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Sonic Boom announced (Wii U/3DS)

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I think Sonic Team does try to make good games...it just seems like they can't consistently do that.

 

Unleashed is one part great game and another part average/mediocre, Colors was great but too short and didn't have enough 3d platforming (even though some zones like Asteroid Coaster/Starlight Carnival showed that it could work) and Generations so frustrating with it missing so much potential (with the game nailing the gameplay and being so much fun, but not having a story what so ever and having really stupid picks for stages...really Sonic Team, you want to have 2 city zones and a Green Hill clone representing the Dreamcast era...really?).

 

I don't know about Lost World (since I don't own a Wii U) but it really is a shame that have had so many chances to make a amazing Sonic but never meet that quality the Genesis games had.....

 

 

It's a shame that no developers who experiment with different gameplay and concepts ever get it right first try and always have to release a few bad to middling games before anything passable comes out.

 

Oh wait

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Trying isn't good enough when a large portion of the industry puts out quality games more consistently without needing to "try their best..!"

 

No one has to defend these devs and say "guys come on they tried" when their games are consistently good always. I'm glad Sonic Team are trying, but I can't say I'm glad that I'm still expected to put up with second best when other devs get it right first try. In the time ST have been trying to "make Sonic good" again, those other devs I mentioned have launched multiple new IPs that are all goodRight away.

 

You hit the nail on the head man; so many great teams make some great original IP the past year alone that easily outclasses Sonic Teams output.

 

Tearaway, Mario 3d World, Pupetter, Rayman Legends, and many others are platformers with great original ideas alongside great gameplay, and Sonic could have that same thing. Maybe with Sonic Boom and Sonic Teams 2015 game, that could happen again :).

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I don't think you honestly have the right to even ask this, when there are fans of Sonic in all different forms, and what exactly makes him less of a fan for liking Sonic Boom?

 

I love the spin off titles more than the main series games, I also like 3D Sonic better than classic, are you going to question why I'm a fan in the first place?

 

I didn't mean it in a rude sense, nor am I saying he's less of a fan for liking Sonic Boom.

 

I'm saying I simply can't comprehend, considering he apparently never cared or was attracted to the games before this point, why he associated himself as a fan of them before.

 

Or in a quicker sense, I get it, you like Sonic now. Why did you like Sonic before? (you here being him)

 

Consider it a counter question to him trying to understand how there even is a Sonic "feel" at all, I'm trying to understand how one can consider themselves a Sonic fan without even knowing that "feel". Before Boom, again.

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I didn't mean it in a rude sense, nor am I saying he's less of a fan for liking Sonic Boom.

 

I'm saying I simply can't comprehend, considering he apparently never cared or was attracted to the games before this point, why he associated himself as a fan of them before.

 

Or in a quicker sense, I get it, you like Sonic now. Why did you like Sonic before? (you here being him)

 

I get what you're saying but Sonic has stretched far beyond mere video games, into both media and publications, Oggy is a fan of Archie if I'm not mistaken, which follows it's own verse rather than sticking to game canon, also STC.

 

He could also just find Sonic's character design aesthetically pleasing to the eye.

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I get what you're saying but Sonic has stretched far beyond mere video games, into both media and publications, Oggy is a fan of Archie if I'm not mistaken, which follows it's own verse rather than sticking to game canon, also STC.

 

He could also just find Sonic's character design aesthetically pleasing to the eye.

 

That's what I just said.

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At the end of the day for me.  I'm ok with Crash Bandicoot, Jak and Daxter and Ratchet and Clack artstyles being implemented into Sonic.  Sonic has never really had a definitive artstyle to begin with.  Which doesn't surprise since the franchise has been going for just under 25 years.  Things are going to change a little bit due to modern appeal.

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Regardless, if Lost World is all it takes for you to say "I don't think Sonic should feel like Sonic", I'm afraid I have to question why you're a fan in the first place? Or were, since now of course you can say "because I like Sonic Boom".

I get what you're saying but Sonic has stretched far beyond mere video games, into both media and publications, Oggy is a fan of Archie if I'm not mistaken, which follows it's own verse rather than sticking to game canon, also STC.

He could also just find Sonic's character design aesthetically pleasing to the eye.

Thank you!

More or less you touched on it. I like the Sonic franchise's designs, the characters, and a lot of the lore surrounding it. When it comes to the games, I play them because they're Sonic more than what the game itself is like. If the game is fun, the game is fun; I'm going to use an outlandish example here but if there was say, a Sonic FPS, and it was fun... well, that's that, I will like it.

However, that's my personal take; I mostly argue for Boom on the basis of marketing (since, barring a game being absolutely atrocious I would like it anyway). In terms of games, Sonic's been so many different things to so many different people trying to find a universal feel is something of a lost cause, I think. The only thing that's really constant between them all is Sonic's reputation for speed and (with some variation) the universe and cast.

If we invent a new type of gameplay (and stick with it), and Sonic sells better for it, I say full speed ahead. Some folks will leave over the change undoubtedly, which is unfortunate, but the influx of new fans could make up for it and make the brand stronger as a whole. Of course, we could also go back to one older style of play, but there's so many to choose from it could be hard to make a choice; something different entirely, coupled with a new look, could make the franchise look fresh again.

I'd like Sonic to be consistent and cease being the butt of jokes, overall. I appreciate Sonic Team's commitment to trying new things, but I think they've been given too many chances.

It's not just the game I'm excited for though, the cartoon, the toys, generally how SEGA's trying to bring Sonic back into the spotlight with the western audience.  We'll have to wait and see how it goes, because it might turn out to be a colossal failure in the end, but the idea of Sonic having a much larger presence here excites me anyways.

I think the 90s taught us all we need to know on which factions in SEGA know how to make Sonic best. It is the Western ones, pure and simple; SEGA Japan grumps about it, naturally, but they need to be mature about it and render unto Caesar's what is Caesar's. They're a company and should care more about profits than anything else, and I think the West controlling the franchise will deliver more profits than letting Japan do so ever will.

Wanting to do everything yourself is a horrible idea from an economic standpoint and a financial one as well. SEGA Japan needs to understand this... and I think they are given the leeway they've given this project. There looks to have been a serious re-evaluation of the Sonic franchise among the higher ups.

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I think I spotted a loop-de-loop in the trailer. I was worried that these wouldn't be present, but I'm relieved that they are.

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Personally, the trailer jumped around too much for me to understand what was going on. They should do a longer and more in-depth trailer showing off more next time. But from what I can tell, the speed sections look very fast, I just hope the combat doesn't bog it down.

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At the end of the day for me.  I'm ok with Crash Bandicoot, Jak and Daxter and Ratchet and Clack artstyles being implemented into Sonic.  Sonic has never really had a definitive artstyle to begin with.  Which doesn't surprise since the franchise has been going for just under 25 years.  Things are going to change a little bit due to modern appeal.

 

If that's the case I can't wait for Mario to get all edgy and borderlands on us. Because he's been going for over 25 years and kept consistency for the most part, so why can't Sonic?

 

Not saying I disagree because seeing Sonic in outlandish bad lands garb tickles me in all the right places, but my point still stands really, and Mario remains as a critical success with the same formula/character designs/ level tropes/ story etc.

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@Ogivle & whoever else:

 

I'm just kinda boggled at the thought that you can't really see the difference between Jak & Daxter and Sonic the Hedgehog's visual styles, or say that Sonic "doesn't really have an established style". Like, it's one thing to like one over the other, but to act it's completely unacknowledgeable? Man.

 

 

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THIS is the Sonic style.

 

Yes, this is mostly what was established in the past three or four games, but Unleashed-Colors-Generations seemed to set out to make a 'blanket' art style that takes the disorganized (yet similar) styles of the previous games and blends them together. ( Lost World is shown here because it even has it's rare exceptions. )

 

This art style is very big on complex or mesmerizing geometric shapes and patterns, and levels are designed with the visual flair of slopes, loops, and irregular terrain are abundant. Even with Lost World's lack of slopes functioning in gameplay, we see that the level design is tubular, helping give that Sonic feel it otherwise would've been slightly lacking on.

 

There is wide usage of bold colors as well as a heavy dosage of general color theory applied, and the style feels bright and whimsical, even at it's darkest or most borderline-realistic. Characters are noodley and simplistically designed, with humans being a Pixar-ish offset that compliments them in design.

 

It feels centric to exactly what it is: a Japanese developer making a 'westernized' game, and its a very delicate (if not perfect) mixture that makes the Sonic series so unique.

 

Now, compare that to this..

 

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Colors are subdued, only mildly saturated, and the shadows are VERY dark. Things are overly, intricately detailed in the textures and nothing fits the more geometrically-leaning art style of the actual Sonic series. Characters are overly detailed as well and the robots look like something straight out of a low-budget CGI cartoon (zing!).

 

It doesn't look bad per se, but it surely looks a lot less like Sonic and a lot more like this:

 

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See what we meant by it looking more like a Playstation 1 or 2 era Naughty Dog / Insomniac game?

 

It honestly looks fine for those games because they established that style from the get-go, but even as a spin-off or alternate series I cannot really come to accept Sonic looking like this. It's not even remotely his style and to be honest, it shouldn't be. 

 

Sonic's style is unique and it shouldn't have to be changed for other audiences. On Sonic, it's ugly and it sort of defiles what the series even is supposed to look like; and while it's not exactly offensive for the TV show to look like this, getting this into the video game territory just feels kinda (no actually REALLY) wrong.

 

And I'm sorry, but whenever you said you wanted Boom style to be the new thing, I had to respond like this. :V

 

That is a great point there; the Sonic series has a very unique look to it and for it to more or less be transformed into a Jak/Ratchet-like look is a bit jaring. I love those games, so it really doesn't bother me and it is interesting to see a Western Developers take on the Sonic series. That being said, it does sting a bit that we may not be getting some things from that classic Sonic style in Boom but its a spin off based on a TV show, so its not like its going to be the main look for future mainline Sonic tittles.

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Well, Azookara, you confirmed I made a right choice not pursuing being an art major, to say the least; most of those details would go right over my head. XD

I can see what you mean upon closer observation though; Sonic certainly is fairly bright and colorful. I appreciate your taking the time to point everything out.

Though when I refer to the Sonic feel I was moreso meaning the gameplay than anything else. While the art style looks to have remained more or less consistent, the gameplay...

Well, dear god, the gameplay.

At the end of the day for me.  I'm ok with Crash Bandicoot, Jak and Daxter and Ratchet and Clack artstyles being implemented into Sonic.

I can echo this. If I have to pick between consistent quality and a different art style or rollercoaster gameplay and a unique art style... I'm picking quality. All of these are games I enjoy, so I'm not seeing much to oppose personally.

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The graphics, to me at least, look comparable to the Adventure games. It's pretty much what Iizuka said he wanted the art style to be like; Convincing, but not hyper-realistic. I think Boom's art direction really harkens to that statement, as it is really convincing. That part where Sonic & Co are running down that [yellow] brick road at full speed felt Sonic-y to me, and it's good to see that high speeds are back after Lost World.

The environment and the graphics really give me Mystic Ruins vibes, I mean, just compare them. They are very similar, and I can't help but think that Big Red Button looked to Sonic Adventure for inspiration.

I don't mind the character redesigns, I dig Sonic's, Tails doesn't look very different, Amy's new outfit looks great, and Knuckles could have been worse.

My main concern for the game is combat, but hopefully it'll be fun.

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I can echo this. If I have to pick between consistent quality and a different art style or rollercoaster gameplay and a unique art style... I'm picking quality. All of these are games I enjoy, so I'm not seeing much to oppose personally.

 

Careful Ogilvie.  I'm opinions ATM have seemed to have p'd off at least 2 people on this forum.

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I found this and I though it was funny because...you know...the scarf.

Watch Hedgehogs, coming to PS4, Xbox One, PS3, Xbox 360, PC, and maybe, just maybe, Wii U. Actually, nevermind that last one.

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Provided enemies can be taken out with one hit I think we'll be fine in terms of combat.

Of course that then lends the question of how to keep combat from feeling stale... while Sly Cooper 1 had one hit kills, you also had very little health and were sneaking around most of the time. Similarly, while Ratchet's enemies can be obnoxious to take out in groups, the game makes up for it with a large variety of weapons to choose from, many of which are hilarious.

How will they implement combat in this game so that it both does not cause massive slowdown like Unleashed, but at the same time doesn't get tediously annoying because of how easy the hordes are to ka-pow?

Overall I'm curious to see what this will look like...

...and of course, if dubstep makes its way into the soundtrack again.

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Am I weird for thinking that both the designs from Sonic Boom and Sonic Generations are similar enough to be in the same universe? Both look great and play the part in my eyes. Sonic Generations probably stands out as the more "video game" interpretation while Boom's universe seems more like a palpable world you can go through, but it's still got that Sonic-fantasy-scifi touch to it that I love about the lore in the Sonic universe.

 

I guess it's just catering to a different part of the Sonic mythos that was barely ever touched, kind of like when Sonic Riders went for the whole sci-fi futuristic vibe and how Unleashed focused on a more real-life location setting. Heck, I'd even give props to Shadow the Hedgehog of all games for lending some darker atmosphere. Not... that I want the series to look like that exclusively, but there should definitely be a balance.

 

Sonic Boom just seems to strike a stronger balance than Lost World did. It's new, but it still feels like Sonic to me. 

 

Well, in the end, art is subjective, so there's no way this argument will ever die.

 

Watch Hedgehogs, coming to PS4, Xbox One, PS3, Xbox 360, PC, and maybe, just maybe, Wii U. Actually, scrap that last one.

*Watch Hogs

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Sonic definitely has an art style, and I can see that Boom doesn't match it so well thus far. Sure the art style was kinda missing in the mid-00s, and I do think Boom looks similar to the Adventure games in some ways, but it's been back lately in Japanese Sonic, even if SLW was a bit intense it was still "Sonicy"

 

The Boom criticism is definitely legit from an art standpoint, I hope there are more Sonicy looking places in the final game, but if not maybe it'll be good on its own merits.

 

Also I'm debate'd out for the day I think, I've made my views on stuff pretty clear. I don't hate Japanese Sonic and I don't want to make anyone else hate him, so I'm sorry if I left a really bad taste in anyone's mouths with my argument. In the end, I just want to see a company who can make Sonic the best he can be, regardless of what his angle is.

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Provided enemies can be taken out with one hit I think we'll be fine in terms of combat.

Of course that then lends the question of how to keep combat from feeling stale... while Sly Cooper 1 had one hit kills, you also had very little health and were sneaking around most of the time. Similarly, while Ratchet's enemies can be obnoxious to take out in groups, the game makes up for it with a large variety of weapons to choose from, many of which are hilarious.

How will they implement combat in this game so that it both does not cause massive slowdown like Unleashed, but at the same time doesn't get tediously annoying because of how easy the hordes are to ka-pow?

Overall I'm curious to see what this will look like...

...and of course, if dubstep makes its way into the soundtrack again.

I doubt dubsteps getting in here (though if it does hopefully its as good as LM3, man that song was good) and as for the combat, I can see them doing something that can let you dispatch enemies quickly while still keeping up the flow since we do have four characters at our leisure and I can see some nice combos being made on that fact alone.

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I thought Lost World's graphics were okay and passable, but the colours were really too flat to me. I mean, playing Generations, then Lost World, then Generations again, it's pretty jarring. The problem is that SEGA seem to have followed the stereotype that cartoony means really really bright and flat colours, but that's not necessarily the case. Look at Pixar or The LEGO Movie, they are bright and vibrant films yet filled with rich graphical fidelity that really blows you away.

Point is, to make something cartoony, you don't necessarily need to make the colours flat. I didn't hate the graphics in Lost World, but I wasn't really over the moon with them in the end. I liked the idea of them, but the colours were just too flat.

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