Space Jam 2- Lebron James is the real Monstar.

[VO.SUPER]

I dont really see much of a problem with that if the movie was better. I dont see the problem in a movie being an ad if it actually was a good movie. I dont think being a blatant ad is mutually exclusive from being a good movie. 

[Ryannumber1gamer]

3 hours ago, VisionaryofSUPER said:

I dont really see much of a problem with that if the movie was better. I dont see the problem in a movie being an ad if it actually was a good movie. I dont think being a blatant ad is mutually exclusive from being a good movie. 

The problem is Space Jam 2 isn’t a good movie, though. It’s a pandering advertisement under the guise of being a genuine heartfelt family romp. For all the faults of the original Space Jam, it at least knew what it was for most of it - a complete and utter farce, and there was a odd and unique charm out of it being a perfect encapsulation of the 90s as an era. It’s one of those movies that’s so bad that it’s good, and it’s like that because it was entirely unintentional.

Space Jam 2 is a movie that knows the original is liked in spite of its nonsense, and thus tries to replicate it while squeezing as much revenue and advertising out of it as it possibly can. It’s not a movie about the Looney Tunes, it’s a movie about all the things HBO Max can offer you while using the Looney Tunes as glorified tour guides. On top of that, unlike the original that took the piss out of most of the plot (there’s literally an entire scene dedicated to the NBA players saying how full of shit it is when a psychic is explaining it to them), this one is genuinely trying to have a sympathetic and serious plot about LeBron pushing his son onto a hobby he doesn’t want to partake in, and how much of a hardass he is, a plot stuck in the middle of what might as well be called Blatant Advertisement: The Movie. It wants to have its cake and eat it too. The problem is intentionally going for “so bad it’s good” charm tends to just mean you’re going to make it very bad instead.

What’s worse is that the premise could’ve at least worked if they bothered to put more than the barest amount of effort in. If the crossovers actually had thematic purpose or even was just funny, but they aren’t. They’re either there for you to go “I recognise that”, or they’re there to have random actors overact in vague ways that try to replicate that character’s movement and attitude in the background.

Spoiler

To me, pretty much the only gag that works crossover wise is Rick and Morty’s cameo, and that’s because it both comes out of nowhere and they’re allowed to actually speak and make a joke that relates to the premise of the movie (Experimenting on Taz and Morty being horrified by what they discovered it legitimately funny).

There’s elements in Space Jam 2 that could’ve worked under better direction, or just under a creation that wasn’t so soullessly shrilling. It’s both a advertising nightmare, a pandering mess (The plot can basically amount to trying to steal LeBron’s Instagram followers, essentially, even if it’s not explicitly spelled out), and a film concept that could’ve legitimately been interesting (The Looney Tunes travelling through different film worlds seems like a genius premise to me), but it doesn’t all work together, especially since a massive chunk of time has to be dedicated to basketball, so you just can’t have time to focus on the crossovers, most of which amounts to lazily reusing old footage with the Looney Tunes badly added in.

The best comparison I can give is this is what people thought the LEGO Movie was going to be originally, before it came out and revealed it focused on being a good movie first instead of a marketing tool. The LEGO Movie is definitely focused on marketing LEGO and licenses to people, but it also legitimately has funny jokes and gags with the crossover element, it cleverly works the crossover element into the plot in a way that relates to the audience (what kid hasn’t used LEGO figures from different series to make their own crossover stories?), and above all else was interested in telling a heartfelt and funny story instead of just trying to sell the audience on various products for 90 minutes straight.

[VO.SUPER]

Well, that's just the thing. I'm not saying Space Jam 2 is good. My problem has always been the idea of it being a blatant ad suddenly makes it bad. 

Its this idea that it being so filled with just content meant to remind you that WB IP exist is what makes it bad. And I feel like several reviews seem to take the shit with just the fact there's so much IP featured in the movie. 

I mean, its one thing for it to be used bad, but I don't see how the idea is bad. 

[Ryannumber1gamer]

38 minutes ago, VisionaryofSUPER said:

Well, that's just the thing. I'm not saying Space Jam 2 is good. My problem has always been the idea of it being a blatant ad suddenly makes it bad. 

Its this idea that it being so filled with just content meant to remind you that WB IP exist is what makes it bad. And I feel like several reviews seem to take the shit with just the fact there's so much IP featured in the movie. 

I mean, its one thing for it to be used bad, but I don't see how the idea is bad. 

The idea isn't bad, as I said - a movie focused on the Looney Tunes going through old and new movies and causing havoc could've been a fun romp. As I said - the LEGO Movie is very much on the same scale of marketability, and yet that movie got high critical and audience praise for being a good movie.

But the issue is that the reviews are correct. This movie is bad because it's a blatant ad, and it's not because it's solely it's an ad, it's because it's status as an ad actively harms the movie and any potential it might've had. The first movie focused on two things - basketball and Looney Tunes. This film is filled with pointless, boring cameos that is there only to say "this exists", and that's it. The Looney Tunes being scattered throughout the WB worlds is pointless and is cleaned up in a montage and done heavily lazily via edited footage in all but the DC worlds, footage that looks cheap and bad. The story is so thin, and yet trying to be sentimental and serious that it comes off as disingenuous and vapid.

The comparisons to The LEGO Movie and Roger Rabbit come from the fact that both contain numerous licensed characters that can be seen as 'blatant advertisement', but the critical difference between those and this film is that both of those were focused on making a good movie first and foremost, and thinking of creative ways that the licensing element informs and builds the world, as well as creating interesting and funny moments all throughout. The joke is never "hey look, its *INSERT POPULAR CHARACTER*", it's "hey look. there's a character who's doing something genuinely funny and fits the plot". It probably helps that both the LEGO Movie and Roger Rabbit actually has interesting and unique world-building, whereas Space Jam 2 is literally just as vapid as entering a server room.

[VO.SUPER]

I mean, yeah. But that's just bad writing rather than advertising and not utilizing all the IP in an interesting way. You said it yourself, it could be interesting while being an ad.

And I'm not trying to be an ass here with my insistence on this point. I just feel like the idea of one big HBOMAX advertisement spread out into a movie doesn't seem like a bad idea and criticizing Space Jam 2 for being that I feel just misses the point that it could still be an ad, just a better one.

[Chili Dawg]

So, ad or otherwise, when I watched the movie, one thing that stood out to me was how poorly most of the Looney Tunes are utilized.

Like so many of them contribute nothing at all to the plot, they're just bodies for there to be a team! And that might have been okay, but there's only even a handful of gags that utilize their personalities. Elmer Fudd? Yosemite Sam? Barely do anything! Sylvester has like one gag with spitting out Tweety, other than that, there's nothing on display that really utilizes his character. Foghorn Leghorn? Sure, he says I say I say at least once, but is there anything at all that makes him truly a relevant and/or necessary part of the film? Even Daffy barely does anything- doesn't even play in the game, and him and Bugs barely even interact. Oh and poor Marvin the Martian, but I suppose the film at least makes a gag of doing him dirty.

Now, this is a similar problem with the original Space Jam- the Looney Tunes shine more when they're trying to kill each other, not playing on a team together. But being a problem before doesn't mean it's not a problem now, and it's even worse here.

 

[Tornado]

On 8/2/2021 at 6:51 PM, VisionaryofSUPER said:

Ok then. Please explain it a second time please in a way that I guess is just simpler

I don't think there's any easier way to explain it to you if you think the premise of paying to be advertised at and nothing else is a concept that's just misunderstood because between Space Jam 2 and that shitty Charlie Sheen movie were both done poorly rather than an inherent disgust at the concept of corporate cynicism being so blatant.

 

On 8/3/2021 at 11:13 AM, VisionaryofSUPER said:

My problem has always been the idea of it being a blatant ad suddenly makes it bad.

Okay.

Edited August 7, 2021 by Tornado

[VO.SUPER]

4 minutes ago, Tornado said:

Okay.

Okay. Everything's fine that way. 

[BlueSpeedster]

Holy shit, I have been gone on here for so long that I forgot about this existing…

Ok… So… I think Space Jam 2 was… fine. It ain’t good tho.

Considering how everything for the film was a marketing team’s wet dream, then yea… this film will be more outdated than the first ironically…

On the other hand… The Suicide Squad was a good movie, highly recommend that instead if you are of age.

Anyways… before I depart this place, let me state that there is a god damn Xbox game for this… available now… for free… on the Microsoft Store… let that sink in.

I’ll be interested into reading your responses.

[KHCast]

I’m kinda surprised, but not really, that the reception among viewers is extremely polarizing.
 

Personally, given all the shit and controversy that’s come out about this film and it’s development, it can get a middle finger from me regardless of its quality, but yeah, that aside, I still find it extremely mediocre, and cringe as a shallow desperate ad. It really comes off to me like it was too prioritized with its marketing vs anything else, to the point, it’s semi serious sub-plot about Lebron and his kid, just feels so alien to the film. it just lacks charm. There’s only a handful of moments that got a smirk out of me.

 

the Rick and Morty bit is legit probably the only thoroughly entertaining “self insert ad”  moment in the whole film.

I can understand why some enjoy it, and some had their standards already low enough that it came out like a great time by virtue of crossing that bar. Idk, I had a low bar the minute it was announced it wasn’t Blake Griffin as the star nba choice (the guy who did multiple looney tunes ads beforehand), and I still ended up not all that impressed, so maybe I’m a bit biased lol

[Tornado]

On 8/8/2021 at 6:13 PM, KHCast said:

it’s semi serious sub-plot about Lebron and his kid, just feels so alien to the film.

The semi-serious subplot about LeBron and his kid that is completely detached from anything about LeBron in real life (and arguably the opposite of real life), as well; which always kind of stuck out to me in particular as endemic of how cynical the whole thing was. In hindsight, when it certainly seems like Michael Jordan had a mental breakdown when his father was murdered rather than the conspiracy theories of him being suspended by the NBA for his gambling problems that were common for decades, Space Jam is a way more (almost certainly unintentionally, mind you) personal movie about Michael Jordan than a smartassed toy commercial has any right to be.

 

 

 

Rather than attempt to do anything like that with LeBron (which, fair enough, LeBron takes such pains to sanitize his image that it almost certainly wouldn't be allowed but still) Space Jam 2 is Over the Top but basketball instead of arm wrestling.

[Wraith]

I don't think it's worth debating the commercial aspect. Like, obviously it's a fucking 3 hour ad, but so is the last 10 years of family cinema. I get the same dull sickness seeing there's a bunch of WB IPs in space jam as when I see that the next Marvel movie is going to be another ensemble with 12 more characters than it needs. I'm dull to it now.

This movie is bad on much more fundamental levels for me. Just about the only thing I was looking forward to here were the extended bits of traditional animation and even as someone who doesn't sweat the details of these things so much basic shit is wrong here. They don't even make sure the lips are synced with the dialogue. A far cry from the technique the original displayed blending live action and animation together.

I don't think the first movie uses the Looney Tunes well either, but this time they just fill in bodies on the team. There's not a clever line of dialogue to come from any of them. Road Runner and Coyote get a few good visual gags because it's basically impossible to fuck them up, but that's it. There are probably kids watching this that aren't endeared to these characters yet so it seems presumptuous to kinda just throw them on the screen and shrug.

Mishmashing them with other WB characters is cynical and all that yadda yadda but the weirdest thing about it to me is that there aren't any jokes. They just do the thing. Occasionally they'll talk about how cool the thing is. but it's mostly really matter of factual. They don't leverage any of the comedic potential of dropping the looney tunes into Hogwarts. They just fly by and Lebron talks about how cool Hogwarts is. The league stay out of the DC scene until the end instead of interacting with the tunes. Coyote plays out the scene from mad max verbatim  It's like WB wanted to be such a perfectly sanitized ad that they wouldn't allow the Looney Tunes to take the piss. What's the point?

At least some of the colors were nice in the first half, but once the movie transitions fully into that ugly sloppy "ready player one" look it gets hard to look at, from the Toons themselves having their designs shat on, to the awkwardly implemented half CGI-half NBA player Goon Squad, to the fucking Don Cheadle hulk out at the end? All harrowing stuff, but special shout out to Lola, who's stifled range of expression compared to the other Toons made her legitimately scary to look at. She's like a fursuit come to life.

Anyway this movie was fucking wack. Easily the worst thing I've seen this year and I caught the Sonic movie a couple of weeks ago. Jordan had better chemistry with bugs than Lebron, too. 1/10