic Team using him less often to stop that, but now... people want him back. And like Sol says above, I don't really want another "lol he broke the master emerald what a clumsy bastard go save the pieces" story again.

 

Really, should he be a reoccuring character? Yes, definitely. But one of the mains? In my honest opinion... no. This may sound weird, but I'd take the current formula of Sonic>Tails>Amy over the old Sonic>Tails>Knuckles anyday.

I'm not that fussed if he's on Angel Island or not, I'd just like him to have some more to do. I thought he was a really cool character, and his aggressiveness was a good parallel on Sonic and Tails always being too nice imo. I do like Amy aswell though. I prefer her over Tails.

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He's frankly getting pointless to me real fast.

I mean sure he's the obligatory power character and he was chucked to Team Sonic because "LOLCLASSICTRIOHE'SAPOWERCHARACTERLOLOLOL" in Heroes but WHAT ABOUT THE FREAKING MASTER EMERALD YOU DOLT

I mean like PONTAC

Sure he wasn't the first one to pointless-ize the Master Emerald but STILL

ahgkashgjkahskj I don't even know what I'm talking about here my point is that I don't think he has a purpose at all.

I mean how many lines does he even get in Lost World like two or three? Yeah yeah YEAH GO BACK TO PROTECTING THE MASTER EMERALD YOU AT LEAST HAVE A PURPOSE THAT WAY

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I feel that Knuckles' story is over now, and the only reason he appears at all is because of the fans.

We had him in Sonic 3, where he was protecting his turf. Then we had him in Adventure 1, where Angel Island fell from the sky as the Master Emerald was shattered apart by Chaos. Then in Adventure 2 he tracked Rouge down to protect the Master Emerald and take it back. That was his trilogy. Then they start putting him in Heroes, Advance, 06 and others games like no tomorrow just because he is liked by fans. It's just like with Shadow, where SEGA can't seem to let fan favourites go.

In all honesty, I'm starting to think Knuckles calls in favours from the disused cast members to guard the Master Emerald when he stars in a game. Seems only fitting he does, since a number of others haven't even seen the light of day for a number of years.

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I feel like Knuckles works better with his own story. If it involves Angel Island that's perfectly fine, but I'd rather see him do stuff unrelated to it. Why not expand on his role as a treasure hunter?

 

As for the Master Emerald, I've always assumed that he doesn't guard it anymore because he stopped leaving it where anyone can come along and steal it.

 

While I don't like the shoddy way he was thrown into Sonic Lost World, the scene with him and the tiny animals really gave depth to his character in my opinion. When they start carrying him away, all he does is ask them release him. Some of you may say that scene made him look weak, but I think it shows he has a soft spot for the little guys and didn't want to hurt them.

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I feel like Knuckles works better with his own story. If it involves Angel Island that's perfectly fine, but I'd rather see him do stuff unrelated to it. Why not expand on his role as a treasure hunter?

I really wish they'd expand on Rouge and Knuckles as treasure hunters somehow. I know theres a whole big thread dedicated to Rouge but it seems like they just forgotten that part of their stories.

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I agree with that, and is virtually what I said in less words.

Either give Knuckles the rivalry with Sonic back, and his role as guardian, or scrap him as a character altogether. We don't need Knuckles degraded to be even less of a character than Tails, or even Cream. And talking of Cream, surely she could have been with Amy during those cutscenes instead of Knuckles. Would have made more sense, what with Cream and Amy being better friends than Knuckles and Amy. And it would allow us the sight of a Chao again in this dark world of Wisps.

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One of my favorite things about Knuckles is the fact that he is so serious minded and His rivalry with Sonic : both of which Sega ditched recently. Knuckles is a hot headed dummy recently and has been robbed of all his honor.  I think Sega would do good to restore his personality and his Rivalry back to the way it was pre-Heroes era.

  I also wish Sega would do more with Knuckles and Rouge the way they did in Sonic Rivals 2. I think that their relationship is hilarious and fun to watch, and after Sonic generations, any hostility they had was lost as they were just standing there being like best friends ever! :P.

  C'mon Sega, I love Knuckles, stop dishonoring him and bring him back, bring back ALL of Knuckles! No, I am not trying to whine, but I just happened to notice that  particularly after Generations and in the Sonic Riders series, Knuckles has become really pointless... It is sad :(.

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I keep a tiny blog where I write my thoughts. And since Knuckles was one of them, I'm just gonna kinda copy and paste, if you don't mind.

 

Who He Is:

Knuckles the Echidna is one of the last, if not THE last, surviving member of, not only the Echidna tribe, but the Echidna species. Knuckles acts as the Guardian of the Master Emerald, as well as Angel Island. He was born on it, grew up on it, takes a great deal of pride in it.

Knuckles acts as one of Sonic's rivals. Where Sonic represents speed, Knuckles represented power -- not that Knuckles wasn't fast himself, he certainly was.

Back in the 90s it was about "Sonic vs Knuckles" not "Sonic vs Shadow" in the way of rivalries. That changed.

 

What He Contributes to the Lore:

A lot. Knuckles' ancestor connect directly to the Chaos Emeralds -- as well as Knuckles' own Master Emerald. We got to learn a lot about his origins from Sonic 3 and Knuckles and Sonic Adventure 1.

The Knuckles Clan were deeply dived into the magic. We see that with the power of Tikal and the future they predicted in Sonic 3 and Knuckles.

 

S&TvK.PNG

They predicted arguably the greatest battle in Sonic's video game career. They have the very roots of the Chaos Emeralds, or Plot Device Emeralds (as I call them).  They are the very connections to why Sonic can even save the world.

And Knuckles is their descendant.

Knuckles is the Guardian -- of the Master Emerald, as well as Angel Island. The Island that could be explored more -- the island that can tell as just that much more about the most coveted powers in all of the Sonic lore.

Knuckles, himself, is lore in his own right. Who knows what all he's capable of. He doesn't need to be Ken Pender's "Hot Pocket of Destiny" but he could certainly be an important aspect. After all, this guy used to be a great rival for Sonic. Let's not forget when he, um... well...

 

 
 
He kinda said "lolnope" to Super Sonic and knocked the Super out of him. That doesn't tell you how important he could be?
 

What The Problems Are:

The problems namely link to Sonic Heroes.

 

He's Been A Sidekick, Not a Rival

After Sonic Adventure 2, he seemed to stop having a reason to really show up. They decided to stop making Knuckles a rival and make him a generic side-kick second to Tails. He lost his value.

From Sonic 3 to Sonic Adventure 2, he was involved, yes. He fought alongside Sonic, yes. But Knuckles had his reasons for doing so. Those reasons were the safety of his island and the sanctity of the Master Emerald.

When the start of Heroes came, we were offered no explanations to why he is involved with the plot. We just saw Tails on his plane coming down with Knuckles -- we can guess he went to get Knuckles with the plane, but Knuckles would leave so freely? (I kinda find it weird that Tails went to Knuckles before Sonic, too).

Knuckle was never one of Sonic's close friends, that's something that SEGA just decided to pass off in the start of Heroes. Knuckles had his own reasons for being involved, and rightfully so. He spent his whole life guarding that emerald and living on that island. That's his home. He was raised with the idea of guarding it. Guard it. Be its protector.

To ask him to be less? That's insulting. Why bring him down to this idea of "trio" that only came about due to Sonic Heroes wanting to utilize the group gameplay? Now, it was okay for one game, but they still should have provided an explanation for it.

Heroes even decided to cast Tails and Knuckles as equals when Sonic went Super and Tails and Knuckles got... bubbles. Knuckles wasn't his own character with his own agenda, he was just another sidekick to Sonic. It's like Batman with two Robins.

Luckily, we haven't seen him in Unleashed and Colors, so we can assume he was guarding... luckily. But Generations and Lost World? I really doubt it.

Knuckles is a Big, Buff Jock

This part is a shot at his personality. Knuckles has been, as of late, just a strong, stupid character. That Sonic Boom shadow of Knuckles makes it seem even more likely. He looks like he's going to be "dumb muscle."

Actually, there's an imagine that explains my sentiments exactly:

knuckles_before_vs_knuckles_now_by_adoub

Almost perfect.

Knuckles was never this muscle bound idiot that SEGA tries to play him as.

Yes, he's strong. Yes, he was tricked a few times. But he was tricked due to ignorance, not stupidity. He spent his whole life as a guardian with no interaction with the outside world until Sonic and Eggman showed up. It's no surprise his trust and ideas can be a little easily shaken. He was tricked again in Sonic Adventure 1, but hey, Eggman wasn't after the Master Emerald and he proved that.

The image above, that shows him with the spear, does make a lot of sense. I don't see why SEGA tries to do more of that Mayan-esque attitude. They did root him towards it with the Knuckles Clan, even having one important member of that clan named Tikal.

Doesn't mean he needs a spear, but he could definitely be shown more towards his culture.

The guy decided to dedicate his life to serving his ancestor's wishes. None of them are alive, and yet he still guards the Emerald and Island. I think where he came from is important to him. He could be the most cultured of Sonic characters.

But yes, he's not an idiot. He's ignorant to some degree, but the stuff he knows, he knows well.

 

What Can Be Done:

It's simple really.

Stop making Knuckles this sidekick and stop making him one of Sonic's cheerleader. Bring Knuckles back to guarding the emerald and the island. Make his people and roots important to him (don't make him a zealot, either. You can show importance without making it consume him).

If Knuckles is going to be involved with the plot, have a good reason for it. Him just being there "Because" isn't going to cut it.

I, personally, rather have Knuckles be a character that, when he shows up, it's a big deal. Showing up as often as Tails does? No.

Tails is just a tool for Sonic to move the plot along. He's hardly a character himself. He's just there for Sonic to talk to in the cutscenes. I don't want Knuckles to be that.

Sadly, as it stands, Knuckles isn't even a sidekick, he's a cheerleader. That could change. A plot that threatens Knuckles' island could bring him along.

That's when you know it's a big deal for him.

I understand people want Knuckles more, I do too. But at the expense of his character? At the reduction of him being a sidekick than a rival? At the expense of making his whole reason for being a part of the game universe irrelevant?

I think it's much more rewarding for Knuckles to show up less, but when he shows up, it's important than for him to show up more, but have no value.

What's so weird about Tails going to the guy that will always be on Angel Island guarding the Master Emerald before going after someone who travels the world all the time and is faster then sound?

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The Sonic Adventure games' portrayals of Knuckles are about as good as it can get for the Modern depiction of the character. He really felt the most spot-on in terms of characters, and he actually had a reason for hanging out with Sonic and CO, in spite of being shoe horned into Sonic Adventure 2. Yeah, it was annoying that he got tricked AGAIN in Adventure, but at least he had his own quest or journey instead of randomly appearing to aid Sonic. This more or less applies to Adventure 2, except he wasn't really tricked, had the brains to shatter the Emerald so Eggman couldn't get his hands on it, and only went with Sonic and CO to the ark so he could focus on finding the shards of the ME, although it was dumb luck that he just happened to exit a sewer manhole right below Tails and Amy.

 

Starting with Sonic Heroes, every Sonic game from this point on(with the sole exception of Rivals 2) completely forgot that Knuckles' main duty is guarding the ME, and he really shows up just for the sake of making Sonic and Tails a trio when the developers need them to be, and/or show they haven't forgotten about him. It gets even worse in Generations and Lost World, as he's been reduced to the dumb oaf, and a useless butt monkey, like being easily shoved aside by Amy and carried away easily by a pack of Forrest Animals.

 

Damnit developers, I love Knuckles, and he's definitely one of my favorite characters in the franchise, but it's time to treat him with dignity again. I'm alright with trying to make him a bit of a more comical character, but if you're going to make him appear, can you actually give him a purpose for appearing, and an explanation for why he's there to begin with? 

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On the Subject of Heroes, Shadow, Battle, '06, Generations, and Lost World:

In Sonic Battle, Knuckles stated that Chaos only appears in times of crisis. How could Knuckles have known this when his first interaction with Chaos was in Sonic Adventure and he had no idea who Chaos was? Easy. At the start of Sonic Heroes, Chaos may have appeared before Knuckles. And The Master Emerald or Tikal could have informed Knuckles that Chaos appeared because the world was in danger. Soon after that would be when Tails comes with Eggman's (Metal Sonic's) Letter. So Knuckles had a reason to leave the Master Emerald and he must have left it in the hands of the "God of Destruction" and a spirit of a Knuckles Clan echidna.

 

So, this must have also been the reason behind his appearances without the M.E. in Shadow, 06 and Lost World. Generations on the other hand... well, even BLAZE crossed DIMENSIONS for Sonic's birthday, so Knuckles could have hidden the Master Emerald and left Angel Island for Sonic's party as well. ...or the Time Eater's actions counted as a Crisis, not that Knuckles was aware of it at the time.

 

EDIT: In the future, SEGA can just re-inforce this idea in the future as the reason behind Knuckles appearances. And Knuckles would automatically have a purpose. Knuckles' guardian status can also be extended to the world as a whole, since the Master Emerald and Angel Island are still apart of Sonic's world. It also ties into Knuckles' theme song.

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What's so weird about Tails going to the guy that will always be on Angel Island guarding the Master Emerald before going after someone who travels the world all the time and is faster then sound?

Because there was hardly any point to it other than "we're Sonic Heroes", which had no substance like most of the plot?

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Because there was hardly any point to it other than "we're Sonic Heroes", which had no substance like most of the plot?

My point was that if you wanted the help of both of your friends, then it's a wiser decision to get the one that's always in the same location 80% of the time before you try to find the one that's always in another location every second.

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What's so weird about Tails going to the guy that will always be on Angel Island guarding the Master Emerald before going after someone who travels the world all the time and is faster then sound?

Out of all the things I said, you decided to pick up that?

Anyway, I find it weird because of Knuckles and Tails' position, prior to this, isn't as friendly as Sonic and Tails. Tails knows he can rely on Sonic, the idea that his thoughts is  "I should get Knuckles and Sonic" rather than just "I should get Sonic" is, in fact, weird.

Before this event, Tails and Knuckles have been on okay terms, not friendly. They'd fought alongside each other if deemed needed. Knuckles is the same guy who put everyone's life at risk because he wanted to turn a space shuttle around to get his shards. That doesn't mean he's not trust-worthy, but why Tails even thought about him is unusual.

 

Now, if they were having a hard time dealing with the Egg Pawns, and either Sonic or Tails suggested asking for Knuckles' assistence, then that's more believeable. But upon getting that letter and Tails acting and deciding to go get Knuckles?

 

I've a feeling Tails would have thought Sonic, alone, would be enough.

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My point was that if you wanted the help of both of your friends, then it's a wiser decision to get the one that's always in the same location 80% of the time before you try to find the one that's always in another location every second.

Nevermind that he somehow managed to find the one who's location changed every second regardless, then leaps out of the jet to run with him to stop a threat on foot instead of using said jet to go after the main threat instead of searching for it in the skies. And that last one's just a nitpick that makes things more ridiculous in the narrative to think about.

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Out of all the things I said, you decided to pick up that?

Anyway, I find it weird because of Knuckles and Tails' position, prior to this, isn't as friendly as Sonic and Tails. Tails knows he can rely on Sonic, the idea that his thoughts is  "I should get Knuckles and Sonic" rather than just "I should get Sonic" is, in fact, weird.

Before this event, Tails and Knuckles have been on okay terms, not friendly. They'd fought alongside each other if deemed needed. Knuckles is the same guy who put everyone's life at risk because he wanted to turn a space shuttle around to get his shards. That doesn't mean he's not trust-worthy, but why Tails even thought about him is unusual.

 

Now, if they were having a hard time dealing with the Egg Pawns, and either Sonic or Tails suggested asking for Knuckles' assistence, then that's more believeable. But upon getting that letter and Tails acting and deciding to go get Knuckles?

 

I've a feeling Tails would have thought Sonic, alone, would be enough.

I think Tails relationship with everyone during those times was almost exactly the same as Sonic's. It's just that since the focus is more on Sonic, Sonic's relationship with the other characters is more apparent. So Tails and Knuckles would have been as good friends as Sonic and Knuckles are.

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Knuckles!!

 

Hes my 4th favorite Sonic character. When I play Sonic Adventure 1, Sonic Adventure 2, Sonic Heroes, Sonic the Hedgehog 2006 and Sonic Free Riders he became favorite of mine! I love his design. And his personality is awesome. He is a ditz and naive but he is strong character who trys to think with logic and helps Sonic not be reckless. He also has a smart side when it comes to protecting the master emerald.

 

also the team of Sonic, Tails and Knuckles are perfect because their personalities and skills go great together. Sonic is the free wind, Tails is the tech and logic side and Knuckles is the responsible/clear side and the muscle. Team Sonic is in my banner and this is why I love them so much. Replacing Knuckles with Amy would make me very sad and it would be weird. Not because of this nistogilga thing but their harmony goes good together.

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Knuckles!!

 

Hes my 4th favorite Sonic character. When I play Sonic Adventure 1, Sonic Adventure 2, Sonic Heroes, Sonic the Hedgehog 2006 and Sonic Free Riders he became favorite of mine! I love his design. And his personality is awesome. He is a ditz and naive but he is strong character who trys to think with logic and helps Sonic not be reckless. He also has a smart side when it comes to protecting the master emerald.

 

also the team of Sonic, Tails and Knuckles are perfect because their personalities and skills go great together. Sonic is the free wind, Tails is the tech and logic side and Knuckles is the responsible/clear side and the muscle. Team Sonic is in my banner and this is why I love them so much. Replacing Knuckles with Amy would make me very sad and it would be weird. Not because of this nistogilga thing but their harmony goes good together.

A team of Sonic, Tails and Amy doesn't completely make sense because when there is no danger around, Amy will be chasing after Sonic all the time. But with Sonic, Tails and Knuckles, if there is no danger to the world, they could all easily just hang around as friends on Angel Island or something when Sonic's not adventuring.

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A team of Sonic, Tails and Amy doesn't completely make sense because when there is no danger around, Amy will be chasing after Sonic all the time. But with Sonic, Tails and Knuckles, if there is no danger to the world, they could all easily just hang around as friends on Angel Island or something when Sonic's not adventuring.

You act like that chasing Sonic around is all Amy does...it isn't.

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A team of Sonic, Tails and Amy doesn't completely make sense because when there is no danger around, Amy will be chasing after Sonic all the time. But with Sonic, Tails and Knuckles, if there is no danger to the world, they could all easily just hang around as friends on Angel Island or something when Sonic's not adventuring.

Yes!! So much this. 

 

Because Sonic, Tails and Knuckles all have relaxing personalities when they are with each other. Sonic is like the wind he likes to run around and be free and even when he is saving the day he is very relaxed and knows he can do it. Tails makes the machines and is very smart. He is serious when the time is right but he is also relaxed when plans are in place because he has faith in him and Sonic. Knuckles when he is not worried about the Master Emerald is relaxed when plans are in place and that he can warn Sonic to be careful. He has responsiblity but when Knuckles wants a thrill he is laid back.

 

And why i also like Knuckles as well, he is laid back and wants to have fun like Sonic and he is coming out of his shell

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