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The "Port Kunckles' Chaotix" campaign!


castell-neath
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Not sure if this should be in discussion or games, but if it needs to be moved - please do so!

 

OK - this is the one game I NEVER managed to play due to not owning a 32x / lack of ports of consoles, but I've seen playthroughs on youtube.

 

What do people think  - should we start a campaign to get it ported to console eshops / mobiles? Do people even care about this game to want to play it?

 

Granted I think that Taxman is hoping for (working on?) a Sonic 3 (and knuckles?) port as hinted by the ending to sonic 2 on the mobile release latley....but what do we think, would him having a look and "tweeking" this game raise enough interest?

 

I'd love to see Metal playable if anything is indeed tweeked, that and more badniks / rings!!

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I think very few people have actually played Chaotix legit. The 32X tanked hard and barely anybody bought the thing. 

 

Personally I emulated it years back, but it's really not a good game. I really don't think it's worth porting it to anything- very few people will have nostalgia for it, and outside of that you'll be exposing people to a bad game, which won't do Sonic's reputation any favours. Even if you let Taxman at it, there's only so much you can polish a turd. To turn Chaotix into a good game would require a complete teardown and rebuild to the point it couldn't even be considered a port any more.

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I'm pretty sure this has been discussed a million times before.  Most of the fanbase see Chaotix as a pretty mediocre game with uninspired level design and repetitive gameplay.  It'd need way more than a tweak to be brought up to the level of the other Classic 2D games.  Only a very tiny, not even very vocal, minority are hardcore fans of it.  I'd like to see it released as an emulation in some kind of collection game for prosperity but it's not worth the effort of a full-scale remake like Sonic CD/1/2.

 

Unfortunately though not many people know or care that it even exists.  It'd be a tough game for SEGA to market when it hasn't got "Sonic" in the title too.

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I personally do understand the dislike for Knuckles' Chaotix, however... kinda consider it a guilty pleasure of mine-- but no, there is no point in a re-release. No-one ever played it on the 32X which rids the "nostalgia" point, most in the fanbase consider it a shitty game anyway, and with Sonic not being the main character, marketing and getting it to be a popular title would be a flat out nightmare.

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The only way I could see Knuckles' Chaotix getting an opportunity to officially see the light of day again, is if it was included in a "retro Sonic" or "Sega 32X" compilation. If I recall correctly, they were going to have the game available on both Sonic Mega Collection (Plus) and subsequently Sonic Gems Collection, but emulation problems with the 32X stopped Sonic Team from being able to do it (similar emulation problems with Sega CD prevented the original Sonic CD from seeing a release on both compilation games as well-the Sonic CD on Gems Collection is a port of the PC version).

 

Though I do recall reading about Chaotix seeing a short-lived release on GameTap.com, though.

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Well there is a small counterpoint on the porting non-sonic titled games, they did port both Tail's solo games, albeit only on the 3DS

 

That was a simple port of the Game Gear ROMs. Not a remaster like what Taxman does. 32X ROMs can't be just slapped onto another device either due to emulation issues.

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Has SEGA ever ported or emulated any of the 30+ games they made for the 32x? It just seems like the entire catalogue of games for that system have been forgotten.

 

It's a shame really, because Chaotix is a very interesting game. Graphically it's top notch. The level design whilst a mess, is certainly entertaining (crazier than Sonic CD's). It has some nice gimmicks, but it gets boring far too quickly.

 

StealthTax could be it's only hope.

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I would like to play the game and although I could easily emulate it I would like to see the Taxman have a crack at it. However, I hear its not very good so that may not do the franchise any favours.

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I have a 32X, with Chaotix and the game Kolibri (the world's best hummingbird based shooter). I'm one of the few fans of this game, and it's pretty hard to defend. For one it's not a gem, it's a straight up oddity, and it doesn't make any sense when played next to the other Sonic games. Most people play it wrong, and get angry when the spindash doesn't work. Let me say it's also fucking impossible on a Genesis controller because the grab/throw button is the B button, while the jump button is the C button, requiring two thumbs if you actually want to jump-throw your partner which is an important move. It's also in great need of a remastering, but at the same time not worth remastering. I'm pretty sure I am the only person alive who played this game start to finish one day, just to see what that was like. It's a 25 act game. Five acts per level. This translates to PADDING. My conclusion was that the first two acts of each level are in fact nothing but filler. There are barely traps or Badniks in the first two acts of any level, and the gimmicks that make each zone distinct don't show up until act 3. Those two acts are just there, totally breaking the normal 2-3 act progression, as if they were an afterthought. What this means is that no one really gets to the meat of the game before they're already sick of it. The game randomly chooses levels, a very poor design choice in my opinion, since you'll be playing these barren "intro" acts for two hours before the zones begin to have enemies, traps, or even recognizable architecture. So I think I'm the first one to say it, but these levels should be cut from Chaotix in a future release. It makes for a shorter, but more understandable and fun game. There should also be an option to remove the damn level roulette. And how about lives? There's no sense of danger in this game, you literally cannot lose the game, there are no lives. How about unlockable Sonic and Tails with their intended sprites from the Crackers demo. Those are some quick fixes to Chaotix that would make the game more enjoyable if ever released again. Please believe that this is no Sonic CD, it's not one of these games that never received its due recognition because of console choices. It's an extremely quirky game you have to forgive for its moments, but with some other moments that definitely stand out. It has one of the best special stages in the series. It's the first appearance of the Chaotix. Metal Sonic is a major villain in this game. It's a truly unique game, but I wonder what you all would think finally getting to play it.

 

Another idea is because of (what I consider) this game's padding problems, Taxman/Stealth could be allowed to add additional levels to this game. If they were allowed original content anywhere, a failed game like Chaotix could be it.

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Has SEGA ever ported or emulated any of the 30+ games they made for the 32x? It just seems like the entire catalogue of games for that system have been forgotten.

 

It's a shame really, because Chaotix is a very interesting game. Graphically it's top notch. The level design whilst a mess, is certainly entertaining (crazier than Sonic CD's). It has some nice gimmicks, but it gets boring far too quickly.

 

StealthTax could be it's only hope.

 

Honestly, I think Mark has a point when he says the game would have to be rebuilt in order for it to be as good as the other Genesis Sonic games (regardless when compared to those game's original forms or TaxStealth's remasters), though I don't think the original game itself is horrible.

 

Arguably the main problem of the game is its level design in my opinion, which suffers from being generic and is designed around the co-op gameplay gimmick that is the physics rubber-band. Large chunks (if not entire paths or even overall maps) of level design would have to reworked so that going through the zones (which, for the record, are five acts per zone...which also number in five) would not feel like a chore, as the level design I'm sure is structured with some areas that require the player(s) to exploit the rubber band mechanics in order to advance through the level. So even if you made Chaotix's entire gameplay structure itself optional and allowed the player(s) to play it similar to the more conventional Genesis Sonic games (namely speaking with the co-op and physics in mind, though the rings and lives system could have a option where it is changed to behave more like Sonic 3&K as well), you'd still have to put up with the level design, which aside from still being bland would (I presume) take any difficulty that was present with the original gameplay structure (which, coupled with the lack of lives and small supply of hazardous zone levels and badniks, is not much).

 

I think an interesting option would be to have Taxman and Stealth take the existing gameplay assets, maybe add to it the Sonic CD zones and Sonic 2 boss rush level that Sega vetoed, and then use that as the basis to create a new Genesis Sonic-styled gaiden game (presumably one that /isn't/ based on co-op).

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Meh.

 

I played an emulated version as I never had a 32X. After the nostalgia subsided I wasn't particularly impressed with the level design or the bosses, but I like the sprites and I like some of the music. Giving the characters different special moves was a nice idea, and I suppose in addition to Tails/Knuckles in S3&K, it paved the way for different character play styles later on. I'm not particularly itching to purchase it, I seem to remember I got hopelessly stuck as Knuckles and Espio in the training mission before I even got to the levels themselves! XD

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I have a 32X, with Chaotix and the game Kolibri (the world's best hummingbird based shooter). I'm one of the few fans of this game, and it's pretty hard to defend. For one it's not a gem, it's a straight up oddity, and it doesn't make any sense when played next to the other Sonic games. Most people play it wrong, and get angry when the spindash doesn't work. Let me say it's also fucking impossible on a Genesis controller because the grab/throw button is the B button, while the jump button is the C button, requiring two thumbs if you actually want to jump-throw your partner which is an important move. It's also in great need of a remastering, but at the same time not worth remastering. I'm pretty sure I am the only person alive who played this game start to finish one day, just to see what that was like. It's a 25 act game. Five acts per level. This translates to PADDING. My conclusion was that the first two acts of each level are in fact nothing but filler. There are barely traps or Badniks in the first two acts of any level, and the gimmicks that make each zone distinct don't show up until act 3. Those two acts are just there, totally breaking the normal 2-3 act progression, as if they were an afterthought. What this means is that no one really gets to the meat of the game before they're already sick of it. The game randomly chooses levels, a very poor design choice in my opinion, since you'll be playing these barren "intro" acts for two hours before the zones begin to have enemies, traps, or even recognizable architecture. So I think I'm the first one to say it, but these levels should be cut from Chaotix in a future release. It makes for a shorter, but more understandable and fun game. There should also be an option to remove the damn level roulette. And how about lives? There's no sense of danger in this game, you literally cannot lose the game, there are no lives. How about unlockable Sonic and Tails with their intended sprites from the Crackers demo. Those are some quick fixes to Chaotix that would make the game more enjoyable if ever released again. Please believe that this is no Sonic CD, it's not one of these games that never received its due recognition because of console choices. It's an extremely quirky game you have to forgive for its moments, but with some other moments that definitely stand out. It has one of the best special stages in the series. It's the first appearance of the Chaotix. Metal Sonic is a major villain in this game. It's a truly unique game, but I wonder what you all would think finally getting to play it.

 

Another idea is because of (what I consider) this game's padding problems, Taxman/Stealth could be allowed to add additional levels to this game. If they were allowed original content anywhere, a failed game like Chaotix could be it.

 

Thanks for this insight, indeed I had no idea the levels get actual gimmicks and enemies at the third act into each zone.

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Hm....so no real point in this then. Seems things are a bit more problematic than i thought

 

So, its eems like a "06 reboot" is this game's only (remote) hope then of making nay sort of comeback.

 

Pity its such a mess to fix....like Sonic Heros it seemed to offer good potential!

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Like everyone else has said, I have the original and a 32x, plus its sitting on my computer emulated for ease of use and it is an oddity. It would be nice to see it finally get a re-release after all these years tho. Surely Sega plans to do a collection for the new consoles at some point, they have one on almost every other console known to man.

Having all the space new disc formats have these days would mean no excuse for skimping on content. Put the Mega Drive and Master System/Game Gear stuff on there. Or better yet the Stealth/Tax remasters. Give it a new selling point of including all the oddities like Sega Sonic Arcade and Chaotix, other versions of games like the Saturn version of Blast, maybe throw in the weird Waku Waku things and footage of the out there things like the Popcorn Maker etc and have a real Sonic Jam 2. Gimme a new history hall, illustration and character room, movie and music viewer and a 3D world with mini games to run round in and I would be a happy fan :)

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Any chance of Chaotix ever getting a release vanished when it wasn't included in the sonic Gems Collection.

 

As much as Chaotix is unknown, Sonic the fighters is even more so. If that's getting releases and Chaotix isn't....yeah, we're never gonna see it again. Get a rom.

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Surprised at the amount of hate for this game. Then again I seem to be one for od and obscure games/characters in the series.

Bought a few Japanese versions of it while I was living there but seeing as I don't own a 32X  ,made sure to get an emulator and have this gem on my comp. Would love to see it have an official release though.

 

They really need to do a round up of the old games; Chaotix, SEGA Sonic arcade, waku waku patrol, all the random games and anything that hasn't seen a rerelease and any old art and movie clips and compile them into a new collection. Love the way they did that with Sonic Gems Collection.

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I never understood the logic behind people who put down a possible port of this game, especially when they cite it as being "mediocre" or "bad".  There've been plenty of ports of other Sonic games to have the same distinction (Sonic Labyrinth, Sonic Blast, Sonic 3D, Sonic R, Sonic Heroes, Sonic the Fighters...) and, while people have complained about that too, it's never really done us any harm.

 

From where I sit, the fact that few people got to actually play Knuckles' Chaotix is exactly the reason why it should get a port.  Not too many people played Sonic CD on a Mega-CD either, and that got ported, so why shouldn't this game?  It really bugs me when I hear about the reaosn it not being ported is because SEGA can't emulate it, or whatever, when, as we know, it can be done as that's how probably the majority of us have played it.  This is one of those colourful, pretty fun, obscure Sonic games that really does need to be made available to us, if only to allow people like me to have a "complete" collection.  But hey, what do I know, I mean I'd like a port of Segasonic the Hedgehog and Sonic Shuffle as well, just because we haven't had them, they've very obscure and hard to come by, and it'd be great to have them available just to say that I owned them.

 

Regarded a Knuckles' Chaotix port, or HD remix or whatever, it'd be nice to see Sonic and Tails added back into the game, right from the start or maybe as a slightly better reward for clearing the game with all the Chaos Rings.  Maybe it might be better to change the random area selector as well, so that we never have to play an Act more than once, and possibly jigg up some of the Zones as well (maybe a few more enemies and variety here and there) but, honestly, I always really liked Knuckles' Chaotix's graphics and music, the characters all look and play pretty well, and the gameplay was pretty decent.  Sure, it's no masterpeice, but that's never stopped SEGA before so the apparent embargo on this game really irks me.

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As someone who actually got the 32X with Knuckles' Chaotix in the '90s and has a bit of nostalgia attached to it, yeah, I kind of have to agree with the popular opinion here that it's not really worth it. The rubber band gameplay was kind of a neat idea, but ended up just being annoying most of the time. Plus the level design, as others have said, is mostly just awful.
 
The game does have some really nice music, so if nothing else, a port of the game could at least expose gems like Seascape to more people. I really love the mix of Door Into Summer they did for the Collection Room in Sonic Generations.
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I never understood the logic behind people who put down a possible port of this game, especially when they cite it as being "mediocre" or "bad".  There've been plenty of ports of other Sonic games to have the same distinction (Sonic Labyrinth, Sonic Blast, Sonic 3D, Sonic R, Sonic Heroes, Sonic the Fighters...) and, while people have complained about that too, it's never really done us any harm.

 

From where I sit, the fact that few people got to actually play Knuckles' Chaotix is exactly the reason why it should get a port.  Not too many people played Sonic CD on a Mega-CD either, and that got ported, so why shouldn't this game?  It really bugs me when I hear about the reaosn it not being ported is because SEGA can't emulate it, or whatever, when, as we know, it can be done as that's how probably the majority of us have played it.  This is one of those colourful, pretty fun, obscure Sonic games that really does need to be made available to us, if only to allow people like me to have a "complete" collection.  But hey, what do I know, I mean I'd like a port of Segasonic the Hedgehog and Sonic Shuffle as well, just because we haven't had them, they've very obscure and hard to come by, and it'd be great to have them available just to say that I owned them.

 

Regarded a Knuckles' Chaotix port, or HD remix or whatever, it'd be nice to see Sonic and Tails added back into the game, right from the start or maybe as a slightly better reward for clearing the game with all the Chaos Rings.  Maybe it might be better to change the random area selector as well, so that we never have to play an Act more than once, and possibly jigg up some of the Zones as well (maybe a few more enemies and variety here and there) but, honestly, I always really liked Knuckles' Chaotix's graphics and music, the characters all look and play pretty well, and the gameplay was pretty decent.  Sure, it's no masterpeice, but that's never stopped SEGA before so the apparent embargo on this game really irks me.

 

The difference between CD and Chaotix, was that not a lot of people played CD but it had a lot of praise, both critical and from the fans, so those who didn't play it really wanted too. Chaotix is even less well known and not particularly loved so there's a much smaller demand for it.

It just doesn't make sense for Sega to put the time and money into a re-release of a game that so few people are interested in. The only chance I think it has of getting released again is if Sega make another mega/gems style collection and need something new to make buying it worthwhile, but seeing as it's more sensible to release the old games individually on PSN, Xbla and phones i don't see it happening...

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A key problem is that Knuckles Chaotix is half finished. A lot of basic obstacles and gimmicks are missing and so many of the levels feel empty and like they recycle the same route (left, upward slope, right, upward slope, repeat). Even basic things such as loops and the water level having actual water weren't refined and implemented in time. It would be nice if Taxman could make a 'finished' version of the game, but given how SEGA is iffy to big changes to the games, it likely won't happen, unless they approve a 'Hard Mode' or something.

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