Megathread The Lara-Su Chronicles and Ken Penders topic - READ PAGE 164, POST 4096

[horridus]

He's deliberately missing the point. It isn't the first time that he's very deliberately misconstrued what another person is saying in order to aid his argument. In fact, it's one of his favorite debate tactics; being obtuse as hell and not actually addressing the meat of an issue, when that issue is an inconvenience to him. If he couldn't find a way to try and twist things in his favor, he'd just ignore the argument entirely.

[GamerGirl54321]

It is possible that he had the idea of her for a while, and the Sonic comic just gave him a place to put her.

Still, though, she wouldn't have become as famous as she did if not for Sonic.

[Tenko]

Wow, that was a wall of 'it was all because of me and only me' posts on his Twitter huh.

I disagree with a fair few of his points as per usual. He tries to say Sonic didn't have a cohesive story or lore that a writer could work with until Sonic Adventure game wise, or until SatAM in other media. While not expansive I would say the original Japanese manuals had a story and lore that could be worked with, even the basics that are found in the English manuals are base enough to create stories with.

What's interesting is this supposed Princess Sally game he seems to recall Sega trying to promote at a NYC expo. Has anyone that has researched Sonic extensively like VEDJ-F or Hoggy know anything about this? It's the first I've heard..I want to call bullcrap but considering they were at one stage trying to promote a SatAM game there could be truth in it.

Finally he goes on to say that Knuckles had no character lore, story and character building to draw from, no villan to go up against or friends to accompany him on his quests. Sega hadn't bothered giving him anything he could work with.

Bullshit, Knux had the Chaotix as friends, even as a 'team' before he started using them as such. He also knew Sonic and Tails from their meeting in Sonic 3 and Sonic and Knuckles. Are six friends not enough for an 'accomplished' writer to work with? Sure he had the same villains as Sonic and crew, but that's because Eggman is the main threat on their world. Failing that he had been up against Metal/Mecha Sonic, had a rival of sorts with Eggrobo, Sega even had Metal Knuckles at that point too that he could have used. He could even have used Nack more too, he went missing for a while after the Mecha Madness arc, the guy steals gems etc, Knux is meant to be guarding the most precious gems of all for crying out loud. I can see plenty to work with and I'm not even a writer.

[RaceProUK]

15 minutes ago, Tenko said:

What's interesting is this supposed Princess Sally game he seems to recall Sega trying to promote at a NYC expo. Has anyone that has researched Sonic extensively like VEDJ-F or Hoggy know anything about this? It's the first I've heard..I want to call bullcrap but considering they were at one stage trying to promote a SatAM game there could be truth in it.

This game by any chance?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfujuAK9FXA

[horridus]

7 minutes ago, Tenko said:

What's interesting is this supposed Princess Sally game he seems to recall Sega trying to promote at a NYC expo. Has anyone that has researched Sonic extensively like VEDJ-F or Hoggy know anything about this? It's the first I've heard..I want to call bullcrap but considering they were at one stage trying to promote a SatAM game there could be truth in it.

I don't recall there ever being talk of a Sally GAME, just that she was considered to be added TO the games. She did get a bit of a push, back in the day, but not to the extent there being a SOLO game ever mentioned, just that she might be in A game, which was likely the unmade SatAM based game. The Sally miniseries was meant to test the waters, so to speak, and when it sank, it sank the chances of her going anywhere other than the the comics or SatAM. But this really is the first time I've ever heard of a Sally *game* being mentioned. 

[Tenko]

3 minutes ago, RaceProUK said:

This game by any chance?

Yeah that was the SatAM one I was referring to. I wouldn't call that a Princess Sally game tho. They way he put it makes it sound like she was the main character in this game he's referring to.

[RaceProUK]

31 minutes ago, Tenko said:

Yeah that was the SatAM one I was referring to. I wouldn't call that a Princess Sally game tho. They way he put it makes it sound like she was the main character in this game he's referring to.

Oh, she was never going to get a game of her own; after all, even Knuckles and Shadow couldn't get a true solo outing i.e. no other known Sonic characters. The only character to get a true solo outing is Tails, who got two, and they didn't exactly set the world alight.

[Adamis]

1 hour ago, GamerGirl54321 said:

It is possible that he had the idea of her for a while, and the Sonic comic just gave him a place to put her.

Still, though, she wouldn't have become as famous as she did if not for Sonic.

According to what he just said on Twitter some minutes ago, yes.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Having the idea of "I should create a random female character" doesn't count as having the idea for the character.

And yes, I am implying Penders' version of Julie-Su has fuck all personality other than role of girlfriend. Have a hint Penders, that isn't a developed character.

[horridus]

7 minutes ago, Adamis said:

According to what he just said on Twitter some minutes ago, yes.

So I see. Man, I have never seen a man so determined to basically confirm the perception that he was a hack writer who rode another company's coattails for his own purposes. 

I particularly love the part where he goes on a lengthy tangent over his popularity and how 'valuable' his name was, despite the fact that you didn't bring up any such thing. No no, wait, my favorite part was his response to you bringing up the way Fleetway did things; 'Europe is a different market to America'. Cause you know, that totally explains why they were able to utilize more game material and actually USE Knuckles in the same year his game debuted. 

Kudos for trying to inject some rationality into his narrative, futile an effort as it is. 

[Tenko]

Decided to finally get Twitter..will be interesting to see how he answers my queries..if he does.

Aaand Mustang has already tried to defend him from me before I got a reply haha.

[Idon'tcare]

6 hours ago, Tylinos said:

He's just intentionally missing the point now...right?  I really hope he is.  It's super-obvious Kell0x is trying to say Ken never would've created Julie-Su if not for the Sonic comic, but he keeps going on as if Kell0x is claiming he stole the idea of her from Sega.

No... Julie-Su could have existed without the Sonic comic, she just wouldn't be the Julie-Su as we know her. For all we know he could have inserted her into a Star Trek comic, the Lost Ones or any other comic project he's worked on doing his career instead. the catch is that her character as such would then have been influence by that medium instead, thus resulting in an entirely different character.

The one Pender's and fans talk about is the one put into a comic with Knuckles in which a large part of her background story is based around the concept of being Knuckles girlfriend. All of her gained personality traits have been obtained in part from her interaction with SEGA characters or places from within the Sonicverse.  Take it all away and you're stuck with a character that's simply not the one people care about.

 

[Tenko]

Hmm Penders seems to think Sega was pitching a Princess Sally game at E3 in 1995. Not Sonic-16 which was had its demo shown in 1993. Also not Popful Mail when the 'Sister Sonic' localization was going around for debate as that got released in early 1995 with no changes to its character's.

I find the idea Sega was pitching a Princess Sally game around the time they were getting ready to launch the Saturn around the world a bit odd. Tho they did push Princess Sally with Sega World in Sydney, plushies etc, and that opened around 1997...hmm.

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Penders is talking a load of nonsense. Julie-Su was literally created with the sole purpose of being Knuckles' girlfriend, and it shows. He couldn't even come up with a decent reason for why the two are good for each other. No things in common, no specific personality traits why, it's just the soul touch that does it.

Not to mention the fact that her only personality traits is to make Vector look like an easy target for looking like an idiot and support Knuckles no matter what.

[RaceProUK]

3 hours ago, Tenko said:

Hmm Penders seems to think Sega was pitching a Princess Sally game at E3 in 1995.

Ah, in that case he's likely talking about one of the earliest prototypes for Sonic X-Treme; IIRC, that particular prototype was actually developed for the 32X

[DaddlerTheDalek]

56 minutes ago, RaceProUK said:

Ah, in that case he's likely talking about one of the earliest prototypes for Sonic X-Treme; IIRC, that particular prototype was actually developed for the 32X

 

I think you mean Sonic Mars. That had SatAM elements and was supposed to be a Sega 32X game.

[Tenko]

Penders mentioned seeing it at E3 in 1995 tho. That would be a bit late for Sonic Mars. They would have moved onto the Sonic Saturn prototype or pitch by then wouldn't they? They may even have been working on X-Treme by that point. After Sonic Mars there's no more mention of trying to include SatAM into the game with only Tiara being carried over.

I guess it could possibly have been Sonic Mars, I would have hardly described it as a 'Princess Sally' game tho, being playable is slightly different than it being called her game over Sonic.

[Tylinos]

To be clear, while it doesn't change much, he said the game was at a "licensing show in NY June 1995", not E3.  Apparently the New York International Licensing Show was held from 20 to 22 June 1995, so it could've been that, assuming he wasn't misremembering.

[Idon'tcare]

49 minutes ago, Tylinos said:

To be clear, while it doesn't change much, he said the game was at a "licensing show in NY June 1995", not E3.  Apparently the New York International Licensing Show was held from 20 to 22 June 1995, so it could've been that, assuming he wasn't misremembering.

Wasn't there someone working on a RPG style fangame at the time based on Satam and the comics?

It is two decades ago but I recall it being very popular at the time with the cartoon and comic crowd. 

[Monkey Destruction Switch]

On 1/5/2016 at 0:21 AM, Zaysho said:

Penders has more or less said he's making LSC out of obligation regarding his copyrights (I can't remember exactly where he said this, but I recall him mentioning this perhaps on his forum?). He doesn't really have a choice. Either he does something with this stuff or he'll probably risk losing them. Really, I think he's biding his time for that one magical phone call where people want to license his works and work with him, but it ain't coming, so he's got to do something even if he's pumping it out at the molasses pace he is.

That...would explain a lot. I guess he still believes that his creations still have value to someone aside from himself, lol.

[Big Panda]

 

Random thing I came across while searching tumblr.

[MightyRay]

Brilliant find TheFatPanda! I laughed hard at the end!

[antyep]

18 hours ago, TheFatPanda said:

 

Random thing I came across while searching tumblr.

I know it's not Christmas anymore, but...

 

 

So anyways, with the pre-Archie project going on, which is found here...

 

 

 

You don't think Penders will complain about it? I'm pretty sure his little minions--I'm sorry-- FANS will run into it and tell him about it, just like what they did with Sonic Chronicles.

 

[Tylinos]

Ken's made it pretty clear he doesn't have a problem with non-profit fanart and fanfiction.  As long as it's not trying to make money, I don't think he'll be complaining much.

[Zaysho]

At most, he MIGHT ask for a copyright notice to be put on it once someone brings it to his attention to try to get him to make a big stink about it. I doubt he's going to care about it if it's non-profit.