Megathread The Lara-Su Chronicles and Ken Penders topic - READ PAGE 164, POST 4096

[biznizz]

So wait, is The Storm going to be included in the physical copy of the first book or is it strictly digital only?

I mean, from the descriptions of it, it's largely pointless as it follows Remington and Geoffrey, two characters who I believe aren't even going to BE in LSC proper, but some equality for physical and digital releases is the least he could do.

[horridus]

So wait, is The Storm going to be included in the physical copy of the first book or is it strictly digital only?

I mean, from the descriptions of it, it's largely pointless as it follows Remington and Geoffrey, two characters who I believe aren't even going to BE in LSC proper, but some equality for physical and digital releases is the least he could do.

Given that it's meant to be 'for free' and serve as a kind of lead-in to LSC proper, I would assume that it's a purely digital release. Something to generate interest in the APP and the Graphic Novel. Which the more I think about it the more I wonder how it's going to do that given that, as you pointed out, it's more about Geoffrey and Remington than it is about LAra-Su. In fact if I were to speculate, I have an awful feeling that the whole thing is going to be more of a protracted info-dump than an actual story. 

[King Scoopa Koopa]

Given that it's meant to be 'for free' and serve as a kind of lead-in to LSC proper, I would assume that it's a purely digital release. Something to generate interest in the APP and the Graphic Novel. Which the more I think about it the more I wonder how it's going to do that given that, as you pointed out, it's more about Geoffrey and Remington than it is about LAra-Su. In fact if I were to speculate, I have an awful feeling that the whole thing is going to be more of a protracted info-dump than an actual story. 

Some kind of dump, anyway...

[Tylinos]

While I could be wrong, I could've sworn Ken said before that he planned on the graphic novel being a digital-only release with the app.  At the very least, it seems he plans to have the digital release first, even if he plans to do a physical one later.

[Idon'tcare]

And we have a bit more on the precise nature of the release.

 

 

Wait,  I'm confused here. Will this thing be released through the app first then converted into a graphics novel or will both formats be released at the same time?

[Ellipsis-Ultima]

I think he means the graphic novel will be released digitally in an app?

[King Scoopa Koopa]

But I thought no mere graphic novel could contain the full revolutionary scope of his grandiose, industry-redefining vision?

[horridus]

But I thought no mere graphic novel could contain the full revolutionary scope of his grandiose, industry-redefining vision?

Indeed. Particularly since he's mentioned wanting things like a narrator and various other 'experiance enhancing' widgets in order to 'take full advantage of the medium'. He once even mentioned knowing a voice actor who might do the role.. naturally, he named no names, but just said that she was a 'legitimate talent'. 

[Ryannumber1gamer]

Indeed. Particularly since he's mentioned wanting things like a narrator and various other 'experiance enhancing' widgets in order to 'take full advantage of the medium'. He once even mentioned knowing a voice actor who might do the role.. naturally, he named no names, but just said that she was a 'legitimate talent'. 

If she was legitimate talent, I'm pretty sure she wouldn't agree with Ken's opinion on payment.

[King Scoopa Koopa]

He knows that taking a picture of them at a convention when they're not looking doesn't count as actually "knowing" them, right?

What am I saying? Of course he doesn't.

[Jason Berry]

So having a free comic to make a quick recap followed by a graphic novel for the main story? Sounds like a good way to do it for once.

[King Scoopa Koopa]

So having a free comic to make a quick recap followed by a graphic novel for the main story? Sounds like a good way to do it for once.

Sure, but Penders has never been short on good ideas, it's just the follow-through that he tends to screw up. Hell, this entire project is like a monument to that.

[Idon'tcare]

So, let's try this then.

Um yeah, I have no words for this.

[Rey Skywalker-Ren]

23 minutes ago, Idon'tcare said:

So, let's try this then.

Um yeah, I have no words for this.

So he is admitting that Chronicles did a better job then he did. Nice. 

[Nestor]

That's a... slightly more direct statement from Ian than I'd expect him to make.

Of course, Ian is contrasting the two, not comparing them - I've just pointed this out to Ken on Twitter (along with a brief breakdown of the differences between the pair); it may be interesting to see what he makes of it, as to be honest from some of his statements I get the impression he's genuinely unaware of most of the details of Chronicles beyond hearsay.

[horridus]

I wouldn't be surprised at all that he doesn't know any of the actual details of the game's plot, despite his claims of having been 'consulted'. God knows that something as simple as a google search or reading a wikipedia article is beyond his efforts when it comes to any of this. 

I find it notable that he didn't link up Flynn's name. Usually whenever he brings the guy up, he rather deliberately alerts Flynn to the fact that he's taling about him.

[DaddlerTheDalek]

Quote

Shade - Julie-Su done right.

 Interesting reaction from Flynn.

 

Quote

Also Omega as HK-47.

Now I want a crossover...

[Idon'tcare]

6 hours ago, Nestor said:

That's a... slightly more direct statement from Ian than I'd expect him to make.

It's rather refreshing to see it, then again there is no legal snafu going on with Chronicles despite Pender's mad dream to sue SEGA/BIoware over it. You know in a way I would  welcome that lawsuit by now, it will so much fun to see Pender's going up against two corporations with better lawyers and a more airtight case then Archie since Pender's have been borrowing ideas and concepts from TV shows since day one.

6 hours ago, horridus said:

I wouldn't be surprised at all that he doesn't know any of the actual details of the game's plot, despite his claims of having been 'consulted'. God knows that something as simple as a google search or reading a wikipedia article is beyond his efforts when it comes to any of this. 

I don't think he was consulted on anything here, clearly Ken Pender's was so far below the radar of SEGA that they simply never gave two cents about him, that whole movie fiasco stunt he pulled with Ben Hurst would highly likely be the one thing SEGA remembers him for. 

[Tenko]

I love it how he still runs from anyone with a decent argument against him. Just flat out doesn't reply and carries on with new tweets and replying to people he can combat easier.

Just about every time someone has brought up the facts that he wasn't the first person to write the Echidnas as an advanced technological race, wasnt the first to have the idea of other echidnas outside of Knuckles, that he also wasn't the first to write a female echidna character, or even the first to write a cyborg/enhanced by technology echidna character etc etc, he moves onto the next conversation. When he does respond its usually along the lines of "I had never heard of/seen any of these at the time, so they didn't influence my work" thus apparently making it, in his mind, still original ideas and all belonging solely to him.

His recent remarks about Shade and Scourge seem to show he still thinks that the rules only work one way, for him. I mean how can Shade and Scourge be influenced by his characters and in his eyes unoriginal copies of his work...yet his characters..especially the likes of Evil Sonic, are supposedly completely original and considered separate enough in personality, backstory etc that he can claim they are unique and not at all copies of Segas original creations. Ugh.

[SenEDDtor Missile]

1 minute ago, Tenko said:

how can Shade and Scourge be influenced by his characters and in his eyes unoriginal copies of his work...yet his characters..especially the likes of Evil Sonic, are supposedly completely original and considered separate enough in personality, backstory etc that he can claim they are unique and not at all copies of Segas original creations? Ugh.

Self delusion is one of humanity's greatest weapons.

[King Scoopa Koopa]

11 hours ago, Nestor said:

That's a... slightly more direct statement from Ian than I'd expect him to make.

Of course, Ian is contrasting the two, not comparing them - I've just pointed this out to Ken on Twitter (along with a brief breakdown of the differences between the pair); it may be interesting to see what he makes of it, as to be honest from some of his statements I get the impression he's genuinely unaware of most of the details of Chronicles beyond hearsay.

Probably not as interesting as you think. Try to fill in any gaps in his knowledge and all you're likely to get back is "LA LA LA LA LA LA LA..." while his hands are over his ears. I think it's been tried before, even.

I say that, but that's probably a more dignified response than whatever tripe he'll actually come up with, if he doesn't just choose to ignore it.

[Idon'tcare]

25 minutes ago, Tenko said:

Just about every time someone has brought up the facts that he wasn't the first person to write the Echidnas as an advanced technological race, wasnt the first to have the idea of other echidnas outside of Knuckles, that he also wasn't the first to write a female echidna character, or even the first to write a cyborg/enhanced by technology echidna character etc etc, he moves onto the next conversation. When he does respond its usually along the lines of "I had never heard of/seen any of these at the time, so they didn't influence my work" thus apparently making it, in his mind, still original ideas and all belonging solely to him.

Considering that the Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles game shows several high tech devices left behind by the echidna's I'd say its pretty unlikely Pender's wasn't aware of the echidna's high technology level not being his original idea. Hmm didn't Fleetway come up with a cyborg Echidna first or was it the fandom who did that first?

 

30 minutes ago, Tenko said:

His recent remarks about Shade and Scourge seem to show he still thinks that the rules only work one way, for him. I mean how can Shade and Scourge be influenced by his characters and in his eyes unoriginal copies of his work...yet his characters..especially the likes of Evil Sonic, are supposedly completely original and considered separate enough in personality, backstory etc that he can claim they are unique and not at all copies of Segas original creations. Ugh.

Scourge I can see in a way, cause while he looked very different from Sonic in the end he is merely a recolored Evil Sonic, who me must not forget is merely a copy of Sonic wearing a leather jacket and sunglasses.

Shade however I can't see being connected in anyway to Julie-Su, hell, going by Pender's logic Tikal can be considered as a knock off one of his characters by the virtues of being a female echidna with possible family ties to Knuckles.

[horridus]

5 hours ago, Idon'tcare said:

I don't think he was consulted on anything here, clearly Ken Pender's was so far below the radar of SEGA that they simply never gave two cents about him, that whole movie fiasco stunt he pulled with Ben Hurst would highly likely be the one thing SEGA remembers him for. 

Key word, he CLAIMS he was asked by Bioware to consult for the game. Which is rather at odds with his statement about things here:

http://www.tssznews.com/2010/07/07/ken-penders-claims-copyright-on-several-archie-characters/

Quote

“I was then startled to learn how many characters and concepts from the KNUCKLES series I created were adapted within the framework of the game’s storyline,”  Penders said.  “It was clearly obvious why suddenly so many fans sat up and took notice.”

In short? Yeah, he's a liar. A rather sizeable one at that. 

3 minutes ago, Idon'tcare said:

Considering that the Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles game shows several high tech devices left behind by the echidna's I'd say its pretty unlikely Pender's wasn't aware of the echidna's high technology level not being his original idea. Hmm didn't Fleetway come up with a cyborg Echidna first or was it the fandom who did that first?

Fleetway did indeed come up with the Evil Echidna idea first, in the form of Dr. Zachary. Going by dialogue there were hints that, somewhere out there, was a remnant of Echidna civilization as well. Along with Zachary there was also the advanced robots left behind by the Echidna as well, in the Fleetway continuity, so its hardly an idea unique to Penders or even implemented by him first within the franchise. 

[Nestor]

27 minutes ago, horridus said:

Key word, he CLAIMS he was asked by Bioware to consult for the game. Which is rather at odds with his statement about things here:

http://www.tssznews.com/2010/07/07/ken-penders-claims-copyright-on-several-archie-characters/

In short? Yeah, he's a liar. A rather sizeable one at that. 

To be fair to Ken on this one, both his statements could potentially be true - he could have been turned down for consulting on Chronicles and then thought nothing more about the game as it didn't involve him; he may then have genuinely been startled when much later he heard about what was actually in the game which (from his perspective) was copied from his stories despite not consulting him.

 

27 minutes ago, horridus said:

Fleetway did indeed come up with the Evil Echidna idea first, in the form of Dr. Zachary. Going by dialogue there were hints that, somewhere out there, was a remnant of Echidna civilization as well. Along with Zachary there was also the advanced robots left behind by the Echidna as well, in the Fleetway continuity, so its hardly an idea unique to Penders or even implemented by him first within the franchise.

Apparently Dr Zachary's first stories actually appeared at the same time as Ken's - they seem to have been written concurrently but in ignorance of each other. However, as you say the Fleetway echidnas had for years before then still been portrayed as technologically advanced, albeit in an ancient Stargate-ish way rather than the 70s Silver Age comic way Ken used; Knuckles even pilots the whole Floating Island into battle with the Death Egg starship-style at one point in Fleetway, which would have been at least a year or two before Ken's work. Knuckles also explicity states that he's waiting for his people to return at the end of his first main storyline.

[King Scoopa Koopa]

35 minutes ago, Idon'tcare said:

Considering that the Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles game shows several high tech devices left behind by the echidna's I'd say its pretty unlikely Pender's wasn't aware of the echidna's high technology level not being his original idea.

Considering Penders thinks you can use a television remote to play the Genesis and seems almost desperate to keep Sonic the Hedgehog from having anything to do with Sonic the Hedgehog, I don't think it's that unlikely.

Quote

Shade however I can't see being connected in anyway to Julie-Su, hell, going by Pender's logic Tikal can be considered as a knock off one of his characters by the virtues of being a female echidna with possible family ties to Knuckles.

Going by Penders' logic, he invented the grilled cheese sandwich just because he decided to put tartar sauce on it.